foolproof Instant WILD anytime ...

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Originally Posted by Happiness is a Warm Gun

Where in the world is it illegal to walk your dog, or speak to members of the opposite sex? Are these practices outlawed for public safety like the use of the drugs we're discussing, or due to social/cultural conventions?

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Please... public safety? When was the last time someone on salvia killed someone? The laws have nothing to do with public safety (ask alcohol if you don't believe me) and drugs ARE illegal due to social/cultural conventions. Way back when Europeans came to the New World Indians were looked down upon as savages. Europeans, especially Catholics, condemned the herbs and spices Indians used in their rituals as witchcraft and "communicating with demons." That's where the stereotype of "psychedelics are bad" originated. Besides, why should even dangerous drugs be outlawed? The way I see it if someone is stupid enough to try heroin and then get addicted then good riddance they made their choice already.

I agree that salvia definitely does not create a lucid state, but I think if everyone tried salvia responsibly only once it would humble them greatly. Also the use of salvia is what got me interested in the consciousness of the mind and eventually LDing.

No Salvia is nothing to be messed with.

Some people love it, some people hate it. Any one who's crazy enough to try it, stay away from. haha jk but srsly.. Don't mess with it, it's not worth it.

Salvia should only be used for self-medication, never for recreation.






There is this one thing though. It's called dimethyltryptamine.

http://www.erowid.org/chemicals/dmt/dmt.shtml

It's this chemical naturally produced in a few different plants/grasses. It's also naturally produced in your brain. It's supposidely the chemical responsible for visuals inside dreams.

So this drug can be ingested, smoked, and or even injected.

It's highly illegal and most people will never get a chance to see it in their life. It takes a chemist to produce, and it's got more profund effects than LSD.

Basically, you dream when you are concious. People have described it as reality ripping into a new universe. Or, neotic lightening.

It's just something fun to imagine. I've been offered the chance to buy it, never had the balls though. It's a drug described as,"If you can buy it, your ready." Not everyone can get it, but when you can, that supposidely means your ready for it, that's how hard it is to get.

What the fuck ever happened to marijuana? Innocuous, harmless, good ol' marijuana?

...No, but seriously. All I see in this thread is a bunch of whiny bitches sniping back and forth at each other shamelessly (I'm referring to both parties here - the advocates and the opposers). It's really quite appalling.

Frankly, I couldn't give two shits about whether anyone here does any sort of drug...nor whether anyone here is gay, communist, or listens to Emo music, for that matter. The reason for that is that if people want to, for the sake of what they call "fun", pump their bodies full of excess chemicals that the human body really doesn't need, it's their own business. Besides, no one's forcing us to do it so why bother getting upset about it?

HOWEVER, I do feel a need to reprimand the advocates of this drug for doing just that - advocating it. I'm not saying that it's a bad drug - although I'm certainly not saying that it's a good drug (what drug really IS good?). Regardless of how harmless you allege this drug really is, the fact remains that it is still illegal in a great number of places...and for ANYONE to suggest to others that they do something - ANYTHING - illegal is a pretty fucking stupid thing to do. Hell, it's stupid enough proclaiming openly on a public forum that you use the drug, especially when any random law enforcement officer can track down your IP address and bust into your home with a search warrant.

This thread should really be nuked; neither side has won and both have lost. Any additional comments defending or attacking the use of this drug will prove beyond the shadow of a doubt that anarchical, stubborn idiocy has prevailed over the civilized manners that our parents have so forcefully tried to beat into our heads.

But you wanna know how I feel about it, honestly? (Actually, it doesn't matter whether or not you want to know, because I'm telling you anyway.) In my humble opinion, anything that I don't have the strength to do without the help of a drug - of any sort - isn't worth doing at all. (Human beings who can actually help themselves...a fascinating, although far-fetched, concept!)

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Originally Posted by Lëzen

I do feel a need to reprimand the advocates of this drug for doing just that - advocating it. I'm not saying that it's a bad drug - although I'm certainly not saying that it's a good drug (what drug really IS good?). Regardless of how harmless you allege this drug really is, the fact remains that it is still illegal in a great number of places...and for ANYONE to suggest to others that they do something - ANYTHING - illegal is a pretty fucking stupid thing to do. Hell, it's stupid enough proclaiming openly on a public forum that you use the drug, especially when any random law enforcement officer can track down your IP address and bust into your home with a search warrant.

