There was only one of those scholarships that I saw in the packet I got. Even though it was $300, I was a bit ticked off that something like that can even fly by.Quote:
Originally Posted by Xox
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There was only one of those scholarships that I saw in the packet I got. Even though it was $300, I was a bit ticked off that something like that can even fly by.Quote:
Originally Posted by Xox
Hmm I've seen so many of them. :P Did you take the PSAT? They make you check something off if you're black since you qualify for this big scholarship. =PQuote:
Originally Posted by Daniel Danciu
My birth certificate says my mother is hispanic. I think that qualifies me for something. But I didn't apply for anything since she isn't really hispanic, it was just a screw up.Quote:
Originally Posted by Xox
I don't agree that black people are a culture. The race, like all races, is extremely diverse. Every kind of mind possible can be found in the pool of black people. By treating black people as a culture, stereotypes are created and preserved. Blackness is nothing more than a skin color. I think it is dangerous to treat it as anything else. Promoting perception of individuality is the only cure for racism. Nothing else will ever work.Quote:
Originally Posted by Sandform
I have come across a few black Youtube commenters who have said some really terrible things about white people. I always approach them with my point about individuality. It is the one thing that calms those individuals down (sometimes) and gets them thinking clearly. There is not one thing I could say about "black culture" or "white culture" that would have that effect. People who do talk about those things just fan the flames.
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Originally Posted by Universal Mind
So you're saying there hasn't been a shared cultural status among black people in the United States? There isn't a reason people can't share cultures without resolving to remove their other cultural heritage. There is a culture associated with being black in America whether you care to agree or not. There are various collections of literature, art, music, and other things that would beg to differ with your opinion, many of them prevalent in the Harlem Renaissance. That doesn't mean that every black person is a part of it, but that doesn't mean there isn't one. Not every Native American is a part of the Native American culture but that doesn't mean there isn't one. Black people in the U.S. for a very long time have endured a shared cultural status. They did form their own culture. Perhaps if we renamed it to "black people that associate with this culture culture" (which is the way you are supposed to look at cultures, not as all inclusive to every single person who could possibly fit into the group, but inclusive to those who do identify themselves as part of, and participate in, that culture)you wouldn't have such a big problem with it. At least that is what I would assume based on the first sentence of your post.
But anyway we are just going to have to disagree. I don't think it is horrible to say this is my history, this is the culture I identify with, and I don't disown the other parts of my culture, or look down on other peoples culture, either. I find no problem with celebrating where you have came from, and people who have affected your way of life. I do understand how you feel on the subject, I just don't see black history month as something inherently divisive. I mean, anything can be divisive if you try to make it be.
I agree with you to the extent that I know cultures exist. However, no race can be completely associated with a culture, and no culture can be completely associated with a race. Terms like "black culture" throw the entire race into an association with a culture, and that is where racial divisions and stereotypes are born.
Black History Month was started because, at the time of its conception, very little was known about the contributions blacks have made to society. You couldn't thumb through a history book and read about all the contributions blacks have made. Indeed, the majority of whites had absolutely no idea of the contributions blacks had made. They were all but ignored, in the public eye, and Black History month was started as a way to get people, who otherwise would continue to ignore the fact that blacks were such an integral part of history, to actually stop and gain some sort of awareness about the contributions they had made.
What's more racist, Black history month, or the reason black history month came about?
Now, that being said, I completely agree with UM. In a perfect world, black history would be as integral as history for any other ethnic group. The truth, however, is that there are plenty of white Americans who would have absolutely no idea of contributions made by blacks to this country, if it weren't for Black History month. My being of a generation that didn't come from segregation, I would much rather there not be a "Black History Month" but that there be all-around awareness of blacks' achievements throughout history, just as there are about whites. It's simply not the case. America is still (regardless of how much some people want to ignore it) learning of the importance of other races besides the most prominent that they read about in their history books (whites). Racism is not "over." Inequality is not "over." The problem has not "gone away." Even if it's not overt, the degree of separation exists. Black History month remains as a kick in the pants to not forget or ignore that which has been an important part of the development of America, just as "White History" has.
