Sharing a discovery

[GordanFreeman]

We all know about Dream Guides, but do we know why we need them? Think about it. I had several encounter with them, even before I knew what dream guide is. I knew only that they are preparing me for something, something that I already knew but choose to forget. Every time I'm pushing deeper and deeper into the rabit hole. Last week I reached new level and with that I became one step closer to my goal. I think, I reached deeper than most dreamers here. I met with the 'Creator' of all dreams, but he wasn't very happy about it. It begin as normal dream, I was walking with my 'best friend' in some town, when suddenly notice something is not right. So I looked around and asked him, what city is this, I don't recognize it. He didn't say anything. In that moment I saw two absolutely indetical cats and said in loud voice "lol dream artifacts"(I mean glithces like in games) and "am I dreaming". Then my 'best friend' get very upset and said "Why, why you are still able to recognize that you are dreaming, after I tried my best to stop you", I just looked him dazled. He was angry and babling some insults in low voice. He turned towards me "OK be your way, next time I will create the dream so perfect, that you will have zero chance to become lucid", he touch my forehead with his index finger. I couldn't move my body anymore, he looked in my eyes "Wake up"(I heard the voice in my head). I wake up in my bed. I think, the greater your desire(goal) is, the greater opposing force exist. What do you think guys about this? Is lucid dreaming a lot more than we think is and are they more unexplored territories? Are they another forces inside lucid dreaming that we are unaware of yet?

[lucidbunnie]

I don't know about the Creator, but I have experience with hyperconscious entities in dreams. Karla can maybe provide some insight, she has some experience with dream guides. ^^

[LeaningKarst]

It seems like lucid dreams never cease to surprise us. You think you’ve seen it all, and then something else comes right out of nowhere and blows it all out of the water. Actually, though, this idea of dream characters that are set on preventing a dreamer from achieving lucidity is a fairly common one—or that’s the impression I get, anyway, after a good deal of lurking around the community. And there was a time some years ago, back when I was first learning to lucid dream, when it did seem very much as if my dreams themselves were trying to prevent me from gaining lucidity. Whatever that problem was, though, it permanently stopped being a problem just a couple months later, all on its own, and so I never had to come up with a satisfying explanation. I don’t know what metaphysical background you’re coming from, but the explanation I think is most likely for my own experience is that I was encountering was an internal block—basically, a force within our own personalities that, for whatever reason, sets itself in opposition to our conscious goals. Internalized superegos were the popular explanation back in the ‘70s, but human beings are complicated, and there all kinds of reasons for us to feel ambivalent about things that, intellectually, we think ought to be clear. I think most of us have probably had the dream where we’re trying to do something we want to do, but every possible obstacle comes up to prevent us from doing it. To my mind, it seems quite reasonable that this might sometimes happen when the goal is achieving lucidity in a dream. As someone coming from a Buddhist perspective, I wouldn’t want to reject out of hand the possibility that this wasn’t just an aspect of my own personality I was dealing with—but, fortunately for me, a Buddhist doesn’t have to make a metaphysical judgment in cases like this because the solutions are the same in either case. If it’s extra-personal (for a given value of extra-personal, mind you), it’s taking advantage of the same habits of mind that would result in mental projections of entities like this. The dynamics are identical, and so we’ve got to make sure our own front porch is clean in any case, so to speak.

[LighrkVader]

fortunately for me, a Buddhist doesn’t have to make a metaphysical judgment in cases like this because the solutions are the same in either case. If it’s extra-personal (for a given value of extra-personal, mind you), it’s taking advantage of the same habits of mind that would result in mental projections of entities like this. The dynamics are identical, and so we’ve got to make sure our own front porch is clean in any case, so to speak. I feel like you're seeing or understanding something I don't here. Could you please help me understand somewhat from the ground up what you mean? I am quite familiar with buddhist thought and perspective, but not so much the doctrine and terminology... I feel like I intuitively have the same attitude to the situation as you.

[LeaningKarst]

I could, but I wouldn't be able to get around to it for a few days, and it would be better if I did it in a new thread. Explaining from the ground up means starting with the Buddhist view of causality, and, as you can probably imagine, that gets technical fast.

[LighrkVader]

Don't do it unless you will enjoy it If you have any resources I can always figure it out myself.

[LeaningKarst]

No, I don’t mind doing it. I think it’s something many people might find helpful in understanding dreams, even if they don’t accept the full account. I just want to make sure I take the time to do it right, and I have a lot I’m working on at the moment.