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Nobody is going to track your IP because you say you do illegal drugs. They have bigger fish to fry than some kids online talking about whatever they do.

Do you know how much time, effort and money its takes to gather IP info and a search warrent? They would if they thought you were pushing some serious dope...but not just because you say you do illegal drugs. Trust me....we don't even register on their radar.

On another note people should be able to do whatever they want to do...illegal or not. I don't agree with some govt. laws, so I don't follow them.

I do plenty of psychedelics and they have given me many profound beneficial insights. I am a much more peaceful and calm person because of them. I realize much of the human drama we voluntary put ourselves through is pointless and avoidable.

Psychedelics won't benefit everyone, but if it helps you out.....do it. Don't follow blindly because you've been brainwashed to obey authority. Life is much bigger, sacred and important than to have a group of people tell you that you can't do something when they don't even understand it.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Lëzen

What the fuck ever happened to marijuana? Innocuous, harmless, good ol' marijuana?

...No, but seriously. All I see in this thread is a bunch of whiny bitches sniping back and forth at each other shamelessly (I'm referring to both parties here - the advocates and the opposers). It's really quite appalling.

Frankly, I couldn't give two shits about whether anyone here does any sort of drug...nor whether anyone here is gay, communist, or listens to Emo music, for that matter. The reason for that is that if people want to, for the sake of what they call "fun", pump their bodies full of excess chemicals that the human body really doesn't need, it's their own business. Besides, no one's forcing us to do it so why bother getting upset about it?

HOWEVER, I do feel a need to reprimand the advocates of this drug for doing just that - advocating it. I'm not saying that it's a bad drug - although I'm certainly not saying that it's a good drug (what drug really IS good?). Regardless of how harmless you allege this drug really is, the fact remains that it is still illegal in a great number of places...and for ANYONE to suggest to others that they do something - ANYTHING - illegal is a pretty fucking stupid thing to do. Hell, it's stupid enough proclaiming openly on a public forum that you use the drug, especially when any random law enforcement officer can track down your IP address and bust into your home with a search warrant.

This thread should really be nuked; neither side has won and both have lost. Any additional comments defending or attacking the use of this drug will prove beyond the shadow of a doubt that anarchical, stubborn idiocy has prevailed over the civilized manners that our parents have so forcefully tried to beat into our heads.

But you wanna know how I feel about it, honestly? (Actually, it doesn't matter whether or not you want to know, because I'm telling you anyway.) In my humble opinion, anything that I don't have the strength to do without the help of a drug - of any sort - isn't worth doing at all. (Human beings who can actually help themselves...a fascinating, although far-fetched, concept!)

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Thats the most hypocritical post i've ever read.

What you just said in a nutshell:
Marijuana is great! But don't advocate illegal drugs!
Condoning or condemning salvia is stupid! But I condemn it!

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Originally Posted by Lëzen

Frankly, I couldn't give two shits about whether anyone here does any sort of drug...nor whether anyone here is gay, communist, or listens to Emo music, for that matter. The reason for that is that if people want to, for the sake of what they call "fun", pump their bodies full of excess chemicals that the human body really doesn't need, it's their own business. Besides, no one's forcing us to do it so why bother getting upset about it?

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I think it's more of a frustration rather than being upset. (That's a lie, it's both really.) I mean, what are you really getting out of it? And not that "enlightenment" crap, because that's just what is, crap, because there are other ways to get said state of mind, contrary to popular belief. And why do you do it anyway?? Is there really a point? Is that the only thing that'll make you happy? And what made you start? Because the only thing I can think of is peer pressure or you just stumbled upon it.

Those questions are really my only complaints when drugs are brought up.

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Originally Posted by Snowy Egypt

I think it's more of a frustration rather than being upset. (That's a lie, it's both really.) I mean, what are you really getting out of it? And not that "enlightenment" crap, because that's just what is, crap, because there are other ways to get said state of mind, contrary to popular belief. And why do you do it anyway?? Is there really a point? Is that the only thing that'll make you happy? And what made you start? Because the only thing I can think of is peer pressure or you just stumbled upon it.