In all fairness, I wouldn't mind at all if the year were split into "---- History Month" to highlight achievements from all races, but the one main (and most severe) divide in recent American history has been that between the whites and blacks - the two most dominant races in America, if I'm not mistaken. So I do understand a little more pressure to attempt to mend that divide, a little more than the others. Not saying it's right or fair, but I understand it.
Very interesting thread. I'm enjoying reading all the various posts here. Let's keep it going.
I read that soon hispanics will soon be the most populated minority, will this then make a hispanic month more prominent?
Sure we treated blacks HORRIBLY back then. That was back then, not now. I don't think of black people as black. I think of them as Americans. I only think of black people as black if they try to stand out.
Pretty much I do and don't believe we should have it.
Do- They have been through hell and no one deserved to be treated the way they were
Don't- No one treats them like that anymore, if they do they are idiots.
American History would be a good idea. All of the ethnicity had hardships, why not recognize them all at one time?
Black history month doesn't bother me so much, but there are many other races deprived by the US in their past that could use a month.Quote:
Originally Posted by O'nus
Along with a Womans History Month someone said would be good, all the major suppressed should be talked about to avoid repeating it in the future.
Whats up, O'nus, get beat up by a black guy recently?
Black history month is racist, but it isn't for black people. Its for the ignorant white people who have ignored everything blacks have done in this country for the last 200 years. Its a time when us honkies are forced to learn about motown, peanut butter, Harriet Tubman etc. etc.
LOL I like that. Fair enough.Quote:
Originally Posted by Xaqaria
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I don't think such events should exist. As has been said, it's full of contradictions. I'm generally completely against talking about a collective of individuals who only have race in common. Pure egalitarianism is the only stance that makes any sense.
I think we should simply celebrate individuals and groups on their merits. There are plenty of black people who have done good things over history, so simply educate ourselves about them and keep them respectfully in mind, just as you would any great person or group of people.
But don't celebrate a race as a whole, that's ridiculous. There have been just as many bad black people as there have been bad people of other races. To celebrate blacks as if they are some kind of homogeneous collective is wrong.
[/sarcasm]?Quote:
Originally Posted by Xaqaria
I honestly don't believe that is the point of Black History month, simply a widespread misinterpretation.Quote:
Originally Posted by Xei
Which black people is it celebrating though? All of them?
I assume it's about slaves, in which case it should be a celebration of the black Americans' fight for equal rights. Which is of course a virtuous cause which should be celebrated.
But 'black history'... what is that?
It is a label. It is what they call a day to celebrate blacks who have had impact. It is a day to show that - just as there are whites who have done great things in history - there have been (often lesser-known) blacks who have done so as well.Quote:
Originally Posted by Xei
Is "Mothers' Day" a day to celebrate all the deadbeat moms out there who don't know how to raise their children? Is Fathers' Day a day to celebrate the deadbeat dads who beat their wives and children on a daily basis, and who let their kids live in deplorable conditions so they can go off and get high with their friends? I think "no," on both counts. (Though misinterpretation could possibly lead someone to have that idea.) They are days of notification and recognition for those that actually have done their share of good in the world (or in their families, in the case of Mothers' and Fathers' day). The same goes for "Black History" month. It is a time of recognition for both slaves and non-slaves who are, for all intensive purposes, extraordinary - those same people that, if you were to look in a standard American textbook, you might not read more than a couple of paragraphs about.
Giving them "their own" month, while controversial, is a good way to heighten awareness about blacks in American history who, otherwise (let's face it) might just slip into obscurity, in the eyes of many white Americans.
To be honest Mother/Father's day is pretty different. If your dad beat you up as a child then you aren't going to celebrate it. If your dad was great then you will. It's about personal thanks, not thanking a group of people.
I still don't agree with celebrating a race of people. As has been mentioned; if you have a day for blacks, you're gonna have to introduce a whole plethora of days for people of other races.
Celebrating the fight against racism in America; great. But that was a historical event brought about by a group of people - including a few people of other races, too.
