Thread: Jeff777's Free-falling WILD technique!

Originally Posted by rynkrt3

Since this is labeled as a WILD technique, maybe you should include "How to transition from SP to a LD" into the thread.

Hm. I suppose in all my years here and practicing LD'ing, I've assumed people kind of knew what to do given a WBTB and a sleep paralysis induction technique but.. that's my fault. You're not the first person to ask me how does one use this method to transition into a WILD. I suppose editing the original post to explain that, or linking to another page of mine in which that is explained would do some good. Thank you rynkrt3.

Originally Posted by Robot_Butler

This is an excellent guide, Jeff! It is hard to describe that illogical-thinking state you get into right before you fall asleep. You rock!

Thanks man.

Originally Posted by rynkrt3

I tried creating my own "chaos" process last night. My mind was basically blank. I started to thing about some weird shit, a few minutes later, the weird thoughts started pouring in, but as soon as I noticed them/paid attention to them, they went away and I had to start the process over, so I did. Yet again the weird thoughts starting coming in without my help, but as I tried to "passively notice" them, they went away again.

This does work, and it works well. I just need to figure out why this is happening.

Any advice?

Sure. It sounds as if you're kind of "surprising" yourself once these thoughts come in, therefore shifting you into an ALPHA state of relaxation. Work on just passively observing without giving too much active focus to the illogical imagery. Attention goes where energy flows remember. Also, you're going to hate me for this but the only advice I can give a person at this point is to..












































Keep practicing. The WILD forums popular "Mind Awake, Body Asleep" SP induction thread I started that received over 1,000 comments and over 130,000 views had many people succeed overnight, many people that claimed they couldn't do it, and many people that reached road blocks. I helped answer as many questions as I possibly could over the course of 3 years within that thread and the main problem I identified that most people kept tripping up on was unrealistic expectations. They expect to find one method, one technique, one word of advice that will make them PRO overnight. When they don't get that PRO feeling in an amount of time that they think they deserve, they give up and go from "I'm having trouble" to "I quit.. this doesn't work".

A dear good friend of mine I met a few years ago out of California started practicing LD'ing at the tender age of 14. She's now 25. She has 2 - 3 lucid dreams per night. She's mastered DILD and has mastered WILD. Many know her here as Naiya. Thing is.. she stuck with it. She never changed her routines too much and after two years of persistently working on a routine and practicing every night, she achieved mastery level. Now.. she's just ridiculous at at.

Another friend of mine started WILD'ing when she was young, thought it was normal and kept doing it over and over without fail. She has about 5 - 6 WILD's (just WILD's), per night. her name may is Silph, from Norway. She used to be a dream guide here.

One more dear buddy of mine took a lucid dreaming book and started practicing. Without giving up, he tried and failed many many times over the course of a few years. But now, he is regarded as a lucid dreaming pro. He's gotten to the point where he only has non-lucid dreams once or twice per month. That's all. His name is Walms. I asked him once what does he think about people being "naturals" at lucid dreaming and thinking he's a natural at it. He said that the idea was ridiculous. He said he worked his butt off night after night to get to where he is and hard work and persistence is the only thing he attributes his successes to.

These aren't the only pro's but they're the ones whose stories I've become most familiar with. What they all have in common is persistence, flexibility in their approach and vision to keep going for the gold.

Sure I'm biased toward my methods, but there are countless methods on DV that I also like and have helped tons of members. As long as you're doing things right, then just keep practicing mate. Anything worth doing, is worth doing well. Regardless of the technique chosen.

Ah yes. I have had many moments of my lucid dreaming life (1 year? Not very long) with WILD, where I'm like YES I will do this, I just need to practice. To make a long story short, it didn't work out, I didn't really try to hard, and just gave up. I think this technique simplify s the WILD a lot, I will practice this until I get it down pat, I will become a master WILD'r

If you don't mind, I'm gonna post my little "recap" of what I think I should be doing, and if there's any faults I would greatly appreciate them to be pointed out, mainly so I don't waste time practicing a wrong technique

1. Whether in a WBTB or not, lie down and relax for a few minutes. Let your mind wander, but don't go unconscious.
2. Try to passively observe your thoughts as they become weird and illogical (dream like) Don't pay to much attention or they will fade away and you will mentally wake up some.
3. Once these thoughts start to occur, get on your back and do deep breathing until your body takes over, kinda like forcing the "Chaos" thoughts, but with breathing.
4. Once your body has taken over your breathing, and your mind is going thru weird thoughts and images. Try to remain aware until you hit SP ( I'm confused on how to remain to just aware enough without waking your mind up. For me, when I try to retain awareness, it just keeps me awake.)

