Is Lucid dreaming Reality checks similar to Insanity/going crazy?

So i am reading and hearing( in video tutorials) that you have to repeatedly do reality checks in your waking life and like ask yourself seriously if you're dreaming and like talk to yourself. I don't know but i feel like this is similar to what people with Schizophrenia or other Mental illness do, talk to their selves and really take it seriously.

I just don't want to get crazy from doing all this practice everyday like 20 + times a day doing reality checks. Or is this perfectly normal and it won't have any bad effects on my sanity?

Like right now i was doing realy checks, looking at my hands and asking my self "am i dreaming" "how do i know this is not a dream?" "oh look this house looks real, am i dreaming or not?" and stuff like that.

It feels kind of like now i'm doing what the Homeless people in the streets who have mental illneess do, like talk to their self as if it they were really talking to someone.

It also kind of seems doing reality checks repeatedly is like OCD.

Anyways, i'm ok if this doesn't lead to me getting mentally insane. But does it have any efects? or is perfectly normal?


Cause i't snot like me learning piano and talking to myself about what i'm doing. I'm actually doing something real. But when i'd be doing reality checks 100 times or whatever, talking about if i'm really dreaming or not. sounds like i'm going crazy.

Any thoughts?:shock:

I know the feeling - I do RCs in school, and get a ton of looks.

Doing RCs daily will not make you go insane. Sure, it's an odd thing to see in society, but you won't develop any sort of mental illness just by checking to see if you're dreaming or not.

Nothing will happen as long as you really know the difference. You should be able to reconize reality and dreams easily but if you start suspecting reality as a dream then you should probably stop and try other techniques like wild. Reality checks doesnt have to look weird you can do it mentaly just by questioning reality while analyzing you situation and surroundings.

The following may seem inordinately direct and provocative (and even ill advised), but I have a headache, so there ... :)

Checking for reality - done correctly - should help in establishing which kind of reality one is currently in. This implies a greater awareness of ones situation. This is good - it is a sign of greater involvement with life itself.

Ordinary people do not check for reality. They are also mentally duller, and less involved with life - they are more "robotic". In the extreme, they have no mental activities at all (vegetable).

Being more aware of reality puts one in greater danger of being insane (really dull people are not insane; they are dull), but reality checking does probably not promote insanity. Conversely, however, insanity might promote reality checking.

If a person does something strange - in public - then two scenarios are possible: either the strange action leads to a good result, in which case the person will likely be viewed as a genious, or at least inspired. Alternatively, if the the action has bad consequences, the person will likely be seen as mad.

There is no objectivity to the concept "insanity".

So take heart: if you're into lucid dreaming then you're probably brighter than the average person. (And the average person would love to view you as mad - if given the slightest opportunity. So conducting reality checks outside of view of that person would probably be a good idea ;) ).

I really don´t think, RCing can lead to insanity.
I wonder, why you are so afraid of that.
Somebody in the family maybe, or otherwise a source for worry in yourself or your surroundings?

And - you can do RC without talking out loud - I never talk out loud, when I do.
And - when I really think, I am dreaming - I use the nose plug - because sometimes my hands are fully realistic in a dream - optics and consistency.
So looking/thumb through is not enough to see, if I can go flying out the window, or not.

But in the day - I do look at my hands - most of the time in a dream they are not realistic.
That other people do as well - like check if your fingernails are clean or whatever seems natural from the outside.
Or look at the surroundings and take it all in consciously - is something weird - out of place? Can you feel all your senses - touch, do you smell something, hear something - does this all fit together?
Also silent and inconspicuous.

Or - best maybe - ask yourself in your thoughts - silently - where you have been ten min. back - how you came to be where you are.
Like - you are at school - did you go there in the usual way - do you remember the bus-ride, or what the plan is for that day - maths, English..
Is it correct like it is?
How do and did and will you interact with your surroundings?

All done in your head only - nobody will see or hear it - and - it is a natural thing, to get aware of your place and station in your life, just here and now.
Sometimes people do that just out of a feeling to have been caught up in something, and lost their feeling about what they originally wanted to do.
Talking posting for ages and forgetting to cook...hehe.

