Buying A New Computer

Quote:

---

you have no sense of adventure[/b]

---

It died with the eventual nine months I did use Linux. :P But it's not all bad - it was fine with broadband. Plug in, turn on, go. It was AOL Broadband, in fact. Don't ask me how I got it working without their client because I don't remember either. Either way, Linux is great fun if you can get past the initial frustration.

I would use it for a server. Definitely. Windows has got nothing on it, unless you're using Windows Server edition or something which comes with enterprise $1,000 fees. No thanks.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Ynot

I'd say linux isn't for you
[/b]

---

What I'm merely doing is the equivalent of parking my car in front of a crooked store or corporation that has ripped me off, with a "BUYER BEWARE" sign, in order to warn others of the warped mentality that the Linux crowd will instill into their minds. It's nothing that people don't do to Microsoft, the difference being, most people don't actually experience problems with Windows, they just hear about them and pass them along.

I see that you are just as fed up with arguing over OS's as I am, so I hereby drop my case and accept the fact that different operating systems are made for different people*.

* Even though Linux is made for doodooheads ;)

I have my minimum font size set to 14pt

My intension wasn't to make it unreadable, otherwise I wouldn't have wrote it, right?

Er...I had TONS of bad experiences with Windows. Reinstalling and configuring took the better part of a day from me. Ubuntu set up and was completely customized in a half hour. (And entirely up-to-date).
As for stability, I went through six months of software crashes on Windows. Still don't know what caused it, but drivers are what I'm suspecting. On a regular basis, at least once a week and typically once or twice every two days, my computer would freeze entirely and have to be reboot.
Then I had a lovely conversation (three, actually) with tech support. The last one was the most annoying. "Hallo, mynameisDave. I live in Geeohrgeeuh, that's in Ahmehrika." Ugh. Then they gave me the same instructions despite me telling them that I'd already done that the last two times I was on tech support, and it wasn't helping. Then he tried to pitch a $100 warranty extension because I was two weeks from the end of my warranty and he refused to replace it because "Sohftwere prooblems are noht coovered" by my current warranty.
But don't worry about that--I blame the crappy support on HP, not Microsoft.
I DO, however, blame the mystery freezes on Windows.
I've only had Linux crash once since I installed it, and only because I did something stupid with a new cursor theme. To fix it, all I had to do was press ctrl-alt-backspace to back out to the login screen, log back in with failsafe-gnome mode, and unset the theme. Problem solved.
As for your complaint of "visually underdeveloped", may I just show you my new lover:
http://img451.imageshack.us/img451/1078/amarokri4.png
AmaroK kicks the hell out of any Windows or Mac music manager/players, visuals included.
You're right, though--visually, most Linux programs aren't quite up to par. And some are missing some functionality at the moment--but that's because of what they are. Linux programs aren't typically released at 1.0. Usually they're already hitting the market at 0.1 as a beta, because people want the functionality ASAP. Then, it's taken, finished, updated, and improved upon, not by highly-paid programmers working for a multi-million dollar corporation, but by a few part-time coders working at home. So, yeah, it isn't as well-developed all the time. I still use it without any troubles, though.
I even game on Linux-- Savage, Enemy Territory, Tremulous, Glest. All work flawlessly on Linux.
And hey, Savage and Glest weren't even in the repositories for Ubuntu, so I had to install them manually. No biggie. Just downloaded a .run file and extracted it. Bam. Done.

Quote:

---

And hey, Savage and Glest weren't even in the repositories for Ubuntu, so I had to install them manually. No biggie. Just downloaded a .run file and extracted it. Bam. Done.[/b]

---

That is most definitely the exception rather than the rule.

Support for anything these days is shit (you'd do better to ask someone you know). I'm definitely betting on bad drivers there - which is ironic, since we're talking about unsigned/signed drivers. That would explain STOP screens, freezes, and frankly pretty much anything wrong.

