B-6 lucid dreaming experiment,

Hello everyone,
For a very long time I have wondered what is a good way to get lucid from a external aid? I looked into specialised lucid dreaming pills but they charge the earth for them and they are reported to induce SP like hell, and that's something I would prefer to stay away from. So I decided on vitamin B-6 if you don't know the actual benefits off lucid dreaming then find out here:
Vitamin B6 Benefits: The Vitamin That Never Sleeps!
Of course I'm not taking it for any of those reasons, I'm a lucid dreamer so that's why I'm going to take them. Dream vividness and dream recall are a by-product of this vitamin yet one of the most desired usages of it. Lucid dreaming is also commonly reported. Note that this pill is very unlikely to get you lucid, you must include what I'm about to tell you to make them a deadly combo. ok so the whole idea of this being a brilliant lucid aid is true but it's not the pill it's self. You see it is infact reality checking. Because of your excellent dream clarity and recall made by this pill you are highly aware in your dreams. All you need is a reality check incentive and you could get lucid every night, well you might it varys in people you see. Ok so how this experiment is going to work is quite simple, I bought 100 50mg pills of B6 from amazon and I'm going to try them out and I will record it every time I wake up on a record sheet I have made. I will then report back to you guys every week. I haven't received my pills yet but the reason I want to start now is to get a control to base the experiment off, I haven't reality checked for at least 2 weeks so I think that if I start now then there will be no external reasons to get a lucid dream.
sweet dreams
- GangsterPanda

Sweet sounds like a plan :)
Maybe if you formulate it like this we could get more info out of this

Week 1-2: Just normal without any aid
Week 3-7: taking b6
Week 8-9: no aid
Week 9-10: taking b6
Etc Etc

In the first part of the experiment we can see what kind of improvement taking b6 has over not taking it and in the second half of the experiment you alternate between taking b6 and not taking it to see what kind of effect there is taking it in moderate steps.

I am really interested in this because I have been wanting to try Vitamin B6 for a while, but from what I read it got mixed views in wether not it improves the vividness of the dream, some are convinced it is merely placebo effect.

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Originally Posted by TheObserver

I am really interested in this because I have been wanting to try Vitamin B6 for a while, but from what I read it got mixed views in wether not it improves the vividness of the dream, some are convinced it is merely placebo effect.

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That's why I'm testing it :content:, if anybody wants to join in you can buy these 50mg pills extremely cheap I brought mine for £2 which is about $3 but that was on after Christmas sale. Just remember though that I did order them off amazon so they will take a while to get here but that's how I can properly test them for a week I will just reality check and then for a week I will I will use the pills and reality check. I hope that they do help I mean there's no solid evidence to say they do but I know people who get lucid everyday just from swallowing this pill, reality checking and thinking about what lucid dream they would like to have that night. So if you ask me it is worth a shot. A plus is that they don't induce SP, which is great because nearly all other lucid pills do. If you do want to join in make sure you take just 50mg because I have head it can cause short term nerve damage if you take other 100mg a day for more than 3 days.
Sweet dreams,
-GangsterPanda

http://kwiksurveys.com/s.asp?sid=i97s2h4k9gr59jo68524
I have made a survey that I answer every time I wake up, it has a password but anybody that wants to join in I can PM that to you :content:

I'd like to join I am buying the pills of Amazon today! I am going to the idea that Dutchraptor had - 3 days of B6 and 3 day without, and so on.

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Originally Posted by TheObserver

I'd like to join I am buying the pills of Amazon today! I am going to the idea that Dutchraptor had - 3 days of B6 and 3 day without, and so
on.

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Cool! remember to reality check!
- GangsterPanda :content:

Ok so I just got my B-6 pills, I'm going to take one every night 1 hour before I go to sleep. For the first 3 nights I'm not going to reality check at all. For the next 3 days I will reality check and then I will go for 3 days without them. Ok so I didn't remember any dreams last night and I can't wait to see the results :content:

Sounds good! Good Luck! Hope you get the results you hope for.

