Thread: Sleep Paralysis Demystified

Originally Posted by dms111

I wasn't talking about a WBTB. I was talking about sleeping for nine hours, waking and immediately returning to sleep. I can feel SP take hold, I am very much paralyzed, and a dream begins to form immediately and after a few seconds I'm totally immersed in a dream. So where is the NREM?

Right where it should be. See for yourself.



You're still going to hit N1 and N2 sleep, no matter how far into things you are. Objectively, that's just how things work.

Originally Posted by dms111

Sleep paralysis is not a perfect term to use, but it is not incorrect when used on this forum. If anyone is incorrect it's the people who think sleep paralysis must be accompanied by a sense of terror. Sleep paralysis as described by the people on the typical sleep/health forums is incorrect. Sleep paralysis as a medical term is incorrect. How many sleep health doctors have actually learned to induce sleep paralysis on purpose to study it first hand? Not very many. They rely on the descriptions given by patients who are even more ignorant than they are.

Are you a "sleep health doctor" by chance? If so, I'd love to see where you acquired this information.

I'll admit, most everything I wrote about above comes from common knowledge, researching a few scientific sources, basic Psychology, and testimonials from knowledgeable people with the chronic condition. If you've got some peer reviewed work that blows all that out of the water, feel free to cite it.

Originally Posted by dms111

I too want to demystify sleep paralysis. But replacing a commonly used and misunderstood term with another commonly used and possibly misunderstood term does not seem like a step in the right direction. I'd rather teach people what sleep paralysis really is.

Sleep paralysis is full body paralysis caused by REM atonia. I've listed common symptoms above.

Sleep paralysis isn't characterized by the sensations that occur in NREM sleep.

Therefore, to call NREM sensations sleep paralysis is wholly incorrect and inaccurate. Hence my call for a change in terminology.

Pretty damn logical, if you ask me.

Originally Posted by dms111

When we perform a WILD our brain is asleep, yet we are still aware of ourselves. That's what it's all about. And that's exactly what happens to a person when they experience sleep paralysis the old fashioned way. Their awareness of themselves is awake while the rest of their brain is still asleep. Just like a WILD. But the average person doesn't know what's happening and panics. They aren't aware that a little mental discipline can allow them to control the sensations or to simply return to sleep.

This is all sorts of false, but that would be attacking a strawman.

What this does tell me is that you don't seem to understand or have a basic grasp of what happens in the brain during sleep and lucidity.

If you'd like to prove me wrong, a brief quiz I came up with in about two seconds:

What frequency (in regards to brain activity) has been recently associated with lucidity?

Name two cognitive processes that don't occur during normal sleep, but do during a lucid dream.

Name the parts of the brain responsible for the processes you listed above.

What is the function of the amygdala? The occipital lobes?

What about the dorsolateral prefrontal cortex?

If you know your stuff, this shouldn't take you long to fill in. I even put a few gimmes in there for you.

Originally Posted by dms111

Sleep paralysis as a medical term is incorrect.

I'm going to have to disagree with this also. I've read plenty of neuroscience journals that use this term, though it is often lengthened to Isolated Sleep Paralysis. As I stated earlier, I suffered from this condition for many years. I did see a psychologist briefly in regards to this and he used the term "Sleep Paralysis" as well.

Is the test really necessary? A healthy disagreement is allowed...

Sleep paralysis does seem to manifest in different ways for different people. So many factors in the human body, so many variables, it's impossible to make hard rules about physiological conditions.

Working to make a comprehensive list/guide of all the possible experiences would be more useful to the forum.

Originally Posted by melanieb

Is the test really necessary? A healthy disagreement is allowed...

I believe it is.

All of my guides are written with some fundamental, scientifically backed basics in mind. The questions in the quiz are trivial, and even if someone doesn't know the answers off the top of their head, they should be able to figure them out in no time at all.

