Curious about use of Alcohol and Drugs

Let me elaborate on my experiances with hydrocodone. I have had a few dreams on it but really only two that I can remeber being really strange. the first on it was short and sweet (they usually are for me), I felt someone or something violently tugging at my skin. I said something that I couldnt understand in a real deep gutteral language, then I growled and nashed at it. This woke me up. The second one that was strange was i imagined a horde HUGE spiders crawling through my window, and on top of me. This freaked me out and made me launch out of my bed and onto the floor a good three or four feet away. Then I woke up. Pretty vivid if you ask me. :)

I'd be afraid to ever touch that stuff with my addictive personality.

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Originally posted by jill1978
I'd be afraid to ever touch that stuff with my addictive personality.

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I normally wouldnt but I have a perscription for it :D

I'm with Jill on this one. I have enough trouble putting the bottle down. I don't need another addiction!

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Originally posted by Seeker
I'm with Jill on this one. I have enough trouble putting the bottle down. I don't need another addiction!

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I know what you mean. I did get to the point where I couldnt sleep with out it

one must know the most serious addiction
to give up all desire forever

one must know absolute evil
to give absolute good

Im addicted to LDing lol, and to obtaining more and more knowledge, I have infinite hunger for knowledge, but this isnt a negative adiction i think...also ultimate evil..ultimate good
I dont know exactly what you try to say but what I think,

We are all good and evil, I rather refer as light and darkness, we all must accept our "dark" sides which is diffirent from our "evil" side, to be completely balanced one must even find peace with the dark side, for example a long time ago I made peace with my nightmares, I still have nightmares but Im not afraid anymore, fear is almost non existant, its the same like with being afraid of the dark, when darkness is accepted you wont see it as evil anymore, it wont even be negative energy anymore,
your darkside contains truth aswell

I dont know, mabey thats what about you meaned, but thats what i think

Wow, how could I miss such a lovely topic!

I've done my share of bad shit. unfortunately i dont know how it affected my dreams, since i wasnt really interested then.

Recently I wasnt able to get anything... I mean anything illegal. Moving

to USA I lost all my buddies and tripping mates.

But I could try some legal stuff like DXM and Salvia Divinorum.
I dont like DXM, but sally is good stuff.

Sally lengthened my dreams to the extreme (like 5 dreams joined together) and I became lucid at the end, or rather dream ended in false awakening cause i became lucid...


As for addictive drugs and recreational use - I'm strongly opposed to this.
It just gives drugs a Veeery bad name. Drugs are really good to shake old beliefs and enlighten your path, If you know how to use them.


Sorry, i have no idea how old this topic is, cause my time is displayed as e122Wednesday010602...

I honestly have to say that I have smoked weed everyday for the past 6 months, and through that 6 month period I don't remember ONE dream. Now I've heard of a couple of my friends say they have had lucid dreams, but I never really believed them.

Last night, I didn't smoke. I had one of the most insane LD's imaginable. I didn't even make myself do it either. I just fell into dream state and for some reason knew I was dreaming. I dreamt for over 5 hours.

I've done LSD, 2-ce, 2-c-t-7 (research drugs), shrooms, and other hallucinagens; and the entire time I was LDing the only thing I could think of is the entire time is how I felt like I was tripping on a hallucinagen. At first I thought that these dreams were triggered by hallucinagens, but after finding this site I've concluded that that is total BS.

I kind of went off on the hallucinagens, but my point in this post is if you want to LD, stay away from the weed.

Calea Zacatechichi (aka "dream herb") has been used for ages by the Chontal Indians of Oaxaca, Mexico to induce intense lucid dreaming.

DRUGS ARE BAD!!!!! YOU ARE BAD IF YOU DO DRUGS!!! YOU ARE ALL BAD, NO MATTER WHAT, AS LONG AS YOU ABUSE IT(that includes smoking anything illegal or abusing over the counter, etc.)

i also think that it would give you MUCH crapier LDs.

Hmmmm....dr0ogs you say?