Those questions are really my only complaints when drugs are brought up.

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Two words. Hate Ers. You have the age old disease called Haterism.

This disease causes you to have no curiosity and to hate everyone else who is enjoying life.

Those without the disease are free to get loads of pussy and experiment with drugs.

Don't worry though, there is a cure! You just have to tell the players and drug users that you hate how you feel in person and they will put you out of your misery!

http://s91.photobucket.com/albums/k2.../th_haters.jpg

http://smg.photobucket.com/albums/v5.../th_haters.jpg

http://www.freewebs.com/kazc/haters.jpg

Well that was mature.

I calm down and decide to talk my mind, and you call me a hater. Wow.

Who are you to say I'm not enjoying life? This might be a huge shock to you, but there are millions of people who are enjoying it without drugs. I'm one of them. I know that's hard for you to understand, you know, what with you calling me a Hater and all just because I haven't done drugs before.

To everyone else who's posted here; I honestly would really like my questions answered. It would help me in the long run understand where you're all coming from, because I really don't get why people do drugs, and would shed some light on somethings, because all I hear in the US is, "My friends were doing it, so I tried it."

You don't need drugs to be happy, plenty of cool people don't do drugs.

But when you hate people that do use drugs, you are incapable of true happiness. The same goes for sex, music, etc.

For example, I don't like country music, I like to have frequent casual sex with random hot girls, and I like to occasionally smoke marijuana.

But I am still good friends with people who love country, are virgins, and never use drugs.

Haters are the opposite. If they hate certain rap music, they hate anyone who listens to it. If they hardly ever get laid or are pussy whipped, they hate anyone who gets lots of action and is not whipped. If they don't like drugs, they hate anyone who uses them.

Its the way of the world, everyone is either a pussy, dick, or asshole.

Then I'm not a hater. I can hate some rap all I want, but I'm still great friends with a lot of my friends. The same with my friends who do drugs. I can think of one in particular. I haven't seen him in a while because he got expelled for smoking on school grounds, but I would never hate him for it or let go of our friendship.

Aside from that, I don't think I ever said I hated any of you. I just honestly wonder what would make someone start drugs. I just don't get it. I think the only reason I'll stop liking a person is if they tell me I'm missing out on the experience, which is why I blew up at SKA, or if they say some benefit will come out of it, which is why I posted in here to begin with.

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Originally Posted by Snowy Egypt

Then I'm not a hater. I can hate some rap all I want, but I'm still great friends with a lot of my friends. The same with my friends who do drugs. I can think of one in particular. I haven't seen him in a while because he got expelled for smoking on school grounds, but I would never hate him for it or let go of our friendship.

Aside from that, I don't think I ever said I hated any of you. I just honestly wonder what would make someone start drugs. I just don't get it. I think the only reason I'll stop liking a person is if they tell me I'm missing out on the experience, which is why I blew up at SKA, or if they say some benefit will come out of it, which is why I posted in here to begin with.

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Then for future reference when you ask people why they do something, try not to insult them before you get an answer.

First mistake; you said it frustrates and upsets you (borderline hating),

Second; you discredited using drugs for spiritual purposes, because there are other ways. When you are an overworked american you don't have time to meditate all day, so a shortcut may come in handy.

Third; instead of questions you said complaints, which of course makes it sound like you are complaining.


I will give my honest answers.

Why I've tried different drugs: Curiosity, to break the monotony, and to gain insight. As soon as I heard about hallucinogens when I was 12 years old I was fascinated and started relentlessly hunting them down and was tripping on a regular basis by the time I was 13.

What I have gotten out if it: Unbelievable amounts of introspection. The ability to see things from countless perspectives. A better understanding of psychology. Humility and gratefulness. Compassion and empathy. Will power and patience. Spiritual insight. Much more.

Is it the only thing that makes me happy?: No, I don't even use drugs anymore other than the occasional hit of weed. I learned what I needed and now I am focused on my career and lucid dreaming.

