Tell Me : How do we know we are not an alien planets science project ?

Sometimes it seems that a lot ( if not all ) of what we all do on a daily basis is just routine for routines sake. The pursuit of anything, no matter how important it may appear, is futile in the face of our mortality. Not that I live my life any different. I set goals and aspire to enrich my life as much as I can. I try to educate myself , meet new people , and reap as much from my existence as possible. But what if we are all just some biology experiment. My dreams are so strange and vivid ; I feel that I'm going to sleep in one world and waking at that same moment in another. Am I ? Am I being checked on by my keepers ? Tell me about that.

We don't.

But try to be semi-reasonable.

What's reasonable ? Who sets those limits ?

Do you have anything that would remotely possibly point to that conclusion?

Its an idea I've toyed with, and theres evidence present in many religious writings, and if any religious writings were true an Alien species would be the most reasonable explanation for our existence.

But the question follows the same logic as any other question: How do we know we're not products of God? How do we know there's not a golden teapot in orbit around Mars?

The question is useless without reason. I can somewhat see where your coming from, but it has no real relation to the idea of us being products our being watched over by alien life. Our semi-systematic behavior in many cases can be directly compared to that of other animals on the planet, but more specifically viruses. Its like asking, how do we know that humans aren't just really complex viruses?

The idea has merit, but you're not pursuing it properly.

What if the earth was a big organism, and we were just little parasites on it?

Oh, wait...

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Originally Posted by ExoByte

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The idea has merit, but you're not pursuing it properly.
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Also, just because I've posed the question doesn't mean it's something I feel certain of. We are all creative folks here, I was curious what other peoples thoughts were; not so much to prove or be disproved. No one, NO ONE*, knows
why we are here. That being said, what is the proper way of pursuing the idea that we may be in a galactic petri dish ? It's such a far fetched concept yet I'm still waiting to hear someone tell me why it's incorrect. You yourself claim to have entertained the idea. What makes you feel that way ? For me it's a feeling of fleeting value, a world of novelty for some and starvation for others. The worlds in my mind seem drawn by something else. What ?

* no one.

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Originally Posted by Seismosaur

Do you have anything that would remotely possibly point to that conclusion?

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Not to play Devils advocate, but do you have any evidence to an alternate conclusion ? Have an open mind, tell me your thoughts, not your doubts.



sorry for the double.

And to iterate:

Do you have proof that I don't have proof that you don't have proof that you aren't not incorrect?

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Originally Posted by CometLike

Also, just because I've posed the question doesn't mean it's something I feel certain of. We are all creative folks here, I was curious what other peoples thoughts were; not so much to prove or be disproved. No one, NO ONE*, knows
why we are here. That being said, what is the proper way of pursuing the idea that we may be in a galactic petri dish ? It's such a far fetched concept yet I'm still waiting to hear someone tell me why it's incorrect. You yourself claim to have entertained the idea. What makes you feel that way ? For me it's a feeling of fleeting value, a world of novelty for some and starvation for others. The worlds in my mind seem drawn by something else. What ?

* no one.

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its an idea I've toyed with, and theres evidence present in many religious writings, and if any religious writings were true an Alien species would be the most reasonable explanation for our existence.

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Anyway, in a way to pursue it, as farfetched as it is, it should be pursued the same way as any other concept. Be it gravity, the earth being round, the earth rotating around the sun, all of which used to be farfetched at one point. It can also be taken as the same idea as God, or any other study of a deity that watches over us. There are still ways to pursue the idea.

I wouldn't be surprised if there was a shred of truth in the idea to be honest, even if this discussion is merely for entertainment value. As I said, I've toyed with the idea. But its been merely a passing thought, something thats crossed my mind. No more.

You won't find proof here, concepts to generate original thoughts possibly,but no proof. You yourself are evidence of that. I won't argue either, if that's your goal.

I think the REAL question is:
How do we know we are not an alien planet's science project of another alien planet's science project?

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Originally Posted by CometLike

You won't find proof here, concepts to generate original thoughts possibly,but no proof. You yourself are evidence of that. I won't argue either, if that's your goal.

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No proof = No.

Notice no one said it was impossible, just far fetched and lacking in that crucial area called "proof".

