MILD my first 5 nights. Suggestions for going back to sleep?

I have tried to have lucid dreams off and on with very little effort (one weak suggestion that i will realize I'm dreaming and remember my dream before bed) for a while with no success at lucid dreaming but vastly improved dream recall (at least one a night when I remembered to set the intention). 5 days ago I attended a talk about lucid dreaming and it inspired me to give it some real effort with some proven induction techniques. That night I tried using the MILD technique I set my intention to wake up after every dream and recall and write down my dream, and told myself that i would realize i was dreaming. I woke up around 4:30 with a weakly recalled non lucid dream and then started setting my intention to realize i was dreaming as i went back to sleep, I succeeded in having my first lucid dream with only one big setback I didn't fall back asleep until 6:30! My lucid dream was such an intensely enjoyable experience I didn't let two hours of sleeplessness scare me away from continuing to try and since this night i have experienced one other lucid dream on a night where i had no trouble falling back asleep after awaking from my first or second dream of the night. But i have also had one night of being up for 3 hours in the middle of the night with no lucid dream payoff and last night i was up from 1:30 to 6:30 again with no lucid dream. Has anyone else ever had this problem? I'm really grateful for the success I've experienced fairly quickly at having intensely enjoyable albeit extremely short lucid dreams so quickly and will continue trying to induce them but would really appreciate any suggestions anyone might have about falling back asleep while setting the intention to realize your dreaming. Even just someone sharing they had the same experience and improved at it over time would give me some extra motivation. I think i may be too excited at the prospect of having a lucid dream and that is keeping me awake or I'm setting my intention with too much or the wrong type of effort and this is keeping me from falling back asleep. Any suggestions or just experiences shared much appreciated?

The good news is you should be able to reduce the times that you have trouble going to sleep over time. I would have some sleepless stretches early on so I decided to just try on the weekends but I'm getting better at finding the balance between waking up too much and waking up enough to prepare the mind to more easily LD. The quickest way for me to fall asleep is to turn on my side but if you like to stay mostly on your back which seems to be good for awareness there is an alternative below from Mr. 0 Blonde:

"Yeah when I first started doing this sometimes it took ages to fall back to sleep, if it took to long though I can just turn on my side and fall a sleep within a couple of minutes, I won't be guaranteed a Lucid if I do that though.

One of the things I do now that helps me fall to sleep quicker if I'm struggling is....

If lying flat out on my back with my arms by my sides after about 10-15 minutes or so and I still feel wide awake, I'll move my body slightly on my side but so I'm still pretty much on my back, then I feel the muscles in the shoulder I lay slightly on and in my back squeeze up a bit.
This contraction of the muscles give a relaxing feeling after being flat out on my back for a while and is often just enough to make me able to drift off quite quickly."

I'm having the exact same issue now, except I haven't had the pleasure yet of my first LD so I'm jealous :). I've been doing LD training for about 23 days now, mostly working on recall and journaling, WL RCs, etc., but this last week I've been seriously working on MILD after waking up. When all I was doing was journaling and falling back to sleep I had no problems getting right back to sleep, but now that I'm seriously working on the MILD repetitions my falling back asleep is much slower, and sometimes takes 2-3 hours at least. I sleep on my side so turning to the side doesn't help, in fact I try lying on my back as an aid to falling asleep since it's a different position, but it doesn't help since it's less comfortable for me. I'm also seeking aids/technique, wondering what I'm doing wrong (?) that's keeping me up.

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Originally Posted by FryingMan

I'm having the exact same issue now, except I haven't had the pleasure yet of my first LD so I'm jealous :). I've been doing LD training for about 23 days now, mostly working on recall and journaling, WL RCs, etc., but this last week I've been seriously working on MILD after waking up. When all I was doing was journaling and falling back to sleep I had no problems getting right back to sleep, but now that I'm seriously working on the MILD repetitions my falling back asleep is much slower, and sometimes takes 2-3 hours at least. I sleep on my side so turning to the side doesn't help, in fact I try lying on my back as an aid to falling asleep since it's a different position, but it doesn't help since it's less comfortable for me. I'm also seeking aids/technique, wondering what I'm doing wrong (?) that's keeping me up.

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Hi Benap and Fryingman I have the same problem...in fact it's got worse since my Ld's...I suppose the expectation is more. I'm looking around for advice and if I find anything worth considering I'll post it here Regards

I'm back...that was quick...I've found this

13 Natural Ways To Fall Asleep Without Sleeping Pills

Some of it doesn't suit me (I don't smoke, haven't got a bath, don't fancy yoga, scent may make me cough...and I do get up for a while.)

