so what do you beleive?
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so what do you beleive?
Hallelujah brother, your prayers have been answered! It was/is a hoax.
Poe's law is definately in effect though.
the picture was bltantly sarcastic u fool
Imran
dont goad him
It's so true :)
But really, that site might have been exaggerated, but there are people that think like that. Some rednecks are really thinking about building a 'fake hell', with actual sulfur-smell, to scare kids so they aren't going to sin and end up in 'hell'. Poor kids, they already are : /
I feel the same way
I believe that cereal shouldn't be restricted to just breakfast.
Perhaps, but does it matter? 99.9999% of everything I've ever said on the internets (and a factor very close to that IRL) has been sarcastic. Maybe I should be blunter next time.
Fuck those immoral atheist pigs!
There, how's that?
Don't even waste your time asking. For one, He's never going to give you a straight up answer and number 2 he doesn't know himself what to believe in.
The Major hole in his point is just that. A Christian doesn't believe that 1 is all 3 nor do they believe that all 3 are all 1 in the same. Let me put it this way. The Almighty God Jehovah, Jesus Christ and the Holy Spirit are all 3 separate entities. Anytime I pray I pray to Jehovah God and not Jesus Christ. I worship the Father and not the Son. So my question is why is that so confusing? I could understand if you've never read the bible and maybe heard it that way, but that wouldn't make much sense because then you will be knocking something you've never read yourself. Now let’s say you have read the Bible then my question to you would be how can you get a trinity out of the bible when it clearly shows the 3 are completely separate of each other?
Why would I have nightmares of a place that doesn't exist? I don't believe in a hell, so why would you? And why I can’t give my opinion? I’m just stating it based off of some of the things I hear from you guys, which is not judgmental it’s fact, because in all actuality the majority of you have so much hatred toward Christians there is no way you can live a life of happiness when you have anger and resentment toward people based off their beliefs. So what is a person supposed to think about you people?
my friend ai have read the bible
I did not say that the bible forumlated the trinity
later christian doctrine did
in many denominations
what is the largest demonation of the church?
the Catholic Church
I have read their official doctrine
the Catechisms of the Catholic Church
from that did i udnerstand that Jesus is worshipped
it was the council at nicea that decided he was divine
jehovas witnesses reject that and are therefore called ehretics by the rest of the church
and I beleive you misunderstand most of us, we dont ahte christians, actually I love the message portrayed by christ
"turn the other cheek"
Im an atheist
LIke Ghandi, I like you Christ but I dont like your christians, I dont believe that christ would like you christians
but no, I dont hate you, your jus mislead, gullable
mark might hate christians, I dont
Imran
p.s my friend I also indulge in a bowl of cereal later in the day lol
to be a Christian, you have to follow the Bible
if someone sdays they are Christian, and go out and do everything the Bible tels him not to do, and (the most important bit) doesn't beleive what is said in the Bible, do you really think he is one?
A christian is expected to follow jesus
Jesus was a jew
Jesus said "I come not to make new laws but to fufill the old ones"
One of the old laws that was given to the Jews by God is not to eat pork
yet most christians dont eat pork
by your reasoning these christians are not christians at all.
Imran
You havn't yet seen the difference between the Jewish race and the Jewish culture.
I would like to expand upon your point
I'm not quite follwing your point
please continue
enlighten me
Imran
there is a difference between the Jewish religion and the Jewish culture. In the past, the two were placed together almost (but not quite) as one
A Moabite could never join the Jewish comunity, but Ruth (a Moabite) joined the Jewish religion, and became the great grandmother of King David
You know there is a major difference in reading some material and understanding what you've read. What good is reading if you don't understand what you are reading? Okay so you didn't say the bible formulated the trinity but you stated you read the official doctrine of what? The Catholic Church? The same Catholics that dictates worship to the Virgin Mary? This is not True Christianity as the bible states thou shall not worship any other God's nor Images of any kind. But yet in majority of Catholic Churches you see a huge statue of the Virgin Mary constantly being worshiped to, and what about confession? 10 Hail Marys and you're forgiven? Are you really going to tell me that you think this is true Christianity? You may want to gather your own resources from your own reading and understanding of the bible opposed to getting information from Christendom.
No I did not misunderstand most of you, believe me the majority of you guys make your points very noticeable. Well that's good to know that you don’t display hatred, but amongst atheism, your kind is very far and few. That's funny how you talk about Mislead and Gullible when you mentioned to me that you've read the Christian Doctrine, The Same Doctrine from a group that falls worship to the Virgin Mary. Why don't I believe the way that they do and follow their Christendom Doctrine? Because for one I'm not Gullible. My question to you is why do you believe that doctrine to be true form of Christianity? When everything they preach clearly contradicts with the original Hebrew, Aramaic and Greek scriptures of the Old and New Testaments? You mentioned you've read the bible, then how can you display accuracy based off what's in the Bible and compare it to their Doctrine? If you've read the bible and understood it then you would see the confliction I'm referring to when it comes to Catholicism.