Sorry for all the question. Just trying to make sure I didn't mis read the information... which I kinda do a lot.

Originally Posted by rynkrt3

Ah yes. I have had many moments of my lucid dreaming life (1 year? Not very long) with WILD, where I'm like YES I will do this, I just need to practice. To make a long story short, it didn't work out, I didn't really try to hard, and just gave up. I think this technique simplify s the WILD a lot, I will practice this until I get it down pat, I will become a master WILD'r

If you don't mind, I'm gonna post my little "recap" of what I think I should be doing, and if there's any faults I would greatly appreciate them to be pointed out, mainly so I don't waste time practicing a wrong technique

1. Whether in a WBTB or not, lie down and relax for a few minutes. Let your mind wander, but don't go unconscious.
2. Try to passively observe your thoughts as they become weird and illogical (dream like) Don't pay to much attention or they will fade away and you will mentally wake up some.
3. Once these thoughts start to occur, get on your back and do deep breathing until your body takes over, kinda like forcing the "Chaos" thoughts, but with breathing.
4. Once your body has taken over your breathing, and your mind is going thru weird thoughts and images. Try to remain aware until you hit SP ( I'm confused on how to remain to just aware enough without waking your mind up. For me, when I try to retain awareness, it just keeps me awake.)

Sorry for all the question. Just trying to make sure I didn't mis read the information... which I kinda do a lot.

For the most part that's about the jist of it. If I can add a few more tweaks, it'd be this:

Step 1: Freefall. What you're doing here is trying to go to sleep as fast as possible. If lying on your side is how you normally sleep, lie on your side. If lying on your back is how you sleep, then lie on your back. Lying on your back will simply keep you from having to readjust later. Remember though.. Step 2: Chaos theory, is where you move toward next UNTIL you notice the images creating by themselves. You can either create them yourself or wait for them to come in by themselves while still free-falling. The point is, for you, once I notice chaos, I would move toward step 3.

Once you start noticing illogical images and patterns (only the illogical ones signals the cue to move on!) making its way into your mind, then you’re ready to move to step three

If chaos has started already, you don't have to continue passively observing chaos. Chaos coming in on its own is just the SIGNAL'ing CUE to let you know that the neocortex and frontal lobe are shutting down the reasoning centers, ergo putting the body to sleep. So now YOUR job is to move to step 3, then step 4. Since you have trouble keeping awareness. I recommend you incorporate logic into step 5

(Remember, no more chaos for you at this point.. passively watching chaos at this stage will only cause you to fall deeper and deeper and into unconscious dreaming. CREATING chaos at this point isn't necessary either because that will cause you to slip deeper and deeper and repeat the process In your case though, it'll keep you awake. Chaos is only meant to be used as a signaling cue for beginners. For those that want to fall deeper, Creating chaos is only to be used to deepen the state.)

Step 5. Try using this..

One thing I’ve found that helps me is by mentally repeating, in between breaths, “I remain consciously aware as my body falls to sleep”. If you want to maintain logic, reasoning and awareness as your body falls to sleep, - in between breaths, mentally count down from 100 - 1. You should shift into sleep paralysis before you get to 1. If you haven't shifted yet, Count down again. The shift is unmistakable. You may feel vibrations, a wave of energy sweep over you, a lead blanket being pulled over you, or you may even notice your hearing shift from external to internal (real time hearing). All of these are indicators that you've successfully (and consciously) entered into sleep paralysis.

I think maybe where you're getting caught up on as well is when to use chaos. I wouldn't recommend trying to initiate it myself unless you're good at catching yourself before you hit the ground, and are good at passively observing your own thoughts. But remember, it's only meant to be used as a signal'ing cue in step 2 to LET you know it's time to move to step 3.


Friend, does that help?

Originally Posted by Jeff777

For the most part that's about the jist of it. If I can add a few more tweaks, it'd be this:

Step 1: Freefall. What you're doing here is trying to go to sleep as fast as possible. If lying on your side is how you normally sleep, lie on your side. If lying on your back is how you sleep, then lie on your back. Lying on your back will simply keep you from having to readjust later. Remember though.. Step 2: Chaos theory, is where you move toward next UNTIL you notice the images creating by themselves. You can either create them yourself or wait for them to come in by themselves while still free-falling. The point is, for you, once I notice chaos, I would move toward step 3.

