Ask Me/ Tell Me About Social Dynamics

Universal Mind. your post is fucking money.

keep in mind. I agree with his interpretation of types. I started this thread assuming that most of the guys here are interested in type one. And juggler method certainly leans toward this type.

If you are interested in quick flings, then read David DeAngelo, Mystery, Tyler Durden etc.

However my philosophy, is that if you go for mainly type 2, you will not lead a very satisfying life if you want the relationship thing. And to me Relationships are more gratyfying and meaningfull to me as a person than just sex. (not to say that I don't LOVE SEX!). Plus surrounding yourself with this type of women will have a drastic, negative and unconconncious effect in the way you percieve women. In my philosophy that is unhealthy.

And personally i feel better goin for the first type. Why? I don't have to use sneaky tactics, I can be myself around them more often. And more importantly they bring out the better side of me.

Bump

So, I haven't posted here in a while, but I've been reading the posts... well, now I have a situation at work that has prompted me to make a post and see someone else's opinion on it.

Where should I start... well, this new girl started working at the same place as me a week or two ago... and man, she's breathtaking. Very pretty face, nice hair, my height, and gorgeous blue eyes that I can't forget. I'm 23, she's 18. :?

Since she started there, I've been working on it, trying to get to know her better, trying to be at least a bit funny, witty, and nice at the same time. It's a little hard to talk at work, since it's so busy all the time (food court at Costco), the only thing we can do is quick talk... very small conversations, small questions, and one liners. She seems comfortable around me, though I haven't tried any Kino or SOI for lack of opportunity.

Through these quick conversations, I found out she's just graduated form High School. She went to Mexico for a week for her graduation trip, got drunk every day. I also found out to my disappointment that she has a boyfriend. To my satisfaction, I also found out that her boyfriend lives in Washington (10 hour drive, if it's the state, a few days drive if it's Washington DC), and that she met him in Mexico. Now, in any other circumstances, I would never feel comfortable trying to be with a girl that already has a boyfriend. However, in this case where she got to know him for only a drunken week, and have been "going out" long distance for maybe a month or two.... well, I think I have more than a right to try to be with her. :p

Oh yeah... I also found out she loves Tequila more than anything else! :drink:

I realized today however, that although I've found out all those things about her, I don't quite remember of a single time she's asked something about me. I don't even think she asked anything (non work related) to anyone else there. I'm starting to think that she's just a really bad conversationalist, very indecisive, and extremely shy. It seems like she gets very confused and doesn't know what to say... like when I asked her "how did that happen?" about her b/f living in Washington, she shrugged, seemed confused for a couple of seconds, and then said they met in Mexico. She seem to shrug and not know what to say a lot... which I don't mind, she still comes across as a very nice girl, but it just makes it a lot harder for me to get a feedback on how she feels around me.

So tomorrow (actually today, since its past midnight) there is a graduation/birthday party for our boss's daughter, and everyone in the food court was invited. Everyone at work is just really nice to each other, we all get along very well, and just about everyone is going to the party, as well as some of the older people, which should be fun to drink with. The new girl is acquainted with the boss's daughter, but she's very undecided about going to the party. When I asked her if she was going a few days ago, she said "I might, but I don't know if I'm working that day." When I asked her about it today, she said "I won't be able to, I work until 8:15pm." The party starts at 4pm, but the boss said she was expecting the party to go until 2am, so I said "well, that's alright, the party should be kicking until 2am, so that shouldn't be a problem" in response, she shrugged and said "well, maybe, I'll have to see what's cracking." :confused:

I'm thinking that's probably her shy/insecure side that's afraid of going to a party with all these people she doesn't really know. I don't know though, I'm usually wrong when I make assumptions like that.

Well, I'll be stopping by Costco to buy a nice bottle of tequila before I head to the party. The time I'll be stopping by there, will be the time she'll be cleaning the lobby, and shouldn't be busy... so I'll talk to her a bit on my way out. I'll give her my phone and tell her to call me when she gets off work if she wants to find out how the party is going.

If she ends up going to the party... well, then she's just lame, and I'll still have tons of fun with my handle of Patron! :D If she does go, then this should be a nice field study on social dynamics! Either way, I'll make another post on how it all turns out. Ranma, the first shot of that bottle will go to you man, for starting this thread. :cheers:

And just one last question... what is a good way to socialize with a bad conversationalist like that? I'm not that great of a conversationalist myself but I think she tops me by a lot... hehe.