Reality checking in itself won't lead to mental illness. Perhaps someone who was already mentally ill might run some kind of risk of getting obsessive or anxious about reality checking and wondering whether everything is a dream or reality, but as long as you know the purpose of it and don't obsess over it, there's no reason for it to be a problem.

You mentioned schizophrenia; people suffering from schizophrenia often lose the ability to differentiate between reality and hallucinations/delusions. In a sense, as long as you don't start hallucinating in waking life and end up concluding that you're dreaming when you're not (which reality checking certainly wouldn't cause in itself) reality checking is the opposite of this. By reality checking and recognizing when you're dreaming, you're becoming more aware and doing something that many people never learn to do - telling the difference between dream and waking/"real" life even when most people wouldn't, naturally :]

As others said, you don't need to talk out loud to yourself at all, and there are plenty of inconspicuous ways to reality check if you're afraid of other people noticing and getting the wrong impression. The point is just to become more aware overall so that you can recognize the differences between waking life and dreaming and therefore become aware of when you're dreaming. Also, you don't need to obsessively do reality checks all of the time. If you pay attention to what's going on around you and stay aware, one or two simple reality checks from time to time when convenient/appropriate and noticing anything out of the ordinary should be enough.

my method of getting a lucid dream has been very successful for me and it is not something crazy. I just practice visual awareness daily(I just "look/concentrate" as much as I can daily and when I go to bed).

Welcome voByJunior2013 :) I checked out your first post here (edit: here on Dreamviews, not this thread) and the profile you listed on that post and I think it would be best if you spoke to your doctor about this first. If you get the okay from your doctor, feel free to look me up and I would be glad to help you any way that I can as it seems like you could potentially benefit from the amazing worlds in our dreams, lucid or not. :) *Edit: I am referring to your first post in the Dreamviews forums, not your first post in this thread.

Spoiler for lsd = pounds, shillings and pence:

A temp guy I worked with back in the 1990's saw this picture I had drawn and coloured in. (Figurative/imagination.)
He seemed to know about 'drugs' being an ex-student type character.
I entitled the picture 'Acid P___' plus I had simply used 'lots' of purple hues in the picture - when he saw it he made out like I must have been on drugs/inspired by drugs, as it was apparently (according to him) the first signs of an LSD overdose; whatever that meant?!
I presume he referred to the purple overflow and the title of course (which was the persons nickname in the picture.)

I wasn't of course. :chuckle:

So basically from the above example 'even if you are not' then to an outsider/certain individuals, they try to make things fit like a glove just to suit themselves; usually from not knowing the full background or story behind it.
In the case of 'reality checks' I guess a lot of people might see it as 'eccentric' and nothing more. If everybody was the same, then the world would be a boring place.

I have the issue where I have had the OCD (checking) appear in a dream. I also have had where you know you are lucid, but still (sometimes) decide NOT to throw yourself out of a high window.
I guess that's a good thing - I mean you wouldn't want to make a (RL) mistake there!

I am Lucid Dreaming every day and sometimes I think I am going crazy, but then I understand that I am not going crazy.

Just as an example, lets say you would see a real alien, he would do crazy stuff to you and make you believe in crazy things. Next day you tell this to your family, they get you to a doctor, you tell him the same and in short period of time you get to the nuthouse. They would call it 'whatever illness name', put you on pills and there you go. Enjoy the rest of your life there.
I am trying to say that, we are living in the modern world and what we do now here, would be called dark magic some time ago. Maybe in future this is going to be normal for every person to lucid dream and enjoy some beyond dreaming capabilities.

Yea, we are very close to going crazy. But we learn to understand this process, so we are not going insane. Every advanced lucid dreamer, ask's him self, from time to time, if he is going crazy or not. I am pretty sure about it.
I think that people who do not believe in obvious fact that Lucid Dreaming does exist - are even more crazy then us.

I am happy that nowadays Lucid Dreaming is not a crime. We are here not to have a war against those who do not Lucid Dream. We are here to learn, explore and enjoy.

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Originally Posted by fogelbise

*Edit: I am referring to your first post in the Dreamviews forums, not your first post in this thread.