Oh My God!
It worked I just had my first night with a 50mg pill and well it was amazing.
-Firstly I remember 2 dreams like a living memory, vividness? No not really I'm going to be honest with you. But the recall was picture perfect, I could remember the colour of everything and can recall to the greatest detail.
- I had two dreams which was like my normal dreams, which I remember but not in extremely detail, probably the first couple of dreams I had.
- A lucid Dream! Oh yes, I didn't need to reality check and I still got one it was vivid and memorable and it felt like I had more control than ever before, I could actually fly and not just hover which is a huge step forward for me :content:
- And a FA which is cool, I have never had one until tonight and it seemed to go very well, it was quite funny because my family all claimed they had the same lucid dream as me. But from there perspective they were not lucid.

So yeah that's just the first night and I'm loving it because I know it can only get better. I think they need to re-name B6 the lucid miracle.

Placebo effect in a nutshell.

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Originally Posted by MrOMGWTF

Placebo effect in a nutshell.

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Look... Prove to me it's a placebo? Oh wait you can't, I got results so I do I care? I mean I don't mean to sound rude but its a bit childish to come on with claims and no proof. What do you think, I'm trying to do a test here, you know I would like to get some results. So yeah I would love it if I could do my test, and then you can make your claims. Just understand that it makes my angry when people come and make claims and don't have the slightest clue to get them that conclusion. Sorry it's just I had a really rough experience 3 years ago, it's not your fault it just comes out sometimes.
- good night :content:
P.S. I'm still taking the pills,

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Originally Posted by MrOMGWTF

Placebo effect in a nutshell.

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If you want to bullshit go to the senseless banter forum.

You take a b6 pill and you get super vivid dreams, a lucid dream, FAs? It's just vitamin B6. Wikipedia says nothing about vitamin b6 helping with sleep. There are no scientific studies that prove vitamin b6 to be sleep aid. What are you trying to fucking prove? It's just placebo. Times ago I've heard somewhere that drinking hot milk before sleep will get you tons of lucid dreams. I've drinked the milk and got a vivid lucid dream instantly that night. It worked the next night too. I was like wow, it's the holy grail of lucid dreaming. But later then it didn't work. It was just placebo and autosuggestion.

Show me the scientific study which proves that B6 is nothing more than a placebo? You need proof that its a placebo. And I hate to say this but looking up for scientific study information on Wikipedia is stupid on its own. Its open to general public to edit at will. I would really like you to only post on this research thread if you are testing the effects of B6 in a controlled matter. And not use it as a way to post your asumptions with no proof to back up what your saying, its of no use to me or any other member of dreamviews.
@everyone else I had 3 vivid dreams last night, and I might even try a WILD tonight because well it's New Years so I will be tired from staying up late. At least i'm using my logic :content:
- Happy new Year everyone, have a good 2013 :)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by MrOMGWTF

You take a b6 pill and you get super vivid dreams, a lucid dream, FAs? It's just vitamin B6. Wikipedia says nothing about vitamin b6 helping with sleep. There are no scientific studies that prove vitamin b6 to be sleep aid. What are you trying to fucking prove? It's just placebo. Times ago I've heard somewhere that drinking hot milk before sleep will get you tons of lucid dreams. I've drinked the milk and got a vivid lucid dream instantly that night. It worked the next night too. I was like wow, it's the holy grail of lucid dreaming. But later then it didn't work. It was just placebo and autosuggestion.

