What type of LD-er are you? CLASSIFICATIONS

The natural
http://feminocracy.files.wordpress.c.../genetics1.jpg

Some of these folks have LD-s every day, usually many times per night, some have them less frequently, the point is that no induction techniques are used and the lucids just "occur". Usually have these abilities from a very young age. They can't turn it off so some view it negatively, while others embrace it.


The accomplished dreamer
http://www.mycatholictradition.com/i...aohs-dream.jpg
these, through great effort can maintain a good amount of LD-s, as much as several per week or even more, by using induction methods


low ability dreamer
http://www.cctv.com/program/culturee...65817290_r.jpg

these unfortunately, even with great effort cannot achieve many LD's. At best they can hope for several per year or month.
low ability dreamers can become accomplished dreamers and the other way round

beginner

http://www.happynews.com/living/livi...-gardening.jpg

You have just discovered lucid dreaming and your ways are not yet set


EDIT: updated definition for "natural"

Well put together man.

I gotta be the low-level one.:P

I think most people fluxuate between the "Accomplished Dreamer" and the "Low Ability Dreamer." Right now, I'm feeling accomplished, but last week I was convinced I was low ability. Ask me again in two days :lol:

No offense, but I have to disagree with these descriptions/generalizations.

For example, based on your classifications, I don't fit into any of your categories. Though I AM a natural LDer, I certainly don't have LDs every night. Sometimes I even have dry spells lasting a few weeks or more.

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Originally Posted by Aquanina

No offense, but I have to disagree with these descriptions/generalizations.

For example, based on your classifications, I don't fit into any of your categories. Though I AM a natural LDer, I certainly don't have LDs every night. Sometimes I even have dry spells lasting a few weeks or more.

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Very good point, I never thought of that.

I was also thinking, someone who isn't a natural can still end up having more LDs per week than a natural.

But it still let's you get the gist of the "classes"

only a beginner, I hope i can be a natural

Just a beginner, hoping to eventually attain natural or at least accomplished status. Gonna be a while, though.

Over-generalizations :\
Not everyone falls dead into these catagories. Like 'nina said, we can't be cut-and dried like this. Everyone's different.

I'd say that I'm in none of those categories. I'd say that I'm an intermediate LD, though I am lately getting many, they are only mediocre, but I do have good control, not great control, they last a mediocre amount of time.

Im a beginner.

It might be fun to add some more categories, and make it into an online quiz. :D

I am in the middle of low and accomplished

I am a bit out of practice but am still having at least 1 a week if not more. I need to get back up to my high of 6-8 a week.

God i imss when i was like that in july

I'm the beginner

im a low ability dreamer but i feel like im on the verge of being an accomplished dreamer

I don't know where to put myself xD I have a set method (MILD with occasional differances) and I have 2 LD's a week recently...

beginner / accomplished? lol

http://www.proprofs.com/quiz-school/...reamer-are-you

made a quick quiz

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Originally Posted by Banana

http://www.proprofs.com/quiz-school/...reamer-are-you

made a quick quiz

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Loving the terrible grammar and spelling, Banana :P

inorite?

somewhere between acomplished and begginer

I guess I am low ability dreamer. I can have weeks where I naturally fall asleep into a lucid dream each day. I can have weeks where I get no lucid dreams at all. My dreams are amazing. Its just activating the "lucid element" that is my trouble.

Racist! Asians can't LD, heh?

:P, just kidding. I guess I'd probably fall under low-level.

I am somewhere between the accomplished, and the natural.

I can not remember back to when I did NOT have lucidity in dreams.I had a very hard time know what was "real" and what was a "dream" which caused no end of confusion, misery and then anger in my early years. I had another life when ...the sun set, and I was in bed, I was transported to another place and when;no less "real" than the other life.

Which is why my latest bout of dream difficulty hits so hard. This life has me to the point I can go to the world I go to in dreams...UG. Pisses me off, and I miss and need the energy I gain there. Oh, well.

