[18:54] <@Serenity> hai party peoples!
[18:54] <Draxis> ahoy
[18:56] <JesterKK> hey
[18:56] <Jakro> hi
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[19:00] <Draxis> welcome back
[19:00] <@Serenity> WB :)
[19:01] <@Serenity> is anyone having problems with lag on submitting stuff, like visitor messages or PM's to people?
[19:01] <Draxis> nope
[19:01] <@Serenity> can someone message spacechase0 and tell him to get in here? :)
[19:01] <@Serenity> dreamviews is running like molasses for me, right now
[19:01] <@Serenity> not sure why
[19:01] <Draxis> sure
[19:02] <Draxis> woah
[19:02] <Draxis> it just slowed way down
[19:02] <@Serenity> bleh!
[19:02] <Draxis> as in not loading
[19:02] <@Serenity> i'mma try IE
[19:02] <Draxis> i blame the communists
[19:02] == feist303 [
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[19:03] <@Serenity> hi hi feist!
[19:03] <feist303> hello! :)
[19:03] <feist303> uch, dv is down, and i didn't know the command to get in :)
[19:03] <@Serenity> main page is loading super slow on IE and firefox
[19:03] <@Serenity> oh it's down
[19:03] <@Serenity> that makes sense
[19:03] <Draxis> aye
[19:03] <Draxis> seems that way
[19:04] <Draxis> faulty technology, i should do a RC...
[19:04] <@Serenity> well... i'm going to wait a few more minutes for people to figure an alternative measure, since i can't contact them
[19:04] == spacechase0 [
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[19:04] <Draxis> i might need to duck out a touch early
[19:04] <@Serenity> my back is in pain... real for me
[19:04] <@Serenity> hey space
[19:04] <spacechase0> Hi
[19:05] <feist303> hi space
[19:05] <spacechase0> Hi.
[19:05] <@Serenity> well... chat logs get posted anyways... i might as well just start, seeing as the website is down
[19:05] <@Serenity> not sure how many others know of other routes on getting in here...
[19:06] <feist303> yeah, looks like i was just in time
[19:06] <@Serenity> So, welcome to class two :) I'd like to start out by quickly touching on induction techniques... just the two major ones, DILDs and WILDs and how they affect your ability to control a LD
[19:07] <@Serenity> who are the WILD'ers here?
[19:07] <feist303> never pulled one of :p
[19:07] <feist303> i'll learn, someday
[19:07] <@Serenity> (yeah, me neither)
[19:07] <JesterKK> me neither
[19:07] <Jakro> I only have WILDs on January 31st
[19:07] <Jakro> for real
[19:07] <Draxis> I have done it
[19:07] <spacechase0> What feist said. :P
[19:07] <@Serenity> Draxis, you've done a couple, right?
[19:07] <Draxis> its how i had my first
[19:07] <Draxis> aye
[19:07] <Jakro> two years in a row only wilds have come that day
[19:08] <@Serenity> so, tell us what it's like... do you feel pretty much in control straight away?
[19:08] <Draxis> well, its how i had my first LD
[19:08] <Draxis> i remember lying down in bed and just thinking about it
[19:09] <Draxis> and then it felt like my soul was being torn from my body almost (*a tad of exageration)
[19:09] <@Serenity> =/
[19:09] <Draxis> i remember standing next to my bed and thinking, its a WILD!
[19:09] <Draxis> it wasn't painful, just not what i was expecting
[19:09] <Draxis> like athena from the head of zeus
[19:09] <@Serenity> i actually think i know that feeling... felt it before
[19:09] <Draxis> and i tried to summon a friend of mine behind a door, and it didn't work
[19:10] <Draxis> tried to fly, didn't work
[19:10] <Draxis> had another WILD the next day
[19:10] <Draxis> and flying worked
[19:10] <Draxis> probably my one of my best LD's
[19:10] <@Serenity> what was the difference between the two WILDs?
