Thread: Menthol as a Dream Enhancer

Date: 02 July
Dose: pre bed SJW, 100mg B6, WBTB 200mg p.oil capsule, some latte (60mg caffeine)
Side Effects: too sleepy from SJW
Sleep Duration: 8 hrs
Cognitive: sleepy and confused
Sexual: no
Atmosphere: classmates/school, had to hurry, positive moments, nonsense
Other Comments: My favourite combo has been less effective for LDs (although I did get some ld moments) and more effective for making me have a good night’s sleep. I am partially to blame because I didn’t do a proper WBTB and feel like I have wasted some good supps. Next time will switch SJW for Gingko.

Sleepy

Thread Update!!

(Well just sort of, but so what, it's my thread lol.)

Alright everyone, this is it. I'm officially leaving DV. I don't know when I'll be back, but it probably won't be for a long time. I'm pretty much dropping the internet as a whole, along with many other things, to focus on living my life the right way.

But before I go, I just wanted to say how awesome everyone in this thread has been ever since the very beginning. I started this thread exactly a year ago to the day, and it's gone so much further than I ever could have imagined. And it never could have been possible without everyone here who contributed, all of whom have put so much more on the field work into menthol use than I ever have. Seriously, you guys rock. I hope you all keep finding better and better supplements and combinations and pushing deeper and deeper into your lucid dreaming abilities so that you can achieve all of your goals because you deserve it.

Even with my coming absence, I would like to reiterate what CanisLucidus said on the last page. Whatever you do, stay cautious with your supplements, and if you have any questions about menthol, mixing something with menthol, or heck, just about any supplements in general, bring it here where others will be able to help guide you in the right direction, tell you if something is a safe idea, and so on. Whenever I'm not around I always worry that someone may come here with questions that I'll wish I could have answered sooner, particular if they pertain to the safety of different supplements and combos, so I've taken an extra step before I go. I have talked to Canis, who has an amazing amount of menthol experience and shares my passion for understanding the brain, about my leaving and he has graciously agreed to keep an extra eye out for anyone who posts here requesting supplement help, so seriously do not hesitate to ask if you need anything!! I'm essentially handing over the thread to him, and I assure you that you will be left in good hands.

Once again, you guys seriously rule. I may have started the idea to use menthol here but it's grown much beyond that, it's not just my experiment but all of ours and I don't think it could have possibly gone better than it has. To everyone here who has participated, I give me utmost gratitude. Just spearheading this thread alone has been an incredible experience for me, and I have all of you to thank.



Maybe one day we'll see menthol popping up on all of the big lucid dreaming sites. But until then, good luck to everyone and all future experimenters in all of your mentholy nights to come!!

I'm posting a little bit more formal of a goodbye in the thread for it along with how to contact me, so in case anyone wants to know check it out here: http://www.dreamviews.com/lounge/718...ml#post2032262

Good luck with any potential questions Canis, I know you'll do great.

I'm going to miss you. You are an incredibly brilliant researcher and amazing lucid dreamer. I wish you well and success in all you do.

Aly, thank you for everything -- all of your amazing work on the menthol thread, your incredible neurochemistry knowledge, your advice, and your friendship. It was just over a year ago that you started this thread. What an amazing amount has happened over this past year.

It's a huge understatement to call this research project a success. It's a huge accomplishment. The only person you still owe anything to is yourself. Now get out there and live the best life you possibly can! Considering how much you've helped all of us, I don't think we'll begrudge you building the life that you want and deserve for yourself.

Make the most of this new perspective and all of this positive momentum in your life. You've got great things ahead of you. Now go get them.

Speaking of great lucid dreams I need to thank Alyzarin for, it seems appropriate that this morning I had one more:

Dose: Pre-bed: 100mg 5-htp; WBTB: 2xGalantamind (8mg galantamine, 400mg choline citrate, B5), 600mg Alpha-GPC, 3 bags peppermint tea, 1 bag green tea
Side Effects: None
Sleep Duration: 7 hours
Cognitive: Lucidity didn't come easily. Lots of dreaming, though.
Sexual: Barely, and only in one spot
Atmosphere: Adventurous
Lucid: Yes

As usual with this combo, I had some very long, fun, meandering dreams.

