Say no to reality checks...

First off, I have never become lucid (personally) due to a reality check at random. I have always first felt that "I'm dreaming" feeling before following up with a RC. At that point I don't really need a RC, I just know I'm dreaming.

A second theory of mine is that, as you perform RC's throughout the day it forms a habit. With this habit also comes the "habit" of the RC's working since you are not dreaming. So I believe that if you RC just out of habit in a dream, odds are high that it will work, just as you would expect it to.

Other people may have more success with them, but they just don't work for me.

One noobie isn't going to change the foundation of Lucid Dreaming.

Hmm...and just when I thought the art of lucid dreaming is all about what you expect to happen. RC's are helpful all right...when you already know you're dreaming.

I think this "foundation" is a little more complex than just reality checks.

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Originally Posted by Lizard King

Other people may have more success with them, but they just don't work for me.

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That's the key sentence right there. Everyone is different. Some people find one technique very easy and effective, and for others it doesn't work at all.

sometimes they work and sometimes they dont. For me, if I get that that feeling where I know im dreaming the reality check is not really necessary but i'll usually still do a few just to be sure. Other times when I get that feeling but im not entirely sure the reality check can fail.

Good point..

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Originally Posted by Ryuinfinity

One noobie isn't going to change the foundation of Lucid Dreaming.

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Wow i gotta say that was incredibly ignorant

Lizard King, that is usually how i become lucid as well. I have had a few lucids and i think only in two of them i used the hands-melting reality check, thats it

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Originally Posted by Hercuflea

Wow i gotta say that was incredibly ignorant

Lizard King, that is usually how i become lucid as well. I have had a few lucids and i think only in two of them i used the hands-melting reality check, thats it

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for some reason the hand rc's dont seem to work for me. Ive never seen my hands melt. Once I tried to poke a finger through my hand and it was as solid as real llife. That rc failed and before i had a chance to do another one a dc came and convinced me it wasnt a dream.

Also I dont know if anyone else does this but lately i've been using my cell phone as a rc. Recently I had a dream where a friend was supposed to meet me somewhere after school(I meet this guy guy everyday) and he was unusually late so i pulled out my phone to call him and the screen had a bunch of gibberish on it and the screensaver was different. This made me quickly realize that i was dreaming. Unfortunately It only lasted for a few seconds because someone came in my room and woke me up.

When you RC really really really really HOPE TO GOD that you really are dreaming! Really expect to be dreaming! Dont just do them to see if they fail or not!
Thats were everyone messes up! Expect to be able to count 10 fingers, expect to be able to breather through a closed nose!

Don't expect anything. Why bother with a reality check, unless you are asking a serious question? If you expect beforehand, then you introduce bias.

Spontaneous lucidity. Some call it that; I do, too. But was it really spontaneous? Or did you think to yourself, "I was in bed an hour ago," or "Wait... There's no such thing as zombies," before the onset of lucidity? Because, although I call this "spontaneous lucidity," I believe it could also be called a mental reality check.

And if you don't have a mental reality check, or any sort of basis to prove that you are dreaming, then how do you know you are dreaming?

I thought the exact same thing when I started trying to LD. One problem I saw with it was that I don't ever do any habits (biting my nails, whistling, brushing my hair back with my hand, etc) in my dream so why would I do an RC if it became a habit?

It turns out though that the purpose of RCs is really just to question your reality more often. It isn't necessarily to make you "accidentally" do an RC in a dream. I've never become lucid from doing an RC. I'm always at least fairly sure it's a dream before I do an RC.

Well, they do for me, and I'll keep doing RCs because it works for me. Everyone is different, I guess.

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Originally Posted by John11

It turns out though that the purpose of RCs is really just to question your reality more often. It isn't necessarily to make you "accidentally" do an RC in a dream. I've never become lucid from doing an RC. I'm always at least fairly sure it's a dream before I do an RC.

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Exactly! And I do a RC to make sure I am dreaming, even though I am pretty sure I am dreaming, most of the time.

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Originally Posted by Ryuinfinity

One noobie isn't going to change the foundation of Lucid Dreaming.

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That's dumb.

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A second theory of mine is that, as you perform RC's throughout the day it forms a habit. With this habit also comes the "habit" of the RC's working since you are not dreaming. So I believe that if you RC just out of habit in a dream, odds are high that it will work, just as you would expect it to.

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Like everyone else said, the idea is really just to stop and ask yourself if you are dreaming. The physical check is just to assure yourself that you are, in fact, dreaming.

RCs definitely work for me. I'll often be in a nonlucid dream and I will think to do a RC and it will fail thus letting me know I'm dreaming. I'm using the nose pinch test at the moment. Usually I am completely convinced I'm awake and I'm totally expecting to not be able to breathe through my pinched nose. I am gobsmacked when I find I can breathe having been thinking there's no way it's a dream!

It's because you're doing your reality checks wrong, it sounds like.

See http://www.dreamviews.com/community/...ad.php?t=69979

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Originally Posted by Lizard King

First off, I have never become lucid (personally) due to a reality check at random. I have always first felt that "I'm dreaming" feeling before following up with a RC. At that point I don't really need a RC, I just know I'm dreaming.

A second theory of mine is that, as you perform RC's throughout the day it forms a habit. With this habit also comes the "habit" of the RC's working since you are not dreaming. So I believe that if you RC just out of habit in a dream, odds are high that it will work, just as you would expect it to.