[19:10] <Draxis> well, a bit of experience and following the rules of expectations
[19:11] <Draxis> the first one fell apart when i saw a cat and expected it to attack me and then it did
[19:11] <Draxis> the second i tried to fly, but didn't quite get it
[19:11] <Draxis> then got it after a while
[19:11] <Draxis> my friend flying with me asked why i couldn't do it yesterday
[19:11] <Draxis> and i said "well, I just needed a little practice is all"
[19:12] <Draxis> i don't remember "feeling" like i was in control
[19:12] <Draxis> but i decided to try flying and it worked for me that time
[19:12] <Draxis> haven't really been able to repeat it
[19:12] <Draxis> mostly summoning stuff and people now
[19:12] <Draxis> sorry for the wall of text, is that what you needed?
[19:13] <@Serenity> perfect :)
[19:13] <Draxis> in short, it doesn't feel much different when you're lucid
[19:13] <@Serenity> feist, you seem to have a pretty high frequency of DILDs, so what are they like for you in terms of control?
[19:13] <Draxis> it just felt different getting there
[19:13] <feist303> hmm, i struggle with control
[19:13] <feist303> my main problem is prolonging my ld's
[19:14] <feist303> so that's what i'm trying to focus on now
[19:14] <feist303> most of em are way to short
[19:14] <Draxis> how frequently do you get them, just out of curiosity
[19:14] <feist303> well, i've only recently started taking ld more seriously, and practicing harder
[19:14] <feist303> i've had 25 different LD's last month, on 14 different nights
[19:15] <feist303> but before that i had like 6-ish nights of lucidity a month
[19:15] <Draxis> bloody hell
[19:15] <feist303> with maybe 10ld's
[19:15] <@Serenity> Partly, I wanted to bring up the discussion because I've only had DILDs... I know I've had the idea that WILDs would be easier to control than a DILD
[19:15] <@Serenity> but I'm not so sure that is the case, now. it seems like they are pretty much on par with each other
[19:15] <Draxis> starting out, yes, but after a while it hasn't made a difference
[19:16] <feist303> i always thought they were harder
[19:16] <feist303> since you still had to do alot of stabelizing
[19:16] <@Serenity> i think the only "benefit" a WILD has over a DILD (at least for me) is the ability to break from the plot... since with a WILD, you don't have to
[19:17] <Draxis> as best i can tell, its just how much you believe in the expectation, a WILD just gets you there faster and because you know you were trying to do something, you're more likely to exert the control you wanted
[19:17] StatServ [
[email protected]] requested CTCP VERSION from Serenity:
[19:17] <@Serenity> yeah, WILDs definitely take a lot of initial stabilizing, so i hear
[19:17] <Draxis> a tad, yes.
[19:18] <@Serenity> but... with either technique, stabilizing, even with a DILD, is the first step to having better control
[19:18] <@Serenity> I would like to talk about a personal experience, if i may?
[19:18] <Jakro> no
[19:18] <JesterKK> sure
[19:18] <@Serenity> :P
[19:18] <Jakro> just joking go ahead
[19:18] <Jakro> x)
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[19:18] == mode/#DVA [+y Alex] by irc.dreamviews.com
[19:18] == mode/#DVA [+o Alex] by DreamBot
[19:18] <@Serenity> Alright, so back in March, I was going mental with the desire to complete a TOTM and I was having problems with my lucidity
[19:19] <@Serenity> it seemed like as soon as I finally got lucid, I would go immediate focus into "amg, lucidity, complete the task now!"
[19:19] <@Serenity> in the months beforehand, this always caused the dream to collapse
[19:20] <@Serenity> until one morning, i got lucid through a DILD and did the same thing... only the dream didn't collapse... i was a bit slower with it this time
[19:20] <@Serenity> the task was to taste a rainbow
[19:21] <@Serenity> i looked around me and saw puddles so i thought, "okay, it was raining, there should be a rainbow in the distance"
[19:21] <Draxis> what did it taste like?
[19:21] <@Serenity> candy apples
[19:21] <feist303> nice :D
[19:21] <@Serenity> anyways, so I look in the distance, and i imagine a rainbow ahead
[19:21] <Draxis> the skittles people lied to us...