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I added a few edits to my posts a few posts back that hopefully make it more clear why I posted that.

What fogelbise alludes to - if there is a psychiatric problem going on - it will be up to you, to intuitively get a feeling for if the whole subject is prone to push you over an edge, you would rather stay away from.

To ask your physician might or might not be fruitful - she should know about LD, see below, and that it is in no way insane in itself - but she will probably not have literature to consult - nor have lots of patients, who did experiment with it.
So - she can only guess, if it does you good or not.
Guess either on the side of caution - sensible in a way - but then it is on you to take on the advice or not, ultimately.
Or guess based on what you are reporting.

Do you LD and since when and how is it - do you suspect, there being a problem with it based on experiences, or just theoretically?
Since you ask about RC - is it about LD yet?

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Originally Posted by flowofmysoul

I am Lucid Dreaming every day and sometimes I think I am going crazy, but then I understand that I am not going crazy.

Just as an example, lets say you would see a real alien, he would do crazy stuff to you and make you believe in crazy things. Next day you tell this to your family, they get you to a doctor, you tell him the same and in short period of time you get to the nuthouse. They would call it 'whatever illness name', put you on pills and there you go. Enjoy the rest of your life there.
I am trying to say that, we are living in the modern world and what we do now here, would be called dark magic some time ago. Maybe in future this is going to be normal for every person to lucid dream and enjoy some beyond dreaming capabilities.

Yea, we are very close to going crazy. But we learn to understand this process, so we are not going insane. Every advanced lucid dreamer, ask's him self, from time to time, if he is going crazy or not. I am pretty sure about it.
I think that people who do not believe in obvious fact that Lucid Dreaming does exist - are even more crazy then us.

I am happy that nowadays Lucid Dreaming is not a crime. We are here not to have a war against those who do not Lucid Dream. We are here to learn, explore and enjoy.

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I do not think, we are close to going crazy but close to more awareness of reality.

And - the ones doing the hard science on LD here in Germany are psychiatrists - with functional-resonance-tomography and the like. And the psychologists are on about it too.
It is actually right now and in the moment something, consciousness research loves.
To go at it from psychedelics would be something very fruitful as well, I think - but that is indeed mostly connected to extremely much action to get the allowances even for neuro-scientists, and esp. with human subjects - that more towards Highlander.
Might be, a change in thinking is coming along - but America forces first order substance regulations on other countries, which do commerce with them - as a primary source of problems.

So - somebody declaring you mad for LDing didn´t do her homework on the state of the art of neuroscience and psychiatry and psychology!
The thing with your alien - weell - could mean a lot of things - could be a good idea to help you, if you were suffering in any which way - could be a good idea to do that with medication.

I still hope for first contact in my lifetime, btw - that´s a whole other bucket of fish.

But surely you do not get locked away for life anywhere these days - if you would - that institution needed to be law-suited down, if it managed to have survived the dark ages of psychiatry.

I do not think, that experiences with the beyond will be common place - I do not believe in such in the first place.
And in believing in things like astral projection and to be in any way in real danger and stalked by sinister entities of the dream-sphere - that I personally deem very irrational - and it might drive you insane to really believe in such things, too.
Never understood how somebody can take stuff like night-stalkers seriously and still be totally unafraid - acting as if in reality - in no way they do really believe in that stuff. So it would be for most, I actually think - half-baked belief, only - not full delusion.

But LDing might be common place one day - yes! Hopefully!

How can you come up with being happy it is not a crime, though??
How can it be - being in your head?
Do you imagine a dream-police, standing at your bed with an EEG and putting you in jail for the wrong sort of waves?
Now that is a bit of a strange sentiment to be happy about this.

I must admit that I don't do a lot of RC checks IWL. If I do then it is the 'classic' nose-pinch check. I might do one outside, etc. if I see something out of the 'norm' for example [Sarcasm] like when an energy company lowers their prices just before the cold winter![/Sarcasm] - RC NOW!

Joking aside, I think the time when an RC is mandatory is when you wake up/get out of your bed (IWL.) Hopefully this has the net effect of being carried over into your dreaming world where you can pick up on realising false awakenings.