Vista actually moves a lot of things into user mode as opposed to kernel mode so that, like Linux, when a driver fucks up, it doesn't crash and burn: it stops, restarts the driver and gets back to work [telling you what's happened of course].

I've got an uptime of three weeks and over on Vista RC1 here, which is not even RTM. I think that's a testament to the fact that it can be just as stable as Linux. I honestly think something is wrong with people who claim their computers stop working after thirty minutes "because of Windows" (which is a lot like saying your car stopped working because you dropped twenty spanners into the car's engine but it's still Ford's fault, but yeah).

On other notes, AmaroK is basically 10x better than anything else in the same ballpark, although reccomending Green Day for anything is a travesty I might consider unforgivable in any other circumstance. I consider that program in particular a testament of how open source can work and work wonders, but as you say, and as I found myself, too many programs have a very raw, unpolished feel to them.

Vista's UI is better than KDE, no kidding. Linux is ugly although it really never bothered me that much. Distros are increasingly putting in compositors and crap, but I still feel that with the exception of Macs, nothing has come quite up to the same level as Vista yet. Including XGL (I care about 'jelly windows' like, at all?)

I often wonder about open source and the scrum philosophy it's adopted. It's a lot of disjointed developers all with different things they want to do; I want to know how they intend to achieve true consistency throughout programs. You tell me Linux's UI is consistent, you would be the biggest liar ever.

I'm guessing it was drivers that caused the crashes, but that wouldn't be my fault--I installed Windows certified drivers whenever possible, but my wireless card, my printer, and my sound card had drivers unsupported by Windows--again, something I blame on HP for putting together a crappily supported computer.
My point with the whole drivers bit is that on Linux, you don&#39;t need to worry about signed drivers--if they&#39;re in the kernel, they&#39;re supported. And their support database, despite being far younger than Microsoft&#39;s, is much larger as far as I can tell. Printer support is the only thing I&#39;ve found lacking--I can&#39;t use the &#036;30 Lexmark printer/scanner I got for christmas because Lexmark refuses to publish Mac or Linux drivers for it. <Asses.>
Everything else in Ubuntu is automated--I&#39;ve never heard of a driver problem with anything but custom game controllers, printers, wireless cards and dial-up modems, in all cases because of the massive variation between individual products.

On the Green Day thing--I hadn&#39;t noticed that recommendation--creepy. Green Day, recommended to a Queen listener? Doesn&#39;t seem quite compatible to me.
Although, I must say Green Day was pretty awesome. It&#39;s just the band&#39;s new "vengeful emo" look and sound that bugs the crap out of me. Green Day, you are dead to me.

On Open Source development--that&#39;s why I&#39;m an Ubuntu user. Ubuntu&#39;s organization and community is quite adept and producing quality work in an organized fashion. They put out regularly scheduled updates, have several teams of organized members with set goals, and generally work better together than the rest of the Linux community, which tends to be disjointed at best.
Here&#39;s an example of what I mean:
Ubuntu Team Specifications.

I&#39;m fully behind them on all their work--I really think that their new take on open source stands a good chance of success. I&#39;m a member of the Ubuntu Art Team (trying to put my two cents in to reduce the gap between Windows and Linux--not an easy thing to do, but a good goal to aim for).
Meanwhile, when Linux has shortcomings, I&#39;m not afraid to turn to Windows, just reluctant.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by MSG

[...]
[/b]

---

MSG, I think you just got the wrong distro. I mean, everyone&#39;s all "yay Ubuntu" but my personal experience with Ubuntu is crap times a thousand.

Yes I know Linux can be a huge bitch when it comes to hardware and often even the tiniest little typo in a config file can kill an entire application from working alltogether but my time with Fedora Core 6 on ONE PC was great (I mean, yay for yum&#33; It hadn&#39;t failed me, ever), but when I tried to install it on another PC of mine it just failed to work.