Actually my friend the catholic church would tell you they do not worship mary.
they would also tell you they do not practice the veneration of saints, but I chose to study them more in-depth than any other christian demoniation because they are by far the largest, and therefore the most accepted version of christianty
I am not saying that Jesus' message advocated the whorshipping of him
but those who came after did
especially the early church fathers.
I refer you to my point regarding the council of nicea
would you like me to find out wich council it was?
Below is the Nicene Creed which indeed is the offical doctrine of the Christian religion
I do beleive my freiend, with this information, I have closed the debate?
Jesus Christ is described as "God from God, Light from Light, true God from true God," confirming his divinity. When all light sources were natural, the essence of light was considered to be identical, regardless of its form.
Jesus Christ is said to be "begotten, not made," asserting his co-eternalness with God, and confirming it by stating his role in the Creation.
Finally, he is said to be "from the substance of the Father," in direct opposition to Arianism. Some ascribe the term Consubstantial, i.e., "of the same substance" (of the Father), to Constantine who, on this particular point, may have chosen to exercise his authority.
Many Thanks
Imran
Oh they don't? :wtf: I have proof that they do because why is it that many who pray to Mary have been taught that blessings can be gained by the repetition of set formulas—prayers such as the Hail Mary, Our Father, and others. For Catholics, “the most widespread form of Marian devotion [that is, devotion to Mary] is without doubt the rosary,” says the book Symbols of Catholicism. The rosary is a religious exercise in honor of the Virgin Mary. The term also refers to the string of beads used to count prayers. “Five sets of ten beads, separated by an individual bead,” explains the same book, “are an invitation to fifty recitations of ‘Hail Mary’, five of ‘Our Father’, and five of ‘Glory be to the Father.’” Does God listen with favor to the devout recitation of the rosary? So what exactly is the role of the Saints in the church? Please don't say an intercessor. Because that would ultimately conflict entirely with the scriptures.
Sorry my friend but with this information you provided is more like the begining of open season to show you that the teachings of the Catholic Church is by no means "True Christianity" They have way to many confictions within their so called christain doctrine.
Would you care to point out where in the bible that it states this?
No if he is begotten then the statement begotten dictates procreation. For instance your Father has begotten you. Let's look at the definition shall we.
Adjective: begotten bi'gót(u)n
Usage: archaic
(of offspring) generated by procreation
"naturally begotten child"Verb: beget (begot,begotten,begetting, also begat) bi'get
Usage: archaic
Make children
"Abraham begot Isaac"
Now care to explain to me how can begotten indicate one and the same? Are you and your father the same persons?
The Bible plainly states that in his prehuman existence, Jesus was a created spirit being, just as angels were spirit beings created by God. Neither the angels nor Jesus had existed before their creation. Jesus, in his prehuman existence, was "the first-born of all creation." (Colossians 1:15, NJB) He was "the beginning of God's creation." (Revelation 3:14, RS, Catholic edition). "Beginning" [Greek, ar•khe'] cannot rightly be interpreted to mean that Jesus was the 'beginner' of God's creation. In his Bible writings, John uses various forms of the Greek word ar•khe' more than 20 times, and these always have the common meaning of "beginning." Yes, Jesus was created by God as the beginning of God's invisible creations.
So why isn't the term homoousios or homoousios(meaning substance) indicated in the Scripture? And if they were both from some sort of substance that would indicate a creation of God and Jesus and the Bible states the Almighty God has no beginning nor does he have an ending. He is the Alpha and the Omega. In short if he has no beginning then how is it possible that he was formed or begot from some sort of substance?
In short there is no way the bible supports a "trinity" And anyone who believes in a trinity is not practicing Christianity.
From what I understand, Jesus is God Word (i.e. "Let there be Light" was Jesus) and thus has/is the Power of God, Created the Universe, and is Gods Son all well being a bit lower then God, yet still diserving of praise for what He has doen, and for who He is
the trinity is accepted by more than 90% of Christians
so I thik you'll find youve just denounced most christians
and I'll answer the rest of your points, when I come back tomy pc 2morrow
some sleep is well in order =D
May God Bless You
lol
Imran
Jesus is God in human flesh:
"For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counsellor, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace." (Isaiah 9:6) Is "the mighty God" anyone less than the Almighty God? Context shows He is the same, as Isaiah 10:20-21 refers to Yahweh the LORD God of Israel as "the mighty God."