[19:21] <JesterKK> loll
[19:21] <@Serenity> i saw it form, and i thought, "alright, so now i have to fly there" and flight has always been my nemesis!
[19:22] <@Serenity> i pushed off the ground and was like, "oh yeah, it's working!"... and i sank like a rock in water :(
[19:22] <@Serenity> so, to make it work, i had to close my eyes... i nearly flew past the rainbow, but... i managed to complete the task.
[19:22] <@Serenity> everything destabilized straight after that
[19:23] <@Serenity> i recall my surroundings being rather blurry and not very clear... and my control wasn't very good
[19:23] <@Serenity> i know this was mainly because i didn't stabilize the dream, first
[19:24] <@Serenity> so... april TOTM... doing a headstand. i got lucid off a DILD again, and literally STOPPED doing anything
[19:24] <@Serenity> i stared at my hands, and just admired how the dream felt
[19:24] <@Serenity> i grabbed my wrist, even :P
[19:25] <@Serenity> but as i did so, it felt like everything around me was becoming more vivid, more clear
[19:25] <@Serenity> everything was as solid as real life gets
[19:26] <@Serenity> so i completed my task... managed to force the completion a little, AND once it was done i realized... the dream didn't end!
[19:26] <@Serenity> so i was all like, "bonus!" :)
[19:26] <@Serenity> and got to try out some other things :D
[19:26] <@Serenity> so ever since then, i've always felt that in order to better control my dream, i should stop and stabilize... let the dream become more and more vivid around me
[19:27] <@Serenity> i did this again in my next LD and i managed to fly without any difficulty... straight to the moon, in fact :D
[19:28] <@Serenity> so... as i type out some stuff on control... questions, comments?
[19:28] <@Serenity> disagreements? experiences?
[19:28] <feist303> i'm good, for now :)
[19:29] <Jakro> Well I always seem to do well with stablizing, admiring the patterns in my hands and details around me, but as soon as I stop doing that dream usually collapses
[19:29] <Draxis> same here, though i've had the same sort of experiences so I understand where you're coming from
[19:29] <JesterKK> I remember I tried to stabilise inside an elevator by touching the walls.. but i did it too fast and it became less stable
[19:29] <Jakro> You know, when I actually try to do something
[19:29] <@Serenity> So there are two different types of control. Passive and Active Control :) We'll talk Passive first, since it's definitely the easier of the two :)
[19:30] <@Serenity> hmm... when you stabilize, try just rubbing your own hands together... perhaps that will help with the tactile sensation, but won't cause your dream to flip out?
[19:30] <@Serenity> otherwise, some people call out commands like, "Stability now!" or "clarity now!"
[19:31] <@Serenity> Passive controls are: Affirmation, Asking, and Schemas
[19:32] <@Serenity> Affirmations are just knowing that your dreams will create things that you know are there
[19:32] <@Serenity> like say, rooms in a house
[19:32] <@Serenity> the dining room will be next to the living room, because you know it is
[19:32] <@Serenity> a person will be there, around the corner, because you know they are
[19:33] <@Serenity> this technique IS a bit difficult, because when using an affirmation, you have to be 100% sure this will be true
[19:33] <@Serenity> any doubts at all, and it may not
[19:34] <@Serenity> You can try "Asking" something. Ask a character to do something, instead of trying to force them too
[19:35] <@Serenity> like say you need them to shoot fireballs and they aren't... ask, "Can you help me by shooting fireballs at this dude?"
[19:35] <@Serenity> you may be surprised ;)
[19:35] <feist303> that does sounds like a good and fun idea :)
[19:35] <@Serenity> if you need to travel somewhere, and you have issues with flying, just try walking it for now
[19:35] <spacechase0> I usually can't find anyone. :P
[19:36] <@Serenity> if it means the difference between accomplishing a goal you want or destabilizing the dream, you might find walking to be the better method... and you might find that walk is just as fast, somehow :D
[19:37] <@Serenity> if you are finding it hard to get something you want, remember that your logic centre is going active when lucid, so you may have to work with it, rather than against it, to get what you want :) but in a bit, i have an idea that may help you with that pesky logic centre :)
[19:38] <spacechase0> Gotta go.