So what do you believe ? And please provide proof.

That whatever happens, happens.

Whatever is, is.

We can do our best to explain it, but that doesn't matter really.

Cuz in reality, the universe doesn't care

What you believe.

A quick aside before I begin,

Technically, since we are the universe experiencing itself, the universe only cares what you believe as much as you do...

Within, and without are really no different.
You can choose to see the bridges, or build the walls between individuals.

Food for thought.






Also, let's try and give more informed responses instead of easily choosing to argue from ignorance, shall we? The topic title isn't proposing something so far-fetched as one might like to believe...

Signs of the gods

A lot of historical ruins worldwide all point to us being initially brought here, or genetically manipulated by another intelligent species which set up shop here on earth for some time teaching us rudimentary math, agriculture, and what not. Some of the famous ancient ruin sites initial blocks are so old and so big, that it simply couldn't have been made with the technology of the people for the time they were around. After the initial blocks were laid down, those same cultures simply built on top of it and the difference in quality clearly shows their inability to have laid the initial stones...a de-evolution, if you will.

---=The Baalbek Stones=---

Notice the sheer size of the Baalbek stones, which predate any known advanced civilizations...
http://z.about.com/d/atheism/1/0/l/y...upiterWall.jpg

The greatest of the Baalbek stones, perhaps 1200 tons
http://www.sacredsites.com/middle_ea...stones-500.jpg

Roman structures atop massive pre-Roman stones of Baalbek
http://www.sacredsites.com/middle_ea...s-atop-500.jpg




---=Pyramids at Giza=---

Great pyramids of Giza
http://www.planetware.com/i/photo/py...za-gzgrtpy.jpg
Current antiquated theories of slaves pulling the blocks just don't add up to the time and technology available at the time in most cases. Even agreement on when the construction of the pyramids actually occurred, is still widely debated...

Sphynx
http://images.jupiterimages.com/comm...2/22619209.jpg
The Mystery of the Sphinx ("..Along with the Great Pyramid of Giza, the Sphinx is one of the greatest enigmas and the most studied ancient monument of mankind’s history. The whole complex of Giza, composed of the Sphinx, the Great Pyramid, other pyramids, and distinct structures, definitely holds the key to understanding advanced past civilizations. There is no other place.."




---=Puma Punku, in Peru=---

Perfectly cut blocks
http://www.world-mysteries.com/mpl_6c.jpg
One of the construction blocks from which the pier was fashioned weighs an estimated 440 tons (equal to nearly 600 full-size cars) and several other blocks laying about are between 100 and 150 tons.

Clamps
http://www.bibliotecapleyades.net/su...es/godsne8.gif
Other stones at Puma Punku contain inexplicable grooves and niches, whilst some such as of metal clamps which were used of these clamps have actually been whereabouts are now uncertain. metal that is not associated with cultures at this time.




---=Nazca Lines, in Peru=---

http://www.lost-civilizations.net/im...a/nascamap.gif
The lighter coloured subsoil which had been exposed formed distinct lines which ran across the desert plain. In due course, it became apparent that the archaeologists had stumbled across a much wider phenomenon - the so-called “Nazca Lines” which cover a 30-mile long strip in the foothills of the Andes mountains. More than sixty years later, not one single theory has been put forward to explain all of the Nazca markings. A prominent scientist has called it “one of the most baffling enigmas of archaeology”.




---=Maya=---

Mayan Temple of Kukulkan (91 steps on each side, with one step on the top, totaling 365 steps)
http://www.lost-civilizations.net/im...yramidlisa.jpghttp://farm2.static.flickr.com/1162/...de6e038f9a.jpg
On the Equinox, the sun shines down this pyramid in the shape of a snake, ending in a stone snake head at the left base.

Mayan Pyramid of the Sun
http://shortwork.net/travels/df/i00-...d-of-sun-3.jpg




---=Ancient Sumerian Tablets=---

One of the oldest writings and first cultures of man, (Ancient Sumer, or Babylon), often depicts themselves being made from their gods, 'The Annunaki'
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi...1/Annunaki.jpg






The answer: Who knows? Either way, no one can definitively say yes or no... and I'd say there is definitely more than just a little evidence pointing to yes...