I'll reply to this later. You should read the ebook i posted. It might give some insight.

It is true tho, some women are terrible at conversation. She probably already senses you like her. I personally have a rule about not dipping my pen in the company Ink.

And I agree about the boyfriend thing. A good tip is: a lot of women have a boyfriend just for the sake of having one, and they aren't always getting into relationships they like. I've had women tell me within five minutes of meeting her say that her boyfriend hadn't slept with her in three months. Well in that case, I have every right to snag her away. A buddy of mine i used to club with told about a story where he was in the middle of having sex with a woman he met that night and she blurts out "I hope my BF doesn't find out about this!" classic.

Ok one final thought Tyrrant.

good for asking questions. But if she's not adding to the convo, and you keep asking questions you are in a way showing interest that she doesn't deserve.
Maybe try the vaccuum concept. It's like a reward system. you give them the opportunity to open up to you, and when they do, you reward them for their effort.

Once again, thanks for the invaluable tips Ranma. :goodjob2:
When I open up the tequila and drink the first shot, it'll be to you... in a manly way. :D

I downloaded the e-book on my Linux partition, but I think I didn't have a program to decompress that format. I'll download it on my Windows partition and I should be able get it working.

Well, I'm gonna go buy the tequila here in a few minutes, so I should be seeing her. woo hoo!

EDIT - Update:
So, I stopped by there, got the tequila, talked to a few people from work briefly, including the girl, they all saw the bottle of tequila... hurray tequila! I asked them to sign a birthday card that I had gotten, then I went out to the lobby to talk to the girl once again really quick.

"So, you are going to the party, right?"
She shook her head with a disappointed sort of look.
"Wha? How come?" I replied smiling
"My mom won't be home, so I'll be having a party at my place."
"Oh, well, in that case I gotta stop by there also to party, if the other party starts dying out. I'm sure there'll still be plenty of tequila left." Me still smiling and flirty
She smiled back but didn't say anything. After a couple of seconds, I said:
"Well, do you want to give me a call after you get out of work to see how the other party is doing?"
She readily took her phone out and handed it to me, so that I could put my number on her cell. I started typing my number on her cell, then called my cell phone from hers, so that I would also have her phone number (got that little trick from the seduction school video). I was kind of nervous though, so it took 3 tries of me calling my own phone from hers for me to type my correct phone number... lol.
I handed the phone back to her. I didn't know what else to say so before I started walking out I said "Well, I'll see you later. Don't have too much fun at work." -- what a lame line. lol.
Then As I started walking out, I turned around and while walking backwards said "Do give me a call when you get off work though..." while smiling and flirty once again.
She opened her mouth as if she was about to say something, but didn't. I took a couple more steps backwards, then turned back around and started walking towards the exit with tequila in hand.

Oh boy... I'm acting like a 10 year old school girl... :rolleyes:

She gets off work at 8:15pm, I'm heading out to the party at 8:00 or 8:30. I'll give her a call around 10... 10:30 if she doesn't call me. Until then, I'll be drinking lightly just in case I do end up going to her place. Right now though I'm just thinking:
"Expect the worst, hope for the best"

EDIT - Update:
Heading to the first party now! Whoot.... tequila amigos!!! Arriba arriba!

Latest News Flash

Just got back from the party... it was fun. Karaoke, good food, and plenty of tequila and beer... hmmmmm. The girl didn't call me, so I called her at 11pm but got the machine, at midnight the same thing, so I just left it alone. I ended up still having a great time at the party, though it was a bit more family oriented than I'd planned. hehe.

I'm not worried that she didn't call though. She's the one losing if she's not interested in me... I'm a great boyfriend. lol. :banana:

For real though. I drank a little bit so I'm rambling. Since she didn't seem interested in hanging out, I'll just let it drop. I'll still be nice. However, I plan on not trying to get a conversation started, to create that vacuum than Ranma talks about. I'll wait for her to start a conversation. If she doesn't, I'm not worried, my day will go by easier without having to think of something clever to say. :p

I'm off... gotta work tomorrow morning... adios!

cool stuff dude. you don't have to get it all in the first go. you're practicing and that's what counts.