A baseline is all I'm looking for. We could go back and forth on that stuff all day, but anyone who can't answer all the questions in that quiz really has nothing to go on except hearsay and their own experience. Which is fine until you're trying to make arguments against easily verifiable points.

Originally Posted by melanieb

Sleep paralysis does seem to manifest in different ways for different people.

Not true. Sleep paralysis (using the widely accepted definition, as defined in my posts above) is well studied and the symptoms are pretty typical across the board.

Originally Posted by melanieb

So many factors in the human body, so many variables, it's impossible to make hard rules about physiological conditions.

I truly hope you can see the flaws in your argument here, as I have the utmost respect for your ability to see reason, but I'll bring them to light anyways.

Consider, for a moment, that your assertion is true. Given this assumption, we say it is impossible to determine the workings of the human body.

As such, we as humans can never determine how the human eyes work and thus can never accurately and precisely adjust for imperfections in vision.

Of course, this is a contradiction of the years of research and successful progress made towards vision correction techniques.

Feel free to replace the vision example with whatever other physiological condition you see fit, and you'll see the results are the same. The fact of the matter is, we can figure this stuff out, and in the case of sleep paralysis the symptoms are well established, if not necessarily the causes.

In the OP, I presented a few theories that are worth looking into, given related research.

Originally Posted by melanieb

Working to make a comprehensive list/guide of all the possible experiences would be more useful to the forum.

Oh hey, looks like I did something useful then.

If you had read through the guide and all accompanying links, you'd see that I touch on just about every experience in both sleep paralysis and NREM sleep. I then make a distinction between the two, because that's where most newbies get tripped up the most, since ~90% of the forum doesn't understand the difference and thus offer misleading information instead of correcting flaws in the newbie's foundational knowledge.

Don't worry, though. I don't plan to write any more guides for this forum; I've given up trying to fix things here. It's just not a good environment for learning things well.

Unfortunately, it took me three years to realize that. Ah well, looks like that's another thing BillyBob and I now have in common. . .

Well I totally botched what I was trying to say I guess. Go ahead and slam me.

So what you guys are saying is that it's impossible to fall straight into REM from a state of wakefulness?

Originally Posted by Mzzkc

Are you a "sleep health doctor" by chance? If so, I'd love to see where you acquired this information.

When I say the medical term for sleep paralysis is incorrect I'm referring to the fear aspect. I understand that sleep paralysis is a real condition that people have. What I'm saying is incorrect is the idea that it has to be accompanied by a sense of fear or dread like you said here

Originally Posted by Mzzkc

Was it the most, or one of the most, terrifying experiences of your life?

'Cause if not, then it probably wasn't sleep paralysis. Especially if there was a lack of open-eyed HH/HI.

Sleep paralysis does not have to be accompanied by fear. I experienced sleep paralysis twice before I knew what lucid dreaming was. I felt the fear. Later I learned about lucid dreaming. Later I learned how to WILD by inducing sleep paralysis. Since I knew what was happening there was no fear. With no panic there is no fear. I was to busy anticipating the upcoming dream. These days I pass through sleep paralysis every time I WILD and there's still no fear. I refuse to believe that I am somehow special and immune to the fear. If I can go through sleep paralysis without fear than anyone can.

Originally Posted by Mzzkc

Sleep paralysis is full body paralysis caused by REM atonia. I've listed common symptoms above.

Sleep paralysis isn't characterized by the sensations that occur in NREM sleep.

Therefore, to call NREM sensations sleep paralysis is wholly incorrect and inaccurate. Hence my call for a change in terminology.

My views are not as far off from yours as they appear to be. Newbies frequently mistake hypnagogic hallucinations for sleep paralysis. I know these sensations can occur before sleep paralysis and are not always tied to it. But I have never tied them to NREM before. I always thought it was just a state of deep relaxation. Maybe this deep relaxation I'm thinking of is actually stage one of NREM. I was unaware that stage one of NREM actually occurs when you are still awake. So you are probably right in that what many people think is sleep paralysis is actually NREM. But the sensations that you describe as happening during NREM can also occur during sleep paralysis.