Remember: Be open to anything, but question everything ;)

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Originally Posted by SolSkye

Be open to anything, but question everything ;)

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...But why?

That's the ultimate question, that we are all here to find, isn't it? ;)

SolSkye: Has anyone ever thought of the fact that there were several thousand people working day and night for years and years to build those?

And that their entire cultures were based around said sturctures?

Why is it so mysterious?

http://www.sacredsites.com/middle_ea...stones-500.jpg

At the southern entrance of Baalbeck is a quarry where the stones used in the temples were cut. A huge block, considered the largest hewn stone in the world, still sits where it was cut almost 2,000 years ago. Called the "Stone of the Pregnant Woman", it is 21.5m x 4.8m x 4.2meters in size and weighs an estimated 1,200 tons.

1 ton = 2,240 lb (exactly 1,016.0469088 kg)

x 1,200 tons

= 2,688,000 pounds

Assuming an average slave could pull, say 200 lbs each, that would take 13,440 people pulling at once to even start to move one inch.

http://www.primaryhistory.org/data/i...vesweb-232.jpg

Do you honestly see that happening in this case, beyond a shred of a doubt?

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Originally Posted by SolSkye

http://www.sacredsites.com/middle_ea...stones-500.jpg

At the southern entrance of Baalbeck is a quarry where the stones used in the temples were cut. A huge block, considered the largest hewn stone in the world, still sits where it was cut almost 2,000 years ago. Called the "Stone of the Pregnant Woman", it is 21.5m x 4.8m x 4.2meters in size and weighs an estimated 1,200 tons.

1 ton = 2,240 lb (exactly 1,016.0469088 kg)

x 1,200 tons

= 2,688,000 pounds

Assuming an average slave could pull, say 200 lbs each, that would take 13,440 people pulling at once to even start to move one inch.

http://www.primaryhistory.org/data/i...vesweb-232.jpg

Do you honestly see that happening in this case, beyond a shred of a doubt?

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Well the example you're using is the biggest possible stone.. and it says it is still where it was cut.. doesn't that mean it wasn't actually moved?

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Originally Posted by Carôusoul

Well the example you're using is the biggest possible stone.. and it says it is still where it was cut.. doesn't that mean it wasn't actually moved?

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Pwnt.

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Originally Posted by Kushna Mufeed

I think the REAL question is:
How do we know we are not an alien planet's science project of another alien planet's science project of another alien planet's science project of another alien planet's science project of another alien planet's science project of another alien planet's science project of another alien planet's science project of another alien planet's science project of another alien planet's science project of another alien planet's science project of another alien planet's science project of another alien planet's science project of another alien planet's science project of another alien planet's science project of another alien planet's science project of another alien planet's science project of another alien planet's science project of another alien planet's science project of another alien planet's science project of another alien planet's science project of another alien planet's science project of another alien planet's science project of another alien planet's science project of another alien planet's science project of another alien planet's science project of another alien planet's science project of another alien planet's science project of another alien planet's science project of another alien planet's science project of another alien planet's science project of another alien planet's science project of another alien planet's science project of another alien planet's science project of another alien planet's science project of another alien planet's science project of another alien planet's science project of another alien planet's science project of another alien planet's science project of another alien planet's science project of another alien planet's science project of another alien planet's science project of another alien planet's science project of another alien planet's science project of another alien planet's science project of another alien planet's science project of another alien planet's science project of another alien planet's science project of another alien planet's science project of another alien planet's science project of another alien planet's science project of another alien planet's science project of another alien planet's science project of another alien planet's science project of another alien planet's science project of another alien planet's science project of another alien planet's science project of another alien planet's science project of another alien planet's science project of another alien planet's science project of another alien planet's science project of another alien planet's science project of another alien planet's science project of another alien planet's science project of another alien planet's science project of another alien planet's science project of another alien planet's science project of another alien planet's science project of another alien planet's science project of another alien planet's science project of another alien planet's science project of another alien planet's science project of another alien planet's science project of another alien planet's science project of another alien planet's science project of another alien planet's science project of another alien planet's science project of another alien planet's science project of another alien planet's science project of another alien planet's science project of another alien planet's science project of another alien planet's science project of another alien planet's science project of another alien planet's science project of another alien planet's science project of another alien planet's science project of another alien planet's science project of another alien planet's science project of another alien planet's science project of another alien planet's science project of another alien planet's science project of another alien planet's science project of another alien planet's science project of another alien planet's science project of another alien planet's science project of another alien planet's science project of another alien planet's science project of another alien planet's science project of another alien planet's science project of another alien planet's science project of another alien planet's science project of another alien planet's science project of another alien planet's science project of another alien planet's science project of another alien planet's science project?