I had a shitty night. i was supposed to go clubbing but my cousin wanted to see strippers. the strippers weren't bad but i'm not too fond of that entertainment. we were supposed to go to the club afterwards but my cousin got drunk and dropped his cell, then he insisted on going home to fix it. I better just go by myself next time with some cab money.

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Originally Posted by ranma187

I had a shitty night. i was supposed to go clubbing but my cousin wanted to see strippers. the strippers weren't bad but i'm not too fond of that entertainment.

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Them f*cking strippers... I was dating a woman when I was around 16-17. She was 23. Anyway, we dated for a few months and had a bunch of fun. Then, one day at her home, I found out the truth of the situation: she was a damn slut, a stripper, and a low-life heart-breaker. She was screwing more guys than you could possibly imagine. I'm just glad I didn't catch anything from her.

I felt so used and violated. It's weird, most guys think they'd love to date a stripper but, believe me, it's complete BS.

I learned two things that day:

1) Don't pick up woman in bars.
2) Strippers are f*cking whores. You may think the thought is attractive but nothing is farther from the truth. There's nothing attractive about some one whose hobby is to play with hearts and spread their attention - and everything else - all over town.

well you can meet some good women in bars. you just gotta screen the bad one's out. Set up a couple of shit tests like i described in the cheating thread.

good places to met women are in parks, and bookstores. I'm sure this time of year there are plenty of show and shines. get out too a few. Cars and chicks... nuff said.

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Originally Posted by ranma187

cool stuff dude. you don't have to get it all in the first go. you're practicing and that's what counts.

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Good point...

Quote:

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Originally Posted by ranma187

well you can meet some good women in bars. you just gotta screen the bad one's out. Set up a couple of shit tests like i described in the cheating thread.

good places to met women are in parks, and bookstores. I'm sure this time of year there are plenty of show and shines. get out too a few. Cars and chicks... nuff said.

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Can you post a link to the cheating thread please? I wanna check out that shit test... hehe.

Bookstores does sound like a good place to meet nice girls, but just the thought of approaching women in a bookstore gets me nervous and nauseous. Probably because the rejection rate would be a lot higher than at a bar. Also, I'm not a huge book reader so I (wrongly) assume that I wouldn't have much to talk about. It probably is a great place for a field "study though." Hopefully after reading these tips I'll grow some balls and try out a book store.

Have you ever tried to practice approaching women at a bookstore for a few hours? If so, how did it turn out?

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Originally Posted by tyrantt23

Can you post a link to the cheating thread please? I wanna check out that shit test... hehe.

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This is probably the one he's talking about.

i was searching jugglers forum and found this pretty decent post.

How to recover from close ended questions:





Just a quick tip that's working well for me. I'm prone to asking CEQs (close-ended questions) instead of OEQs (open-eneded questions) by accident. I do it frequently. I've found a good way to recover.

After she answers the CEQ, there's usually an obvious OEQ follow-up, but don't ask it. Instead, just wait. Vacuum. Usually, she'll elaborate, and then you've gotten about the same effect as if you'd asked the OEQ to begin with. The vacuum demonstrates high value on your part, and you get a good conversation going.

Example:

You: How was the beach today?
Her: Great.
You: <vacuum, with a bit of a smile>
Her: We sunbathed for about four hours. Check out this tan line.

If she doesn't elaborate, still do not ask the obvious OEQ. This looks needy, and you're on your way to a question train. Instead, answer the OEQ yourself using the I-perspective. Then ask her, "How about you?"

Bad:

You: How was the beach today?
Her: Great.
You: <vacuum>
Her: <vacuum back at'cha>
You: What did you do at the beach?
Her: I don't know. Hung out.

Good:

You: How was the beach today?
Her: Great.
You: <vacuum>
Her: <vacuum back at'cha>
You: I did this crazy amount of surfing. I'm worn out, but I've got that slightly euphoric feeling I always get after a good workout. How about you?
Her: We sunbathed for about four hours. Check out this tan line.

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Originally Posted by ranma187

i was searching jugglers forum and found this pretty decent post.

How to recover from close ended questions:

...

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That's a very interesting article! I seem to have a problem asking CEQs by accident too... my head is always thinking of how to phrase a certain question into an OEQ. lol. I've tried all those situations before, but just by random chance. I never stopped to think about it that way, that's very insightful!