"And Jesus came and spake unto them, saying, All power is given unto me in heaven and in earth." (Matthew 28:18) Restored to heaven, Jesus Christ the Son of God has ALL power, which means that He is Almighty, not just "a mighty god" as taught by some who do not want to "honor the Son just as they honor the Father." - John 5:23 NIV
People should stop judging Christians basd on Christian Religion. . . most Christians today don't go to Church, and its not becuase they are hypocrites but rather one day they just realized, Church is not a building or a sermon - it is a people.
People should not say you are not a Christian if you don't follow the bible, the bible wasn't around in Jesus's time, and most of the bible are stories not laws to follow. There is only one commandment a Christian needs to follow as well. And understanding WHAT Jesus is to a Christian is the key to understanding why it is necessary to believe in Jesus to go to heaven, and also the explanation and reason why every non-christian goes to heaven as well.
If a Christian can not answer those questions, or honestly believes those who are non-christian burn in hell have missed Jesus' message entirely and probably do not believe in a loving God as well.
That's what I've been trying to point out to you from the start Irman. The Trinity is accepted by Christendom beliefs not Christianity. Jesus Christ never gave any indication of a Trinity no where in the bible and people who believe in it are not following what Jesus Christ was preaching. I didn't denounce Christians I've denouced Christendom.
Now on to becondreamer.
He is a God but this is not the "Almighty God."
Now don't get me wrong Jesus Christ is definately an entity to be loved, cherished and given praises to, however Jesus has a position far higher than angels, imperfect men, or Satan. Since these are referred to as "gods," mighty ones, surely Jesus can be and is "a god." Because of his unique position in relation to Jehovah, Jesus is a "Mighty God."—John 1:1; Isaiah 9:6; Isaiah 10:21 The reference of the name "Yahweh" is not speaking of Jesus Christ. That name belongs to the "Almighty God"
But does not "Mighty God" with its capital letters indicate that Jesus is in some way equal to The Almighty God? Not at all. Isaiah merely prophesied this to be one of four names that Jesus would be called, and in the English language such names are capitalized. Still, even though Jesus was called "Mighty," there can be only one who is "Almighty." To call Jehovah God "Almighty" would have little significance unless there existed others who were also called gods but who occupied a lesser or inferior position.
You missed a verse accompanying Matthew 28:18 what about the verse right after which states the following.
Matthew 28:19
"Go, therefore, make disciples of all nations; baptise them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit."
Do those verses say that God, Christ, and the holy spirit constitute a Trinitarian Godhead, that the three are equal in substance, power, and eternity? No, they do not, no more than listing three people, such as Tom, Dick, and Harry, means that they are three in one.
Matthew 28.18
I recall this verse but if All Power was given unto Jesus over the Heavens and the Earth who do you think has "given" this power unto Christ?
Believe me I do honor the Son as well as I honor the Father but I pay special attention to the Father because that's what Jesus wants me to do.
Now let me point this out to you because we also need to keep in mind that not even so much as one "proof text" says that God, Jesus, and the holy spirit are one in some mysterious Godhead. Not one scripture Anywhere in the Bible says that all three are the same in substance, power, and eternity. The Bible is consistent in revealing Almighty God, Jehovah, as alone Supreme, Jesus as his created Son, and the holy spirit as God's active force.
So, would you like to present some additional infromation that supports your Trinity belief? So that I can clear up some additional missunderstanding you may have.
what is your take on what I said?
It varies from person to person. Some may put faith in that Jesus will save them, while others think another person, their dog or something else will. But this Jesus-thing will probably work for many, since Jesus is a symbol of goodness in many peoples' eyes.
Personally I prefer saving myself.
NE-YO, do you eat pork? (you shouldnt)
do you honour the Sabbath. (you should)
As a christian who follwos the bible and not later adaptions on Gods word, as a christian who does not beleive in later adaptations of the doctrine, such as the divinity of Jesus or the trinity you should not eat pork.
The Jews and Christians are also forbidden from eating pork. Here is a quote from the Old Testament to that effect: "And the swine, because it divideth the hoof, yet cheweth not the cud, it is unclean unto you: ye shall not eat of their flesh, nor touch their dead carcase." Deuteronomy 14:8
Many Christians believe that this verse was directed only at the Jews. But Jesus himself says during the Sermon on the Mount; "Think not that I am come to destroy the Law, or the Prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfill."
The old laws. The laws given to moses, and Abraham, the Jewish laws.
And not it is not based on Jewish culture it is based on Jewish Religion as to why Jews do these things. (as you can see by the frist quote,so dont repeat Keepers inept defense when I asked HIM this question.)
You should also be circumscised.
You reject the doctrine of the Church, and you reject the the words of the Bible.
What you are follwng is not Christianity, but a jumble of ideologised youi mixed yourslef together to suit yourslef. Removing all the hypocrysises from the religion, ignroing them if you will.
Imran