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Fixed :biggrin:

How do we know that the OP isn't an evil alien from the planet X who is going to suck our brains out with a straw?

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Originally Posted by Carôusoul

Well the example you're using is the biggest possible stone.. and it says it is still where it was cut.. doesn't that mean it wasn't actually moved?

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That's quite a narrow view, isn't it ? One that sees only what wasn't accomplished in the face of all that was.

SolSkye, thanks for posting all the photos and info.

How do you know you're not a brain in a vat?

Comet the burden of proof is on you to provide evidence supporting your idea about humans being an aleins expirement. Its not enough to say

"How do you know? It could be possible ya know?"

I could say hey Comet did you know that people in China have inverted anuses?

You would say NO they dont!

Then i would say you never know you nver been thre!

The burden of proof would be on me to provide evidence that people in china have inverted anuses, likewise in this thread the burden of proof is on you to provide evidence. Otherwise your theory is just as hocus pocus as the bible and the tooth fairy.

Like I stated, I posed the thought to see what other peoples opinions and concepts were. This is an ask me / tell me thread, not a prove each other wrong
thread. Obviously I can't prove any of this, you would be silly to think that I could. I'm pretty discouraged by the majority of these responses, a lot of negativity and not much creativity. You seem more interested in being contrary and crude ( inverted anuses ? ) than actually posting your opinion. BTW, how do you know where I have or have not been ?

join the club comet. we have some pretty close minded people here. i mean here we are on a small planet. we can barely take a man to the moon. our technology is so limited. yet we boast about knowing for certain the fact that intelligent beings don't come here, and twe are 100% sure based on no evidence. More people believe UFO's exist than really voted for george bush... niff said.

http://www.movieprop.com/tvandmovie/...slandearth.jpg

Just kidding. :P To tell you how we know we're not an alien planets science project, I can't.

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Originally Posted by ranma187

join the club comet. we have some pretty close minded people here. i mean here we are on a small planet. we can barely take a man to the moon. our technology is so limited. yet we boast about knowing for certain the fact that intelligent beings don't come here, and twe are 100% sure based on no evidence. More people believe UFO's exist than really voted for george bush... niff said.

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Incorrect until proven correct is my motto.

If I see no reason to believe something-- I won't.

And judging transportational travel and physics and logic and reason is failure.

Oh and btw Ranma I'm pretty sure that the Majority of the public believes that 9/11 attacks were totally unprovoked and unpredicted. Does that make them right?

Let's face it, the majority are idiots.

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Originally Posted by Seismosaur

Incorrect until proven correct is my motto.

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Alrighty then, please list us some things that you know to be correct because they have been proven, in your opinion. And try to avoid the obvious and retarded if you possibly can. For example : The sky is blue, the earth is round and any other inane crap that will make many of the open minded folks here want to choke you for your ignorance.
Don't be scared to actually let us in on some of your inner most beliefs. Though I doubt you really have any judging from your posts.

Be more specific.

Yeah, that's pretty much what I expected.

Well you basically said "Tell me something you believe to be a fact but nothing that is just obvious".

You didn't really define obvious.

For example it is quite an obvious fact that the earth is round-- It wasn't just a few hundred years ago.

Again-- Be more specific.

You have no original thoughts. People like you are a waste of space. Specific enough for you, junior ? The point was for YOU to be specific about YOUR beliefs. I also believe that you understood that but chose belligerence as a veil to hide your lack of creativity. Prove me wrong, if you can. Do I have to hold your hand and tell you how to accomplish that as well ? Contribute in a positive way, if only this once.

He can't. Never has and never will.

It's best to ignore trolls like him. They feed off the anger they incite because they can't do anything productive with themselves so they feel it best to bring others down.