Morrigan

I think I fall into 'The accomplished dreamer'

I have been practising lucid dreaming for around 6 months or so. I think I have made good progress :)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Aquanina

No offense, but I have to disagree with these descriptions/generalizations.

For example, based on your classifications, I don't fit into any of your categories. Though I AM a natural LDer, I certainly don't have LDs every night. Sometimes I even have dry spells lasting a few weeks or more.

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thanks for the advice- I updated the definition.


There seems to be a lot of controversy surrounding the accomplished/low ability dreamers and who is what. Indeed, both are extremes and the DV populus is usually in between, each member transient and not holding any truly defined status. I could have split the definitions up into more like accomplished/expert/medium/beginner/etc however that would still be imperfect since the skill depends on a function of LD's per week

http://img114.imageshack.us/img114/4726/ldgraph.jpg

rather than doing that I just chose the 2 extremes.
especially since no DV member, say has a static 2 LD's per week every week no more and no less.

make me a natural...

somewhere in between beginner and accomplished dreamer.

It also doesn't take into account the quality of the dreams. That, I think, plays an important role. I know a few naturals who wake up the millisecond they become lucid. I know people who can work very hard, get maybe 4 lucids a year, but they seem to last at least half an hour and they accomplish tons of dream goals.

I dunno, I disagree strongly with this post, especially the "HERE IS THE WAY IT IS" presentation. I'm not really all for these classifications, especially because there ARE no set definitions or categories, and I don't believe these should be them even if I wanted there to be.

I'm a beginner. I have been trying for 2 months and my recall is terrible, and I haven't had a single lucid yet. A lot of that has to do with my motivation lately.

:/

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Originally Posted by Shift

It also doesn't take into account the quality of the dreams. That, I think, plays an important role. I know a few naturals who wake up the millisecond they become lucid. I know people who can work very hard, get maybe 4 lucids a year, but they seem to last at least half an hour and they accomplish tons of dream goals.

I dunno, I disagree strongly with this post, especially the "HERE IS THE WAY IT IS" presentation. I'm not really all for these classifications, especially because there ARE no set definitions or categories, and I don't believe these should be them even if I wanted there to be.

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I completely agree.

I don't really think that most people can be categorized like this.


But I'd say I'm the one with the plant. ^_^

Accomplished dreamer, although there should still be more categories. :D


The quiz put me at Natural though. :P

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Originally Posted by Ethereal

Racist! Asians can't LD, heh?

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yeah... so girls reading books in tibetan are inexperienced?

low level, unfortunately...
I'm kind of jealous of all the naturals out there...

I'm a natural :cooler:

Can't see the problem with attempting to define a "natural" lucid dreamer.
The range of definitions I've seen used in DV is fairly broad.

I suspect the problem is that many LDers like to describe themselves as "natural" for the Kudos. So of course they're going to grumble when they find out that, actually, they're maybe not the messiah of Lucid dreaming.

I'd describe myself as accomplished.

I've given the inductions a miss for the last couple of months.
I've also only been recording only my most interesting dreams.
But I do maintain a good dream awareness and still spend a few minutes remembering them each morning when I wake up.
As a result, with little effort, I'm still managing at least 1 spontaneous lucid a week.

Some people might be inclined to label themselves a natural based on the above. Not me thought!

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t also doesn't take into account the quality of the dreams. That, I think, plays an important role. I know a few naturals who wake up the millisecond they become lucid. I know people who can work very hard, get maybe 4 lucids a year, but they seem to last at least half an hour and they accomplish tons of dream goals.

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yeah you could have 999 different categories- I've tried narrowing it down to the extremes. Personally I don't consider a dream were you wake up the instant you become lucid an actual LD. (other people's opinions may varry- I just have numerous FA's where I'm writing down my dream in my DJ and suddenly I'm like "aww nuts this is a dream" and wake up)

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I dunno, I disagree strongly with this post, especially the "HERE IS THE WAY IT IS" presentation.