If chaos has started already, you don't have to continue passively observing chaos. Chaos coming in on its own is just the SIGNAL'ing CUE to let you know that the neocortex and frontal lobe are shutting down the reasoning centers, ergo putting the body to sleep. So now YOUR job is to move to step 3, then step 4. Since you have trouble keeping awareness. I recommend you incorporate logic into step 5

(Remember, no more chaos for you at this point.. passively watching chaos at this stage will only cause you to fall deeper and deeper and into unconscious dreaming. CREATING chaos at this point isn't necessary either because that will cause you to slip deeper and deeper and repeat the process In your case though, it'll keep you awake. Chaos is only meant to be used as a signaling cue for beginners. For those that want to fall deeper, Creating chaos is only to be used to deepen the state.)

Step 5. Try using this..

I think maybe where you're getting caught up on as well is when to use chaos. I wouldn't recommend trying to initiate it myself unless you're good at catching yourself before you hit the ground, and are good at passively observing your own thoughts. But remember, it's only meant to be used as a signal'ing cue in step 2 to LET you know it's time to move to step 3.


Friend, does that help?

Helps a ton man, cleared up every question I had. Thank you

Alright so last night, I put my alarm across my room, and set it to 4:30 am. I put it in a place where I would have to stand up from bed, walk to where my alarm is, and turn it off. Somehow, when I woke up this morning, my cell phone (which is my alarm) was lying beside me, in my bed. So basically, I stood up, turned my alarm off, and went back to bed unconsciously, therefore I was not able to attempt your technique .

Originally Posted by AndresLD

Alright so last night, I put my alarm across my room, and set it to 4:30 am. I put it in a place where I would have to stand up from bed, walk to where my alarm is, and turn it off. Somehow, when I woke up this morning, my cell phone (which is my alarm) was lying beside me, in my bed. So basically, I stood up, turned my alarm off, and went back to bed unconsciously, therefore I was not able to attempt your technique .

Aww, haha. Happened to me on a number of occasions. Just give 'er another go.

Originally Posted by AndresLD

Alright so last night, I put my alarm across my room, and set it to 4:30 am. I put it in a place where I would have to stand up from bed, walk to where my alarm is, and turn it off. Somehow, when I woke up this morning, my cell phone (which is my alarm) was lying beside me, in my bed. So basically, I stood up, turned my alarm off, and went back to bed unconsciously, therefore I was not able to attempt your technique .

I have the same problem (3 days in a row, I hope the next will be better). Today I didn't even wake up (or I don't remember).

All my help questions have been responded to, I'm now ready to start tinkering with this until I'm a master WILD'r!

I do, however, have a curiosity question. To Jeff777, how long, using this method, did it take you to be able to have WILD's almost any time you attempted?

Originally Posted by rynkrt3

All my help questions have been responded to, I'm now ready to start tinkering with this until I'm a master WILD'r!

I do, however, have a curiosity question. To Jeff777, how long, using this method, did it take you to be able to have WILD's almost any time you attempted?

Well I've been playing with the MABA (Mind Awake, Body Asleep) state since early 2007. Over the course of several years of being aware of the process, I developed this technique as an offshoot from it. I have a while to go before I'm at mastery level but I would probably say it took me around 1.5 - 2 years to get to the point of having at least one WILD per night using the steps laid herein this thread.

Good luck.

2 years using this? Fuuuuu.....

Originally Posted by rynkrt3

2 years using this? Fuuuuu.....

Haha, well everyone is different. And I always say you should never compare yourself to anyone other than the person you were yesterday. But if you want to truly master a skill.. say soccer.. how long does it take someone? Days? Weeks? Or years to be able to play in the world cup?

Sorry mate, 1 last question. Your relating chaos and image patterns. With me, I don't really see images, but I do start having chaos thoughts. Is this still the same cue to continue to the next steps?

Originally Posted by rynkrt3

Sorry mate, 1 last question. Your relating chaos and image patterns. With me, I don't really see images, but I do start having chaos thoughts. Is this still the same cue to continue to the next steps?

Yup. Some think things some see things. Either are representations of the reasoning centers shutting down.. in a manner of speaking.