Menthol didn't sex things up too much, at least not with this dose. I guess there was one part where a buddy and I were hanging out on a beach and everyone walking by was attractive and female. This is always amusing -- I've only had this particular Girls Everywhere! effect happen with menthol. I really need to make sure that I recognize it as a dreamsign.

Overall, the 3 bags of peppermint tea seems to be a nice sweet spot. I get good dream enhancement effects at this level and the "sexy sexy" stuff is pretty minimal. (Not that this isn't great fun, too, but can really distract from other goals.)

The lucid dream:
Woodrow the Giant - Dream Journals - Lucid Dreaming - Dream Views

Thanks a lot for everything Aly! You have no idea how many people and dreams you have inspired with your research. Have a fantastic time following your goals and dreams. Take care!

Take care Aly, wishing you all the best!
Many thanks for your hard work, help and advice.
I sincerely hope things work out for you, both now and in the future.

Wish I could have joined DV and followed the thread sooner. I didn't know you all to well but this whole thing looks extremely successful and I'll keep going on with trying menthol! Good luck with what you want to do and have fun!

Date: Sun July 7th 2013
Dose: 14 mg (2 cough drops)
Side Effects: None
Sleep Duration: 10 hours
Cognitive: Not Vivid
Sexual: No
Atmosphere: Dark
Other Comments: I vaguely remember being with a few people and seeing a lightning storm off in the distance. It was just constant lightning hitting the ground every second but that's all. I think it also didn't have much of an effect because I didn't go to sleep until about an hour after I took the cough drops.

Dose: Pre-bed: 100mg 5-htp, 500mg B5; WBTB: 2xGalantamind (8mg galantamine, 400mg choline citrate, B5), 600mg Alpha-GPC, 200mg L-theanine, 3 bags peppermint tea, 1 bag green tea
Side Effects: None
Sleep Duration: 7 hours
Cognitive: Lucidity didn't come easily. Lots of dreaming, though.
Sexual: Yes, but controlled
Atmosphere: Adventurous, slightly sexy
Lucid: Yes! (Two DILDs (?) + 1 DEILD)

Very successful night! Plenty of lucidity and jam-packed with dreaming in general (the latter part pretty typical for menthol.) Hit my WBTB a little later, which was probably a help.

I had a moment of pretty strong "menthol" style sexy effects -- I got really distracted by a cute reporter and had a hard time getting refocused on my lucid goals. I ended up having to flee into the void to escape my own runaway crush.

Even so, I'm interested in experimenting at some point with a few more bags of peppermint tea or throwing in a very small amount of peppermint oil alongside the tea. (Obviously, I'll be sure to keep total menthol well under control.)

The lucids:
Sandwiches for Skeptics - Dream Journals - Lucid Dreaming - Dream Views
Dive Bomber in Darkness - Dream Journals - Lucid Dreaming - Dream Views

Date: Wed July 10th 2013
Dose: (Bed) Oil of Peppermint capsule (x1) = 200mg, Menthodex cough drops (x2) = Menthol @ 0.36% w/w. (WBTB) Menthodex cough drops (x3) = Menthol @ 0.36% w/w, L-Arginine (x2) = 1000 mg
Side Effects: Slight gripey stomach (post-WBTB)
Sleep Duration: <6 hrs approx before (WBTB = 44 min) <2.5 hrs approx after. Total = 8 – 8.5 hrs approx
Cognitive: Very good recall. Good to excellent awareness.
Sexual: No.
Atmosphere: High stability. Fairly vivid. Odd and fairly bizarre themes.
Other Comments: A good amount of dreams recorded which included a 'void'-type (lucid) dream and a fairly memorable DILD. Unable to carry out certain actions (e.g: Phasing) although the basic TOTM was achieved.
Physical exercise during WBTB (15 min.) Post-WBTB relaxation exercise.

Where’s the Gym? - TOTM - Dream Journals - Lucid Dreaming - Dream Views

So I think I may try this soon. If I use cough drops alone, what would be a good starting dose? And should I do this before bed or during WBTB?