Alcohol = potential for increased dream imagery in my case, but only in limited amounts. If I drink over 4 beers my dreams will be crap.
Weed = not much of a change, diminished if any.
The mixture of them both gives me wicked false awakenings, providing I got super drunk before sleeping. The false awakening happens usually when my body's Dehydration alarm starts going off. Not worth it really.

I use kava and melatonin regularly ever since I had the single most incredible LD of my life after using a combo of the two, mixed with B6 and valerian. I was doped to hell, but the dream came immediately, like walking into a movie, or being plugged into the matrix.

I used sleep aids at one point to stop sleep paralysis, and it gave me waking dreams pretty hard, but there were literally no dreams that I can remember. If so, they were weak and loosely defined.

Never had a chance to use the shrooms, one day hopefully. Sticking with kava for now.

When you're awake, and you use any drug that has an effect on your perceptions, you accept that things are, as such, not 'normal'. Your opinion may be that it's an improvement, or a benefit, or that it's fun for what it is, but you don't accept it as what your normal waking perceptions are, or ought, to be. So why would you accept that your dreaming perceptions are any more real or beneficial when they're altered by drugs? If you wouldn't normally consider drug conciousness an improved reality rather than an altered one, why consider drug dreams improved? Accept them for what they are. Different, and nothing more. No drug will improve dreaming any more or less than it will improve waking reality.

It won't. It will only temporarily alter it. I'm not saying that it can't be helpful, but you need to realize it's not the answer. It's just a different perspective. You won't conquer dreaming with drugs any more than you'll conquer waking life with them. They can be a useful learning aid to dreaming, but learn to do it on your own.

Don't let this give you the impression I'm anti-drug. I've done more acid than most of you will ever see, and until recently, smoked around an oz a week, as well as experimenting with a mind boggling variety of other things. But when I see people thinking they can use drugs to skip the hard work it takes to own your reality (awake or asleep) it makes me nuts. Like B.B. King says, it doesn't count when you're high.

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Originally posted by Torcher
Sticking with kava for now.

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I've read some about and it got me interested and at the same time skeptycal about it. Do the effects of helping you relax/fall asleep, and increased dream awareness really do work? What dosage do you need to get the effect (a bowl, a joint)? Also, do you know of a good site I could get some for experimenting? thanks... ;) kava + melatonin does sound like would be a good combo.

I got really drunk last night (had a party at my place so I didn't have to drive and junk). I also took a valium b/c I was having trouble sleeping after everone left. I passed the f$%@ out and I remember all my dreams vividly and had my 2nd real lucid dream and FLEW for the first time!!!!!!! I woke up too excited to have a hangover :) That's just my 2 cents....

I feel that Drugs are Illegal in the first place because they expand your consciousness and your awareness. Yes you can do it naturally, but its a huge shortcut. You have to realize that every single one of you creates your own reality. If you take a heavy drug and start flipping out, you have to take control and know everything will be ok! Yes drugs can Kill but who put that thought in your head in the first place? Anything can kill you...you can slip and crack ur head open..that can kill you. Or you can fart and die from the smell. :mrgreen:

I feel that the only reason people Die from drugs is simply this...

when you take these drugs..and you become connected with your higher being and higher conscioiusness...than there is always the chance that you are not ready to connect...and it causes a "System Overload." Think about it...your connecting to Energy...everything is energy..

Electricity is Energy and Light is Energy. If you "Plug Into" that outlet and your not ready to handle it....think about it system overload.
:shock:

I was using a legal psychoactive drug called dextromethorphan (DXM for short) for a few months, on a weekly basis. The night OF using it, I would not experience dreams, because it prevented me from reaching the REM phase. But the NEXT night I would begin to have such spectacular dreams I could hardly believe it. And then they started to become lucid. So I would always go to bed earlier the next night and sleep for 12 hours, and have some amazing lucid dreams, some of my best I've had. These wild dreams would last the rest of the week until I used it again.