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HERE IS THE WAY IT IS :)

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I'm not really all for these classifications, especially because there ARE no set definitions or categories, and I don't believe these should be them even if I wanted there to be.

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for lucid dreaming to progress it should be scrutinized and classified.

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especially because there ARE no set definitions or categories,

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now this really stung. is there supposed to be someone on top of a hill who says "these are the definitions" or indeed should laberge come and give the definitions? The beauty of Dreamviews is that everyone can participate in defining what exactly lucid dreamers are

I heard about Lucid Dreaming 2 years ago, and I 've had at about 15 LDs so far, but considering the fact that i started writing my DJ just today i would say I am a NOOB, a beginner. :boogie:

Well your thread never said "Guys, how do you think we ought to classify LDs?" it just sort of said "Here I've come up with the classification system." and to have been presented as a definitive explanation of the 'classes' of lucid dreams, I think it was an incredibly oversimplified and narrow range that was discussed.

The only reason I'd prefer that someone like Laberge do it is because I have the feeling they'd be very objective and systematic about it, taking the myriad of factors into account and considering every possible aspect of a lucid dream, versus people who haven't dedicated their entire life to lucid dreaming (not just your recreation and sleep time, but also your academic, professional, and personal life and career) and probably couldn't even think up half the factors that could be playing a role.

I mean you could define them by length, memory, vividness, number of senses, reason for induction, complexity of the dream environment, need to stabilize, emotions experienced, attitude toward your lucidity, varying degrees of sensory perception (ie if you can see, how many colors CAN you see), first or third person, reality checks needed to establish you are dreaming, prevalence of uncontrollable dream urges/desires, level of logic in the dream environment, number/types/behaviors/whatever of dream characters present, god it just goes on and on and I've only spent about three minutes typing this.

The problem I have with this thread, besides the narrow scope of factors considered, is the fact that these qualities are transient. They don't remain constant, they can only be applied to a specific dream or a certain time span of a lucid dreamer or oneironaut's dreaming, and it could change with the slightest change. Stress, motivation, dedication, practice during the day, general dream memory, amount of sleep, foods consumed, medication, exhaustion level, etc. So to just have a short list of "Here's How It Is" is, IMO, so drastically oversimplifying that it has gone to the point of irrelevance.

And, as usual, the whole 'what is a natural dreamer' debate. Like I said, these things vary by the person using the term and so if dreamviews (hardly the authority on lucid dreaming, just a large community of people wanting to learn to do it from a few very basic resources) wants to establish 'official dreamviews LDer categories', then I think it should involve a lot of deliberation and consideration between the staff and community members. As I would in any other circumstance, I'm not going to just agree with something that someone made up simply because they went ahead and did something that I strongly disagree with it.

What we absolutely shouldn't do is let people with a desire to classify themselves as "naturals" classify what a natural is. :)

Don't think its that big an issue really.
The LD community has a rigerous obsession with classing MILDS, DILDS, FILDS, WILDS, if it moves we, as a community, manage to classify it.
It serves a useful purpose.

Not sure why the term "Naturals" should be considered so special.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Morrigan

I am somewhere between the accomplished, and the natural.

I can not remember back to when I did NOT have lucidity in dreams.I had a very hard time know what was "real" and what was a "dream" which caused no end of confusion, misery and then anger in my early years. I had another life when ...the sun set, and I was in bed, I was transported to another place and when;no less "real" than the other life.

Which is why my latest bout of dream difficulty hits so hard. This life has me to the point I can go to the world I go to in dreams...UG. Pisses me off, and I miss and need the energy I gain there. Oh, well.

Morrigan

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Your view on dream traveling matches my view of it sooooo well! For the longest time I thought I was the only one who believed that! You'll get those dreams back! Just hang in there! :D

I guess I'd have to describe myself as an 'accomplished' lucid dreamer... although I don't see the point in applying labels to ourselves. I had to work quite hard for my first LD, but it was worth it and now I can WILD practically every night with a few DILD's tossed in for good measure! :boogie: :boogie: :boogie:

Low ability dreamer... I guess haha

I can now say I am an accomplished dreamer. With some helpful guides and previous lucid experience, its no longer hard to attain lucidity. So far out of my 5 attempts 4 of them were successful this week.