Originally Posted by Mzzkc

This is all sorts of false, but that would be attacking a strawman.

What this does tell me is that you don't seem to understand or have a basic grasp of what happens in the brain during sleep and lucidity.

Well I'm going to ask you to attack it. I don't know what happens to the brain during
sleep. I experience sleep paralysis frequently now that I've learned how to WILD. I feel I've woken during the night and I can not move. I feel like my body has disconnected from my mind. I know it's there but it feels like dead weight. I often feel a presence in the room and hear voices. When this happens I know exactly what it is so I simply relax and surrender to it and in no time at all I'm immersed in a lucid dream. But this has occurred so many times now that as soon as I realize I'm in sleep paralysis I turn my mind towards the upcoming dream and these hallucinations become part of the dream.

Do you think people can't experience sleep paralysis as their entering sleep? That it only occurs as they're waking up?

Originally Posted by dms111

Well I totally botched what I was trying to say I guess. Go ahead and slam me.

So what you guys are saying is that it's impossible to fall straight into REM from a state of wakefulness?

Technically speaking, yes.

Originally Posted by dms111

When I say the medical term for sleep paralysis is incorrect I'm referring to the fear aspect. I understand that sleep paralysis is a real condition that people have. What I'm saying is incorrect is the idea that it has to be accompanied by a sense of fear or dread like you said here

Right, that's just a commonly reported symptom and the source of many a newbie's unfounded fear. Like I pointed out in the OP, it probably has a lot to do with how the amygdala functions differently during sleep and wakefulness. Sudden shifts between these states, specifically to and from REM, can cause quite an experiential stir if the person is conscious for them.

Originally Posted by dms111

Sleep paralysis does not have to be accompanied by fear. I experienced sleep paralysis twice before I knew what lucid dreaming was. I felt the fear. Later I learned about lucid dreaming. Later I learned how to WILD by inducing sleep paralysis. Since I knew what was happening there was no fear. With no panic there is no fear. I was to busy anticipating the upcoming dream. These days I pass through sleep paralysis every time I WILD and there's still no fear. I refuse to believe that I am somehow special and immune to the fear. If I can go through sleep paralysis without fear than anyone can.

Yes, sleep paralysis can be traversed without fear, but for both first timers and those who understand what's happening, it takes a conscious effort to calm down and not freak out. The reasoning for this is simple: the malevolent presence triggers the flight or fight response, but since neither is possible fear kicks in. If the problem isn't dealt with or worked through logically, that fear will persist.

All that said, it is unusual to experience sleep paralysis during a WILD attempt. Sure most people might experience vibrations, HH, and the like, but objectively speaking a dream should have formed by then.

Originally Posted by dms111

My views are not as far off from yours as they appear to be. Newbies frequently mistake hypnagogic hallucinations for sleep paralysis. I know these sensations can occur before sleep paralysis and are not always tied to it. But I have never tied them to NREM before. I always thought it was just a state of deep relaxation. Maybe this deep relaxation I'm thinking of is actually stage one of NREM. I was unaware that stage one of NREM actually occurs when you are still awake. So you are probably right in that what many people think is sleep paralysis is actually NREM. But the sensations that you describe as happening during NREM can also occur during sleep paralysis.

Well, REM itself has a whole slew of sensations attributed to it that have nothing to do with sleep paralysis.

RobotButler provided a really cool article in one of the threads I linked to here that explains how spinning or falling sensations could potentially come about: http://www.dreamviews.com/f79/some-i...2/#post1872367

Originally Posted by dms111

Well I'm going to ask you to attack it. I don't know what happens to the brain during
sleep.