My alarm clock has been failing to wake me up these days... makes it harder to WBTB.

Tried this with a WBTB after 5 hours of sleep. I lay in bed for about 3 minutes when I noticed chaos set in. Weird thoughts would come and go, but not continuous. I let that happen for about 2-3 minutes then rolled over to my back. I began the breathing step, I did that for a few minutes then just fell asleep

I was able to do WBTB, stayed awake for about half an hour. When I went back to sleep I started day dreaming, and after a while I started noticing the illogical thoughts. The only one that I remember was something about the Lion King and Hamlet, how they were kinda similar. Eventually I fell asleep unconsciously, but I will keep trying

Originally Posted by AndresLD

I was able to do WBTB, stayed awake for about half an hour. When I went back to sleep I started day dreaming, and after a while I started noticing the illogical thoughts. The only one that I remember was something about the Lion King and Hamlet, how they were kinda similar. Eventually I fell asleep unconsciously, but I will keep trying

Try incorporating logic. See the bullet points in Step 5. The illogical thoughts is just a cue to let you know it's time to move to the next step.

i've made it! I couldn't sleep for about an hour. But i wanted to sleep further because i needed some more sleep.
Then i decided to try the free-falling technique. I've done that before, but not knowing what it was.
So i layed still for a while. Let my mind do what it wanted to think. I don't remember what random thoughts i had, because i gave them no attention!
I didn't intend to WILD, but at some point i 'catched' my mind from falling deeper. It was the moment when sleep paralysis set in.
Sensations were going through my whole body and i was lifted a bit. As i was set back into my bed, i knew i was now dreaming. Opened my eyes and voila!

Originally Posted by lemonDrops

i've made it! I couldn't sleep for about an hour. But i wanted to sleep further because i needed some more sleep.
Then i decided to try the free-falling technique. I've done that before, but not knowing what it was.
So i layed still for a while. Let my mind do what it wanted to think. I don't remember what random thoughts i had, because i gave them no attention!
I didn't intend to WILD, but at some point i 'catched' my mind from falling deeper. It was the moment when sleep paralysis set in.
Sensations were going through my whole body and i was lifted a bit. As i was set back into my bed, i knew i was now dreaming. Opened my eyes and voila!

Congratulations mate! Where do you think most people mess up on this technique at and what would you recommend for them to combat that problem?

I mess up when having to wake up: I know I can do it, but first I need to get over that trouble.

Wait... You can induce SP at any time, just to practice getting into it before attempting WILD? I thought you had to be in REM. I've never tried WILD before, but I might because this tutorial sounds awesome.

Originally Posted by Jeff777

Try incorporating logic. See the bullet points in Step 5. The illogical thoughts is just a cue to let you know it's time to move to the next step.

I tried to, but I got carried away by my thoughts xP. My alarm didn't wake me up this morning, but I will set 2 alarms tonight, that should wake me up .
I'm planning to stick to this technique for a while, most of my WILDs have been achieved through this technique basically, so might as well !

Originally Posted by Jeff777

Congratulations mate! Where do you think most people mess up on this technique at and what would you recommend for them to combat that problem?

I think it's impatience. If you are trying to WILD, you will fail because you consciously try. Falling asleep requires that you let go your awareness. This should be the part doing free falling. The trick now is, that you recognize the inset of sleep paralysis or the dream entry.

Just my 2 cents, and for myself i've had only 2 successful WILDs at all.
It's all about trying and experimenting for yourself, everybody's different.

To summarize what i did for my last WILD:
I slept for about 3-4 hours, was drinking all night. So i think i had no REM at all. Then, i couldn't fall asleep anymore, so many things kept my mind busy. I was totally alert, but my body was tired. At first, i allowed my breathing to go deeper, and tried not of thinking anything (like void meditation) soon my mind got cought by random thoughts, i just let it go with it. Free-falling. Then i cought the inset of sleep paralysis, and just observed it passively. try not to interrupt it. you will notice when it's over. Don't take this for reality, you will most likely have a false awakening

I will make an afternoon nap later
EDIT: Failed but had a good nap

This will be perfect for me! I haven't been on here in a while because I decided to take a break from all things lucid to try and rejuvenate my poor, over-worked brain. WBTB is my main problem so this, hopefully, should work for me. I'm quite used to observing my illogical thoughts so perhaps I have a head start