Well, i think i was in all of these categories at a point of my life.

I was a natural LDer ocasionally while i was a child. Rare times, countable through the fingers of an hand, but i had some natural LDs.

I was a beginner when i discovered this website for the first time and found that they were inducible. Then i practised really hard and i became an accomplished LDer. I didn't pass throught he low level at that time.

Now i got a lot to do in university so i'm more into studying. So, i would say that at moment i am a Low level LDer as i'm not much focused anymore but, eventually, i'll try to regain my skills.

I think just 4 categories are too narrow to fit all of the possibilities that there are.

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Originally Posted by Junknown

I think just 4 categories are too narrow to fit all of the possibilities that there are.

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please read the entire thread. these are the "extremes", people usually are somewhere in between

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Originally Posted by yuriythebest

please read the entire thread. these are the "extremes", people usually are somewhere in between

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It wouldn't take much effort to add a few more general categories:

Beginner - Occasional LD, one or twice a month
Novice - Has LDs 2 to 3 times a every month, better control over them
Dreamer - Has LDs once a week, has average control
Advance Dreamer - Has 1 to 3 LDs a week, better control on dreams
Expert - Has 3 or more dreams a week, can control nearly every aspect of a dream decently, can enter dreams in a variety of ways


Seems a little better.

Or just none at all. Seems infinitely better.

Beginer.

Lowest of the low of course :D

Low level i'd say. I Just came back here after like 1 and a half year, so hopefully i'll get some more experience soon.

To all the people saying "I hope to accomplish natural"..You cant accomplish "natural" your either a natural at it, or you train yourself to do it & so your accomplished :P

Natural :D
(H)

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Originally Posted by RachLIVE

To all the people saying "I hope to accomplish natural"..You cant accomplish "natural" your either a natural at it, or you train yourself to do it & so your accomplished :P

Natural :D
(H)

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Dunno. Wouldn't a person be able to train yourself into this so much that he would have natural LDs without induction techniques later on?

I used to write my dreams on diary and before that i didn't remember any at all. Did this for a few months. Due to study i had to stop writing them a bit because i had exams but, for some reason, i still remembered them with high detail. This lasted a month during which i kept remembering full dreams. Now i had the exam and decided to write them down again as i want to try induction techniques. Although i remembered the dreams well i didn't have any spontaneous LD during that month.

Any toughts on this theory?

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Dunno. Wouldn't a person be able to train yourself into this so much that he would have natural LDs without induction techniques later on?

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I suppose, these classifications are too subjective lol.
I still see natural to be natural ability - like when you can do something really well without practicing. & someone who is really good but practiced & trained first may be very good but still not naturally good, they worked for it.

But then I suppose you can have natural talent which you can train to become better & make your skills more autonomous..

Lol I dunno

somewhere between beginner and low-level. I am only just getting used to the RCs and stuff, and i have LDs in bursts like 3 a week and then none for a LONG time. I remain confident that eventually i will become high level.

on a side note, i actually am glad that i am not a natural (no offence to anybody). I just feel that I would get more enjoyment from it than someone who has been doing it his/her whole life.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by RachLIVE

To all the people saying "I hope to accomplish natural"..You cant accomplish "natural" your either a natural at it, or you train yourself to do it & so your accomplished :P

Natural :D
(H)

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I guess that makes "naturals" really very special then.:roll:

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Originally Posted by moonshine

What we absolutely shouldn't do is let people with a desire to classify themselves as "naturals" classify what a natural is. :)

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Originally Posted by Banana

http://www.proprofs.com/quiz-school/...reamer-are-you

made a quick quiz

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That quiz says i'm a natural. I havn't kept a dream journal or practiced reality checks since school started. I don't get lucids that often though, but when I do I just know that i'm dreaming.