Thread: What happened? Post Your WILD Attempts, Good or Bad, Here

So I had somewhat of an epiphany today. I think I've finally come to understand what you really mean by self in these techniques, although it's somewhat hard to describe. My main problem was that I was getting mixed up between what I can only describe as "body" self-awareness and "spiritual/mind/being" self-awareness, as I wasn't even really sure what this "spiritual/mind/being" self-awareness was until I took the time today and studied my previous successful DEILDs and how things felt during that process.

I could be completely off-base with this, but I'm going to give it a shot while trying to incite the feelings that I've experienced when I've DEILDed and see how I get on.

^^ That was a major step, RareCola -- nice work!!

Be sure to let us know how it goes!

Originally Posted by Sageous

Just one suggestion: Stop concerning yourself with deft maneuvering and start working on keeping your self-awareness at full steam throughout the dive. I have no idea where you learned of this "minute" awareness concept, but whoever told you that is dead wrong. You must be fully aware at all times. After all, it's not called SWILD, for "Sorta-Wake-initiated Lucid Dream, is it?

And for about the nineteenth time, SP is not a stage. It's just noise; try to ignore it.

Sorry if I came off a bit short here ... Sometimes I really hate the crap they feed you guys on these sites!

Well, I always have the problem of just being caught for a half hour or longer being aware-- and I seem to go nowhere and am just wide awake, (as opposed to people falling asleep mid-WILD), so It made sense that I needed to do something less active, which is what I meant by minute-awareness.

And correct if I'm wrong, the whole point is to eventually fall asleep? (howelse do you begin dreaming?) Maintaining awareness all the while of course...

In short: I have no problem being aware. And my second point was that I AM comfortable with the whole SP thing (that is to say that it doesn't bother me anymore), as it regularly occurs for me. But nothing ever happens afterwards.

PS: I also understand you're reason for being short, I can't imagine how many times you've gone through explaining this stuff

I took a nap that was probably two hours ago, it was really just for practice with maintaining awareness. I set the alarm timer at 5-10 minute intervals, and the alarm duration itself would be 4 seconds or so when it triggers, so it wouldn't scare me too much.

It failed because someone woke me up to go to the gym, but either way, I'm getting A L O T better at lying in the supine position, and getting less of the swallow reflex. Most likely because after a few gulps, I'm free from it. It used to be such a big concern that I'd have to turn to my side.....hmmm, wonder what changed that. (And I don't even have to prop my pillow or anything)

I can't wait to try this out tonight! Good luck to everyone! I think I might shorten my WBTBs to 5-10 minutes, and type my dreams in notes, and just have faith I can remember them in good detail.

I think that might be a factor that prevents me from maintaining awareness mentally, because it takes too long to type a dj entry, which makes me too awake.

Not too sure what happened last night. I was attempting a WILD when all of a sudden a dream scene formed around me, although I wasn't sure if I had entered this lucidity or had just dozed off to sleep. The scene lasted maybe 5 seconds total so I didn't have time to get my bearings. I was in a classroom when a gust of wind blew into my face, knocking me backwards out of the chair I was sitting in and falling back into my waking life body.

Hi Arqmeister; sorry for the delay in responding -- I managed to let your note slip past me!

So:

Originally Posted by arqmeister

Hi, new to the forum, but wanted to register so i could jump in on this thread. Sageous, your technique has given me all the answers i will ever need for achieving a wild. I have a question though.
I lay down after a wbtb and relaxed focusing on my mantra of choice, "self awareness, focus". This seems to keep my awareness very well focused. However, it seems like Hi does what it can to suck me in to sleep. I can be laying there focusing hard on my expectation of the dream to come while repeating my mantra, and then, a random hypnogogic thought will seem to override my mantra. Is there a reason for this? I should mention, that i am a blind guy so, my hypnogogic thoughts i am refering to are all auditory. Like i said, i feel the mantra is strong enough but i can't seem to hole awareness when powerfull hypnogogic crap starts asulting my waking awareness. Should i just ignore it as strongly as possible, or should i use a different mantra? I did achieve a Dild after lapsing breefly in to sleep once the hypnogogic stuff started so, i don't feel like i screwed up completely.