I'll definitely be trying that out... :)

I do have one question about the article:
"How was the beach today?"
Isn't that an open ended question?

well that is closed endened. because the most common answer would be "Fine" or "Great" etc. but if you ask something like "Tell me, What did you like about going to the beach today?" is very different.

I'm going to calgary and clubbing this weekend. i will post field reports!

Hi... just thought I'd give an update, and sort of set up an explicit goal for myself tonight. I had some plans for tonight that went down the drain, so I'm sitting here at home, all prepped up, and doing nothing...

This is the perfect time for me to go out, by myself, and sarge some girls. The truth however, is that I'm nervous as hell just from thinking about it. When I thought about going out before, I'd never be this nervous, because it wasn't for certain. The difference now, is that I'm going there... whether I want it or not... and I'm going to approach girls, whether I want it or not. I'm trying to keep a mindset of "I don't give a damn about what happens..." but it's still a bit terrifying that I'm going there by myself and its just gonna be me... :shock:.

Hopefully I won't shit my pants before I get to the bar. :rolleyes:

Just for the record, I'm going to a bar/pool place in Berkley, California. My goal is to approach at the very least, 3 girls. If I get rejected quickly, then that means I'll have more time to approach more girls.

Here's to hoping I'll come back a better man! :D

cheers!

If I could give any advice, it would be to disconnect from the situation. Presumptions and planning always lead to self confidence issues, hence the "shitting the pants" thing.

Kick some brews, and wait.

You're jsut going out to be social i personally don't like the term "sarge". it is gonna be tough at first. but forcing yourcelf to approach will work wonders. don't just talk to the girls. talk to the guys too. it's gonna suck at first. remember the guys from the seduction school video. how nervous and afraid they were.

we all go through that. good luck.

edit: And I've found psyching myself up is bad. My best nights are when i go out expecting not really anything. if nothing happens nothing happens. if something does, than it suprises me and i roll with it. Don't psych yourself too much.

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Originally Posted by Half/Dreaming

If I could give any advice, it would be to disconnect from the situation.

Kick some brews, and wait.

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I agree with the first part, but somewhat disagree with the second part. The reason, is that if I "kick some brews, and wait" then I will just end up kicking some brews all night, and waiting all night. I do want to get more social, and the only way of doing that is to well, get more social, but next time I will have to disconnect myself a bit like you say.

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Originally Posted by ranma187

You're just going out to be social i personally don't like the term "sarge". it is gonna be tough at first. but forcing yourself to approach will work wonders. don't just talk to the girls. talk to the guys too. it's gonna suck at first. remember the guys from the seduction school video. how nervous and afraid they were.

we all go through that. good luck.

edit: And I've found psyching myself up is bad. My best nights are when i go out expecting not really anything. if nothing happens nothing happens. if something does, than it suprises me and i roll with it. Don't psych yourself too much.

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Very nice post Ranma! I can see where you're coming from with the term "sarge." The reason I used it then is because I had just read about that term that same day, and I had that one goal in mind that night. Sadly, I ended up psyching myself too much, like you say, and was getting too focused and worried on the whole "sarging" that I forgot to just stay cool, and be social.

Having said that, here's an outline of how that night went by to anyone interested:

I left home, psyched out, expecting to just approach women. On the way, I drank a red bull to get energized, and smoked a couple of cigs to calm down... haha.

As I walked in the pool place/bar, I kept a good image of myself, looked happy, without a care, checked out any possible girls to approach later on in the night. Walked to the bar, and ordered a Guinness. By then, I had already seen a group of 7 girls with one guy sitting at a table, two girls sitting by themselves at another table, and a couple of girls by themselves near the bar area.

After I got my beer, I got a bit nervous about the whole situation and went to the bathroom, from the bathroom to the smoking area. There I asked a lighter to a girl that was sitting by herself, but I didn't say anything to her for thinking that she was with some other guys at a table near us... a couple minutes later she finished her cigarette and walked out, then I just felt dumb for not being social. I went back inside and went to the bathroom, then went back to the bar area.

At this point, I was already a little lost and too self-conscious, feeling as if everyone was noticing me just wandering around. I stood in one spot, and started drinking my beer quickly while watching the tv. I was reluctant to approach the two girls that were sitting at the table because it was a few feet behind me, and I was too self-conscious of how I looked lost just standing there, drinking a beer by myself.