For example my DJ word cloud has the word 'Bedroom' displayed quite prominent in bold - thus I would say it is a common theme. I guess it is for many other dreamers too.

In your bedroom you don't have to answer to anybody, except your other half maybe, or the cat; so you can RC away to your heart's content. ;)

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Originally Posted by StephL

To go at it from psychedelics would be something very fruitful as well, I think - but that is indeed mostly connected to extremely much action to get the allowances even for neuro-scientists, and esp. with human subjects - that more towards Highlander.

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I know Thomas Yuschak wrote an excellent book regarding certain supplements on the actions of the main key neurotransmitters of the brain, etc. I dunno about psychedelics. I'd have thought the leaning would be toward nootropics and the brain myself, athough it is a topic for another day maybe.

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Originally Posted by StephL

Might be, a change in thinking is coming along - but America forces first order substance regulations on other countries, which do commerce with them - as a primary source of problems.

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Phama (with a capital 'P.')
Politics, (sex, and religion.) My advice - steer clear if you can! ;)

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Originally Posted by Highlander

..
Joking aside, I think the time when an RC is mandatory is when you wake up/get out of your bed (IWL.) Hopefully this has the net effect of being carried over into your dreaming world where you can pick up on realising false awakenings.

...

I know Thomas Yuschak wrote an excellent book regarding certain supplements on the actions of the main key neurotransmitters of the brain, etc. I dunno about psychedelics. I'd have thought the leaning would be toward nootropics and the brain myself, athough it is a topic for another day maybe.



Phama (with a capital 'P.')
Politics, (sex, and religion.) My advice - steer clear if you can! ;)

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Oh - I do steer clear - and I did not mean it in connection with LD.
You should not even "only" be a neuro-scientist, but best one with a reputation beyond doubt, if you go into this subject.
And - yeah - nootropics are interesting - and esp. with LD - but - we do not really expect marvellously different things to be measured, when a subject on nootropics is put into MRI, while otherwise - even without any own experiences - it should interest and does interest neuro-science, what could be maybe seen..
Totally off topic, though.

I have a nice "automatic" RC with my I-phone dictation function for dream-journalling - doesn´t work in a false awakening..
Maybe not enough, though - maybe one day it does work..?
And thanks for the book-tip!

I don't think you can develop schizophrenia from RCing. If you are RCing correctly, then you should be gaining an awareness of the world around you, it makes a distinction between waking and dreaming life, not the other way around. If you see something weird as hell and you do an RC that fails, coupled with the feeling of being awake then it's a good thing, not a bad one. If anyone is going to crazy it's not you since you know 99% sure what you saw was real.

The difference between a schizophrenic person and a normal lucid dreamer is colossal. Generally lucid dreamers are more down to earth, understand more about states of being, able to control themselves emotionally and sometimes they get a good grasp on logic in the process. If anything lucid dreaming for a normal person is only beneficial.

Just like with depression, lucid dreaming only really affects you in an adverse manner when you are already suffering from something. If you have schizophrenia then lucid dreaming could make it worse.

If you are a perfectly healthy being than you'll be fine.

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Originally Posted by dutchraptor

If you have schizophrenia then lucid dreaming could make it worse.

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Not sure about if LD would really be harmful, if you have schizophrenia - I do see, that there stands "could" not "does", though.

Pure guesswork - but one could also hypothesise, that by the very process of pondering reality and becoming more conscious about the distinctions and nuances between pure waking reality and the dream - a schizophrenic might actually get a better handle on "other stuff, which is not real", as well..
But then - maybe the opposite is intuitively making more sense, after all.
I doubt there are case-reports about a negative or positive effect out there.

If you were to decide about this personally - the best would probably be to have a really good and close rapport with one´s psychiatrist, who is well-informed, able and willing to do a responsible supervision - with accompanying critical assessment as to how the effects turn out.

Quite the dream-physician that would be - needs to be dreamed up, I am afraid, for all but the most lucky patients..

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Originally Posted by StephL

I do not think, we are close to going crazy but close to more awareness of reality

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It depends how serious you take Lucid Dreaming. If you keep it on time-to-time occasions for fun only, then it is another story. If you choose to study it, if you want to go deeper you will sometimes catch your self on the idea that you might be going crazy. But that's just an illusion, we are alright. Well most of us.
I am not talking about that some people use Lucid Dreaming as a drug, they want to escape their failed reality and get into new world. It is another topic.