You probably ought to continue on the course you're on, without changing your mantra, and with more effort allowing the hypnagogia to come and go naturally. Since hypnagogia can be the doorway to your LD, and it clearly wants to make itself heard, you might also consider working with it to form your dreams. Instead of being bothered by the thoughts, try forming them into the things you'd like your dream to be about (per WILD session 4, I think).

All in all it seems like you are on the right path, arqmeister; a little time and patience could be all you need!

I had a WILD this morning, set my alarm to 7am, stayed up for about 40 minutes and went back to bed
as i laid there i felt my body being sortof dragged off the bed, whenever i feel this sensation i usually "wake up" in my dream fully lucid.
and surely enough i did, it was crazy, hadnt felt something that vivid in a while and i god to meet my dream guide finally

Hey sageous, thanks for the reply. I have tryed to use skimas to change hypnogogia in the past with no success. I assume that this takes patients and practice which i can do easily enough. I will reread the particular session for more details again. Thanks for this great course!

Originally Posted by RareCola

Not too sure what happened last night. I was attempting a WILD when all of a sudden a dream scene formed around me, although I wasn't sure if I had entered this lucidity or had just dozed off to sleep. The scene lasted maybe 5 seconds total so I didn't have time to get my bearings. I was in a classroom when a gust of wind blew into my face, knocking me backwards out of the chair I was sitting in and falling back into my waking life body.

To tack onto this experience, I just recalled another experience last night. I remembered earlier that during my DEILD transitions I never really had any sign that I had transitioned into a dream, I would have to open my eyes and reality check to actually pick up that I was in a dream, as it faded through so seamlessly. I think this could be an issue I'm having with WILD, not noticing the transitions, as last night I opened my eyes very briefly at one point and saw some kind of figure next to my bed which looked like my Dad (which I guess could have been HH, but probably not as I never seem to experience hallucinations). I immediately closed my eyes and paid no attention to it though because for some reason I had something telling me that I had to keep my eyes closed to transition into a WILD.

Is it possible that I would not notice the transition at all with a WILD, like with my DEILD experiences? Would it be wise simply to open my eyes at certain points and perform a reality check just incase, or would that set me back too much if I wasn't inside of a dream?

Originally Posted by RareCola

To tack onto this experience, I just recalled another experience last night. I remembered earlier that during my DEILD transitions I never really had any sign that I had transitioned into a dream, I would have to open my eyes and reality check to actually pick up that I was in a dream, as it faded through so seamlessly. I think this could be an issue I'm having with WILD, not noticing the transitions, as last night I opened my eyes very briefly at one point and saw some kind of figure next to my bed which looked like my Dad (which I guess could have been HH, but probably not as I never seem to experience hallucinations). I immediately closed my eyes and paid no attention to it though because for some reason I had something telling me that I had to keep my eyes closed to transition into a WILD.

Good choice, and good instincts, I think! Oh, and did you, um, make sure later that no one was standing by your bed?

Is it possible that I would not notice the transition at all with a WILD, like with my DEILD experiences?

Certainly ... to me it's not only possible, but favorable.

Would it be wise simply to open my eyes at certain points and perform a reality check just in case, or would that set me back too much if I wasn't inside of a dream?

I wouldn't bother opening your eyes, for the reason you cite -- it could definitely set you back. And if you think about it, you do not open your eyes normally when doing RC's, so would it make sense to do so here? I don't think so; it seems like it would screw up the RC as well as the WILD...

Originally Posted by Sageous

Good choice, and good instincts, I think! Oh, and did you, um, make sure later that no one was standing by your bed?

Nobody was home at that time, so not possible that anyone could have been standing by my bed.

I wouldn't bother opening your eyes, for the reason you cite -- it could definitely set you back. And if you think about it, you do not open your eyes normally when doing RC's, so would it make sense to do so here? I don't think so; it seems like it would screw up the RC as well as the WILD...