After I got done drinking the beer, I went to the bathroom once again, then headed back to the bar to get another beer. I noticed a very good looking girl standing next to me on the crowd of people wanting to get goodies from the bar. I took me one minute to let go of the worries and finally say something, and made sure to put up a nice, calm and confident body language and I think I did a pretty good job:

"Say, I was in the mood for trying out a new drink right now... what would you recommend?"

from there we started talking about different drinks, places she's been, where I'm from, the fact that I was there by myself since my friends flaked out on me, etc. I did kino a few times, and it was a nice addition to the conversation. She then invited me to hang out with her friends that were playing pool. Turned out she had a boyfriend, her other girlfriend had a boyfriend also, and there was a guy friend whom they claimed to be a good wing-man. I hung out with them a bit, we were all having a good time, played a game of pool, drank another beer, then the bar started closing. We went outside, smoked a cigarette, and the girl said to her boyfriend that he should get my number... and so we exchanged numbers. That was my night... and I even got a guy's number! haha. :rolleyes:

Seriously though, it turned out fun, and goes to tell that next time I really shouldn't psyche myself out that much. I should just try to be a bit more outgoing, without getting to the point where I'm too worried about it.

Sorry for the double post, but this is unrelated to my field adventure. I thought it would make it less cluttered to make a separate post about it.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by ranma187

You're jsut going out to be social i personally don't like the term "sarge". it is gonna be tough at first. but forcing yourcelf to approach will work wonders. don't just talk to the girls. talk to the guys too. it's gonna suck at first. remember the guys from the seduction school video. how nervous and afraid they were.

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In response, I will just post some insight I read on the Juggler's Method. By talking to both men and women, you show a genuine interest in people in general, instead of looking like you're just after women.

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Projecting genuine interest is important in your interactions with groups of people as well…

I was in San Francisco demonstrating the art of picking up women for a client at the Matrix nightclub. It’s a good place with many attractive people and a laid-back feel. Perfect for a Midwest boy such as myself. In the course of the night I see a guy sitting all in a row with four beautiful women. I approach him and introduce myself.

‘Frank’ was happy to talk. He invited me to sit down. It turned out these girls were his Brazilian cousins. They had been dragging him along all day shopping. He was in a state of dying-for-some-male-company. As we chatted about duct tape and hammering things, I came to appreciate him as a sincere and cool guy. We were connecting. But that is when the bad thing happened. As my new friend was in mid-sentence, one of his hot cousins leaned over and asked me where I was from.

This is predictable behavior from a girl who sees a person in her group making a connection with a stranger. She becomes curious. I should have simply smiled, put my index finger up indicating 'just a moment' and let the topic of conversation with Frank run its course before engaging her. That would have demonstrated I was motivated by genuine interest and that it was more important for me to make a real connection with a person than to jump on the first opportunity to talk to a hot girl. They all would have respected me for such a simple gesture as raising a finger.

But what I did do was leave Frank in mid-sentence and push over to her. That was a stupid thing to do. I was so focused on demonstrating how fast I could sit next to a hot girl that the only thing I demonstrated was that I was insincerity towards Frank so that I could get at his women. I didn't want Frank to feel that way about me. I wanted him to feel I was genuinely interested in him as a person first and foremost. But instead I chose to be shallow and out-for-myself and it showed. I demonstrated low value. And as further karmic punishment, in the process of hurrying over to the hot cousin, I knocked over everyone's drink. I was the Jerry Lewis of PUAs.

Two months later I was in a similar situation that had a much different outcome. I was standing in New York City at an outdoor bar in Union Square with some clients - all great guys and future hall of fame PUAs.

I don’t just demonstrate - sometimes I push. I asked one of my clients to walk over and casually engage the wearer of a Yankees cap. He and ‘Carl’ hit it off and were quickly chatting like old friends about baseball.

But a couple minutes into the conversation one of the three cute women Carl was with wandered over and tried to steal my client’s attention. But wisely he didn't take the bait. He just gave a friendly little wave and kept talking about RBIs and puffed-up home run hitters.

Later my student asked Carl in a confidential tone, "Which one of these girls is your girlfriend? I don't want to be accidentally flirting with her."

A big smile reached across Carl's face.

"That one right there. The others are fair game. I know Shannon with the red hair there just broke up with her boyfriend."

