Oddities that I need help with

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11-02-2009, 04:36 AM
Leonix

Oddities that I need help with

Well, first of all, I'm new here. Long time lurker, brand new member :).

Anyhow, when i'm going to sleep, I start seeing things. It's as i'm falling asleep for the first time, not after waking up during my REM period and going back to sleep. I'm pretty sure it's not hypnagogic imagery, but hell, i'm not sure.

Anyhow, it's like my mind is making a scene, usually with people I know, but they only last for a few seconds. They either do or say something REALLY weird, and I generally only remember a few seconds of it. The images go away once I realize i'm having them, but I'm wondering how I can use this for lucid dreaming. I don't see how this could be utilized, considering it's about 5 hours before REM.

Next, I have my phone under my pillow set to wake me up 5 hours after I fall asleep. I've been doing it for the past few days, attempting to FILD. After I wake up, I turn off the alarm, still half asleep, and I try to relax. I end up falling asleep before getting to try to FILD, because i'm just too tired. But it feels like i'm too awake to do it once I immediately wake up.

Is there any easier way to do this? Is there an easier and more successful WBTB technique? Thanks!

Edit:
Couple more things to add in.
A few nights ago, I saw someone reading "Exploring the World of Lucid Dreaming" but I did nothing, I didn't even consider it strange (especially considering everyone in that certain class knows nothing about lucid dreaming, therefore has no reason to be reading the book in the first place)
11-02-2009, 10:26 PM
Conzo

Yes that was HI. Try not to concentrate on them as much and they should soon develop into full dream scenes.

As for the WBTB thing... what seems to work for most people is to actually get out of bed for about 10 mins, go to the bathroom, read a chaper in a book, or something. Not enough for you to get too awake, but enough time for a successful WBTB.

Good luck!
11-03-2009, 12:25 AM
Leonix

Quote:

Originally Posted by Conzo

Yes that was HI. Try not to concentrate on them as much and they should soon develop into full dream scenes.

As for the WBTB thing... what seems to work for most people is to actually get out of bed for about 10 mins, go to the bathroom, read a chaper in a book, or something. Not enough for you to get too awake, but enough time for a successful WBTB.

Good luck!

But if I don't concentrate on it, I generally just pass out.

Also, is it possible that I enter REM sleep immediately?
11-03-2009, 12:39 AM
Conzo

Quote:

Originally Posted by Leonix

But if I don't concentrate on it, I generally just pass out.

Also, is it possible that I enter REM sleep immediately?

This is why people usually count their breaths, so they don't end up falling asleep. Watching the HI more like a movie, just letting the images passively roll through your mind without concentrating on them too much. Sit back and enjoy the scenery, but don't think about what you are seeing too much or else they go away.

And yes during a WBTB you generally go straight into a REM sleep which is why people use it for a good time to WILD.
11-03-2009, 12:42 AM
Leonix

Quote:

Originally Posted by Conzo

This is why people usually count their breaths, so they don't end up falling asleep. Watching the HI more like a movie, just letting the images passively roll through your mind without concentrating on them too much. Sit back and enjoy the scenery, but don't think about what you are seeing too much or else they go away.

And yes during a WBTB you generally go straight into a REM sleep which is why people use it for a good time to WILD.

No no, by enter it immediately, I mean right when I get into bed for the first time of the night.

Also, i've never ever experienced sleep paralysis, no matter how hard I try.
11-03-2009, 12:51 AM
Conzo

Quote:

Originally Posted by Leonix

No no, by enter it immediately, I mean right when I get into bed for the first time of the night.

Also, i've never ever experienced sleep paralysis, no matter how hard I try.

Then no, your body does not go directly into REM when you first go to sleep. In fact REM sleep is the 5th stage of sleep you enter.

http://dreamviews.com/sleepstages.php

As for SP, how long are you trying for? What is your technique?
11-03-2009, 12:59 AM
Leonix

Quote:

Originally Posted by Conzo

Then no, your body does not go directly into REM when you first go to sleep. In fact REM sleep is the 5th stage of sleep you enter.

http://dreamviews.com/sleepstages.php

As for SP, how long are you trying for? What is your technique?

Well how can I get hypnagogic imagery immediately, once lying down for the first time going to sleep?

And I was trying Jeff777's tutorial.
11-03-2009, 01:08 AM
Conzo

Seeing HI and entering REM sleep are two totally different things. HI are just thoughts from your brain being turned into visual images or auditory sounds. When you are dreaming, your brain is sending out totally different brain waves, and you are acually dreaming like its the real world.

Anyone can get HI when first going to sleep. You can even enter SP. You just won't go into REM sleep directly, thus, you won't WILD. You would end up sitting there in SP waiting for the dreams to come which is why some people who have done WILD when going to bed report trying for at least an hour before finally entering a very short lucid dream because REM stages are very short during the beginning of your sleep. This is why WBTB are very successful for WILD because your brain is ready for a long REM sleep cycle, plus having already been to sleep, get to REM much faster then when going to bed.
11-03-2009, 01:11 AM
Leonix

Alright, makes sense. Think you can give me any aid in FILD? Same as wild, count numbers? I remember hearing counting anything will stop you from being able to FILD.
11-03-2009, 01:25 AM
Sylph

You shouldn't keep your phone next to your head (or next to any other part of your body if you can avoid it, actually) when it's on. Even when you're not speaking it keeps checking for a signal and, according to a recent study, the emissions get your cells to do funny things.

