Problems geting SP... Seems almost like I black out?

So I seem to be having problems getting any kind of SP. Either that or I'm getting it and just not realizing it which I doubt highly. It seems that when I do get comfortable and relax. After about, maybe... 20min "sometimes longer" I seem to get what I call a black out. ("It's probably not but only my mind shifting.") They usually happen without me realizing it until they are over. During it, it's like, well I stop hearing things completely, I don't really feel anything, and I can't recall any thoughts while I am in it.

I usually can tell when it happens. I'll listen to binaural beats with earplugs, and wear my industrial strength ear muffs. I'll notice the sound kicks out were I stop hearing it for about, maybe a little less than a second. Just enough for me to notice it and them, bam, I seem to pop back to the point were I can hear stuff.

Sometimes I end up getting caught up in a dream by accident when it happens, then when I come out of it, I'll accidentally move as I was in the dream. Which ruins it for the most part.

I'll include what happened last night in detail for people who love details ^_^

First off, my bedroom is dark and silent. Except for a cat in my upstairs who keeps meowing. So I wear my ear muffs and ear plugs. I tried my binaural beats again. Which usually seem to help. I then laid down. I sat there for well a good hour and a half. Within the first 15 min, I was just relaxing. Slowly counting down with each breath, and trying to let my mind wander but not too far. After that I started to visualize dream scenarios, to let my mind, get my mind, off of what I was trying to do. I do this so my body can relax naturally without my mind worrying about it.

I remember having one blackout once, and a feeling afterworlds of my head.... almost spinning xD But then I slipped into a dream state but woke up about a half hour later. Then tried it for a little longer, and once again, fell asleep for the rest of my trials that night. -_-

Oh well anything is progress. I just was interested in knowing if theres something I do wrong at all. Or what these could be. I am very interested in any input. Anything can help. ;) I'll probably be trying again tonight, and tomorrow night, and every night from here on out. I am very determined for this to work eventually. :D

Also just a side note, feel free to ask questions.

Well, and this may surprise you, those 'black outs' are a good thing! It's a great sign that you're really close to falling asleep, and if you hold on to your awareness, after a couple of these when you snap back to awareness you may find yourself drawn into sleep paralysis or a dream :)

Thank you for your reply! Thats fantastic news! :) The most of these I've been through in one night seemed to be around five or six. Because this one night I managed to have them consecutively. It was like one right after the other for about three times straight. The only problem is it seems I can never keep my awareness once in a dream. I seem to forget its a dream, and forget how I got there. I seem to think of nothing outside of it, and due to that can't be lucid while in it >_<

Oh well I guess with practice I will train my mind to know. ;)

Tonight I'll try it again. No guarantee's, I don't always get them. But then again, I can imagine a inexperienced person like myself may struggle with simple stuff yet. xD Oh well I'll post results tomorrow morning.

What I do to remember that I'm still dreaming even after becoming lucid is that I tell myself the current date and remind myself where my physical body is. For some reason this gives me the highest quality LD I could ever possibly have if I remember to do it. :)

Thats a cool way to do it I guess. I just don't seem to remember anything once I'm in a dream... Hmnn.. Its funny, in my dreams often I do the impossible, but yet I cannot realize it's a dream xD Last night was neat. I had maybe two blackouts, and all of that fun stuff. Then I got this itch on my elbow, but I ignored it. Then I was suddenly in a random dream, then I came out of it and for no apparent reason. I honestly cannot remember why I did this. But I just stopped all together and went to bed. :/ I don't even remember why I stopped. xD

Oh well I try it again tonight. I've also been trying to remind myself when I wake up not to move, so I can try to LD that way.

That sounds like a good plan! Keep at it. :)

Yea I feel it may take a while, well I can't say it will. But it feels like it will take a while before I can actually do some of this. But I will eventually, and thats the point of all of this.

Yeah it may, but when you start to have LD regularly it will be sure to pay off. :)

Yea it will. If only I could have been one of those people who was able to do it on their first try... xD

Yeah, that would have been awesome if I could've done that too. :D

Yea. I envy people who get to have SP on their first try. Considering I have been trying this for about four months I seem to get rather frustrated with myself when I fail to reach SP and yet know someone got it on their first try. >_> I must sound selfish saying stuff like this.

They way I look at it. At least when I do finally get it, I will have a great feeling of accomplishment from spending all this time training myself to try and get it working.

No it's not selfish at all. I think that almost everybody feels that way. We all want to be able to have LDs anytime we want. Ill feel the same sense of accomplishment after I achieve my goal. :)

Well thats nice to know. Tonight I plan on attempting this again. I will hope for the best but be willing to accept another failure if need be, I can always try again tomorrow night. Not that I have already given up on tonight, after all, the SP I have had that I hadn't ever tried to cause came when I least expected it, and did nothing to cause it that was special. I just woke up into it. So who knows, maybe I'll get lucky :)

I'll post results tomorrow.