"Cool," my student said, "Can you introduce me to them?"

"Sure. Hey girls this is my new friend..."

I was so proud I almost cried. This is the gentleman’s way of pick up. Not only did my student show he was genuinely interested in people but he used that to segue into meeting the women in a friendly, pre-approved way. I love him.

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Really some amazing insight. :)

cool how you just infiltrated a social circle like that. I'm pretty good at that too. it feels more social and relaxed than cold approaching. good job. Even if you don't sleep with the girls. stay friends with them. hot girls have other hot and single friends. these are called Gatekeepers.

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Originally Posted by tyrantt23

I meant to give an update of that bar night, but never got around to it. I still have some lingering questions though, so I'll give a little rundown of how my night went, and what my questions are:

So, I started out by driving 45 minutes to Sacramento. I was mainly interested in dancing, but also ready to engage in a few quick conversations. When I was walking towards the club I was going to, I met another group of 2 guys and one girl that were going to the same place. There was a big line and a cover charge, so we smoked a cigarette and talked for a bit. The conversation went alright, no awkward silence, no signs of them thinking I'm weird for being by myself. They decided to go back to the bar they were at before instead of waiting in line, and since I said I was new to the area, they asked if I wanted to come along. The two guys were very drunk, but a friendly drunk, the girl didn't seem so, but she was sexy and I was still trying to figure out if she was single, so what the hell, I went along for the walk.

Once we got at the bar, I was introduced to 5 more of their friends, and hung out there listening to some live music. Now, at times like that when I'm around complete strangers, I tend to be a little lost in the conversation and feel a bit out of place. They are talking about things that I don't know, and I'm trying to listen to all the separate conversations at the same time to hopefully find a topic that I can relate to and then comment on it. What usually happens though is that I end up looking from conversation to conversation, not really knowing what they're talking about, and trying to look interested by giving smiles/laughing... when a topic does pop up that I may have something to comment, then I'm reluctant to say anything, because I wasn't paying much attention to that particular conversation in the first place, so I don't know if what I think is relevant really is. Does that make any sense?

Anyway, I went to get another beer, it was just me and the other two guys I met earlier were talking, the conversation was going good. Then they saw another friend, and introduced me to her. She was alright-looking. I'll call her Sara. Now, I'm not trying to be shallow, but by her looks, I didn't have much interest in Sara. I went out for a cig and she came along. We were talking for a little while, again, the conversation was going well, no awkward pauses, I tried to be funny a few times, but since I wasn't really interested in her, I didn't KINO, and didn't SOI... just chatted.

The guys I had met earlier (and the girl) all left while I was smoking the cig because one of the guys had to go be the DJ for some other club. $20.00 cover charge, so I stayed talking with Sara. Back at the bar, she brought me to her table... 8 other friends that I met. 7 girls, and one guy that I'm 99% sure was gay (I have nothing against gay people by the way). Yeah, I was under a bit of pressure there, and feeling a bit out of place once again, but I just tried to keep some sort of conversation with the girl I'd just met, without closing ourselves from the table. It was a large group of people I didn't know, so the same thing also happened a few times, where I just looked from person to person, trying to capture the conversations and trying to comment on it. At the same time, I was trying to figure out which girl was good looking, which girl was single, which girl looked interested in me... yes, a task that's pretty much impossible, especially considering I never asked any questions regarding that subject. lol.

Fast forward a bit, the bar was closing down. "What now?" was the mutual concern... some of the girls were planning on going back home. Sara and her brother, came up with the idea of buying some liquor and going to the park in Sacramento to drink. Sara lives in San Francisco, but was in Sacramento for the night, so everyone thought "alright" to the idea of hanging out and drinking a bit more. Sara rode in the car with me. We all got to the store a few minutes late, and they weren't selling alcoholic beverages anymore. Her friends decided to go back home, and Sara asked if I could drop her brother at his place, and her at her parent's place (where she was spending the night at). Shurrr... why not?

On the ride back, turns out that she and her brother are huge fans of Bossa Nova type of music, so I scramble through some CDs and end up finding some, which happened to be her favorite song. Hah, bonus points for me... lucky draw. After dropping her brother off, she asks if I was ok to drive 45 minutes back home, or if I wanted to stay at her parent's house for a bit. Now, like I said, I never made any advances on her, and I wasn't all that interested in her, but she had a pretty nice body (not as much on face), and I have a real hard time saying no to advances from women 1 on 1 like that. So when I dropped her off, I asked if I could use the bathroom.

