I'm curious if you guys think that Buddhist monks are able to achieve lucidity easily ? Since strong practices of meditation are involved in their lives?
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I'm curious if you guys think that Buddhist monks are able to achieve lucidity easily ? Since strong practices of meditation are involved in their lives?
Interesting question. I would say no because they don't do reality checks as part of their normal routine. While I'm sure they consider dreams to be important and pay close attention to them, I don't think they spend considerable time focusing on the idea of becoming lucid.
I bet they do have dreams, but I don't know if they lucid dream.
I'm pretty sure that the Tibetan monks not only lucid dream, and have been doing so for centuries, but LD'ing is an integral part of their lifelong quest to maintain their awareness straight through death so that they can bypass the Wheel of Life and move more quickly to higher existence.
Because sleep is very much like death, consciously speaking, the Tibetans believe that if they can master strong awareness in a dream (aka LD'ing), they may be able to better prepare themselves when actual death finally comes.
This is incredibly simplistic and of course there is much, much more involved, but suffice it to say that LD'ing is an important part of the Tibetan Buddhist monks' journey. I would guess that many other groups of Buddhist, Hindu, and -- believe it or not -- Catholic, monks incorporate waking awareness in their dreams. They might not call it LD'ing, but that's what it is.
RC's are the weakest method of becoming lucid.Quote:
Originally Posted by Omnis Dei
I would say that some, if not all are lucid dreamers. It would make sense that some of them, at some point would realise "Hey, I'm practicing awareness all day, but when I'm asleep/dreaming I lose it". And they would try to work on that.
They were actually one of the first group to learn it. They meditate a lot, and they work hard to be constantly aware, which is the strongest way to LD (IMO). If you are aware of everything during daytime, then you will also be a LOT more aware during your dreams, which = LD.
I wonder what monks do during a lucid dream.
This might be a little off topic, but I felt I should respond to this. RC's are not a method of becoming lucid. To believe that they are will definitely hamper your ability to become lucid, and probably lead to a lot of false lucid dreams (dreams where you think you are lucid, but lack any waking awareness). RC's are tools for developing awareness, meant to force you by habit to frequently pause to double-check your surroundings, and your place in those surroundings. That they've been turned over the years into a sort of "switch" that's supposed to induce LD's is not a very good thing. To base your LD'ing success on RC's instead of on the awareness that they are meant to develop is to hold real awareness, and real LD'ing, at arm's length,Quote:
Originally Posted by tommo
I use RC's all the time, in waking life, but never in a dream, because the habit of testing my state as a tool for building constant self-awareness has made understanding that I'm dreaming much easier.
And, just to get back on topic, since those Tibetans' entire waking life tends to be an RC, I would disagree with Omnis Dei and say that they are certainly doing them!
Also:
As I mentioned above, I think the Tibetan mindset towards awareness and LD'ing extends a bit further than that. Their sleep and dreams are major components of their quest for higher existence (to step off the Wheel of Life), and much of the awareness that they build in waking life is done specifically to prepare them to continue to be self-aware when they are asleep. LD'ing for them is not an afterthought.Quote:
I would say that some, if not all are lucid dreamers. It would make sense that some of them, at some point would realize "Hey, I'm practicing awareness all day, but when I'm asleep/dreaming I lose it". And they would try to work on that.
Practice spiritual disciplinesQuote:
Originally Posted by Raetin
Receive initiations, empowerments and transmissions
Visit different places, planes and worlds
Communicate with an enlightened being
Meet with other sentient beings
Fly and shape shift into other creatures
What they do when they're awake, meditate and practice strong discipline.Quote:
Originally Posted by Raetin
Sounds to me like what we all should be doing in our LD's!Quote:
Originally Posted by ThePieMan
I think they would often have lucid dreams just due to their awareness in general. Things like meditation, clear mindedness, general cognizance, etc all are things that will sort of naturally produce lucid dreams.
Yeah, the tibetans had (have) something called Tibetan Dream Yoga that they practice. It was actually one of the first things i read all about when i first became interested in lucid dreaming. If you google it you can find all kind of stuff about it, its pretty interesting
If RC's cause awareness, then RC's are a method for attaining lucidity.Quote:
Originally Posted by Sageous
The only reason they're just a very weak method is because most people slip in to doing RC's habitually, instead of actually becoming aware/lucid.
Okay, I guess you are correct semantically, except that RC's do not cause awareness; they are a tool for helping you develop awareness. There is a huge difference. And yes, when "people slip in to doing RC's habitually, instead of actually becoming aware/lucid," they are certainly defeating the purpose of doing state tests (RC's) in the first place.Quote:
Originally Posted by tommo
I suppose you are also right in another way -- people who assume that RC's do cause lucidity, and use them as a technique, are indeed using a very weak technique.
Actually in the practice of dream yoga, the monks use lucid dreaming as way to break free of the grasps of the conceptual mind. They will multiply themselves in, change their size, lift enormous rocks, turn marbles into hopelessly heavy objects, manipulate time... Anything that would defy the dualistic logic of waking life.Quote:
Originally Posted by Raetin