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    Thread: if time travel were possible...

    1. #1
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      if time travel were possible...

      well, hypothetically, if time travel were possible, and you went back in time and killed yourself. what would happen?

      because if you were to kill yourself you would be dead, which means you couldn't have gone back in time in the first place, which means you couldn't have killed yourself which means you couldn't have died.

      well?

      some say the universe would seize to exist, and that a parallel universe would carry on with an alternate way of things (i.e. you decided not to go back in time), some say you would just die.

      i am partly asking this to see what you guys think, and partly because maybe there is an actual answer which is most widely believed by scientists.

    2. #2
      섹시한 암컷 C911's Avatar
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      I have no idea...

      But i would think it would be like back to the future when marty goes back in time and when he sees his parents never get together he just starts to dissapear.

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      Quote Originally Posted by C911 View Post
      I have no idea...

      But i would think it would be like back to the future when marty goes back in time and when he sees his parents never get together he just starts to dissapear.
      yes but if he was to deissapear (i.e. never been born in the first place) then there would be noone to stop them from kissing which would mean time would go on as normal and he would still be born, which means he could still go back in time to mess things up so he would dissapear.... but that cycle would carry on in an infinite loop

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      Member sunshineDaydream's Avatar
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      I think I remember hearing somthing about the actual answer. I think it's that you can kill your past self, but your present self still exists. Which I could imagine the most as actually happening. But then what about all the stuff that you did from the point that you were killed to the point that you went back in to actually kill youself? Like if you would have set your car on fire the next day after you were killed by yourself, would your car still exist when you went back to the future? But I have read a few books that mention something about time, past, and future all being ilusions and the only thing that is constant and exists always is the present.

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      Quote Originally Posted by sunshineDaydream View Post
      I think I remember hearing somthing about the actual answer. I think it's that you can kill your past self, but your present self still exists. Which I could imagine the most as actually happening. But then what about all the stuff that you did from the point that you were killed to the point that you went back in to actually kill youself? Like if you would have set your car on fire the next day after you were killed by yourself, would your car still exist when you went back to the future? But I have read a few books that mention something about time, past, and future all being ilusions and the only thing that is constant and exists always is the present.
      good points there

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      Rational Spiritualist DrunkenArse's Avatar
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      I don't think that there is a definitive answer other than that time travel leads to the paradox that you've brought up in a classical universe. If one goes to the quantum multiverse interpretation of things, then when you go back into your past and kill yourself, time starts moving along an essentially different path in which you don't exist but the path that you came from still exists in the "universal quantum superposition". If it could ever get falsifiable, the multiverse ontology of QM would make a lot of problems like that disappear.
      Previously PhilosopherStoned

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      Quote Originally Posted by PhilosopherStoned View Post
      I don't think that there is a definitive answer other than that time travel leads to the paradox that you've brought up in a classical universe. If one goes to the quantum multiverse interpretation of things, then when you go back into your past and kill yourself, time starts moving along an essentially different path in which you don't exist but the path that you came from still exists in the "universal quantum superposition". If it could ever get falsifiable, the multiverse ontology of QM would make a lot of problems like that disappear.

      mkay...

      ill just take your word for it

    8. #8
      Xei
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      Well, the fact is time travel (in the sense you mean; going into the past) is impossible, so it's a bit of a non-issue. It's like asking 'if it were possible to turn gravity off, wouldn't that make it possible to violate the first law of thermodynamics?'. Well yes, but you can't turn gravity off.

      A possible answer though is that when you change the past you create a whole new timeline and universe, so there's no contradiction.

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      Quote Originally Posted by slash112 View Post
      well, hypothetically, if time travel were possible, and you went back in time and killed yourself. what would happen?

      because if you were to kill yourself you would be dead, which means you couldn't have gone back in time in the first place, which means you couldn't have killed yourself which means you couldn't have died.

      well?

      some say the universe would seize to exist, and that a parallel universe would carry on with an alternate way of things (i.e. you decided not to go back in time), some say you would just die.

      i am partly asking this to see what you guys think, and partly because maybe there is an actual answer which is most widely believed by scientists.
      It's simple. You cannot go back in time and kill yourself. If, for the purpose of this problem, say that there is exactly one timeline we move back and forth along when traveling, you have to deal with self-consistency. If you tried to pull out a gun and shoot yourself, the gun would jam, or you would get distracted, or your past self would survive the shot. If you went back to fix the gun or take care of the distraction, something else would happen to stop you from doing that. The odds of you being able to cause a paradox will be exactly zero. The general idea is, for you to be able to do something in the past, it would have to have always been that way.
      198.726% of people will not realize that this percentage is impossible given what we are measuring. If you enjoy eating Monterey Jack cheese, put this in your sig and add 3^4i to the percentage listed.

    10. #10
      Xei
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      That's kind of a cop-out. It creates a paradox in itself, because there's really no reason that you shouldn't be able to kill an ancestor once you've gone back in time. It suggests there'd be some mysterious force guiding you to stop you breaking logic...

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      Quote Originally Posted by Xei View Post
      Well, the fact is time travel (in the sense you mean; going into the past) is impossible, so it's a bit of a non-issue. It's like asking 'if it were possible to turn gravity off, wouldn't that make it possible to violate the first law of thermodynamics?'. Well yes, but you can't turn gravity off.