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I guess I should believe you because your experiment was foolproof? It worked two nights and you assumed it was the holy grail of lucid dreaming, you clearly lack competence in logical reasoning.
If you can link me an article or give me a solid reason as to why B6 is just a placebo go ahead.
You wont be able however because it is documented that B6 can improve dream quality, likely because B causes the conversion of tryptophan to serotonin

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Originally Posted by GangsterPanda

Show me the scientific study which proves that B6 is nothing more than a placebo? You need proof that its a placebo. And I hate to say this but looking up for scientific study information on Wikipedia is stupid on its own. Its open to general public to edit at will. I would really like you to only post on this research thread if you are testing the effects of B6 in a controlled matter. And not use it as a way to post your asumptions with no proof to back up what your saying, its of no use to me or any other member of dreamviews.
@everyone else I had 3 vivid dreams last night, and I might even try a WILD tonight because well it's New Years so I will be tired from staying up late. At least i'm using my logic :content:
- Happy new Year everyone, have a good 2013 :)

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Wikipedia says nothing about vitamin b6 helping with sleep. *END OF THE SENTENCE* There are no scientific studies that prove vitamin b6 to be sleep aid.

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Can you read?

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Show me the scientific study which proves that B6 is nothing more than a placebo?

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I didn't say that. I said that Vitamin B6 does not affect anything related to sleeping.
And here are tons of trusted scientific papers about placebo effect:
placebo effect - Google Scholar

Look... you clearly don't understand my point here. While yes there is no proof that B6 (for lucid dreaming) isn't a placebo, there's also no proof that it is. And the reason why there has been no official documented scientific studies regarding the effects on sleep is because there has been no research is because there is no reason to. Trust me I know about Placebo's there strong enough to beat cancer, my Uncle does blind trial testing on new medicine. But you come on here and it gets everyone angry because as much as you argue you are saying something off pure belief, nothing else. Now please i'm not trying to have a go at you but you must learn that this is the whole point of the test. Effectively you have come in on a uncompleted test and who knows it might be a placebo, but you can't prove that no matter how much you say. I think me and DutchRaptor have proven that what you are saying is uncalled for. I'm now asking you as a fellow member of Dreamviews to not post on this thread regarding the placebo effect, or personal views. In doing so may compromise the experiment because you might make us believe it is a placebo when in fact it might not be.
-GangsterPanda

I just said it's placebo, you both started to argue.

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If you want to bullshit go to the senseless banter forum.

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Isn't that a beautiful flame starter?

I talked to my uncle (who is a doctor) about taking vitamin B6 pills to see if it increases vividness of lucid dreams, and he told me I should do the study for a month - 1 week on then 1 week off and repeat. He told me to record it in my dream journal and after a month I can come to where he works and get my results analyzed by a dream researcher.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by TheObserver

I talked to my uncle (who is a doctor) about taking vitamin B6 pills to see if it increases vividness of lucid dreams, and he told me I should do the study for a month - 1 week on then 1 week off and repeat. He told me to record it in my dream journal and after a month I can come to where he works and get my results analyzed by a dream researcher.

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It's cool that you can talk to a member of your family about lucid dreaming, I can't :( Anyway your uncle gave you some good advice. Is it possible if you could ask him what you should limit your B6 dosages to a day? Because I want to up the dosage, but want to keep it safe.
- Thank you,

He recommended 50mg, but I think 100mg is highest amount with any adverse side effects.

its legitimate i got this information off of a website. it wont let me post the link because i have not been a registered member for seven days
but if you go to google and type "b6 and its effects on dreams" its the first link

Tryptophan.

Tryptophan is an amino acid taken by Vitamin B6 and converted into Serotonin. Serotonin can cause extremely vivid dreams at higher levels. So the reason such a high dose of B6 is recommended for vivid dreams is that it’ll convert more tryptophan into more serotonin.

I have been taking 200 mg's per day right before i go to bed and have experienced more rememberable dreams, but ive taken no scientific method to record this. just thought i'd put my input in. ive heard alot on dreamview about apple juice so i think i am going to start taking b6 and apple juice before bed

Before you guys go down in flames, just spend 5 minutes doing some research, you'll find that a scientific placebo test has already been performed on B-6 and dreaming. The results showed it had significant effects on dreaming, which of course might be one reason the lucid dreaming community has taken to B-6.