It's rather like having a 'women history month' to celebrate women getting the vote. It's just bizarre. It was only a small band of women in a specific period of history who brought that change about. It's not representative of women in general, and of course, women have done other great things than that particular event, and continue to do so.
Apologies but I am a strict adherent to the idea that each individual should be taken to their personal merits and actions, and nothing more. What they were born as should have nothing to do with it.
I still don't believe you understand where I'm coming from.Quote:
Originally Posted by Xei
I don't think Black History month is "celebrating a race of people." It is celebrating great people who - because of their race - have often not been given fair recognition, throughout history. This will take the matter a little deeper but: do you honestly believe that mainstream, white America truly pays its due recognition to blacks in history? Do you not feel that there is just the slightest bit of one-sidedness? That great minorities have always gotten less academic (and social) recognition than whites? If the former, I'd have to disagree with you. If the latter, then you might understand why there is a Black History month, a little more than you might even be conscious of.
It's not about "celebrating a race." I think that misconception is part of the reason it gets so much flack. Whites feel alienated because there is no "White History month," even though an overwhelming majority (disproportionate to whites just being a majority) of the "greatness" that is celebrated in America, on a daily basis, is about white people in history.
"Grand label" aside: in reality, Black History month is nothing but a consolation prize.
I'm afraid I can't really answer anything about the American education system (I'm a Brit and I don't have much of a passion for history). Although from my extremely limited knowledge of American greats (which is about equal to most other people over here)... I basically know of Abe Lincoln and Martin Luther King; and the latter is the only one I've actually studied in school. So if anything it's weighted in favour of black people.
And there's still the issue of why all the other races don't get a month...
Ah. My mistake. I didn't take that into consideration.Quote:
Originally Posted by Xei
From an insider's perspective, it's definitely not weighted in favor of black people. Just the same, though, I can't really comment on how it's perceived outside the states, or by many people inside, for that matter.Quote:
Originally Posted by Xei
I agree. Great people in history deserve quality recognition, regardless of their race. As I mentioned, it may not be fair that there isn't a "--- History Month" for every race, but BHM was started in a time where America was deeply stained by a single, most prominent confrontation - the segregation of blacks and whites. Blacks had to fight long and hard to gain their position in society and (aside from the Native Americans - who truly endured some of the greatest American hardships, in their time) were likely the most worthy of being integrated into academic record. I'm sure someone that knows a little more about American history can problem explain where I'm coming from a lot better than I can, on that point. I know more about overall concepts than I do about details. But, like I said, though it may not be fair to the other races, I understand why BHM exists.Quote:
Originally Posted by Xei
Well people are always flaming about how blacks get lots of scholarships. But a lot of time those scholarships are from private indivuals, so they can give it to whoever the hell they want. It still make my mom rage when she sees a Negro Scholarship Fund commercial. If I ever get a will made out I'm gonna donate half my money to that just to piss my mom off XD, just like when I ordered her an book about Obama.
Anyway, someone should start a thread on affirmative action. I got LOTS to say about that. Of course if I start ranting here it will be off topic... kind of.
Oh and also without MLK there probaly wouldn't be Stevie Wonder. Im sure we will all be a little less happy if there was no Stevie Wonder.
Oh and also without MLK there probaly wouldnt be Obama. Im sure we will all be a little less happy.... errr... nevermind XD
You can't make a whites only scholarship. That would be called a hate crime or some such. Explain that.Quote:
Originally Posted by justme
I believe it's pretty common knowledge that, before affirmative action, the discrimination that ran rampant in American power-positions (much of which still exists today) kept countless blacks and other minorities out of high positions of social status. As such, there was already an unfair advantage to whites, as far as scholarships and other methods of getting ahead were involved. Minority-only scholarships were created to help undo that imbalance. Creating strict "white only" scholarships, on top of that, would be like giving a head-start to a handicapped racer, and then giving the stronger athlete performance enhancers, during the last stretch of the race.Quote:
Originally Posted by drewmandan
Bullshit. There are just as many disadvantaged whites now as blacks.Quote:
Originally Posted by Oneironaut