      A possible answer though is that when you change the past you create a whole new timeline and universe, so there's no contradiction.
      again, this is all just hypothetical.
      but, my point is once you change the the past and create a whole new timeline, (i assume the new timeline is one which you wouldn not exist anymore) then you wouldnt be there to go back in time to kill yourself. which means there is absoloutely nothing that could prevent you from existing any more. which means that wou would exist. but then it comes back to the fact that time would carry on as it would have and you would go back in time and kill yourself, and the loop starts again.

      do you get what i mean? am i making any sense?


      Quote Originally Posted by Licity View Post
      It's simple. You cannot go back in time and kill yourself. If, for the purpose of this problem, say that there is exactly one timeline we move back and forth along when traveling, you have to deal with self-consistency. If you tried to pull out a gun and shoot yourself, the gun would jam, or you would get distracted, or your past self would survive the shot. If you went back to fix the gun or take care of the distraction, something else would happen to stop you from doing that. The odds of you being able to cause a paradox will be exactly zero. The general idea is, for you to be able to do something in the past, it would have to have always been that way.
      this is the science section, not the philosiphy or religion section.
      there is no scientific reason why that should be true. there may well be a religious/spiritual reason though, which is what you are talking about

    12. #12
      Xei
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      again, this is all just hypothetical.
      but, my point is once you change the the past and create a whole new timeline, (i assume the new timeline is one which you wouldn not exist anymore) then you wouldnt be there to go back in time to kill yourself. which means there is absoloutely nothing that could prevent you from existing any more. which means that wou would exist. but then it comes back to the fact that time would carry on as it would have and you would go back in time and kill yourself, and the loop starts again.

      do you get what i mean? am i making any sense?
      Yes, and I understand the paradox, but creating a new universe solves it, because your parents are in the old universe, and they are dead in the new one. No contradiction, no loop.

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      Quote Originally Posted by Xei View Post
      Yes, and I understand the paradox, but creating a new universe solves it, because your parents are in the old universe, and they are dead in the new one. No contradiction, no loop.
      oh i see what you mean now.

      thats kinda what i meant when i said "a parallel universe would carry on with an alternate way of things (i.e. you decided not to go back in time)". its not completely what i meant, but its along the same lines. i think

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      It will always be impossible to travel in time. I don't know how anyone has ever believed this is possible. It's a fun idea, but whoever takes it seriously is a horrible thinker.

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      Quote Originally Posted by Michael View Post
      It will always be impossible to travel in time. I don't know how anyone has ever believed this is possible. It's a fun idea, but whoever takes it seriously is a horrible thinker.
      do you know the meaning of the word "hypothetical"?

      i certainly hope your comment wasnt reffering to me.

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      Rational Spiritualist DrunkenArse's Avatar
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      you are travelling through time at about the speed of light at this moment. You're just moving forward through it
      Previously PhilosopherStoned

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      Quote Originally Posted by Michael View Post
      I don't know how anyone has ever believed this is possible.
      You didn't put enough points into Creativity when you made your character.
      Also, refer to what PS and Xei have said. Time travel would be like jumping into
      a copy of our universe at some other point in time.

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      Quote Originally Posted by PhilosopherStoned View Post
      you are travelling through time at about the speed of light at this moment. You're just moving forward through it
      yes, but what has that got anything to do with this?

    19. #19
      Xei
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      He was responding to Michael saying that it is impossible to travel in time, which it clearly isn't. It is also possible to travel at different speeds, as has been empirically verified.

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      Rational Spiritualist DrunkenArse's Avatar
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      Quote Originally Posted by slash112 View Post
      yes, but what has that got anything to do with this?
      It was in response to what micheal said. It's a valid point though. People that say time travel is impossible really don't know what they are talking about. I'm not saying that reverse time travel is possible, I would just like an explanation of why it is impossible. My opinion is that it has something to do with the second law of thermodynamics being more fundamental than we've thus far given it credit for as that is pretty much the only thing about physics that isn't time reversible.
      Previously PhilosopherStoned

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      Quote Originally Posted by Invader View Post
      You didn't put enough points into Creativity when you made your character.
      Also, refer to what PS and Xei have said. Time travel would be like jumping into
      a copy of our universe at some other point in time.
      yeah.. it would be "like" that. have you ever jumped into a copy of our universe? No... it would be like that, but that isn't time travel. the normal time travel would be disappearing, and re-appearing in the same universe, at another time. not in a different universe... you're making up different shit. which would be actual travel, not TIME travel.

      No, slash i wasnt referring to you. I was referring to people that believe this is possible, and dedicate their lives to trying to invent time machines and shit.

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      The other universe would be the current one, at a different time, though.

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      i heard that if you travel closer to the speed of light, you go forward in time (well, it appears to do so). but i really dont know about back in time, the only way i can think of is going faster than the speed of light which is impossible anyway so thats no use.

    24. #24
      Xei
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      Yes that is correct, the faster you travel, the faster time flows for stationary things.

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      Quote Originally Posted by Xei View Post
      Yes that is correct, the faster you travel, the faster time flows for stationary things.
      How do you figure? Time never changes... it is just there... its not really even a thing....

      according to this, if a jet is flying super fast, I am suddenly aging faster for no reason?

      Maybe the faster you go, the less time it takes, but thats all I notice.

      Can you explain more? I'm sure you're correct... It just seems to me that time is unchangeable, and mainly just measurements for us humans

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