Since then I quit using it, because I was worried that continual use could be harmful to my liver. But I still experience much more enhanced dreams, even now, and have lucid dreams every night now. When I DON'T have a lucid dream on a certain night, I am often surprised. So I do credit my slightly newfound abilities to taking that drug, but probably could have achieved it without the use of any drug.

Even though the results I listed of using DXM to achieve lucid dreams sound very positive, I don't recommend that anyone try it themselves (especially teenagers), unless you learn a great deal about it before hand. And even then, it's best to err on the side of caution.

I smoked weed for like 4 years straight withought going 2 days withought smoking. But recently i experimented to see if my dreams would be better withought. on the 3rd day of quitting i had a very vivid dream recall, i woke up right from the dream. Then I smoked weed last night, got really stoned. and i didnt remember shit this morning.

drugs and alcohol are very bad for you. it really isnt worth it for a dream.

hey blu (i think, or someone, can't remember) said somehting about peyote, the plant. i was a regular drug user of nearly all the drugs you said exept ketamine and probly another or two but anyways, back on subject. i just recently found peyote grass, its grown all over the world!! i found some that grew at a ravine by my house, im talking 600+ yards worth, but if you haven't done it yet, when you smoke it (and you gatta smoke alot) it taste like burning asshole, and that is a MAJOR UNDERSTATEMENT!! so i urge you to extract the dmt out of it, and smoke the extract, because if you take it orally, you will digest it and it will not do a thing, unless you are taking MAOI's

as for drugs while dreaming, i was a habitual pot smoker. but not anymore cuz my parents dont like it........ but ive noticed that as long as i smoke weed, i can never remember my dreams, and when i stop smoking, i always remember my dreams great! as for other drugs they don't really effect it as much, dxm and shrooms are incredible for dreaming, not sure about LD though...

I don't use drugs 8)

Honestly, I highly respect anyone who chooses not to use drugs. I used to despise drugs (because of the ads on TV and in magazines), and looked down on people who used them. But then I found out that there are lots of respectable, "normal" people out there who use drugs without any major consequences. The majority of drugs, though, I believe are harmful and worthless, and cause a lot of problems for people. But things specifically like psychedelics, seem to be much safer, anti-addictive, and serve an actual purpose, as opposed to things like meth, cocaine.

Anyway, once I had researched a lot about psychedelics from reliable scientific resources, I decided I would give it a try. But didn't want to do anything illegal, so I didn't try any illegal ones.

But all I want to say is, I encourage those of you here not to look down upon people who try or experiment with drugs, until you know more about the circumstances, because using drugs doesn't make you scum... and honestly not all drugs are scummy. I know that from experience (although I haven't tried much). Even though the media is very good at manipulating society with its ads and messages portraying drugs as dangerous and the users as lawless rebels and addicts, there is another point of view, one that actually reflects the average drug user. How effective would those ads be if they told the truth? "Some drugs are dangerous and addictive, and some people may suffer side effects or possibly die from overdosing, but then others that use them responibly will be fine. Don't do drugs." How well would that work?

Anyway, don't look at me as an advocate for drugs. I'm not. I just like to offer another view point.

Sigh. Time to shed some light. I'm gonna do something similar to what beta124 has done. Any repetition is to reiterate a point.

Let me give you some personal information, so I don't appear to be talking out of my ass. I'm a very occasional drinker, and alcohol has given me two of the most vivid lucid dreams of my life. I call that a fluke, because all it probably did was relax my body a lot. I don't enjoy booze very much, and I wouldn't recommend it as a tool for dreaming.

I'm a regular pot-smoker, though after about two weeks of smoking I'll generally take a break to "clear my system." I do it because it's enjoyable, safe, even healthy in some respects. That being said, I think going to sleep stoned will plummet you right down to non-REM delta sleep, and that's coming from a guy who enjoys smoking weed. I try not to smoke too early before bed if I want to remember any dreams.