Other people may have more success with them, but they just don't work for me.

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I'm in the same boat. By the time I think to do one in a dream, I already know I'm dreaming. I usually become lucid by becoming aware of a growing feeling, or the feeling that something just isn't right.

So instead of doing RCs throughout the day, I instead just try to become super aware of my surrounding and try to keep it up for as long as possible. Since that's what seems to lead to my lucidity, it makes more sense to try and develop that than doing RCs.

I also find the awareness RCs much easier to do, I'm just way more motivated.

RCs are brilliant. I'm having so many LDs from RCs. I do them during the day whenever something even slightly unusual happens and really pay attention. I know what you mean though about getting used to the tests passing. It's a complete waste of time for me to look at my hands now because my brain has learned to construct them perfectly when I'm dreaming. Luckily the nose pinch test has always failed when I'm dreaming so I'm relying on that. I hope to God that test doesn't ever pass when I'm dreaming or I'll definitely miss the fact that I'm dreaming.

I have always tried to raise my general awareness rather than doing random RC's. Granted, I am also self-defence instructor and occasionally doing jobs as bouncer, so high awareness is a must for me. RC is mainly for me to make sure that I am dreaming after I have initially realized it.

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Originally Posted by Lizard King

I think this "foundation" is a little more complex than just reality checks.

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It is. But telling people not to RC is like telling them not to keep a dream journal or do WBTBs. It won't work.

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Originally Posted by Ryuinfinity

It is. But telling people not to RC is like telling them not to keep a dream journal or do WBTBs. It won't work.

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Well... you can achieve lucid dreams without dreamjournal or WBTBs :P and it will work. You can achieve LD without RC too but I would suggest all those three to beginning lucid dreamer ^^

^I agree with you that you can achieve an LD without any of those, but whatever method you use, the three basics are still incredibly helpful IMO.

I agree that the basics are really helpful, if only to get you thinking about LDing more, questioning reality, ect. However, I think that the 'status quo' mentality isn't very helpful either. What if there is something incredibly better than RCing, and noone has figured it out yet. My philosophy is that questioning the norm is exactly what the point is on these forums. If the idea were just to say "Oh yes, well here is the way to do it, now follow these steps" then DV would just be a tutorial page, and not a forum. Thanks for your input Lizard King.

Agreed. The problem is, if you stick too much to other people tutorials, ways of doing, it might stop your progress or cause confusion. We are working with dreams after all, which I believe is one of the most personal ground we can ever think of.

But there are general guidelines of course :) but imo you will never master anything if you listen too much others. Gotta do your own digging :)

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Originally Posted by Ryuinfinity

One noobie isn't going to change the foundation of Lucid Dreaming.

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Lizard King is just suggesting an idea. No need to completely shoot 'em down for it. :p

Still, RCs are definitely important, if not as a major way of achieving LDs but rather as a way of confirming whether one is or is not dreaming.

In my own personal experience, "accidental" LDs are generally as a result of noticing something really odd like a flying car or electronic devices not working and then doing an RC to make sure before I attempt to fly off a cliff or anything drastic. XD

It all comes down to what works best for each individual.

I don't use RCs to find out if I'm dreaming, just to confirm it. I often have a feeling that I'm dreaming, and I do a RC to make sure, but I have never done an RC randomly in my dreams out of habit.

For me when I do a reality check its not physically its mentally like i will look aroudn to make sure everything is alright and normal. My goal is to go through a whole day checking my reality all the time.

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Originally Posted by Abra

Spontaneous lucidity. Some call it that; I do, too. But was it really spontaneous? Or did you think to yourself, "I was in bed an hour ago," or "Wait... There's no such thing as zombies," before the onset of lucidity? Because, although I call this "spontaneous lucidity," I believe it could also be called a mental reality check.

And if you don't have a mental reality check, or any sort of basis to prove that you are dreaming, then how do you know you are dreaming?

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RCs are pretty usefull to induce lucidity (keeps your mind on subject) and, while dreaming, were pretty usefull to me on my first couple of atempts since I didn't quite know what to expect from lucidity. After that, however, I did it more for kicks or to stay focused. I don't usually need them (in the dream) and the only question that normally pops into my head is "You know you're dreaming, right?"

The one time I found myself thinking something was off it was because the dream seemed too real. I got confused and started wandering if I was awake. :shock:
Then I RCd. I wanted to make sure I wouldn't get ran over by a bus. :D

Lizard King, you're not alone. Im another one that never used a RC to realize that Im dreaming (funny, I was about to start a thread about this). Every last DILD that Ive had was attained without any RCs in any one of them. Whenever I become spontaneously lucid, its a quick and sudden "Eureka" moment. I wouldn't even say that I do any mental RCs like Abra said above. I realize (become aware of) my surroundings and just "know" (for a fact without a doubt) that Im dreaming. I know this b/c I simply know that Im not awake. Once I realize this, I just continue along with my lucid/dream w/o even bothering to question my reality or do a RC b/c Im already %100 sure that Im dreaming; doing a RC, for me, would be redundant.

True for me, i've never had a lucid by reality checks but those who do i believe should not stop using them.

Whilst reality checks may not work for all, I think that the do generate an awareness of whats going on around you.

In reality we probably ask am I dreaming, then do the tests.
In a dream, we probably ask am I dreaming, and the answer is so obvious we don't bother with the tests.