So how would you go about realising that I've made the transition into a dream without opening your eyes? I've never been able to pick up on the fact that I'm dreaming after a DEILD unless I've opened my eyes, although I realise that WILDs are slightly more delicate.

Originally Posted by RareCola

Nobody was home at that time, so not possible that anyone could have been standing by my bed.

... Well there it is then!

So how would you go about realising that I've made the transition into a dream without opening your eyes? I've never been able to pick up on the fact that I'm dreaming after a DEILD unless I've opened my eyes, although I realise that WILDs are slightly more delicate.

I'm not sure I understand you, RareCola. Since in a dream you have no actual eyes to open, what are you opening?

For me, a dream will form, images and all, with no regard to whether my eyes are open or closed. With (successful) WILDs, including DEILDs, you are fully aware that the world into which you are emerging is a dream. What else could it be? The exception to this of course is a false awakening, especially with DEILD, but doesn't a FA imply that consciousness was lost and you're switching from WILD to DILD?

I think I'm saying too much, because I have a feeling I missed something obvious. Bottom line, I guess, is this: you should have no trouble knowing you made the transition to the dream without even considering your eyes. If you have eyes to open, and they do so, then I think you're either still awake, or in a FA .

Let me know what I missed!

Originally Posted by Sageous

... Well there it is then!



I'm not sure I understand you, RareCola. Since in a dream you have no actual eyes to open, what are you opening?

For me, a dream will form, images and all, with no regard to whether my eyes are open or closed. With (successful) WILDs, including DEILDs, you are fully aware that the world into which you are emerging is a dream. What else could it be? The exception to this of course is a false awakening, especially with DEILD, but doesn't a FA imply that consciousness was lost and you're switching from WILD to DILD?

I think I'm saying too much, because I have a feeling I missed something obvious. Bottom line, I guess, is this: you should have no trouble knowing you made the transition to the dream without even considering your eyes. If you have eyes to open, and they do so, then I think you're either still awake, or in a FA .

Let me know what I missed!

The thing is, I do have actual eyes in a dream.

I know it's very weird, but I'll post examples of two of my previous DEILDs so you know what I'm experiencing:

Spoiler for Dreams:

#1 - I was laying in bed after a DILD, recalling the experience. My eyes were closed and I wasn't particularly seeing any HI or anything but at one point the sheets that I felt over me seemed to just fade away and my body became really light, almost like I was hovering above my bed. There was no lapse of consciousness at all, and I could still see the blackness behind my eyelids at this point. I opened my eyes and I was still laying in bed with the sheets over me, but I couldn't feel any of it. I looked over to my clock and all the numbers were freaking out, changing sporadically. I double checked by lifting up my hands and sure enough I had 7 fingers. I lifted myself out of bed and had one of the most vivid lucid dreams I've ever had, I truly understood that everything was a creation of myself and that I was inside of a dream, it felt even beyond reality.

#2 - Awoken from a non-lucid dream this time. Laying in bed when I see vague HI in the darkness of my eyelids of a small character, putting on clothing to "gear up" for lucidity. This was while I was counting from 0 to 10. When I reached 10 the small character had finished gearing up, I opened my eyes and I was inside my bathroom, lucid. After waking from this experience I DEILD chained into another lucid, getting the same "gearing up character" experience but this time when I opened my eyes, I was outside in the same place from where my previous lucid dream ended.

This is the problem, I never really seem to get much of a signal that I transition, there's never much that happens behind my eyes, all I generally see is blackness with some possible vague HI. It's only when I open my eyes that I can really see a dream world, unlike your experience where it forms from the blackness that you see.

I'm actually getting closer to DEILDs than WILDs actually, it seems. Now almost always whenever I wake up, I don't move. The only problem is that my eyes always flutter open! It's so annoying. It's like, if I don't move, I have to compensate for it and open my eyes for "security", if you get my drift. So my eyes flutter open, and I quickly close them, but then all is lost.

I had a couple awakenings last night where I didn't truly realize I was awake. And when I did (which was about a couple minutes later when I awoke but didn't realize), I was always in a relaxed state, but I didn't get anywhere.

So my main problem is my eyes. :/ Any tips on how to keep them closed?