Originally Posted by Matt1

So I think I may try this soon. If I use cough drops alone, what would be a good starting dose? And should I do this before bed or during WBTB?

Hi Matt! My personal preference is to use menthol during WBTB if possible. It has a relatively short half-life, so the closer you take it to your dreaming, theoretically the better. In practice, WBTB has worked best for me, but some have had good results with pre-bed as well.

As for dosage, I like the strategy of starting small, noting the effect on dreaming (if any) and gradually raising to the more typical dose. A good starting dose may be something like 15-20 mg of menthol. (Hopefully your drops give you some indication of how much menthol they contain.) See what the effects are, and if they are mild enough, take a few days off between doses, gradually increasing. I find 30-35 mg to be a very effective dose for dream enhancement.

The highest dose I've personally used was probably just under 40 mg of menthol, which was 6 cough drops. This was pretty tedious to choke down! Good luck, and let us know how you do!

Originally Posted by CanisLucidus

Hi Matt! My personal preference is to use menthol during WBTB if possible. It has a relatively short half-life, so the closer you take it to your dreaming, theoretically the better. In practice, WBTB has worked best for me, but some have had good results with pre-bed as well.

As for dosage, I like the strategy of starting small, noting the effect on dreaming (if any) and gradually raising to the more typical dose. A good starting dose may be something like 15-20 mg of menthol. (Hopefully your drops give you some indication of how much menthol they contain.) See what the effects are, and if they are mild enough, take a few days off between doses, gradually increasing. I find 30-35 mg to be a very effective dose for dream enhancement.

The highest dose I've personally used was probably just under 40 mg of menthol, which was 6 cough drops. This was pretty tedious to choke down! Good luck, and let us know how you do!

I got down 91MG menthol from cough drops. Talk about tedious! Actually cough drops don't seem to effect me that much but maybe everyone is different. I recommend peppermint tea and/or peppermint oil.

I find the difference between caps and drops is in the atmosphere and parasomnia, menthol dreams with cough drops are more prone to displaying atmospheres of violence and dread, with nightmarish undertones to content. On the flipside the content is more fanciful and 'dreamlike'. I am also more likely to experience isolated sleep paralysis on waking, with more hypnagogia and inertia. I've yet to try tea during WBTB.

Also, it's a real shame to see Aly go. I'm sure I speak for all of us when I say that her astounding knowledge and experimentation and guidance an inspiration.

I usually have between 2 - 4 cough drops during a WBTB session. I tend to get an increase in recall and general dream enhancement, with the bonus of a DILD opportunity providing I take the menthol occasionally due to possible tolerence issues.
Combining menthol with my other favourite dream aids seems to help too.

I think it is important to factor in the length of time to ingest a cough drop relative to your WBTB.
For example, I took 10 mentholated cough drops during a WBTB one time where it took about 50 minutes to ingest them all.
A longer and later WBTB usually results in insomnia for me.

Has anyone thought about Altoids? I can't seem to find any information about how much menthol or peppermint oil is in it. It's got to be better than eating cough drops or peppermint oil and more convenient than peppermint tea. I saw my wife bought some this morning and got curious. She told me no but I was planning a little menthol tea tonight. I may have to snag up some Altoids to go with or if I'm too lazy try it alone.

its a good thing i got some sheesha with menthol in it

Originally Posted by Xanous

Has anyone thought about Altoids? I can't seem to find any information about how much menthol or peppermint oil is in it. It's got to be better than eating cough drops or peppermint oil and more convenient than peppermint tea. I saw my wife bought some this morning and got curious. She told me no but I was planning a little menthol tea tonight. I may have to snag up some Altoids to go with or if I'm too lazy try it alone.

Ha! That's funny. This got me curious, so I did a quick search. The one piece of information I found was from here: http://www.bvsde.paho.org/bvsacd/cd53/ahijevych.pdf

They said:

Originally Posted by That paper

In comparison with mentholated cigarettes, it has been reported that candy lozenges (Altoids, Elmsford, New York) contain approximately 10 mg menthol, and mint tea (Good Earth Peppermint Herb Tea) contains 9.0¡1.7 mg menthol/240 ml (Gelal et al., 1999).