I've got Valerian (Kalms) They're mild and I've only taken them twice before...and that was because I thought they might enhance dreams and now I need help getting off so I'll experiment with them.

Melatonin is obviously what our body uses at night (this article says take it earlier before bed) I'm wary because it says it shifts circadian rhythm and maybe that would create a problem. But there's plenty of discussion on Dream Views about both the above supplements

I always drink a small coffee when I WBTB...I think it doesn't affect me but I'll have to abstain for a while and see what happens

Herbal tea Mmm...I think they're pretty foul but they may work...I'll cadge a couple off my daughter-in-law

Muscle relaxation is good. KingYoshi has a simple one minute session on his WILD blog and it makes me involuntarily yawn every time I use it

I use music rather than white noise and, although I play it so often it's now just background, I really need something that drones more, without much variation...binaural and/or isochronic I'm looking at this

http://www.dreamviews.com/lucid-aids...nic-tones.html


...and I have to get a black-out blind for my bedroom...and you? Move the wife into the attic....

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...and I have to get a black-out blind for my bedroom...and you? Move the wife into the attic....

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Thanks for all the suggestions! I don't like the notion of using "stuff" because I don't want to be hooked on it for the only way to sleep / have LDs.

Haha, no wife last night, as I said I had zero distractions (I came to our little place outside the city on my own, the wife is coming tonight). Pitch black room, absolute silence outside, perfect conditions, I thought: still couldn't get back to sleep. Although I just had a successful almost-2-hour nap right now with a very short dream recall. And I'm eating bananas like a monkey today ;).

I was thinking that perhaps exposure to a lot of sun during the day (I started LD training during my vacation and was outside a lot in the sun) and exercise (was swimming in the lake, working in the garden, hiking in the forest during vacation) made me sleep better. With the more passive city life I may really not need 8 hours of sleep, so I'm going to make an effort to do physical activity every day.

For too-much-light-room conditions I've found a sleep mask + a little towel on the head blocks the light pretty well.

I feel all of your pain...I have been there (and still on occasion, but much more rare). I am no expert on falling asleep but the other things that helped me(some nights more than others) were earplugs if any distracting noise, sleep mask as mentioned above, **not getting anxious about going to sleep, & *not waking up too long. I think those relaxation techniques work, you just need to find the right one for you. If it is affecting work or school or your sanity, hold off until the weekend or days you can sleep in and you will see that you have less anxiety about going back to sleep if you know you can sleep in (assuming you can) and that alone gets me to sleep quicker.

I use SSILD and I was finding the balance between not making it through the exercise (the "cycles") due to falling asleep during the attempt because I did not wake up enough, and the other end side of the balancing scale - waking up too much. Just thinking about not getting back to sleep is likely to make it harder.

I used to have trouble falling asleep but then read a little about meditation (very little). But one thing it said is to clear your mind. I discovered if I stare with my eyes closed to the up and right it is relaxing for me. Figure out what is most comfortable for you. Then I imagine a sliding tuner where the middle is "zero distractions". I imagine sliding it to the middle then I turn off my thoughts...just stop thinking about anything. Very quickly...seconds or minute or two...I am out. Amazing how it works but if you can clear your mind and stop thinking, you blink out.

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Originally Posted by Rothgar

I used to have trouble falling asleep but then read a little about meditation (very little). But one thing it said is to clear your mind. I discovered if I stare with my eyes closed to the up and right it is relaxing for me. Figure out what is most comfortable for you. Then I imagine a sliding tuner where the middle is "zero distractions". I imagine sliding it to the middle then I turn off my thoughts...just stop thinking about anything. Very quickly...seconds or minute or two...I am out. Amazing how it works but if you can clear your mind and stop thinking, you blink out.

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Thanks that's good advice! I had a better time last night when the same thing was shaping up to happen again by making these mental adjustments:
1) I set my mind not to stress about not sleeping, I set a happy/interested/amused attitude that watching the falling asleep experience was entertaining and educational
2) I did something like what you're talking about: tried not to react or focus attention on or get excited about anything (like "hey maybe I can WILD From here!"), not think about anything. Once I successfully got this going I think I fell asleep pretty fast.

There is stil the temptation to WILD when I see the brief scenes forming, but I resisted and focused on falling (unconsciously) asleep. I'm glad I did because I was asleep most of the night this time.

As a result I had a pretty good night: a number of wakings (4? Including the final one) with a large variety of dreams, with ok (not great) recall of detail. Including another mention of lucid dreaming (which my dream ego let pass without a hint of questioning reality :( )

Yay I hope this is the end of this little trend-let

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Originally Posted by FryingMan

There is stil the temptation to WILD when I see the brief scenes forming, but I resisted and focused on falling (unconsciously) asleep. I'm glad I did because I was asleep most of the night this time.