The thing is, Linux has a severe lack of SiS (SATA) Controller support and God, does that suck.

What distro of Ubuntu did you use? I haven&#39;t tried anything older than 6.06, but I haven&#39;t had any problems running it on my computer, or two of my friends and the computer downstairs.
It supports one of the widest (if not the widest) array of hardware of any Linux distro. It&#39;s also got the biggest community, and it&#39;s growing fastest, so the holes in its support are rapidly being plugged.

I ordered ten free Ubuntu disks.

I do not need them and am unlikely to use more than one of them (for VPC purposes).

Ha-ha.

I had a question about a new pc; I didn&#39;t want to make a new topic about it though, as... THERE&#39;S ALREADY ONE HERE&#33; Joy&#33; :P I buying this computer for gaming, plain and simple. (Gotta get Oblivion to run well... >_<) Based on the discussion here, Windows seems better for that. I&#39;m just beginning to get savvy with all this tech stuff, so go easy on me. My proficiency with computers is about that of Bush&#39;s speaking skills; I can talk, but the end result is... erm...

Basically, I got a price from my local pc shop. It&#39;s only a tower, as I have all the other hardware needed. It has a list of included hardware, but I don&#39;t know what alot of the hardward "titles" mean.

The PACKAGE
--------------------
Processor: Intel Core 2 Duo E6600 (2.4GHz - 4MB Cache - 1066MHz FSB - Socket 775) --- &#036;450

Motherboard: ASUS P5N-E SLi LGA775 Socket Intel Quad-Core, NVIDIA nForce 650i SLITM + nForce 430i, FSB1333/1 --- &#036;170

GFX Card: NVIDIA GF7950 GT KO-PCIE-512-E - EVGA 7950GT 512MB PCI Express --- &#036;400

Memory: PC2-5300 512MB 667MHz DDR II (Buffalo) --- &#036;80

Fan?: Coolermaster Centurion 5 Silver No Window, No Power Supply --- &#036;65

Power: 550 Watt CG PS-550W Dual 12V, Dual Fan, SATA, 24/20/8pin Power --- &#036;80

Disc Drive: 18x DVD+RW, Double Layer, Dual Format --- &#036;65

Hard Drive: 160GB 7200RPM Seagate SATA II w/NCQ --- &#036;95

OS: Windows --- &#036;120... or less... :D
----------------------
Comes to a grand total of about &#036;1,300... with tax. I know I could do better for gaming, but that&#39;s all that&#39;s in my price range right now. I&#39;m planning on getting another GF7950 card for SLi, but later, and prolly of Newegg when it&#39;s cheaper.

Is this worth it? It sounds alright to me, but then again, what do I know? Is there any reasonable way to get this for cheaper? Please, ANY advice, even "STFU noob&#33;, taht POS pc is teh suXXor" would be appreciated.

If you&#39;re even thinking of running Oblivion, you&#39;d better get at least another 512 MB of RAM. 1 GB is a pretty good benchmark for most computers nowadays, and having at least 1 gig is pretty much required for most any modern game.
And hell, if you really need to keep the cost down, you don&#39;t really need to buy Windows. *cough*ThePirateBay.org*cough*.

EDIT:
Oh, and BTW, if those are the prices quoted to you by the computer shop, then chances are you&#39;re not getting a good deal. Check online, on something like Froogle, to see if you can find better prices on the components. Chances are you will.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Richter

I had a question about a new pc; I didn&#39;t want to make a new topic about it though, as... THERE&#39;S ALREADY ONE HERE&#33; Joy&#33; :P I buying this computer for gaming, plain and simple. (Gotta get Oblivion to run well... >_<) Based on the discussion here, Windows seems better for that. I&#39;m just beginning to get savvy with all this tech stuff, so go easy on me. My proficiency with computers is about that of Bush&#39;s speaking skills; I can talk, but the end result is... erm...