[19:38] <@Serenity> just as a passive technique... don't fight your logic, try to work with it to reach your goal
[19:38] <spacechase0> See everyone tomorrow.
[19:38] <@Serenity> night space :)
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[19:38] <@Serenity> and schemas! schemas can work hand-in-hand with affirmations
[19:39] <@Serenity> it's important that when you attempt to affirm something, to understand how your schema views the relationships of what is currently happening in your dreams
[19:40] <@Serenity> like if you ask someone you know is a dog-hater to give you a puppy, it may not work out so well
[19:40] <@Serenity> (my BF just showed me a massive wasp he trapped in a glass, gross!!!)
[19:40] <feist303> hehe :p
[19:41] <feist303> let's hope that it won't be day residue later :p
[19:41] <@Serenity> alternatively, with summoning a RL friend into your dream, it may just be your location... if this person has never been to your current location (your house, your school, etc), it might be harder to summon them there, because they've never been there IRL
[19:42] <feist303> lol, in my first ld's i would try to fly to this girls house, i always woke up before i fly'd have my way there :D
[19:42] <JesterKK> same here lol
[19:42] <@Serenity> Now onto the *funner* controls! :P The Active Controls... these are: Attachments, Flying, Teleportation, Telekinesis, and Summoning (to name a few)
[19:43] <@Serenity> Active controls can be anything really :) magic powers and all
[19:43] <@Serenity> Attachments are the thing that ties together with the logic centre
[19:44] <@Serenity> if you are having troubles making an object float, it's because deep down, you know that we have gravity, and objects "can't" float
[19:44] <@Serenity> In order to control your dreams, you have to let go of attachments.
[19:45] <@Serenity> My way of doing that is simply asking myself, "why *can't* i summon a 30 ft storm giant to carry me around the world? it's my dream! :P"
[19:45] <@Serenity> it's your imagination... it's like a real life day dream... you can day dream a 30 ft storm giant, you can dream a 30ft storm giant
[19:46] <@Serenity> you just have to remember it's your dream :)
[19:46] <Draxis> i personally find if you look away for a second that its far more probable to happen because you don't have to see it appear from nowhere
[19:46] <feist303> yeah, i do that to when certain things don't work
[19:46] <@Serenity> yes!
[19:46] <@Serenity> i definitely look away, or close my eyes
[19:46] <Draxis> Thats how i got summoning people to work
[19:47] <@Serenity> because if i try to see things appear, sometimes it causes destabilizing
[19:47] <Draxis> and i even had an instance where i got the wrong person, so i just changed them
[19:47] <@Serenity> flying. where to start? well... flying used to be the bane of my existence
[19:48] <@Serenity> because i believed it was, partly
[19:48] <@Serenity> i had to come up with something, at first, that would help me fly
[19:48] <@Serenity> so, my idea was to spawn wings, like my aion character
[19:48] <@Serenity> just grow wings out of my back
[19:48] <@Serenity> i even got an arm motion for it ;)
[19:49] <JesterKK> lol I used to flap my arms to fly
[19:49] <feist303> spawning wings sounds much harder to me then flying :p
[19:49] <feist303> hehe
[19:49] <@Serenity> you could summon a jet pack or a rocket pack if you're good at summoning
[19:49] <Draxis> at jester, i did the flap before i went neo style
[19:49] <@Serenity> or just take a pill that allows you to fly
[19:49] <Draxis> gotta try that
[19:49] <@Serenity> i tried swimming in the air, once :P
[19:49] <@Serenity> it looked pretty funny
[19:50] <feist303> haha :)
[19:50] <JesterKK> hehehe
[19:50] <@Serenity> but it works for some people :)
[19:50] <@Serenity> or... how about an ultra trampolene?
[19:50] <@Serenity> just bounce until you're in the clouds and ride the wind?
[19:51] <JesterKK> aahh imagine surfing on the clouds.. that would be sweet
[19:51] <@Serenity> get a friend to fling you off a cliff?