As a result I had a pretty good night: a number of wakings (4? Including the final one) with a large variety of dreams, with ok (not great) recall of detail. Including another mention of lucid dreaming (which my dream ego let pass without a hint of questioning reality :( )

Yay I hope this is the end of this little trend-let

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I'm glad for you Fryingman...that a great sign and now you're moving forward again. That's dreaming isn't it? Battles won...then setbacks...then more victories. Ever onward to Berlin!

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Originally Posted by FryingMan

Thanks that's good advice! I had a better time last night when the same thing was shaping up to happen again by making these mental adjustments:
1) I set my mind not to stress about not sleeping, I set a happy/interested/amused attitude that watching the falling asleep experience was entertaining and educational
2) I did something like what you're talking about: tried not to react or focus attention on or get excited about anything (like "hey maybe I can WILD From here!"), not think about anything. Once I successfully got this going I think I fell asleep pretty fast.

There is stil the temptation to WILD when I see the brief scenes forming, but I resisted and focused on falling (unconsciously) asleep. I'm glad I did because I was asleep most of the night this time.

As a result I had a pretty good night: a number of wakings (4? Including the final one) with a large variety of dreams, with ok (not great) recall of detail. Including another mention of lucid dreaming (which my dream ego let pass without a hint of questioning reality :( )

Yay I hope this is the end of this little trend-let

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Nice! By the way, since you had a number of awakenings, have you thought about DEILD, the "easiest" form of WILD?

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Originally Posted by fogelbise

Nice! By the way, since you had a number of awakenings, have you thought about DEILD, the "easiest" form of WILD?

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That's a good idea. Before I was worried about filling out my dream journal and working on recall, but since that seems to be coming along pretty well I think I may try DEILD. Doing the journaling keeps me up for about 10-15 minutes so I end up trying a WILD from scratch when I don't do MILD. I'll try a DEILD from time to time as well!

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Originally Posted by FryingMan

That's a good idea. Before I was worried about filling out my dream journal and working on recall, but since that seems to be coming along pretty well I think I may try DEILD. Doing the journaling keeps me up for about 10-15 minutes so I end up trying a WILD from scratch when I don't do MILD. I'll try a DEILD from time to time as well!

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As I am sure you know, keep up with those fundamentals (that you have been working on, DJ and recall) at the same time you try anything new. By the way, it looks like the OP Benap has not been back since they posted their question. But at least the rest of us got to discuss ideas and your success is encouraging.

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Originally Posted by fogelbise

As I am sure you know, keep up with those fundamentals (that you have been working on, DJ and recall) at the same time you try anything new. By the way, it looks like the OP Benap has not been back since they posted their question. But at least the rest of us got to discuss ideas and your success is encouraging.

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Oh, I wil, definitely keep up the journaling and recall efforts.
So I tried DEILD last night! Didn't make it in to the dream, but I happened to notice that I'd woken up, and I kept still and didn't open my eyes. I had no lingering dream in my mind, so I asked myself "What was I dreaming about?" and the recall came immediately. I visualized using these scenes, but no dream formed. My body screamed to move, my hands were very annoyingly numb from my position, and I badly needed to go to the bathroom, but I was able to remain still, and the body signals did subside a bit eventually. I did a few swallows and closed eye "blinks" since my eyes had that "tired/scratchy/sleepy" sensation, but these actions didn't really wake me up and I didn't pay them attention. I kept this up for about 10-15 minutes it felt like, but I didn't move from the "daydreaming" into real dreaming (just like my typical WILD attempts) and I was feeling quite alert, and I didn't want to lose more dreaming time so I gave up. I did stick with it for a good long while, but I felt that with DEILD either you get it or you don't, within a few minutes (is that right? Just how long should one maintain the attempt for it to be a true DEILD?)

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Originally Posted by FryingMan

I kept this up for about 10-15 minutes it felt like, but I didn't move from the "daydreaming" into real dreaming (just like my typical WILD attempts) and I was feeling quite alert, and I didn't want to lose more dreaming time so I gave up. I did stick with it for a good long while, but I felt that with DEILD either you get it or you don't, within a few minutes (is that right? Just how long should one maintain the attempt for it to be a true DEILD?)

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That is great that you were able to remain still and grab that recall quickly after your question to yourself. I am still learning DEILD but the times it has worked for me it happened very quick. Like you were saying if it doesn't happen within a few minutes it may just not be happening this time and you might want to switch to a different technique or just go back to sleep if you need to. Some of the regular lucid dreamers seem to use different techniques according to what feels right at the time. I would definitely keep trying it when you awake like that. Ideal is when you barely notice that you have awoken and feel like you can go right back to sleep.