You should do some simple research into those questions, then. You might be surprised what you find. ^.^

Originally Posted by dms111

I experience sleep paralysis frequently now that I've learned how to WILD. I feel I've woken during the night and I can not move. I feel like my body has disconnected from my mind. I know it's there but it feels like dead weight. I often feel a presence in the room and hear voices. When this happens I know exactly what it is so I simply relax and surrender to it and in no time at all I'm immersed in a lucid dream. But this has occurred so many times now that as soon as I realize I'm in sleep paralysis I turn my mind towards the upcoming dream and these hallucinations become part of the dream.

Yep, all that is entirely valid, and your experience with sleep paralysis speaks volumes. With competency, knowledge, and experience, the fear can easily be overcome. Sadly, newbies often have none of those things. Which is why I tired to be clear cut with this guide.

Sleep paralysis: full body paralysis that happens every night during REM sleep; very uncommon to experience consciously, even when WILDing; source of the common fear/terror stories; not the goal of WILD.

NREM: stages before REM that always occur, even after a WBTB; common to experience effects of each stage during WILD; source of stories around audio and visual hallucinations, vibrations, etc.; dream should form somewhere here, as one passes into REM;

Originally Posted by dms111

Do you think people can't experience sleep paralysis as their entering sleep? That it only occurs as they're waking up?

No, both are possible, but the latter is more commonly reported. Of course, neither are the norm, so they shouldn't be taught as such.

Originally Posted by dms111

So what you guys are saying is that it's impossible to fall straight into REM from a state of wakefulness?

It is actually possible, but usually only associated with narcolepsy.

I have a post to make in reply but I am going to hold off in order to collect more information. I expect you can appreciate my desire to make the best reply possible.

^^ Just be sure to note that Hermine was right. Because she was.

Another excellent thread by mzzkc! You're one of maybe 2 or 3 posters here on DV that I trust to not say something totally stupid when talking about WILD.

I must admit, this issue of what happens in the time between being fully awake and being in HH confuses even me. For me there always seems to be a momentary lapse of consciousness followed by a regaining of consciousness accompanied by full HH and vibrations. Now, I've always assumed that the lapse of consciousness *was* the NREM stage, and the HH and vibrations were more associated with the REM stage that comes after. Is this incorrect?

Originally Posted by hermine_hesse

It is actually possible, but usually only associated with narcolepsy.

^This, some people who WILD really do experience REM through a REM intrusion.

Would someone with Narcolepsy WILD more easily? Could random REM intrusion account for some successful WILDs? Or even explain why some people have a predisposition towards successful WILD?

Nearly all of my WILD's involve me focusing on my body and sensing the moment (and it is a specific moment) when I can no longer physically move it. I am asleep and I am paralyzed - it's why my brain can say roll out of bed and my dream body does, but my physical body does not. In getting to this state I often must pass through moments that would be scary to the inexperienced - the same experiences cited by sleep paralysis (in the "traditional" sense) sufferers.

Sleep paralysis to the non LD'ing sufferer or scientist studying it seems to be defined as the a moment when the mind awakens in a paralyzed state of REM sleep. Why can we not call it sleep paralysis when our minds stay awake as we enter the paralyzed state of REM sleep?

From Laberge/ Levitan article on OBE's (which they seem to believe are dreams, but don't come straight out and say it)...

Sleep paralysis occurs sometimes when a person
is waking from or falling into REM sleep, the state in which most
vivid dreams occur. During REM sleep, the muscles of the body,
excluding the eye muscles and those responsible for circulation
and respiration, are immobilized by orders from a nerve center in
the lower brain. This prevents us from acting out our dreams.
Occasionally, this paralysis turns on or remains active while the
person's mind is fully awake and aware of the world.

From Laberge/ De Gracia...