As for HI and WILDing I can't really help you there. I always doze off when I try it. :P
11-03-2009, 01:27 AM
Leonix

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sylph

You shouldn't keep your phone next to your head (or next to any other part of your body if you can avoid it, actually) when it's on. Even when you're not speaking it keeps checking for a signal and, according to a recent study, the emissions get your cells to do funny things

Odd, my mathematics teacher just mentioned that to us today as well.

Do you have any suggestions to a better way to wake myself up?
11-03-2009, 01:54 AM
Conzo

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sylph

You shouldn't keep your phone next to your head (or next to any other part of your body if you can avoid it, actually) when it's on. Even when you're not speaking it keeps checking for a signal and, according to a recent study, the emissions get your cells to do funny things.

As for HI and WILDing I can't really help you there. I always doze off when I try it. :P

That's a myth. Provide some proof because until then, that's total bogus. If this were true, why hasn't anything bad happened to us yet?
11-03-2009, 01:58 AM
Leonix

Quote:

Originally Posted by Conzo

That's a myth. Provide some proof because until then, that's total bogus. If this were true, why hasn't anything bad happened to us yet?

What I was told today was that they start the mass reproduction of cancer cells, though I really doubt it.
11-03-2009, 07:08 AM
Conzo

Quote:

Originally Posted by Leonix

What I was told today was that they start the mass reproduction of cancer cells, though I really doubt it.

Yeah, but if this was true, you think many people would have cancer, and people with cancer would die much faster. If this was true, this would cause a much bigger uproar than it does.
11-03-2009, 10:59 PM
ah19

Quote:

Originally Posted by Conzo

Yeah, but if this was true, you think many people would have cancer, and people with cancer would die much faster. If this was true, this would cause a much bigger uproar than it does.

it takes a while.. cell phones became popular in the last few years.

i want to reply to the original post. i also get these "scenes" in my mind when im falling asleep and as soon as I realise that is not real they go away immediately
11-04-2009, 04:04 AM
Conzo

Quote:

Originally Posted by ah19

...i also get these "scenes" in my mind when im falling asleep and as soon as I realise that is not real they go away immediately

My advice for you is the same as said before. Don't concentrate or think about what you are seeing. When you think about them, they usually disappear. Instead, let them passively go through your mind. Pretend you are watching a movie about HI. Don't concentrate on it.

Of course this advice is for someone trying to WILD or achieve HI. That is what you mean right?
11-04-2009, 04:58 AM
ah19

nope... the images are as clear as a dream but when u become lucid u wake up
11-04-2009, 05:29 PM
Conzo

Quote:

Originally Posted by ah19

nope... the images are as clear as a dream but when u become lucid u wake up

Your post confuses me. Are you trying to become lucid but can't because you are thinking about the HI too much? Or are you falling asleep regularly and just want to know what the images are?
11-04-2009, 06:24 PM
Kexo

I know those and I think they are advanced HI, like they are still a HI, but really close to a dream. For example, last night I've woke up and couldn't fall asleep for a really long time. I was constantly falling into SP, which was as unpleasant as it possibly could be. Next thing I remember is that I'm feeding chicken with some sort of a pipe or straw. I thought: "I've finally fallen asleep! I hope I'll have some LDs.." and instantly woke up again. I hate those little SPs :(
11-04-2009, 10:30 PM
ah19

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kexo

I know those and I think they are advanced HI, like they are still a HI, but really close to a dream. For example, last night I've woke up and couldn't fall asleep for a really long time. I was constantly falling into SP, which was as unpleasant as it possibly could be. Next thing I remember is that I'm feeding chicken with some sort of a pipe or straw. I thought: "I've finally fallen asleep! I hope I'll have some LDs.." and instantly woke up again. I hate those little SPs :(

yeah same here
11-04-2009, 11:12 PM
RandomNumber677

Do you find you kind of lose consciousness as these small dream scene things happen?

I get the same thing but I always kind of lose consciousness then suddenly remember that I was saying in my head 1 - I am dreaming etc then it disappears and I pretty much wake straight back up again.
11-05-2009, 06:08 AM
Leonix

Totally, it feels like it's a dream. It also happens when I get awoken to get ready for school and I end up staying in bed for 10 minutes to doze a bit more, man are those weird.
11-06-2009, 04:09 AM
ah19

Quote:

Originally Posted by Leonix

Totally, it feels like it's a dream. It also happens when I get awoken to get ready for school and I end up staying in bed for 10 minutes to doze a bit more, man are those weird.

OMG are you me???? this happens to me too
11-06-2009, 05:44 AM
Leonix

Quote:

Originally Posted by ah19

OMG are you me???? this happens to me too

Haha, I had a feeling it wasn't a rare occurrence :D
11-06-2009, 12:42 PM
RandomNumber677

Nope, happens to me too :)
11-09-2009, 12:45 AM
Sylph

Quote:

Originally Posted by Conzo

That's a myth. Provide some proof because until then, that's total bogus. If this were true, why hasn't anything bad happened to us yet?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Conzo

Yeah, but if this was true, you think many people would have cancer, and people with cancer would die much faster. If this was true, this would cause a much bigger uproar than it does.

Sorry, I was trying to google it up but I can't remember the name of the guy. It was on a documentary I came across the other day while zapping. It was something about trying to finally answering those same doubts. I only watched the end. Some fellow in a lab found out that that cells did react to emissions. It caused them to activate the same mechanism they use for growth.

Quote:

Do you have any suggestions to a better way to wake myself up?

I just use the alarm on my watch, but I don't know how heavy a sleeper your are for that. :) Still, there are plenty of choices when it comes to alarm clocks.