I was never peer pressured and I did not stumble onto anything. I intentionally sought out hallucinogens because my mind has a veracious appetite for adventure.

Lucid4sho

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Thats the most hypocritical post i've ever read.

What you just said in a nutshell:
Marijuana is great! But don't advocate illegal drugs!
Condoning or condemning salvia is stupid! But I condemn it!

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HAHA I was thinking the exact same thing as I read his post. You put it perfectly.

Snowy Egypt you seem to be being pretty reasonable, I never remember names of peoples unless I see their posts very often so I can't remember anything you said beyond this page lol.

But you seem to want to know why people do drugs but then when people say enlightenment you say that's bullshit.
If people used drugs due to peer pressure they wouldn't say they did it for enlightenment they would say they did it for fun.

Think about it. Enlightenment in its fullest in the fastest way without drugs (Zen I believe) can take up to 30 years. Longer, it all depends on the person.
If you use certain Hallucinogens it can probably be done within two years.
But you would still have to put all your time and effort into it.

You seem to misunderstand enlightenment. It is not to be happy. It is to have an unstuck mind. You can't explain it in one simple analogy your metaphor. But that's a major part of it, you don't let your thoughts control you. You'll laugh at that sentence if you ever get enlightened lol.

I suppose drugs are really the only way also in this western world unless you are lucky enough to find a person who speaks English in whichever foreign place you choose to find a teacher.

On the millions of people are enjoying life without drugs thing. That is true. Hence the saying ignorance is bliss. If you've never seen a cloud you're not going to miss seeing them.
Honestly I think anyone who has never touched a drug is at least a little less (can't think of the word.... intelligent kind of) than everyone who has used them responsibly and not just to get fucked up.
But of course there are people who basically have the same thought pattern as someone on drugs and therefore they don't need to take them lol. When I say drugs in this post I'm not talking about like speed and things that can't give you any sought of insight into yourself at all.

Even smoking weed a few times in the right setting gives you an ENTIRELY new outlook on life, or view of life.

Basically drugs can help open your mind to what can be possible, they help you think of new ideas that you can't even fathom with the restrictions set on you since you were a child.

Also if you believe that any state you can reach on drugs you can reach without drugs, I'd like to see you reach the peak of an ecstasy trip without ecstasy. Or meditate till' you hallucinate as intensely as an acid trip. Then take acid and ecstasy and compare. It won't even come close.

My dad always used the argument about any state you can reach on drugs you can reach without drugs, then we were talking about DBS (Deep Brain Stimulation) and he said see it's possible. All I could think was, so you'd rather have someone open your skull, stick a probe in and fire electricity into your temporal lobe than eat a 5mm piece of paper?
That simple fact is proof that it is all propaganda by the government forcing you to believe they are a bad way to achieve states of mind.
Do you have any idea what you have to do to reach states even slightly comparable to these with non drug meditation? Deprive yourself of sleep, food, sex, light, et al.

Most ancient type meditations is built on Mushrooms and DMT anyway. Shamans use the Ayahuasca brew which contains DMT.

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Originally Posted by Tweek

Some people love it, some people hate it.

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I think that's about all that needs to be said really.

If you study up on it (through the various links so generously provided here) and it seems like something you'd like to try, then go ahead.

If you don't like the idea of using a drug, then don't, but don't hate the people in the first group.


I tried Salvia once, several months ago. I remember getting a lot of the effects I read about (sinking feeling, becoming one with the chair/couch you're sitting on), but I had a bad feeling. I think it was my friends saying something that kind of freaked me out, and I forced it to stop. The "visions" or whatever only lasted mere seconds, but stopping before it could "play out" made me kind of nauseous with a slight headache. Both ended less than an hour later.

Also, for those that decide to give this a go, DO NOT touch the salvia with your hands. There are oils on your skin that screw with it, and increase the chances of a "bad trip". I still think my friend handling contributed to my bad experience.

Hm got a study or anything showing that? Never heard it before. How are you supposed to load the bowl and whatnot? plastic gloves?

I have never heard that before as well... everytime i have done it i touched the salvia with my hands and it still works very well...

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