Sound may be experienced during WILDs, in the transition from waking to sleep, in the form of cracking, hissing, twinkling, or similar sounds, sometimes reported as “haunted house” sounds. These are auditory forms of hypnagogia. Lucid dreamers have reported hearing songs during lucid dreams, as if a radio was playing, when in fact, there was no other source of the perception of music using other modalities. Subjects experiencing sleep paralysis have reported hearing voices, sometimes of a threatening or terrifying nature, reminiscent of the auditory hallucinations of schizophrenics. Lucid dreamers also frequently experience playing music:

They don't seem to have any problem to say that sleep paralysis can be a part of the WILD experience.

I consider what I experience sleep paralysis, but agree it is not necessary to feel the experience in order to WILD.

Then you may well experience sleep paralysis. But then you can WILD successfully, so it doesn't matter either way. Many people don't experience SP when they try to WILD, and then they fixate on SP, and then they don't WILD, because of a misconception that isn't really their fault.

That's the point Mzzkc's OP.

Also bear in mind that Laberge is basically appropriating the medical term sleep paralysis (as we know, to any observer it appears that's what's happening) because it seems to fit. Laberge's PHD was awarded on the merit of his MILD technique and the eye signals sent from a lucid dream he recorded. He's a pioneer of lucid dreaming science, but he might not be the best neuroscientist out there.

Scientists will use the accepted paradigm until research reveals a new paradigm to replace it, in a sense, what we're humbly trying to do in this thread.

Originally Posted by cmind

Another excellent thread by mzzkc! You're one of maybe 2 or 3 posters here on DV that I trust to not say something totally stupid when talking about WILD.

I must admit, this issue of what happens in the time between being fully awake and being in HH confuses even me. For me there always seems to be a momentary lapse of consciousness followed by a regaining of consciousness accompanied by full HH and vibrations. Now, I've always assumed that the lapse of consciousness *was* the NREM stage, and the HH and vibrations were more associated with the REM stage that comes after. Is this incorrect?

I'm of the opinion that lapse typically occurs as a result of N3 sleep, the deep stuff that consciousness doesn't play well with. HH is known to happen during NREM, but can occur at the onset of REM as well. Vibrations are trickier to pin down (have seen/read no research in that regard), but the patterns I've observed through anecdote and personal experience suggest N2 sleep plays a big role.

The WILD Progression article I put together covers all this, and even has some great accompanying research courtesy RobotButler.

Originally Posted by djv

Sleep paralysis to the non LD'ing sufferer or scientist studying it seems to be defined as the a moment when the mind awakens in a paralyzed state of REM sleep. Why can we not call it sleep paralysis when our minds stay awake as we enter the paralyzed state of REM sleep?

We can, because sleep paralysis is defined as such. The period before the paralysis, however, is a completely separate experience with different characteristics none of which involve paralysis. Hence, when someone refers to NREM as sleep paralysis, they're suggesting that paralysis is typical of NREM.

It isn't, but that's what newbies pick up on. As Ctharlhie pointed out, the purpose of the OP was to address this issue and get newbies to clearly see that paralysis isn't something they should be actively seeking. By definition, sleep paralysis is abnormal. I'm of the opinion it should be taught as such, since that tends to be how most university curriculum handles such matters.

Originally Posted by djv

From Laberge/ Levitan article on OBE's (which they seem to believe are dreams, but don't come straight out and say it)...

From Laberge/ De Gracia...

They don't seem to have any problem to say that sleep paralysis can be a part of the WILD experience.

I'm in agreement with Ctharlhie here. LaBerge is simply pointing out similarities between the observations he has made regarding OBE/WILD and observations others have made about those who suffer from sleep paralysis. It's a good way of saying, "Hey, these things look like they're related, can I have monies to do moar research plox?"

When those articles were written, LaBerge was still pioneering this stuff. Of course, even from your examples one can note some key differences between the experiences, and more recent studies have pointed to why that could be (NREM vs Sleep Paralysis).

For What it's worth:

I just finished presenting a WILD class on the DVA forum, and hands-down the most difficult task was getting the students to unlearn all the crap they had previously picked up about the "noise," particularly "SP." I don't think it went too well, because right to the end students were still trying to "get to SP," and then getting thoroughly lost whenever they thought they had "reached it."