After getting out, she asks if I want to hang out for a bit. She was supposed to sleep on the couch in the living room that night, her parents already asleep on the room close near the living room. I thought it might be a bit difficult to do anything, but what the heck, I'm already there, so why not hang out for a little bit. We tried to pick out a movie to watch, and she says Elizabeth might be nice to watch because of all the pretty colors, so I was down with it. We sat down and the first scene of the movie was some people getting tortured and burned to death... ah, so romantic! She said she forgot how violent the movie was, but I didn't really care, I knew where this was going already.

We talked a little bit as the movie was playing, and after rapport was pretty built up, I turned my head and we started kissing. Kissing went to me being on top of her, to some mutual masturbations, to orgasm, to her giving me oral. She seemed very little experienced in it... just very plain, up and down motion kind of thing.... but its still not that bad right? Eventually I get another orgasm, and well... she keeps on with the oral. So, the scene at that time started getting a little awkward and funny to me. I had already had two orgasms, had the small little TV playing that intense movie in front of me, her parents are asleep next door, and her head is going up and down like a yo-yo on crack. I was already feeling very satisfied, but how do you go about telling a girl that "hey, can you stop giving me oral now?" If you know, please tell me. Instead, I just sat back and let it happen... just examined everything and found the whole situation very funny. After a few more minutes I actually had a third orgasm to my own surprise.

To wrap up this huge story of that night, we sat for a little while longer in the living room, with not much to say other than being polite and commenting that "wow, that was good." Then I suggested a cigarette and we both went outside, smoked, and that was my exit plan. When we got done smoking, I said I should probably head back home, I got her phone number, and drove the 45 minutes back home.

That was a week and half ago... and I haven't called her.

So, first of all, I'm really sorry for the huge story. Now, I just have a few questions and wanted some opinions from you all... am I too shallow for not being interested on her based on her looks? What is a good way to go about when meeting a large group of people, like the table with the 7 girls? Also... are there any etiquettes that most people follow for a one night stand like that? Am I an ass for not having called her? She said she would show me around San Francisco, but that would mean I would be with her, and not really be meeting other people/girls... so, I just never called. What do you guys think?

Once again, sorry for the huge post, hopefully whoever reads at least parts of it will find it a bit entertaining. That's all folks... I'm heading to bed now. Nite. :D

EDIT: OMG! After posting it I can see how huge my post really is. Damn... I don't blame you guys if you don't read any of it. hehe.

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I wanted to read the whole thread before I posted ut I read your story and I have to say it is a must read for all women on the planet that want insight into the average guy's head when they don't get called back. Honestly if a girl wants a relationship and not just sex, this why the "give the phone number and wait till he calls before giving any sex" rule is key. I've been in that same situation. I just acted on instinct and out of drunkeness, ot laid and a phone number and thought, "You know on second thought, I really don't want to be with her." It's hardly our fault, we have a drive that's built to have us not conceive long term consequences of our actions, sexually at least.

Ok it's a bout time i posted a decent field report. No lay. but i got a number and had some really good interaction with a chick. I socially vibed well with others all night. it was awesome.

My Wing came down for a visit. i live in a small town so i suggested aanother small college town a few minutes away. it has a few bars. and a small nightclub.

On the drive we do a drill on storytelling. basically we give eachother a random word or subject and then we relate it to a story about ourselves. This is a great excercise to do with your wing BTW. you'll suck at the storytelling at first. but when you start doing the field work you will be amazed at how fast and easily stories game come up during the gaming. A good idea is to tweak your storytelling. learn how to build tension. have low points. and end on a high point.

We get to a lounge to relax and play some pool. A nice waitress comes up.

Her: Hi, how are you?

Me: good, how are you?

Her: good!!!

Me: Darn and i was hoping i would have to cheer someone up.

Her: (laughs) oh yeah I'm so depressed.

Me: well maybe getting me a kokanee would cheer you up.

Me and my wing get drinks and set up a game of pool. I see some guy at the pool table next to us. he's with a group of firneds. I recognise him from high school. I chat him up. meet some of his friends. One of his friends is where a flashy outfit. the waitress goes up to him.

