Confused on how to go past REM Atonia/SP

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11-23-2012, 03:26 PM
wyman01

Confused on how to go past REM Atonia/SP

Hi fellow LDers and LD attempters. I need help with my WILD technique as I am hitting the wall at a certain point. My best success for WILD has been early/mid morning (7-9:30 AM) where I wake up yet I still feel sleepy. This the point where I can start the WILD procedure. I listen to music on a low volume and then relax. 2-10 minutes later, my eyes close then reopen with my body being unable to move and I have this weird awake feeling. This is where the trouble starts. For some reason, I can never get past this Atonia/SP phase.

The closest I've gotten to LDing was willing my legs to slide off the bed and stretch my arms above my head. However, my torso and head couldn't shake off the paralysis. I then woke back up out of impatience and my body was in the exact same position ( indicating that I was LDing :D). I've managed to trigger this Atonia/SP phase (I don't know which to call it) multiple times per WILD attempt. I stay fully conscious, but I can't will myself to advance past.

How does one go past this stage? I tried visualizing my dream, but I'm failing miserably and I can never seem to trigger the hypnotic imagery. ;( help is much appreciated.
11-23-2012, 03:47 PM
YourDreamingNow

I have never felt paralyzed in any of my WILD/OBE attempts. I do feel numbness, but that's a whole different thing. You don't need to wait for REM Atonia, as it will occur even if you don't want it to.

Quote:

Originally Posted by wyman01

How does one go past this stage? I tried visualizing my dream, but I'm failing miserably and I can never seem to trigger the hypnotic imagery. ;( help is much appreciated.

I had my first HH and HA, when I tried to have an OBE.
I have made a tutorial on that, I have explained all my experience and how to reach that Hypnotic Stage.

http://www.dreamviews.com/f19/guaran...onight-137941/

If you have any questions or doubts, leave me a PM. :)
11-23-2012, 06:09 PM
Ctharlhie

By the time you enter REM atonia a dream has already formed so you could just step out of bed or visualise an entirely new scene!

But what you're experiencing probably isn't REM atonia, but rather witnessing falling asleep consciously.

Here's some further reading on WILD, good luck!
http://www.dreamviews.com/f79/sensat...y-wild-137332/
WILD (Sageous)
Sleep Paralysis Demystified - Lucid Dreaming - Dream Views
11-25-2012, 01:12 AM
wyman01

Quote:

By the time you enter REM atonia a dream has already formed so you could just step out of bed or visualise an entirely new scene!

But what you're experiencing probably isn't REM atonia, but rather witnessing falling asleep consciously.

Would it be SP then? Every time I try to WILD, I get to the point where I transition from my regular awareness to this paralyzed state. I literally cannot move, no matter how hard I try and my eyes can only open halfway. This used to happen to me a lot more during my childhood and it always brought a sense a fear and even hallucinations of a black-ish figure whenever it would happen. I outgrew the fear since viewing this website, but the paralyzation is still there.

There are no images, no otherworldy sounds, no vibrating, and no numbness. It is just the paralyzation. I read the SP: demystified article and my experiences fit what the symptoms of SP are. The only time I can get close to LDing is when these paralyzation attacks happen (usually mid-early morning or afternoon naps) and I feel the shift in awareness (I can't explain the feeling for the life of me). I just want to know how to progress past this stage. Simply willing myself to step/roll out of the bed isn't working and the visualization of another dream scene works temporarily before I wake myself up.

I'm really sorry if I sound desperate, it's just I am so frustrated that I am so close to achieving a complete LD

@YourDreamingNow
Thanks. I am reading the article now. I'll pm once I have my questions. :)
11-25-2012, 03:31 AM
gab

If you really can't move, you may be experiencing SP. Most of the people don't exerience it, because it starts after we fall asleep and we are dreaming, and it ends, when dream ends and before we wake up. But for some people, it kicks in sooner and doesn't end, even after you wake up.

Some are able to use SP to have OBE. I don't have experience with that, so can't help you with that, sorry.

You can either break it by changing your breathing pattern and trying to wiggle ends of your toes and fingers to let your body know, that you are awake.
Or, you can go back to sleep and try again when you wake up.