The Gelal et al paper that they cite is this one: Disposition kinetics and effects of ment... [Clin Pharmacol Ther. 1999] - PubMed - NCBI

What's funny is that there are homemade Altoids recipes out there and they basically use gum paste (aka fondant) and peppermint oil with a little bit of confectioner's sugar. Here's one: Homemade Altoids Recipe The point is that seems to indicate that Altoids are just a more sugary packaging for peppermint oil.

So did I read it right that your wife warned you to stay away from her Altoids?

Originally Posted by That paper

^

@ CL.
Is 'That paper' related to 'That thing!'

Talking about that subject it seems that I got totally distracted by it.


Date: Mon July 22nd 2013
Dose: (WBTB) L-Arginine (x2) = 1000 mg, Menthodex (Menthol) cough drops (x2) = 0.36 % w/w
Side Effects: Very slight sickly feeling/Gripey stomach
Sleep Duration: 5.5 hrs before (WBTB 30 min) 4 hrs approx after. (Total = 9.5 hrs)
Cognitive: Clear thought processes noted.
Sexual: No – more sexy than sexual.
Atmosphere: Realistic, very stable and very vivid. Excellent.
Other Comments: Very good recall (inc. pre-WBTB which included a very brief, now rather vague lucid.) Crisp and very memorable lucid dream post-WBTB. Totem (LH.)

The Fair – (DILD) - Dream Journals - Lucid Dreaming - Dream Views

Thanks CL! I couldn't seem to find any info anywhere. So 10mg huh? Well I took 4 (40MG) early this morning alone with some L-DOPA with little effect and poor recall. (Not worth taking the time to post in the format) I may have been a little too sleepy. BTW way my wife likes to give me hard time especially with the dream supplements. She relented in the end!

Date: July 30th 2013
Dose: (WBTB) L-Arginine (x2) = 1000 mg, Menthodex (Menthol) cough drops (x3) = 0.36 % w/w
Side Effects: A slight gripey stomach
Sleep Duration: 6 hrs before, 2.75 hrs approx after. (Total = 8.75 hrs)
Cognitive: Some element of control and reasoning during the LD itself.
Sexual: No
Atmosphere: A memorable meeting.
Other Comments: Good recall all things considered. A memorable DILD. Totem (LH) - incubated. Occasional weak HI/dreamlet noted.

Meeting my GF’s deceased Dad (DILD) - Dream Journals - Lucid Dreaming - Dream Views

Dose: Pre-bed: 100mg 5-htp; WBTB: 2xGalantamind (8mg galantamine, 400mg choline citrate, B5), 500mg choline bitartrate, 600mg Alpha-GPC, 3 bags peppermint tea, 1 bag green tea
Side Effects: None
Sleep Duration: 7 hours
Cognitive: Prospective memory trouble. Bold behavior.
Sexual: Slightly in micro-lucid
Atmosphere: Adventurous
Lucid: Yes! One lucid + one micro-lucid

I got a nice, long lucid out of my galantamine / menthol / caffeine mixture. There were a lot of scene changes and transitions from one environment to the next, but things held together well. Prospective memory was a bit flaky, but control was for the most part really strong. Very high quantity and quality of dreaming.

Love this combo!

The lucid dream:
Donkey Kong Junior - Dream Journals - Lucid Dreaming - Dream Views

I haven't logged in, in a long ass time. So what did i miss? any new supplements or herbs you guys discovered?

Originally Posted by PeterF

I haven't logged in, in a long ass time. So what did i miss? any new supplements or herbs you guys discovered?

Welcome back, PeterF! Speaking only for myself, a moderate dose of menthol combined with a reasonable acetylcholine-enhancing stack is still the most powerful base combo I've hit. And if you add to that a small amount of caffeine, the odds of lucidity are raised even further and the chances for a WILD go up as well.

The only problem with the galantamine / menthol / caffeine combo is that it's preventing me from experimenting with other potential combos.