I too am going to try a WILD tonight. I have been trying for the past couple months with little success.

I wish you luck! :)

Question:

Do you want to experience SP or do you want to WILD?

I would like to experience them both. Experiencing SP, finally, I think would help me better understand it. So If I would better understand SP then it may help lead to making WILD more easier. Although I doubt it will make anything easier, it still would be nice to finally experience it.

Everyone says you experience SP when attempting a WILD. I however never, have ever, experienced SP in the whole 4 months of my trials on it. -_- Don't get my wrong, I do believe I will eventually get it, but its frustrating when I try so many times, and get nowhere. I just try to ignore the frustration though, and make it go away.

As for last night, I first went to bed at 1am. I think I may have been too tired. I couldn't really relax all that well. I laid there for a half hour, then I figured I wasn't able to relax for whatever reason, and told myself I would try again tonight.

Also a side question. Is there anything to look for as any kind of sign in this whole thing? Like your heart rate changing or anything like that?

Not everyone experiences SP when they WILD. Take me for exsample, I don't feel anything when I WILD. That makes it a little tricky for me because I don't know when to RC. :)

What I hate is when I'll move how I would in a dream at random and it breaks my concentration, or causes me to move something after I had already moved.

Yeah it's hard to stay focused sometimes. :)

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Originally Posted by Flash619

Everyone says you experience SP when attempting a WILD.

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I don't, and neither do most experienced WILDers.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Flash619

Also a side question. Is there anything to look for as any kind of sign in this whole thing? Like your heart rate changing or anything like that?

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I wrote up a reference guide on the subject recently.

I know it's just it seems most how-to's on the subject talk about vibrations, so for those who don't feel any, I guess it can become rather confusing.

I love that reference guide!!! :D

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Originally Posted by Flash619

I know it's just it seems most how-to's on the subject talk about vibrations, so for those who don't feel any, I guess it can become rather confusing.

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That's misinformation for ya. ^.^

So then what would someone expect?

I don't get any physical sensations but I sure get some visualization as soon as SP kicks in. :)

I usually watch my thoughts develop on their own, then they start making pictures like a dream, and usually I get caught up in it and fall asleep that way -_- Once again forgetting the fact that its a dream. Last night though I was in space :D

Yeah, I think there is a tutorial on the forums about that. Jeff's free falling WILD technique I believe its called. :)

Cool I'll definitely have to look that up! :D

Also what are some ways of helping yourself remember your in a dream?

Do you mean when you're already in a dream or when your WILDing?

Well every time I dream I seem to forget I'm in a dream no matter what I try before it. So maybe I'm trying the wrong things is what I'm thinking. So what would you do to remind yourself that your in a dream?

Oh I see. What I do is I anchor my self in the dream. There is a tutorial about that in the Wiki. I also try and do an RC every 5 minutes or so. I remember to do this because I tell myself " I'll do an RC in 5 minutes."
This usually works for me but sometimes it fails. I too also lose lucidy after I gain it. ;(

KK I'll look that stuff up! Its so annoying you go to sleep thinking, hey this will work this time. Then you wake up and realize it didn't work xD

I really should practice regular RC's...... but I never stick with it >_<

Yeah it is annoying after a while. :)

I do RC's every so often but not as much as I should.

I don't do them at all, so I guess I really should start xD

I just do them every 5-9 hours or so. ;)

What exactly do you do in them? I've always found that to be slightly confusing. Look at a clock or something?

Well, I pinch my nose and close my mouth and try to breath in. If I can then Im obviously dreaming. You could also look at a clock and read the time. Then look at it again and see the time. If the time changes drastically then your dreaming. There is a tutorial that describes in detail everything about RCs in the Wiki section. :)

Thats cool. I'm a bit worried though that if I find out I'm dreaming within a dream that I would get over excited or something and wake up.

It was weird for me the first few times but after awhile I learned how to remain calm. :)

Well I look forward to eventually learning to do the same thing! :)

Yeah, it really is a thrilling experience. :D

Hmnn I wounder, do dreams seem to last longer then?

Yeah, I do believe that when you are lucid the dream seems to last longer. Think about this, when you wake up do you feel like you slept a lifetime? Some people when they're lucid they live a whole life in one dream. :)

Nice, once again, more motivation to get this working! XD

Yep, motivation is the key to success! :D

Yep, were as frustration is not xD Although, for me it seems like frustration is the precursor to success.

As always tonight I'll try again, and let you know how it goes :D

I looked up his technique, but once again they talk about SP >________>

Oh well. Also what do they mean when they say your hearing shifts? As in hearing thoughts? For instance, playing a song in your head and suddenly it sounds real, like your actually hearing it through your ears?

Yeah. Its kind of like listening to the radio when there is no radio. :)

So then thats a sign that your close to the right track? Or does that mean your like 90% through it? Or I mean... If that's happening just were are you on the time line from awake, to SP or WILD ?

