Inducing Trance To Wild - Part 2

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When you visualize something, it's not directly in front of your eyes is it? It's somewhere else in your mind, and usually if you play around with it trying to find where in your mind this visualization is taking place, its usually at the back of your head where the visual cortex is. The visual cortex is the part of your brain which interprets what your physical eyes see. Anyways if you bring your awareness to this area you'll be able to catch vivid images of whatever you're visualizing just like after images. These get stronger and more stable the more you keep your awareness there and finally begin to move the visualization forward to in front of you were it'll be most stable[/b]

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hey! i get it now! :) i didnt get that much either but now i know what you're talking about. im doing alright so far i guess. i can see faint objects, and they can move, but they are still quite random.

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Originally Posted by Josh_Mac

I don't quite understand... so you need to be able to think of full 3D objects. correct? But does it have to be like that border between thinking it and actually seeing it in the darkness with your eyes closes? do you know what I mean?
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No, these 3d objects come later... I don't understand your question too well?

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Originally Posted by Josh_Mac

hey! i get it now! :) i didnt get that much either but now i know what you're talking about. im doing alright so far i guess. i can see faint objects, and they can move, but they are still quite random.
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Great to hear that freefire! You're doing great.

Ah, sorry about that... it was a really badly worded question anyway. It's irrelevant now because I've fully grasped what HI is. I can Wild, but I have more Audible stimulus then visual and then I'm suddenly plonked in front of a detailed image.

Okay, I did the visualising for 30 minutes before bed. And I had my mp3-player with some relaxing ambient music. I started visualising, And tried moving in infront of my eyes. I ´don´t think i succeded. But I got alot of HI after a while, It was awesome! :)

And this morning I had a extrmely good memory from a dream after 3 hours of sleep. And that has never ever happened before.

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Originally Posted by Gabriel

Okay, I did the visualising for 30 minutes before bed. And I had my mp3-player with some relaxing ambient music. I started visualising, And tried moving in infront of my eyes. I ´don´t think i succeded. But I got alot of HI after a while, It was awesome! :)

And this morning I had a extrmely good memory from a dream after 3 hours of sleep. And that has never ever happened before.
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Nice!

You will notice that after practicing at night vivid imagery, you will increase the vividness of dream recall in the morning as well as increase vividness of dreams during the night. In my case, enough vividness actually triggers lucidity.

i just thought of somthing since i can create hi almost at will, what if i created some hi and tried touching it? say i create a 3d scene, if i were to reach out and touch it, would i be pulled into the dream/created scene? i have an idea i will try and see if it works.

if i was actually in a dream, would i see the dreamscape/world instead of whereever my body actually was. for example, i go to sleep in my bed in my room, and have a dream. if i was dreaming, i would see whatever i am dreaming, but not be able to see my boody/room any longer right?

i think i have been in my dreams before, just not lucid. also when i dream, i seem to ALWAYS be in first person, i can see anything BUT my dreambody. hmm come to think of it, i have never TRIED looking at my hands/ground ect. whenever i dream, it seems i am always looking forward for some weird reason.

i also figured out why i don't dream, it seems i can put myself into a deep sleep without even trying. THIS would explain why i don't dream. i was reading about brainwaves/states, and it seems there is DELTA sleep, and then another form of delta that is even deeper. in this state, it is impossible to dream, because your brainwaves are to low to create them.

it seems i am always in that state when i sleep, so i never dream. how can i go to sleep, but not get to that point? i COULD dream as a kid, and i could now if i could figure out how i got to the right state to dream..

i am getting closer, if i could get to the right state, i could succeed easily i am sure.

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Originally Posted by Sythix

In my case, enough vividness actually triggers lucidity.
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Yeah, me too. I like that. :)

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Originally Posted by Sythix

i just thought of somthing since i can create hi almost at will, what if i created some hi and tried touching it? say i create a 3d scene, if i were to reach out and touch it, would i be pulled into the dream/created scene?
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I'm not sure as I have never WILDed before, but I think you would imagine yourself reaching out to touch it. It might form to a dream then. You might wake yourself up a little more if you literally tried to reach out!

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Originally Posted by Sythix

i also figured out why i don't dream, it seems i can put myself into a deep sleep without even trying. THIS would explain why i don't dream. i was reading about brainwaves/states, and it seems there is DELTA sleep, and then another form of delta that is even deeper. in this state, it is impossible to dream, because your brainwaves are to low to create them.
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If that is the case, try sleeping in a cooler room, or listening to different brainwaves. How did you figure out that you were a deep sleeper? You might just not recall dreams aswell as you used to.