There were moments in real life where I could not confirm whether it was dream or reality. I had many strange things happened to me, during 6 years of Lucid Dreaming. And I am not the only one, there are many others with same experience.

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Originally Posted by StephL

How can you come up with being happy it is not a crime, though??
How can it be - being in your head?
Do you imagine a dream-police, standing at your bed with an EEG and putting you in jail for the wrong sort of waves?
Now that is a bit of a strange sentiment to be happy about this.

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I guess to each their own, if you do not believe in Beyond Dreaming it is your choice and I do not have anything against that.

I feel that you think that Shared Dreaming is the only aspect of Beyond Dreaming, but it is not. Even if was shared dreaming, as far as I know and as how my experience shows, we cannot affect each other in shared dream, we can only change our shared dream world.

Yea the idea that we might have some kind of dream police sounds funny. But you never know, it might happen one day.

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Originally Posted by StephL

Not sure about if LD would really be harmful, if you have schizophrenia - I do see, that there stands "could" not "does", though.

Pure guesswork - but one could also hypothesise, that by the very process of pondering reality and becoming more conscious about the distinctions and nuances between pure waking reality and the dream - a schizophrenic might actually get a better handle on "other stuff, which is not real", as well..
But then - maybe the opposite is intuitively making more sense, after all.
I doubt there are case-reports about a negative or positive effect out there.

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Totally right. The danger though is much higher if you were schizophrenic than for a normal person since we're dealing with an extreme. If you are really worried about it, then seeing one's psychiatrist is definitely the best option.

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Originally Posted by dutchraptor

Totally right. The danger though is much higher if you were schizophrenic than for a normal person since we're dealing with an extreme. If you are really worried about it, then seeing one's psychiatrist is definitely the best option.

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Yepp - fully agreed - there is definitively a danger - and to do one´s own experiments without guidance sounds like a bad idea.

I don't really do them for the sake of doing them. I do them when I notice something weird. I focus on my surroundings and if I notice something weird I check.

I don't think it can be a negative thing to ask yourself if you're in reality or a dream, it can only make you more aware of yourself and your surroundings. You don't have to do it out loud and attract attention. I mean everyone talks to themselves in an internal monologue right? Mine just isn't audible enough which is why I talk to myself out loud anyway. :lol:

Wth dude XDD of course NOT,be subtle in doing Rcs in public
and there is no need to say it out loud but make sure that you focus on the thought of " i might be dreaming" we need your mind to be trained to question reality !
it's not insane nor crazy it's just you training your brain to be critical "and being critical" is so scientific,asking "why this isn't a dream ?" and answering it with a proof is really smart and will swich your consciousness inside a dream " where consciousness and memory are confiscated" i really like it tbh i like to make my mind strong !
Goodluck ! and be subtle because people can be annoying.

Ha! theres many more things in life that can drive you insane, than a rc.

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Originally Posted by voByJunior2013

So i am reading and hearing( in video tutorials) that you have to repeatedly do reality checks in your waking life and like ask yourself seriously if you're dreaming and like talk to yourself. I don't know but i feel like this is similar to what people with Schizophrenia or other Mental illness do, talk to their selves and really take it seriously.

I just don't want to get crazy from doing all this practice everyday like 20 + times a day doing reality checks. Or is this perfectly normal and it won't have any bad effects on my sanity?

Like right now i was doing realy checks, looking at my hands and asking my self "am i dreaming" "how do i know this is not a dream?" "oh look this house looks real, am i dreaming or not?" and stuff like that.

It feels kind of like now i'm doing what the Homeless people in the streets who have mental illneess do, like talk to their self as if it they were really talking to someone.

It also kind of seems doing reality checks repeatedly is like OCD.

Anyways, i'm ok if this doesn't lead to me getting mentally insane. But does it have any efects? or is perfectly normal?


Cause i't snot like me learning piano and talking to myself about what i'm doing. I'm actually doing something real. But when i'd be doing reality checks 100 times or whatever, talking about if i'm really dreaming or not. sounds like i'm going crazy.