[19:51] <JesterKK> lol some friend
[19:51] <@Serenity> (I had a dream where wakingnomad tossed me off a cliff :P)
[19:51] <Draxis> well i have a few friends i'm sure would love to push me off one...
[19:51] <feist303> :D
[19:52] <@Serenity> anyone ever tried teleporting?
[19:52] <Draxis> of a sort
[19:52] <Draxis> spinning count?
[19:52] <@Serenity> yes
[19:52] <feist303> with spinning a few times maybe, by accident
[19:52] <Draxis> then yes, but only partially succesfully
[19:52] <@Serenity> i've never spun, tbh... kind of afraid to, since my lucids are few and far between :)
[19:53] <feist303> never really had the need to
[19:53] <@Serenity> usually, when i teleport, i close my eyes and snap my fingers
[19:53] <@Serenity> usually i know where i want to end up, so i imagine it and i'll see it when i open my eyes
[19:53] <feist303> i try to avoid closing my eyes...
[19:54] <@Serenity> i just believe it works because that's how i do it in non-lucids
[19:54] <@Serenity> yeah closing eyes is dangerous for some
[19:54] <@Serenity> because some people end their dreams that way :(
[19:54] <Draxis> try looking at your hands while you do it then
[19:54] <feist303> yes, often i'll end up in a void, or wake up
[19:54] <Jakro> me too
[19:54] <feist303> or fa's!
[19:54] <@Serenity> one thing naiya said, when she was talking about wilding was trying to reopen your dream eyes
[19:55] <@Serenity> you could try to walk through a mirror, or even just another door
[19:56] <@Serenity> you could be in one of those houses from cheesy 60's comedies where you open the door and wham, there's a train track :)
[19:57] <@Serenity> perhaps you have a DC friend who's fantastic at this stuff and they can teleport you?
[19:57] <@Serenity> that was the first time i had a lucid teleport... a DC actually teleported me
[19:58] <feist303> cool :)
[19:58] <@Serenity> telekinesis is a another favourite
[19:59] <feist303> i'm trying it atm :)
[19:59] <@Serenity> that was one that just kind of works for me... all i do is use my arms/hands in the motion i want, but not actually touch the object
[20:00] <@Serenity> i haven't actually gotten it straight to the mind yet, but i haven't really tried :P i'm okay with arm motions :D
[20:00] <@Serenity> summoning!
[20:01] <@Serenity> i think the biggest part about this one is just believing it's there
[20:01] <feist303> i just use doors :)
[20:01] <Draxis> yeah, or like i said
[20:01] <Draxis> look away and back
[20:01] <Draxis> if text and stuff changes, why not what you want?
[20:01] <@Serenity> i've heard some people say that they ask their intended subject a question to answer as they walk around a corner, or just look behind the,
[20:01] <@Serenity> them*
[20:02] <@Serenity> you could feasibly summon two things at once :P "hey paul, have you seen my baseball bat?" O.o
[20:03] <JesterKK> lol
[20:03] <@Serenity> having confidence in your results is key
[20:03] <@Serenity> don't doubt it working because you've never done it
[20:03] <@Serenity> it WILL work, because this is your dream and you're the master of it
[20:04] <@Serenity> you can fly because you swallowed the flight pill... donned the P-wing... summoned a rocket pack
[20:04] <@Serenity> or just because you CAN
[20:05] <@Serenity> you can fly to the moon... it's your dream :)
[20:05] <@Serenity> open for questions :D
[20:06] <@Serenity> that's all i have for today's lessony part, so open chat now :D
[20:06] == Alex [
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[20:06] <Draxis> so whats the homework?
[20:07] <@Serenity> Read the basic task of the month and come up with a way to actively and passively complete the task. Describe how you became lucid (WILD Dream sign RC ect) and then stabilized the dream. Then walk me through how you completed the task in each manner. You may use one of your dreams from your dream journal, if you like. It does not have to be a lucid dream, but to complete the assignment; you would have to turn it into one!