I never gave much of a crap about SP myself, and have no idea how it gained such popularity, but defeating its status in the LD community -- especially novices -- might be quite the windmill indeed. Mzzkc!

Originally Posted by Mzzkc

I'm of the opinion that lapse typically occurs as a result of N3 sleep, the deep stuff that consciousness doesn't play well with. HH is known to happen during NREM, but can occur at the onset of REM as well. Vibrations are trickier to pin down (have seen/read no research in that regard), but the patterns I've observed through anecdote and personal experience suggest N2 sleep plays a big role.

It sounds like the correct interpretation then is to say that all (or most of) the "lead up" sensations to the lucid dream are part of NREM, and REM doesn't "officially" begin until I enter the dream proper.

On the topic of REM atonia, I've experienced the real paralysis hundreds of times (I mean after waking up from REM), but oddly enough I've never personally experienced the sense of dread. And I am prone to anxiety in my waking life. Go figure.

Originally Posted by Ctharlhie

Then you may well experience sleep paralysis. But then you can WILD successfully, so it doesn't matter either way. Many people don't experience SP when they try to WILD, and then they fixate on SP, and then they don't WILD, because of a misconception that isn't really their fault.

That's the point Mzzkc's OP.

I did acknowledge that it's not necessary to experience SP to WILD. I'm not on here enough to notice if people consider HH and vibrations to be SP - do they? I have no problem to make a distinction between these NREM events and SP. I feel SP is probably more common in WILD's than Mzzkc suggests though.

When I first started WILDing it took a few weeks - each night I progressed a bit further into the NREM experiences mentioned above. After a couple of nights of vibrations, then next night a moment after vibrations stopped I felt my body distort - I was paralyzed. I sunk my body into the bed and voila - I was in an LD. I almost exclusively WILD that way now. After vibrations I usually feel my mouth turn to a frown, then it feels like my body sinks into the bed an inch or so - at that moment I know to roll out of bed and start my LD.

It's been forever since I read EWLD, where I learned to WILD. I thought one method Laberge taught was to get to that point of feeling your body distort and then rolling out of bed (or floating or sinking), but maybe that was my own idea. I guess if it's so unusual (and I'm not sure that it is), then yeah - discourage the fixation on it. But if one can notice this paralysis before a dream scene forms, then it is a great way to WILD.

I always was intrested in WILD, even though it's not my main lucid dream technique. Just putting a post here to see if i got it all right? Just correct me if im wrong, i wanna know as mutch as i can.

So basicly it's close to impossible to reach SP while doing a WILD attemp, cause u should be in a dream at that point? And the HH and vibrations that we experience in a WILD attemp are actually from NREM?


I had 2 experiences where i got into SP, this happend when i woke up from a lucid dream. And i must say, it feels a lot more intense. On my "first" SP, i had a man pushing my face against my pillow. But i must say, there was no fear cause i knew what was happening and i could in a way control it. I even spoke to that "person" in my mind, and he even talked gently back. So i agree on the no fear part (if u know what it is all about), but i imagine if your new to this it would be very scary.

What i notice when i do a WILD (a good one) is that i feel like my body is getting very numb, but i always have a feeling that i can move it, if i really try. While when i wake up from a lucid dream and go straight into SP, it feels like i can't do anything. Would u say this numbness is the preparation for the real SP? If so it would make sense, cause when this extreme numbness and heavy vibrations and so on kick in, ur basicly really close to the rem state i would say. And if this all is true, then i think that people mistake that feeling with the real SP.

Although i think WILD is still a good way to induce a lucid dream, if u practice it enough. Hope this post makes a little bit sense!

Originally Posted by djv

I did acknowledge that it's not necessary to experience SP to WILD. I'm not on here enough to notice if people consider HH and vibrations to be SP - do they? .