Any thoughts?:shock:

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first of all, that is called stigma. People with "mental illnesses" are not "homeless people". Also, 2/3 of people who hear voices don't seek help and are not crazy. Thirdly, I believe mental illness is a social projection, making people feel like their minds aren't right. God doesn't make mistakes. It's GOOD to feel the lows and the highs and talk to your family telepathically.

So change the way you think about "mental illnes". Many people who define themselves as "mentally ill" have jobs and live perfectly "normal" lives, though why do you want to be normal? This website isn't for people who want a boring normal life. It's for people who want to explore their psyche and learn about weird facets about themselves.

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Originally Posted by Voldmer

The following may seem inordinately direct and provocative (and even ill advised), but I have a headache, so there ... :)

Checking for reality - done correctly - should help in establishing which kind of reality one is currently in. This implies a greater awareness of ones situation. This is good - it is a sign of greater involvement with life itself.

Ordinary people do not check for reality. They are also mentally duller, and less involved with life - they are more "robotic". In the extreme, they have no mental activities at all (vegetable).

Being more aware of reality puts one in greater danger of being insane (really dull people are not insane; they are dull), but reality checking does probably not promote insanity. Conversely, however, insanity might promote reality checking.

If a person does something strange - in public - then two scenarios are possible: either the strange action leads to a good result, in which case the person will likely be viewed as a genious, or at least inspired. Alternatively, if the the action has bad consequences, the person will likely be seen as mad.

There is no objectivity to the concept "insanity".

So take heart: if you're into lucid dreaming then you're probably brighter than the average person. (And the average person would love to view you as mad - if given the slightest opportunity. So conducting reality checks outside of view of that person would probably be a good idea ;) ).

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don't be ashamed. Be humble but proud, don't hide from people. Be yourself.

Though the OP of this thread is some 4 years old, I feel a need to respond to this, and the conversation in general.

The premise of the OP, basically this:

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Originally Posted by voByJunior2013

So i am reading and hearing( in video tutorials) that you have to repeatedly do reality checks in your waking life and like ask yourself seriously if you're dreaming and like talk to yourself.

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... is categorically wrong, and represents a real failure in communicating what a RC actually is.

Critical state tests, or RC's, were originally meant to confirm that you are not dreaming, and not the other way around.

In other words, when doing a RC you are questioning a reality you already know is true (waking-life), in the hopes that you might be in a reality that you didn't expect (a dream). This is very handy if you should happen to do a RC during a dream and it works (i.e., your finger passes through your palm), because then you can come to realize that you are dreaming. But the opposite is absurd: to try to imagine that you are dreaming when you know damn well you are not dreaming is indeed an exercise in insanity, and by no means helps improve your LD'ing prospects.

I'm not sure where this whole "assume you are dreaming during your RC" rule came from, but I think it originated because Stephen LaBerge, the guy who basically defined state tests (RC's), suggested that you imagine you are dreaming after you performed the RC (and it failed, proving you are awake), just to get a dreamy sort of mindset in your head during a moment you happened to be thinking about dreaming. That imagining is a completely different step that has nothing to do with the RC itself, but over time the two somehow got conflated, I think.

So, in a nutshell: RC's are incredibly simple things to do: if, say, your finger doesn't pass through your hand, you are wake. Period. Doing things like imagining you are dreaming (when you know you obviously are not) are not part of RC's at all, and such counter-intuitive complications them will only lead to confusion.

Here finally is the sequence for RC's as they were originally concieved: Something happens that is odd (or perhaps you just rememebr to RC), and you ask the question: "Is this a dream?" ... you ask that question with the assumption that you are not dreaming, but do the RC just to be sure. Then, if your RC works (i.e., your finger won't pass through your palm), then you have confirmed your reality and that you are awake, but if it fails (i.e., your finger passes through your palm), then you are dreaming. It really is that simple; all that convincing of yourself that your are dreaming, when you know you are not, is utterly unnecessary during a RC.

I recommend to check out the yt-channel of "the rararabbit". He talks about his own experiences with mental health issues, hearing voices and ld.