Basically, I got a price from my local pc shop. It&#39;s only a tower, as I have all the other hardware needed. It has a list of included hardware, but I don&#39;t know what alot of the hardward "titles" mean.

The PACKAGE
--------------------
Processor: Intel Core 2 Duo E6600 (2.4GHz - 4MB Cache - 1066MHz FSB - Socket 775) --- &#036;450

Motherboard: ASUS P5N-E SLi LGA775 Socket Intel Quad-Core, NVIDIA nForce 650i SLITM + nForce 430i, FSB1333/1 --- &#036;170

GFX Card: NVIDIA GF7950 GT KO-PCIE-512-E - EVGA 7950GT 512MB PCI Express --- &#036;400

Memory: PC2-5300 512MB 667MHz DDR II (Buffalo) --- &#036;80

Fan?: Coolermaster Centurion 5 Silver No Window, No Power Supply --- &#036;65

Power: 550 Watt CG PS-550W Dual 12V, Dual Fan, SATA, 24/20/8pin Power --- &#036;80

Disc Drive: 18x DVD+RW, Double Layer, Dual Format --- &#036;65

Hard Drive: 160GB 7200RPM Seagate SATA II w/NCQ --- &#036;95

OS: Windows --- &#036;120... or less... :D
----------------------
Comes to a grand total of about &#036;1,300... with tax. I know I could do better for gaming, but that&#39;s all that&#39;s in my price range right now. I&#39;m planning on getting another GF7950 card for SLi, but later, and prolly of Newegg when it&#39;s cheaper.

Is this worth it? It sounds alright to me, but then again, what do I know? Is there any reasonable way to get this for cheaper? Please, ANY advice, even "STFU noob&#33;, taht POS pc is teh suXXor" would be appreciated.
[/b]

---

&#036;1,300 for that? It&#39;s pretty good, but not THAT good. Double/triple the RAM and you&#39;ll be fine, except for the prices. You&#39;re being ripped off - 160GB 7200RPM SATA II for &#036;100? Dude, I got the 320GB version for the exact same price. &#036;80 for 512 MB RAM is reasonable but there are better deals out there. Also, &#036;450 for the motherboard? Damn.

I think you should look for a better deal in terms of pricing, but the specs aren&#39;t too bad.

Those prices are a rip.

-The E6600 should cost you no more than &#036;350
-&#036;400 for a 7950GT? You could get a 8800GTS 640MB for that price&#33;
-They sell 512MB for a price that could buy 1GB (and 2GB is recommended)
-DVD Drive, they doubled the price
-Motherboard, not too bad, but it&#39;s almost the same cost a P5B-Deluxe
-Hard Drive, you could get 320GB for what they charge.

Do what TweaK said, look for better deals in pricing, or maybe it a shot and build one yourself.

If you&#39;re building one yourself - has anyone suggested http://tigerdirect.com, or sometimes ever http://newegg.com

If you have an Electronic Fry&#39;s near you, go there instead, Most of the time their prices are even better than tigerdirect or newegg.

Sorry it took a while to respond, but I&#39;m definitely still interested.

Tsen: Yeah, I know I&#39;m not getting the BEST deals... but I&#39;m in no way confident enough in my knowledge of computers to build one myself. Maybe someday soon I&#39;ll be able to, but not yet. I&#39;m just generally asking if I&#39;m not getting TOTALLY ripped off. BTW I made a mistake in that post; that price for the memory is for TWO sticks of 512, so all&#39;s good there.

Yeah, about "buying" windows, I have this friend who knows this friend who&#39;s cousin works for Microsoft, and he might be able to get me a REALLY good deal on Vista... :bigteeth:

TweaK: How might I get a better deal without building the computer myself?

blade5x: Again, where might I find better deals without building myself? There are no real electronics stores around me except for Best Buy, and I&#39;m guessing I&#39;d get ripped off WORSE there...