The effect of psilocybin mushrooms may only last 6-8 hours directly, but the afterglow can persist for a few days. During that post-shroom period, you will be prone to very vivid dreams that can easily turn lucid, since the primary effect of shrooms is to blend the subconscious with waking perception. A shroom trip is basically dreaming whilst awake, and as such, the "residue" will do much of the same. Shrooms are some of the safest psychoactives you can take, physically or psychologically, but I wouldn't recommend them as solely a dream tool. A mushroom experience is better as a rare journey, and good dreams are merely one side effect.

LSD is a good deal more intense than magic mushrooms, and during the time following an acid trip it's difficult to fall asleep, mainly because you're still so excited by all the things that have just happened to you. LSD is a much more energetic drug, and would probably be detrimental to dream work. That being said, it is a rather rewarding and creatively stimulating experience, and is actually almost entirely harmless, despite the many myths about brain-bleeding and rat poison.

Opiates such as opium, heroin, oxycodone or other prescription painkillers of the same variety are famous for their dream-inducing abilities. I personally have never used any of the three mentioned above, although I have used lesser opiate painkillers such as codeine. All within the realm of prescription, mind you, as they're just not my bent when it comes to recreation. I simply noticed vivid dreams as a side effect.

Mescaline will make it impossible to sleep for a solid fourteen hours. This generally means that when the trip is over, you're a bit weary and will shoot into a deep sleep. A mescaline trip has many valuable features, but dreaming is not one of them.

Kanna is a legal drug in the United States, although I'm not sure about its legal status elsewhere. It is a hypnotic, and depending on how it's taken it will have different effects. Snorted or chewed, it is exciting and euphoric, and will not lend well to dreaming. Smoked, however, it's more dreamy, and will actually help in that respect.

Morning Glories, Hawaiian Woodrose, and other sources of LSA (lysergic amides) are generally more sedative than their cousin LSD (lysergic acid diethylamide) and therefore work much better for dream induction. If you experiment with any of these, however, be wary of your dose. Hawaiian woodrose seeds contain a small amount of cyanide which is harmless in quantities of 10 seeds or lower. However, I tried eating 20 seeds once, and woke the next morning with muscle pains in addition to my vivid dream memories. It is also possible to eat too many Morning Glories and Rivea Corymbosa, though if you observe a proper dose and don't try to be the first to hit a new peak, you should be completely fine.

MDMA (ecstasy) is a stimulant, so one wouldn't expect it to help with dreams. That isn't the case, however, at least not after the main effects have worn off. Ecstasy works by mass-producing serotonin in your brain, and as such, leaves you with very vivid dreams for a day or two following the experience. This may be different if you use Ecstasy to party and dance, and tire yourself out. Personally, I think Ecstasy as a party drug is a waste of a valuable therapeutic chemical.

* Note: beta124, your info about MDMA making "holes" in the brain is outdated. That presumption came from misread brain scans. Doctors mistook areas of high serotonin activity as deteriorated brain tissue, and their premature judgment has, of course, stuck in the public mind. That's not to say that MDMA is totally safe, but it has been proven to be much safer, even in high-dose, long-term use, than it was originally thought to be.

Salvia Divinorum is terribly intense and sometimes scary, and personally I find myself immensely stimulated after a brief Salvia trip. However, I've heard of it being used as a dream aid, though I expect that's only true of the Salvia leaf. Extracts and tinctures are the popular mode of ingestion for those psychonauts that usually choose to screw with it, and that's primarily how I've used it in the past. I can't give a definite yes or no on the usefulness of this particular chemical, though it is very safe to try, unless you have a heart condition.