He's the one that has to quiet that chaotic mind of his and sleep with himself at night, not I. That's punishment in itself, if you ask me. Ef 'em.

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Originally Posted by Seismosaur

Incorrect until proven correct is my motto.

If I see no reason to believe something-- I won't.

And judging transportational travel and physics and logic and reason is failure.

Oh and btw Ranma I'm pretty sure that the Majority of the public believes that 9/11 attacks were totally unprovoked and unpredicted. Does that make them right?

Let's face it, the majority are idiots.

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Just because the majority of people believe that, is only because they can't think for themselves... Sheep can't help being sheep. But sheep must have their reality shattered so they become the black sheep. all at once. And for those of us who are open minded it's our job to wake people up. eitherwise we are just a bunch of whiners not taking responsibility for our lives here on earth. Such whiners will die like the rest of the sheep.

It sound to me seis, like just because you believe that 911 was an inside job. That THAT fact therefore makes you better than everybody. There fore it's never your fault if Elitists take over the globe. It's just stupid people. blame the elitists AND the stupid. Yet what you fail to realise is this: you can't handle the fact that It's your responsibility on this planet, is to wake people up, for your sake or your childrens sake. you're so fucking insecure that you have to blame people for being idiots just so you don't have to feel bad about anything. PERIOD.

ranma, you know these guys feed of this type of reaction, right?

Why do you think DV upped it's age limit? Simple. Because of children like him.

I was a member here a few years back and a topic like this was typically met with a wide array of responses ranging from logical to ludicrous, but always thoughtful to some degree. I began posting again because my dream recall is always better when dreaming culture is more constant in my life, such as exchanging thoughts with you all. I can't say that this thread has motivated me to stay involved, though.

As an aside, I had a neat half lucid last night in which I could fly as I normally do but was convinced that I was really awake. Good control, like in waking, but without that sense of " I'm definitely dreaming ". I was trying to explain to a friend of mine how I had learned to fly in dreams and could now do it awake as well. Pretty fun.

Well, I put a lot of time into my post for you so you should learn to look at the silver lining... it's all too easy to stare into the void and get mesmerized and encompassed by it.

Also, the ask/tell me section isn't the best kind of place to get a fair response...

Try Extended Discussion.

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Originally Posted by SolSkye

Well, I put a lot of time into my post for you so you should learn to look at the silver lining... it's all too easy to stare into the void and get mesmerized and encompassed by it.

Also, the ask/tell me section isn't the best kind of place to get a fair response...

Try Extended Discussion.

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Thank you, I appreciate your outlook.

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Originally Posted by SolSkye

He can't. Never has and never will.

It's best to ignore trolls like him. They feed off the anger they incite because they can't do anything productive with themselves so they feel it best to bring others down.

He's the one that has to quiet that chaotic mind of his and sleep with himself at night, not I. That's punishment in itself, if you ask me. Ef 'em.

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That's the best assessment of people like him I've seen.

I just want to take the time to address sol skye's post right now (about the blocks)...

First of all, do you know anything about physics? I mean, it is vastly oversimplistic to pretend that it would take that many slaves to move it. Besides the fact that you are assuming that they are pulling it at exactly parallel to the stone with no friction. To use your logic... well, consider those people who could pull an airplane by themselves (one of those strongmen). I imagine then, it would take about... max, 10 of those people to pull that block. Now, imagine a "slave" equals 10 or even 20 of those guys. That means about 100-200 people can move that stone. Not that big of a deal. Also, you do realize that while it would take that many to lift it, it is not the same to push or pull it. A LOT less people are required to push or pull something than lift it. I mean christ, I can push a car by myself. I can even push really heavy stuff with no wheels by myself. It is a lot harder to lift it though. Besides that anecdotal evidence, it is actually physically easier to push/pull than lift (for a simplified explanation, lifting fights against the force of gravity on the mass. Pushing/pulling only against friction, and simply the force of the object. And to really show you where your logic was flawed, technically, in a world of no friction, it requires exactly 1 person to move that object (even an inch). I don't think you understand basic concepts of physics. ANY force on an object with no friction will cause it to move (albeit a negligible amount). Also, there is a difference between "static" and "kinetic" friction.