Originally Posted by Sydney

So my main problem is my eyes. :/ Any tips on how to keep them closed?

I tried doing calculated DEILD attempts for a while by using an alarm that would trigger just for a few seconds so that it wouldn't distract me from recalling any prior dreams I could re-enter to. To prevent myself from opening my eyes from this alarm (because it really is an eye-opener, but is bound to wake you up if you set it to max), I started to listen to the alarm sound over and over again until it started to become white noise to me.

I told myself periodically that "When the alarm rings, I will stay still and keep my eyes closed," as my little mantra. It actually worked out perfectly for a few days! I felt my body feeling fuzzy, and looking through the back of my eyes, I could feel that misty and twilight kind of vision, but I didn't really get that far into entering a dream scene unfortunately.

I had the timing right, and my eyes thankfully complied by remaining shut even when the alarm rang.

To me, if you try to do DEILDs naturally, there is some chance that you might open your eyes, but I in my opinion, setting an alarm that lasts for a few seconds to wake you up, combined with a mantra for a few days helps with consistent results (I was actually going to keep up with this method, but I somehow lost interest in it, even though the mechanism behind doing it was perfected). But I don't know if you favor the inconvenience of setting up the alarm and all that, since I saw you had some trouble with an alarm app for the iphone I believe in one thread you made.

I just use my laptop (and the con with that is Windows Update restarting the computer and literally putting the alarms I set on hold until I log in), and I used a program called "Free Countdown Timer." I don't think showing the link is allowed, but you should be able to find it easily. But I think it's only for the PC, and not for smartphones and other mobile devices though.

Originally Posted by Sydney

I'm actually getting closer to DEILDs than WILDs actually, it seems....So my main problem is my eyes. :/ Any tips on how to keep them closed?

I have one sort of silly one: try wearing a sleep mask. That way if your eyes should open, light won't invade, and hopefully you'll be able to close them without incident.

Just a thought; beyond that, I got nothing, except to keep trying to both keep your eyes shut and to hang onto the dreamy thoughts you need to go "back in" lucid...

Nice work, Sydney -- I had a feeling you would grow attached to DEILD!

Originally Posted by Linkzelda

I tried doing calculated DEILD attempts for a while by using an alarm that would trigger just for a few seconds so that it wouldn't distract me from recalling any prior dreams I could re-enter to. To prevent myself from opening my eyes from this alarm (because it really is an eye-opener, but is bound to wake you up if you set it to max), I started to listen to the alarm sound over and over again until it started to become white noise to me.

I told myself periodically that "When the alarm rings, I will stay still and keep my eyes closed," as my little mantra. It actually worked out perfectly for a few days! I felt my body feeling fuzzy, and looking through the back of my eyes, I could feel that misty and twilight kind of vision, but I didn't really get that far into entering a dream scene unfortunately.

I had the timing right, and my eyes thankfully complied by remaining shut even when the alarm rang.

To me, if you try to do DEILDs naturally, there is some chance that you might open your eyes, but I in my opinion, setting an alarm that lasts for a few seconds to wake you up, combined with a mantra for a few days helps with consistent results (I was actually going to keep up with this method, but I somehow lost interest in it, even though the mechanism behind doing it was perfected). But I don't know if you favor the inconvenience of setting up the alarm and all that, since I saw you had some trouble with an alarm app for the iphone I believe in one thread you made.

I just use my laptop (and the con with that is Windows Update restarting the computer and literally putting the alarms I set on hold until I log in), and I used a program called "Free Countdown Timer." I don't think showing the link is allowed, but you should be able to find it easily. But I think it's only for the PC, and not for smartphones and other mobile devices though.

That sounds like a really cool idea! That's too bad that you lost interest in it. well I actually did use an alarm that I found after an hour or so of research ^^ I guess I'll try what you did and see if it can produce any results

That's strange but I have had to open my eyes in a LD before. At the time I wasn't sure if I was opening my real eyes or dreams eyes. When I saw a pickup truck in front of me I knew.