Effects of pyridoxine on dreaming: a prel... [Percept Mot Skills. 2002] - PubMed - NCBI

There are more resources outside of this forum and members. If you're looking for more information about vitamins and supplements why don't you read up Ryan Hurd's free book:

Remember More Dreams | dream studies portal

And while I have not read Advanced Lucid Dreaming: The Power of Supplements, it's on my list and seems to have good reviews.
Advanced Lucid Dreaming: The Power of Supplements: Thomas Yuschak: 9781430305422: Amazon.com: Books

I've experimented a little bit with supplements, not methodically, but dynamically. Last night in fact I woke up at 3 a.m., and was deciding between a galantamine or a B-6/5-HTP/choline combo, and chose the later. I was a little desperate because my dream recall has been nil the past 7 days, and I hadn't had a vivid dream much less a lucid dream in weeks. I laid down and started a WILD, and had my first successful dream-reentry.

The Results,
Before anybody claims that I didn't do this under strict test conditions, in fact I did and I'm not going to lie to you it's quite annoying so I'm going to finish the test early. There are both advantages and disadvantages of using B6 as a lucid dreaming supplement and I will try to cover them all.
The Advantages,
- It will help with dream recall drastically: yes you will be surprised how much it helps, and if you stick on them for a long period of time you will start noticing intense recall of which you can relate to waking life memory's.
- It can help with Vividness, sort of: The reason why I say this is because my dreams only increased vividness after about 3 nights of taking B6. And I tracked the progress and noticed vividness was a key feature that was improving over time. From the results I gathered you would be able to get a vivid dream comparable to real life just after 4 weeks of B6 at 50mg dosage, that's impressive.
- You will get a lot more DILD'S: this is true but I believe it's just a by product of the first 2 advantages because I have noticed the pill does make you slightly more aware and makes you fell like your in the dream and not just a memory afterwards.
The disadvantages,
- You wake up earlier: this is true I have noticed that my base time of waking was 9:00am and decreased to a lowest time of 5:00am which might be good for some people and it does increase dream recall even more, not my cup of tea though.
- Rib cage and arms hurt like hell when waking: I know this has got something to do with these pills because I have never had this feeling before and will piss the avarage person off. Although being a lucid dreamer I know how great they are so I just put up with it.
- You will wake up at least once in the night: yeah it's not annoying for me because you can change it into a WBTB but you know the majority will not enjoy this so I'm labelling it as a disadvage.
Most Data
Lucid dreams: 2 ( one with reality checks and one with out)
Avarge dreams with Avarage recall and avarage vividness: 8
WILD: 0
Ultra vivid dreams with good recall: 6
Avarage amount of dreams remembered in one night: 5
Nightmares: 0
False awakenings: 1
Sleep Paralysis episodes: 0
Unable to sleep: 0
Undefined experience: 0
What you would classify as a OBE or AP: 0
Hope you have enjoyed the results I would recommend everybody who wants to take lucid dreaming a level higher to buy these B6 tablets, but you should consult your doctors first.
- Thank you for reading :content:

Gansta just do not take high doses of B6 for many days in a row.
In my case I notice a difference with a dose of 200 mg of B6, but this difference does not justify the side effects such as nausea.


What are the risks of taking too much B6?

Toxic effects of too much B6 include:
•Sensory Neuropathy: “Symptoms include pain and numbness of the extremities, and in severe cases difficulty walking. Sensory neuropathy typically develops at doses of pyridoxine in excess of 1,000 mg per day. However, there have been a few case reports of individuals who developed sensory neuropathies at doses of less than 500 mg daily over a period of months”
•Increased Dream Recall: Interestingly enough, one source on B6 refers to its effects on dreams in relation to toxicity, writing “in moderate toxicity (B6 produces) an increased (capacity for) dream recall.”

Yesterday jus for curiosity I took 150 mg of Vitamin B6. Results: I had to get up 4 or 5 times during the night to use the bathroom. I had like 6 or 7 dreams of which I only remember fragments and two of which I can remember quite a few details . What was different is that if one of the dreams that I can remember was pretty violent and unpleasant. When I have time I'll put it in my dream journal.