What I would do is to stay calm and try to see if I get any vibrations or any other HH, just because I'm familiar with that and I know that LD is not far from that moment. Or try to see yourself standing in a kitchen, by the door or any other familiar place that's away from your bed, maybe adding some commands "Now, I'm out of my body" and "to the door..." to see, if you can get an OBE. If you interested in OBE, check out some OBE websites about exiting during SP. Good luck:alien:
11-25-2012, 05:50 AM
wyman01

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gab

If you really can't move, you may be experiencing SP. Most of the people don't exerience it, because it starts after we fall asleep and we are dreaming, and it ends, when dream ends and before we wake up. But for some people, it kicks in sooner and doesn't end, even after you wake up.

I really can't move lol. I can't move anything, and the only thing that can move are my eyelids which can only open halfway. There are no HH or vibrations (at least that I notice). It it just me being unable to move. I trust through your years of LDing that you have experience this before. I used to be so scared when I was young because I couldn't move my limbs no matter how hard I tried. The weird thing is, I sometimes wake up (what I'm assuming is the beginning or end) during a REM cycle and I can "trigger" the SP when I am trying to go back to sleep. I can't explain the feeling (typical LDer and his/her experience), but it's like I can tell when the shift is happening and when the paralyzation starts.

Quote:

Some are able to use SP to have OBE. I don't have experience with that, so can't help you with that, sorry.

I have had an OBE once and it was awesome to say the least. However, I want to just have a normal LD although I really don't care if I do have an OBE. Successful lucidity is successful.

Quote:

You can either break it by changing your breathing pattern and trying to wiggle ends of your toes and fingers to let your body know, that you are awake.
Or, you can go back to sleep and try again when you wake up.

Weird thing is, that's how I usually break out of it AND how I try to enter the lucid dream. I either wiggle my toes or try to get my body to move back and forth. Eventually, my eyes close, I re-open them, and I can move again.

Going back to sleep is the best method although I get mad when that happens.

Quote:

What I would do is to stay calm and try to see if I get any vibrations or any other HH, just because I'm familiar with that and I know that LD is not far from that moment. Or try to see yourself standing in a kitchen, by the door or any other familiar place that's away from your bed, maybe adding some commands "Now, I'm out of my body" and "to the door..." to see, if you can get an OBE. If you interested in OBE, check out some OBE websites about exiting during SP. Good luck

I've learned how to calm down during an SP attack so I got that down. The vibrations and other HH is the next step as my mind refuses to let me experience it. I'll try visualization again and hopefully I will have a clear enough mind to try it first.

Thanks for all the help. Maybe I'll try to go the OBE route if I have the paralysis episode again.
11-25-2012, 06:06 AM
gab

I did have SP twice in my life. Both times, upon awakening. Both times, I saw my room with eyes closed, tried to scream for help but I guess I was making only grunts, if anything. I tried to rock myself closer to the edge of the bed hoping I'll fall off and wake up - I didn't know at that time what it was. But could not move at all. Then I had it once more, this time as a grown up and thit time I saw "aliens" around my bed, felt being touched. Also could not move. So yeah, I know it is not a pleasant feeling. It's like you are trapped or burried alive.

But you could concentrate on trying to move your astral body when in SP - there is no chance you will move for real and ruin your attempt. Some of my exits into WILD feel similar, but not the same as OBEs, when you just get up from sofa and walk away. So you could try that. Check out this article Sensations and types of entry into WILD and see, maybe you recognize something you could use.
11-25-2012, 04:16 PM
wyman01

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gab

I did have SP twice in my life. Both times, upon awakening. Both times, I saw my room with eyes closed, tried to scream for help but I guess I was making only grunts, if anything. I tried to rock myself closer to the edge of the bed hoping I'll fall off and wake up - I didn't know at that time what it was. But could not move at all. Then I had it once more, this time as a grown up and thit time I saw "aliens" around my bed, felt being touched. Also could not move. So yeah, I know it is not a pleasant feeling. It's like you are trapped or burried alive.

I'm so glad you do know the feeling. It is exactly like you're trapped and I just hate the feeling, especially when I can't LD or have an OBE from the experience. I'm not sure if I saw the room with my eyes closed like you did, but it felt like my eyes could only happen halfway. Is that what looking at your room with your eyes close is like?

Quote:

But you could concentrate on trying to move your astral body when in SP - there is no chance you will move for real and ruin your attempt. Some of my exits into WILD feel similar, but not the same as OBEs, when you just get up from sofa and walk away. So you could try that. Check out this article Sensations and types of entry into WILD and see, maybe you recognize something you could use.

Funny thing, I was trying to move my astral body. Except I could only move my extremities. It's always my head and torso that refuses to leave. The paralyzed feeling never leaves that part of my body, but I am trying experiment different ways to stop that.