I&#39;ve tried NewEgg, and have actually bought a GFX card from them before. (It was a Radeon X800 GT at &#036;150, &#036;50 less than at the PC shop. Unfortunately, I had to have the shop install the card for me as I was REALLY a noob at computers back then. I can put a GFX card in nowadays, but don&#39;t know bout motherboards, memory sticks, etc...)

Is there a tutorial or such on building a PC? From what I understand, one needs the basic componenets: case, motherboard, processor, gfx card, possibly sound card, memory, hard drive, possibly fan, power source, and a disc drive.

I don&#39;t know how to install memory, power source, or processor onto a motherboard. I might have an idea on how to install a fan and disc drive. I know how to do GFX cards and sound cards. I&#39;m willing to try building myself, but I need to know EXACTLY what I&#39;m doing, like a step-by-step process. I&#39;m willing to take smart risks; smart as in possibly &#036;400 cheaper&#33; :wink:

Building a computer really is not that hard.

Finding compatible parts is actually harder than assembling the computer itself. Finding the parts takes time and research.

I&#39;m not sure where a step-by-step guide is, but I suggest you go for it anyway. If you order all of your parts and have any questions while assembling it, I&#39;d be happy to help you out.

It does take some patience for the first build. No need to rush it.

I&#39;m not big of pre-built retailers, but I think ibuypower.com has some pretty decent prices. I do not know of much else, because like I said, I&#39;m into the pre-built thing ;)

Building a computer is dead easy, you should have no problems with it as long as you&#39;re not retarded. Everything is built to fit together, you&#39;ll have to do minimal screwing, some clamping, but definitely not any soldering. If you&#39;re still not too confident, get a nerd friend to show you how it&#39;s done and you&#39;ll see how easy it is.

My uncle is educating me about comuters; he got me an A+ study guide by Sybex, and that has just about everything that you need to know to make you computer knowlegeable. not 733t, but you know, pretty good.

Building a computer is dead easy, you should have no problems with it as long as you&#39;re not retarded.

Uh, but i is ARE redarted&#33;? o no i kant bild cumpewter&#33;&#33;&#33;&#33;

:bigteeth:

Alright, I&#39;m pretty much convinced to build my own now, as after looking at the prices on newegg compared to Milwaukee PC, it&#39;s would amount to a HUGE difference.

Problem is, I don&#39;t know exactly what to buy. I&#39;m guessing similar hardware to what the pc shop recommended, but whatever works is fine with me. Also, I&#39;m pretty set on buying from newegg; I&#39;ve always recieved good deals and such from them.

So, I can get a Hard Drive from Best Buy. Same with a DVD drive and fan, etc... I&#39;m looking at the processor, GFX card, motherboard, and memory. What would you all recommend/what do you all use? Be specific, as I don&#39;t know the subtle differences between two pieces of hardware&#33;

The main problem is getting parts that fit together. You&#39;re going to want to have a motherboard that supports your desired CPU and has your desired slots.

What&#39;s your budget?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by PNG_pyro

My uncle is educating me about comuters; he got me an A+ study guide by Sybex, and that has just about everything that you need to know to make you computer knowlegeable. not 733t, but you know, pretty good.[/b]

---

Sybex? Never heard of them - What topics does it cover? "Computer knowledgeable" is too general, you can say you know a lot about History but that doesn&#39;t mean diddly. :P

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by PNG_pyro

Building a computer is dead easy, you should have no problems with it as long as you&#39;re not retarded.

I&#39;m looking at the processor, GFX card, motherboard, and memory. What would you all recommend/what do you all use? Be specific, as I don&#39;t know the subtle differences between two pieces of hardware&#33;[/b]

---

Well, it really depends on what you&#39;re looking to use your computer for - If it&#39;s gaming, every nerd in here would have a field day picking out parts for you, but if you&#39;re just looking for a computer that let&#39;s you check Dreamviews every month or so then we&#39;re talking about a whole different setup. What will you be using this computer for? How much do you have to spend? etc.