Theory about WBTB / WILD

I've been struggling to get any consistency with LD'ing. It just won't "click".
But I have a thery about why my attempts to WILD have been so difficult.

I tend to wake breifly after every REM epoisode, which is quite good for dream recall.
However, if I try to WBTB, I ususally end up trying for ages, and then just falling asleep, only waking after the next REM cycle, if I'm lucky.

Anyway, my theory is that waking just after a REM cycle is no good, because the next REM cycle could be 60-90 minutes away,so doing a WILD is really difficult then.

What is needed is to wake just before the REM cycle begins.

Not sure how to do that, except by setting an alarm clock just after I wake to go off again in maybe an hours' time.

Do people think that would work?

^^ Instead, how about trying WBTB after several hours' sleep (at least 5, in my opinion)? If you do so, your REM periods should be close enough together that your WILD attempt will likely land you right in REM.

In other words, because REM periods are far apart at the beginning of the night but move closer as your night's sleep progresses, that 60-90 minute delay should only be a problem in the first couple of hours of sleep; your theory only holds if you attempt WILD at a time when it perhaps shouldn't be attempted. You might want to change your timing a bit, rather than setting an alarm.

Another way to help time your WILD attempts with a REM cycle is to stay up for about 75 minutes after you wake up. Do a light activity, read a book or meditate. Avoid anything with a bright screen. Once you lay down you should still be relaxed, but your brain will have been active for over an hour and your logical centers should be more active. This will help you get lucid because it will easily drop you into a REM cycle, and even if you fall asleep during a WILD, a DILD will be much more likely.

Sorry Sageous, meant to say, my WBTB/WILD attempts are usually after some hours of sleep. I find I often wake just after each REM period, and that can be at 3-4am, after 5 hours sleep.

bb316 - yea that's how I've had a successful WILD, sort of, but just by sticking at it, not actually getting up for over an hour. I should try that.

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Originally Posted by bb316

Another way to help time your WILD attempts with a REM cycle is to stay up for about 75 minutes after you wake up. Do a light activity, read a book or meditate. Avoid anything with a bright screen. Once you lay down you should still be relaxed, but your brain will have been active for over an hour and your logical centers should be more active. This will help you get lucid because it will easily drop you into a REM cycle, and even if you fall asleep during a WILD, a DILD will be much more likely.

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In my opinion, one of the absolutely best things to do during WBTB is to analyze the dreams you had, and look through your Dream Journal.

WBTB by itself works best if you stay awake long enough so when you finally go back to bed you hit REM right away due to the rebound effect. This of course is easier said than done, not mention the risk of unable to fall back to sleep. IMO it is okay to try this long WBTB + WILD combo once in a while but in a long run you are better off with shorter WBTB combined with non-WILD techniques such as MILD and SSILD.

I read a DV thread that suggested doing the WBTB method, only instead of waking up and going back to bed, wake up and go back to sleep in a comfortable chair (like my recliner, suuuuuuuuper cozy) I tried this the other day and it worked very well. I slept for about five and a half hours, woke up and wrote down what I could remember from my dreams, did some light stretching, grabbed my blanket off my bed and went downstairs to crash on the chair for about three hours. Although I didn't become fully lucid, I did have an extremely vivid dream where I realized I was dreaming several times (Damn false awakenings, you know how it goes.) Anyway, it worked out well the first time, going to try again tomorrow and see what happens.