Dextromethorphan, or DXM, is a disossciative that acts as a cough suppressant in low doses. That's right, this is what the kiddies are chugging Robitussin for. This would be more useful for astral projection than lucid dreaming, as by its very definition it separates the mind from the body. However, DXM is at least a few steps above PCP, another disossciative, one which was taken out of the mainstream and scheduled after it proved too unstable for human use. It was replaced with the much safer, healthier Ketamine. I have used DXM once, and PCP twice by accident. I have not used Ketamine, although that would be the safest and surest route. Though again, it would be better as an astral projection tool than one for dreaming. I personally wouldn't recommend any but Ketamine, as PCP and DXM both have overdose levels. Ketamine does as well, but it is used as a surgical anaesthetic, and a recreational Ketamine experience is achieved by using sub-anaesthetic doses. Unless you WAY overshoot your does, an OD on Ketamine will simply result in you anaesthetizing yourself. If anyone wanted to steal your kidneys, they'd be well advised to catch you in the middle of a high-dose Ketamine trip.

DMT, dimethyltryptamine, or 5-meO-DMT, an analogue, are both rather intense. After using them, you may feel creatively inclined and visualizations will come with ease (though during the trip itself you will be too overwhelmed to make anything of it). They may be helpful for dreams if you could get yourself to sleep after using them. I wouldn't recommend them, at least not for lucid dreaming.

Nicotine is, of course, a stimulant. While it sometimes helps to have a bit of caffeine or nicotine in your brain before you attempt a lucid dream (in order to keep your mind awake), too much will obviously keep you from falling alseep at all. I am not a smoker, so the few times I've smoked a cigarette, the nicotine stimulation was most likelystronger than it would be for a regular smoker. Some say they smoke cigarettes to calm down, although this is generally because their brains have become accustomed to nicotine.

Diphenhydramine is the active ingredient in Benadryl, and it is very similar to diphenhydrinate, the active ingredient in Dramamine. Both of these, if taken in excessive doses, can cause "waking dreams," but not in the same vein as shrooms. These dreams are indistinguishable from reality, and are often terribly scary for that reason. I have only used diphenhydramine to "trip" once. It was impossible to sleep, despite the trademark drowsiness of Benadryl, because every time I shut my eyes my eyeballs would flitter around as if in the middle of REM. It was very distracting, and I ended up waiting out a light-dose Benadryl trip (200mg) that I had decided to try as, guess what, a dream aid. In addition to the health risks involved in taking Benadryl excessively, I would advise against it simply because it doesn't help you dream. Though it will clear your allergies up nicely.

Phew.

Now then, let's think about this again. Calea Zacatechichi, Valerian, Melatonin, B-6.... all are recommended for inducing dreams. These are all DRUGS. Advil is a DRUG. Coffee in the morning is a DRUG. Chamomile tea is a DRUG. Any substance that has any psychoactive effect is a DRUG.

To say that all drugs are bad and bad for you is a rather uneducated statement. In fact, some drugs that are illegal here in the United States are perfectly legal elsewhere. Illegality is often not decided in the best interest of public safety, but rather by popular opinion. For example, marijuana and LSD are classified as Schedule I in the United States, whereas cocaine is only Schedule II. In addition, alcohol is abhorred in Muslim cultures. Like beta124 has said, www.erowid.org is a terrific source for impartial information, should you care to learn any more.

Please know that if you choose to make broad generalizations about drugs, or to condemn a drug user for using drugs of any kind, you should immediately stop drinking caffeine, eating chocolate (theobromine is psychoactive), drinking chamomile or green tea, taking medicine of any kind, and using melatonin. If you have done any of these things at any time in your life, congratulations, you are or were at one time a drug user.

(I'm looking at you, dreamer3.)

Some drugs have great value, some simply do not, and some have a little of both. It is a complicated issue, much more complicated than DARE or Freevibe would have you believe. If you don't mind transcending some social stigmas and actually educating yourself and trying them on your own, you may find some benefit. That is, provided you choose the right drug and the right dose.

I have spent WAY too much energy on this. If anyone still wants to say all drug users are bad and pot is a straight gateway to crack, go ahead and deprive yourself of an expanded life experience. I did my best to educate, anyway.

Time for my disclaimer again.

Disclaimer. The management of Dream Views does not condone the use of any chemical or herbal substance for the induction of lucid dreams and is not responsible for any injury that might result from the use of any substance discussed on this forum.