Lol stupid me and my requirement for every little detail xD

Its actually a little hard to say. It usually comes during the end though. You could also use the noise to introduce you to a dream which is a nice trick.

Well then maybe I got close to the end and never realized it!! :o

That sounds like a nice idea too! Hey if I don't completely fall asleep on my first attempt tonight I will definitely play around with different things like sound, and visions and such. Who knows, maybe I'll even get it to work! :) As I said, details will be posted in the morning as to how it went.

Ok cool. I have only succeed entering a LD by listing to sound around 3 or 4 times. It works quite efficiently. :)

So funny story. I don't think I got SP last night, but I did use what I had learned to get back to sleep this morning when I woke up, and couldn't get to sleep. Just a bit of relaxation and slow breathing ;) Worked like a charm, so I must be getting better at this.

Congrats, friend! ;)

I woke up for the alarm for WBTB last night but fell asleep too fast. Well, there is always tomorrow morning to try. :)

I tried WBTB But I found it made me too tired the next day, and was hard, considering there are other people and noise carries. But I did manage to always make myself wake up at like 1am somehow, by training my mind. Really just affirmations, of me telling myself I was going to wake up at, such and such, time. It worked for getting dreams, but I never really found much else in it than that.... maybe I was doing something wrong. I never got SP with it. only falling back to sleep. I had woken into SP once with it, for only a split second, and then fell back to sleep. Hmnn Oh well now i'm trying WILD and the one thing I like is not waking up in the middle of the night. But whatever works best. :)

I used to be able to train my mind to wake up but then I got lazy. :)

Hahaha, It just comes naturally for me, I don't know why. Just like how once I have a dream, I can never forget it, and can visualize it happening at any time. My mind is weird xD

lol Oh well, I'm off to bed. I'm so tired I have headaches, and feel like my brain is a brick. Post results in the morning again. :)

Same with me. :)

MEh last night all that happened was my hands got a little tingly. I eventually just decided that I needed the sleep and went to bed, because I honestly couldn't see me falling asleep that way last night. Almost too tired, although I don't think it works like that in this predicament.... but still.

Last night I didn't hear the alarm. :D

Haha Yea that was one of my fears of WBTB, along with the fear of it being to loud and startling me, and along with the worry, of waking up others.

Wait... Was not hearing it a good thing?

Nope. I slept right through the alarm when I was supposed to get out of bed and wake myself up. :lol:
Sometimes the alarm startles me so much I'm out of bed even before I even know what is happening. ( reflexes ) :lol:

Perhaps your mind got used to hearing it, that it is infective now? Maybe change it or something? So I got some Chamomile tea and am going to see how that works out before bed tonight! :)

Should be interesting!

I know what you mean with reflexes. One time while doing WBTB "although I never used an alarm" Would force myself up fast so I wouldn't fall back asleep. I got up a bit to quick and only after I got out of bed, realized I was actually awake xD

Chamomile tea? Is that just a spice or a flavor of tea?

To fix my alarm problem Ill turn it up higher and maybe change the noise that it makes. :)

While we're on topic, my main problem seems to be when I wake up for WBTB I never seem to be at a good medium. I'm either so tired I black out, or I'm so wired I can't sleep at all. I only got SP when I went to sleep at 12 at night, and I was out the whole night at a party far away and I didn't get good rest the night before

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Originally Posted by MarineRecon

Chamomile tea? Is that just a spice or a flavor of tea?

To fix my alarm problem Ill turn it up higher and maybe change the noise that it makes. :)

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It's a type of tea. Chamomile is known to be a very mild relaxant due to the glycine it contains. It also helps the immune system. Its known for many other things as well. So, heres a link that lists benefits! :)

apparently I can't post links because I have not been here seven days..... Just copy and paste.

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teabenefits.com/herbal-tea-benefits/chamomile-tea-benefits.html

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by Enargo

While we're on topic, my main problem seems to be when I wake up for WBTB I never seem to be at a good medium. I'm either so tired I black out, or I'm so wired I can't sleep at all. I only got SP when I went to sleep at 12 at night, and I was out the whole night at a party far away and I didn't get good rest the night before

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Have you tried waking up at different times? It could be that either one, your not sleeping enough, or two, are sleeping too long. Is there anything you eat or drink before bed? If so could it be a direct connection to you being to wired?

That would make sense though, how you got SP because your body was so tired it probably sent a sleep signal faster that it normally would, and shot you straight into REM.

Thanks for the link. Turns out I may actually have it! :D

That is awesome! :)

Last night I used two tea bags in one cup, it actually worked great! :D Still haven't gotten WILD to work... but In due time. Once I practice a bit. Something was bothering me yesterday. Not sure what. But it kept me from my meditation, and caused me to not be able to relax much... Also my dreams have been a lot more violent as of late... Hmnn. Oh Well these problems with me normally fix themselves anyway, no use worrying on something I can't change because I never knew what the problem was in the first place.

Makes sense right? xD