I think that the WILDs you do without entering a stage of "sp" is a wild when you loose conciousness early in the process and regain it when the dream either is about to form or has already formed(easily attained through deild)
But from a wakeful state, if you're performing a wild, dont you most likely enter a stage when you're unable to move, feel uncomfortable, hard to breathe, sort of claustrophobic feeling? HH and stuff? isnt that sp? afterall you are paralyzed.

Originally Posted by daban

I think that the WILDs you do without entering a stage of "sp" is a wild when you loose conciousness early in the process and regain it when the dream either is about to form or has already formed(easily attained through deild)
But from a wakeful state, if you're performing a wild, dont you most likely enter a stage when you're unable to move, feel uncomfortable, hard to breathe, sort of claustrophobic feeling? HH and stuff? isnt that sp? afterall you are paralyzed.

*repeats everything previously stated above*

Originally Posted by djv

I did acknowledge that it's not necessary to experience SP to WILD. I'm not on here enough to notice if people consider HH and vibrations to be SP - do they?

They do. *gestures upward*

That's the whole point of this guide. To draw a fine line between sleep paralysis and NREM sensations and then shout at it until everyone knows where it is. The line was drawn by hand, so it isn't perfect, but it was never meant to be. It's a practical tool for newbies and those trying to teach newbies the differences between the sensations on either side of the line.

If you want to read more advanced material, you can check out some of my other stuff. I intentionally left out unnecessary details here because that sort of knowledge comes with experience, and even I do a shit job of explaining some of the intricacies.

@Ekyu: Yes, you understand the difference. This sort of thinking will give your first dozen WILD attempts a better chance at success.

It's amazing how SP has gained this reputation over time. I personally never even feel any form of heavy vibrations nor do I hear or see hallucinations when I Deild. Is it possible to transition around the n1 stage and go straight to rem sleep?

Originally Posted by djv

After a couple of nights of vibrations, then next night a moment after vibrations stopped I felt my body distort - I was paralyzed. I sunk my body into the bed and voila - I was in an LD. I almost exclusively WILD that way now. After vibrations I usually feel my mouth turn to a frown, then it feels like my body sinks into the bed an inch or so - at that moment I know to roll out of bed and start my LD.

I would say what is happening here (and what most people refer to as SP in a WILD) is body dissociation. Your body is not actually paralyzed; you are transferring your awareness from your physical body to your dream body. I imagine when this happens you are trying to lie still, not trying to move. If you actually tried to move your physical body, you would ruin the WILD, right?

In contrast, when you experience Sleep Paralysis you are completely aware of your physical body, but completely unable to move it. You wake up into your physical body, but cannot move no matter how hard you try.

Originally Posted by hermine_hesse

I would say what is happening here (and what most people refer to as SP in a WILD) is body dissociation. Your body is not actually paralyzed; you are transferring your awareness from your physical body to your dream body. I imagine when this happens you are trying to lie still, not trying to move. If you actually tried to move your physical body, you would ruin the WILD, right?

In contrast, when you experience Sleep Paralysis you are completely aware of your physical body, but completely unable to move it. You wake up into your physical body, but cannot move no matter how hard you try.

No. I am not trying to lie still at this point. I try to roll out of bed, but only my dream body does. I have remained consciuos to the point of sleep paralysis in REM sleep. I am aware of my body. It is my technique to focus on my body. I recognize exactly the point where I can try to get out of bed, knowing that I physically can't.

If I have a dream body - then I am paralyzed. That is a normal occurance that prevents you from acting out your dreams.

I do not ruin my WILD, because my WILD attempts are successful when I have noticed the point where my body is paralyzed and I simply roll out of bed. Dream scenes rarely (maybe 1 times in 20) appear before my eyes for me to enter. Most of my WILD's start as pitch black dreams in my bedroom. I have to use different techniques to achieve vision within these LD's.