Flash: pez? (holding up a pez dispenser)

her: sure.

Flash: weren't you ever told not to take candy from a stranger.

Her: hehe (not enthusiastically)

I burst out laughing recognising the mystery pez opener. I roll up to flash and say
Me: how are you doing Mr. Mystery method.

We wind up chatting a bit. he lives in a town not too far away. From his vibe i definately don't wanna wing with him. but i chat anyway just to be social. I talk to D my highschool friend again. Were talking about our drunken adventures and bs. I was in the middle of a story about a friend of mine who had a gf who always got drunk, riled him up for sex and passed out. too cut too the punchline, in the stry the girl wakles up one morning and says "I can't open my eyes AHHH" I'll let you buggers figure out the middle of the story .

As i finish telling i notice a petite blonde is quite ineterested in my story and vibe. This is great also. If you talk to lots of guys as well as girls. You'll attract more female curiosity.

she says she never passes out. except once at her grad party. She threw up and passed out on the bathroom floor.

Me: that could be sexy.

She bowls over laughing. I ask her name again. I introduced myself earlier but i forgot her name. she says it's ok she has a bad memory except for the most irrelivant details.

Me: like what?

Her: Well when i was 8 i remember decorating my christmas tree by myself. I accentally tipped it over and made a huge mess.

Me: haha really? when i was five. i wanted to know if my mothers perfume was drinkable.

Her: haha

Me: yeah i wound up throwing up all over her bed.

Her: laughs more. (gives some childhood story about climbing and something about t.v. shows she use to watch as a kid)

Me: Hey I use to watch my little pony. Didn't they have stupid powers like sharing honor and s--t? (I hate routines but this seemed appropriate.)

We story tell a bit more. I forget to SOI or escalate. but i just say "I'm gonna scout around a bit (kino on shoulder,) I'll be back.

I go back to D. He says they're hopping to the next bar. I vibe with his friends with a bit. Me and my wing are invited to join them.

WE leave the bar with the girl (who is in their group). some guy gives her a happy birthday.

Me: It's your birthaday? Happy birthday. how old are you?

Her: I turned 18 an hour ago. It sucks tho, i have to come home sober tonight. i can only have a few drinks.

Me: WEll normally I don't buy drinks. But, since it's your birthday, I'll make an exception in your case. And my birthday is coming up to you know (It's not lying it's flirting)

Her: Oh yeah. I'd totally buy you one.

WE keep walking I chat with the other dudes a bit. they are slightly drunk and loud. D complains about he's too loud sometimes when he's drunk. I told him what Wayne says about loud people don't scare people. quiet people do. He totally agrees.

I vibe with the other guys a bit. they are talking about desperate drug addicts. I told a true story about a guy i knew who sold his family thanksgiving turkey for crack. that got the wohle group laghing.

WE arrive at the bar. Sit down. D introduces me to a bunch of girls. i just make small talk. with some open ended questions. I join the birthday blond. Some cougar had already bought her a drink. It's called a malibu sting. I buy her one. We start talking again. I'm goin with rapport now. I kino a lot. we get to know eachother quite well. she got picked on at school. She loves drama but her parents want her to be a teacher. she said she would be good at teaching. She's both motherly and stern.

Me: well if you wind up being a teacher what would be your face for getting the children to behave... Give me your mean face.

She does a funny mean face. My wing points out there's a slow song going on at the dance floor. I take a hint and say "I hate you dude i can't dance". he insists. I'm terrible at dancing. I don't wanna ask to dance and then dissapoint her. i suddenly got an idea. i use the sexual tension principle.

Me: (with kino) this is a great song to dance too. But I'm a terrible dancer

Her: OOH I love dancing. Let me teach you.

we go up and slow dance. I lift her arm and twirl her.

Me: haha i saw that on a salsa dancing video.

Her: ooh i've always wanted to learn salsa.

Me: me too Lets take lessons together.


After the dance i go to my wing. It's late and everyones leaving. My wing tells me to get her number. I don't have a cell. or a pen. Buyt i have a notepad. My wing gets a pen from the bar. I get D's number, i want to hang with him again. he says it's cool. I # close the birthday blond. and leave.

all in all good night. things I could have done more : SOI, More sexual tension, kiss close.

comments, criticism all welcome.

What's SOI then? And uh, if she turned 18.. At least she's legal.