... And you sort of amplified my point: If you "open" your eyes and see something that categorically should not be there --and you possess waking self-awareness -- then you wil know without question that you're in a dream. And, conversely, if you're not asleep yet you'll know it's your actual eyes you're opening, then you have a good idea that your WILD might not be going so well, or at least to simply shut your eyes and press on!

I guess "opening" your dream eyes could work nicely as a dream-forming tool, now that I think about it. Of course, you still need a way to either know when to open them, or be willing to risk your current WILD attempt if you're not quite asleep yet.

I hope that made sense ... I have a feeling this is an important concept, and well worth discussion.

Originally Posted by Sageous

... And you sort of amplified my point: If you "open" your eyes and see something that categorically should not be there --and you possess waking self-awareness -- then you wil know without question that you're in a dream. And, conversely, if you're not asleep yet you'll know it's your actual eyes you're opening, then you have a good idea that your WILD might not be going so well, or at least to simply shut your eyes and press on!

I guess "opening" your dream eyes could work nicely as a dream-forming tool, now that I think about it. Of course, you still need a way to either know when to open them, or be willing to risk your current WILD attempt if you're not quite asleep yet.

I hope that made sense ... I have a feeling this is an important concept, and well worth discussion.

I agree it's an important concept, and for me at least, provide the most vivid and fully conscious lucid dreams.

For DEILDs, I think a good time to try opening your eyes is going by what you mentioned earlier in this thread about seeing HI during DEILD attempts not being generally possible, as it's more likely to be a dream character.

As for WILDs, they are definitely more delicate, which is why I brought it up before. I guess the only way is trying and seeing.

^^ Agreed ... Especially the "...only way is trying and seeing," bit!

I did a WILD a few hours ago which is around 4:15 AM up to 5:33 AM. This is like my third attempt with the combination of WBTB+WILD. After I went into the relaxation stage or sensation stage I didn't feel my body (Alright), but after that I felt like my leg is falling of the bed ( While it's not ) so right after I entered into a blank space my attention has gone to my left leg since it was falling of the bed for some odd reason. So I failed to enter into the dream state, but I learned something new which is my best way to relax. Although I was wondering why I entered into a blank space? Is it because I didn't create the dream or there was no dream at all? Thank You!

One thing that still bothers me is the lapses in awareness i seem to experience while doing the dive. I can be using a seemingly very effective mantra and then i go from being completley aware to randomly just "clicking out" for a minute or two. I then awake to foggy awareness and a semi lucid dild. Is there any fix for this? I have been doing the awareness technique alongside my wilds so in theory, i should have all the self awareness bit taken care of. What is the deal with my brain not doing what i want!

Originally Posted by Moznic

I did a WILD a few hours ago which is around 4:15 AM up to 5:33 AM. This is like my third attempt with the combination of WBTB+WILD. After I went into the relaxation stage or sensation stage I didn't feel my body (Alright), but after that I felt like my leg is falling of the bed ( While it's not ) so right after I entered into a blank space my attention has gone to my left leg since it was falling of the bed for some odd reason. So I failed to enter into the dream state, but I learned something new which is my best way to relax. Although I was wondering why I entered into a blank space? Is it because I didn't create the dream or there was no dream at all? Thank You!

Well, at least you learned something about relaxing -- that's always something! Now try to pay less attention to distractions like your legs falling out of bed, and you'll be well on your way...

Though I could be wrong, my guess about that blank space you entered was a bit if NREM. If that's the case, it was simply that your body wasn't in a REM state yet, so there was nothing at all going on. This has happened to me many times, and I've found that the best thing to do is wait it out; it shouldn't last too long if you're well into your sleep cycle, as you were this time. So no, it wasn't blank because you failed to create the dream; there was indeed, I think, no dream at all.

You could attempt to form a dream in NREM -- what you try probably won't work, but I've found that what you get can be quite interesting! However, you'd do just as well to wait quietly, thinking dreamy thoughts filled with your intention and expectations, and in time you'll see those familiar events that indicate that REM has begun (like HI, bits of dream images, or a complete dream scene of a familiar place like your bedroom). Then it's back to work...