So besides that point, the second point is that....

Just because we don't know exactly how it was built doesnt' mean it was built by some supernatural being or something. That's how people used to think. But actually, research into ancient building techniques has shown that they were in fact able to be moved... rather easily.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lRRDzFROMx0

A SINGLE MAN builds a mini stonehedge. Imagine if that technology was used to a much greater degree. Unique lifting and moving systems were used in order to move these things, not magic.

Also, all materials used in that were available at the time to the people who built these structures. Just because in our world today OUR only way of lifting giant things is with massive cranes and such, doesn't mean that is the only way. There are ways to take advantage of simple laws of physics that were indeed known back then (they had physics then, too!) to move massive things as well as prop them up. Those ways are just a bit more time, energy, and material consuming. But entirely possible.

In short, all of your examples of these giant, seemingly impossibly built structures are well, completely possible. Not built by "gods" or "aliens" or whatever the hell you think. Don't use your ignorance of physics to justify that "magic" was used. Please study basic laws of motion and friction at LEAST, as well as other more complex physics if you want to actually learn how these things were moved. Good luck :)

That is a great video, wasup. Makes you want to try some of it out. I'm glad you posted it. Btw, I'm not attributing all things unknown to magic or aliens. I do like to pose questions that generate good conversation, though.

CometLike I'm mostly just addressing SolSkye's point, I think your question was totally legit (I mean, as you said, there really is no way to know). Maybe aliens "created us" and let us develop... but I wouldn't say anything more than that (already I take a more "we don't really know, but I doubt it" stance). As in, I wouldn't say they were directly involved, such as SolSyke believes.

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Originally Posted by CometLike

You have no original thoughts. People like you are a waste of space. Specific enough for you, junior ? The point was for YOU to be specific about YOUR beliefs. I also believe that you understood that but chose belligerence as a veil to hide your lack of creativity. Prove me wrong, if you can. Do I have to hold your hand and tell you how to accomplish that as well ? Contribute in a positive way, if only this once.

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Well, well, Mr. "I like to communicate poorly then yell at people and act smug when I am misunderstood"

I have explained my beliefs before, and they aren't anything very complex because in reality, it is very hard to prove things.

My core beliefs are just go with the flow. I like to think about things yes, but I don't pull overused ideas out and assert them unless I find it having enough backing to be considered factual.

Some things I accept as facts:

- The earth is round
- We do not know how the universe came into existence
- Evolution is a fact
- Abiogenesis is a plausable idea
- Tectonic plate theory isn't complete
- The sun is made of hydrogen and deutritium
- The world is not going to end until the sun goes nova or a grossly large object collides with us.
- Gravity works
- No theology is correct
- Christianity, Judaism, and many religions are based around Fables and fairy tales
- Your brain works through electrical synapses

And who the hell are you to judge my creativity because I challenge the idea that the earth is a science project?

I'm here to disagree, you're here to bring up some kind of evidence.

If you don't like it that I am not just saying "Oh wow that's a revolutionary idea!" (Which it isn't-- It's been circulated many times) then oh well.

Call me a troll, call me what you like. I don't really care. You're the one with the idea, not me.

And how dare you tell me I have no original thoughts when this whole idea is almost as old as UFO sightings!

Oh and by the way: facts are universal, so it's stupid to ask what I consider a fact and then tell me "Not the obvious ones"

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Originally Posted by wasup

CometLike I'm mostly just addressing SolSkye's point, I think your question was totally legit (I mean, as you said, there really is no way to know). Maybe aliens "created us" and let us develop... but I wouldn't say anything more than that (already I take a more "we don't really know, but I doubt it" stance). As in, I wouldn't say they were directly involved, such as SolSyke believes.

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That video was cool, but you can take that unnecessary condescension of yours you posted along with it elsewhere...

I never said I believed anything. Please don't assume or put words in my mouth. Thanks.

I just entertain all thoughts and possibilities and keep an open mind about it. I find it to be the best way to go about living.

By all means, look at the evidence and jump to your own conclusions. I'll continue to jump between them. A maverick in the system, if you will.

Ciao.

So much for discussions. See ya folks.