Another great thread by Sythix. I used the reverse blinking techniques from the last thread and found them incredibly useful for inducing trance states and deep relaxation with a minimum of effort or concentration. I will be trying all of these techniques and reporting back on my progress. So far I have been using the image of the white and orange circles on the first page to develop vivid imagery. Staring at the picture for 30 seconds and then closing your eyes definitely leaves a lasting image. I will report back on progress for daytime and nighttime practice. Furthermore, i recommend that everyone checks out the thread on reverse blinking, and gives it a try.

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Originally Posted by really

Yeah, me too. I like that. :)
I'm not sure as I have never WILDed before, but I think you would imagine yourself reaching out to touch it. It might form to a dream then. You might wake yourself up a little more if you literally tried to reach out!
If that is the case, try sleeping in a cooler room, or listening to different brainwaves. How did you figure out that you were a deep sleeper? You might just not recall dreams aswell as you used to.
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ok first, i can sleep though almost ANYTHING. i can go to bed watching tv, i wake up and its still on, but i didn't hear ANYTHING when i was sleeping. second, i wouldn't forget one of my dreams, they are almost ALWAYS weird/creepy/totally random.

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Originally Posted by Sythix

:arrow: Don't see with your physical eyes, see with your minds eye. Pinpoint the area in your consciousness where this image is projected. It is different than where your eyes project their image. Keep your attention in this area and you might find yourself seeing the images vividly!
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I am having great difficulty in visualizing the apple. I don't think practice will help if I'm not practicing correctly. Sythix, do you have any suggestions on how to pinpoint the mind's eye and use it? Is it the same location in which you picture the layout of rooms in your house or what others things that are ingrained in your memory look like? If so, I can't seem to use that spot in my mind to create images that are not in my memory. Do you have any suggestions?

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Originally Posted by dsr

I am having great difficulty in visualizing the apple. I don't think practice will help if I'm not practicing correctly. Sythix, do you have any suggestions on how to pinpoint the mind's eye and use it? Is it the same location in which you picture the layout of rooms in your house or what others things that are ingrained in your memory look like? If so, I can't seem to use that spot in my mind to create images that are not in my memory. Do you have any suggestions?
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dsr,

It's the same location you picture things from your memory, if you can think about how a room in your house looks like then you can visualize. If you find it difficult conjuring a totally made up scene in your mind, then picture things you do know and remember. You can try this: Take any object you have lying around such as a pencil, a paper weight, anything small and easy to remember. Closely examine it and embed the image in your memory, then close your eyes and try to remember what it looks like. You can try this with other senses, like taste. Try to remember what you ate last and how it tasted. Think back to what water sounds like splashing. Think back to how it feels to brush a hand over your hair. Think back to what the sound of a bird sounds like. Everyone is able to do this, if you take some time to develop this further you'll reap great rewards with the power of visualization..


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BTW, everyone, I updated the first post with another neurological technique and will be updating tomorrow with the last of the HI techniques and explain how this all can be used in a method to induce Lucid Dreaming.

Thanks. I just tried to ingrain the image of a pen in my memory, and I was successful. Although, I can't see it vividly, I can picture all the details (with my eyes open or closed). I'll be sure to practice with other objects and with other senses. Sythix, you have some great tips in this thread.

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Originally Posted by dsr

Thanks. I just tried to ingrain the image of a pen in my memory, and I was successful. Although, I can't see it vividly, I can picture all the details (with my eyes open or closed). I'll be sure to practice with other objects and with other senses. Sythix, you have some great tips in this thread.
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Glad to hear that dsr, and thanks.

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Hello everyone, I updated the first post at last today and finally finished the thread. I hope you all have enjoyed it and please if you have any questions/comments or whatever let me know.

Wow... amazing posts Sythix, Im printing the entire thing out tomorow now that its finished :).

A while back i spent time developing my visualization skills too, got to a point where i was getting exactly what you mentioned while fully concious: "flashes of a crystal clear, breathtakingly vivid imagery for a split second", usually in the form of a tropical island which i was aiming for (never exactly as i was trying to imagine it though).
Im wondering what stage you are at? can you hold those vivid images while conciously visualizing? can you move around them? how long does it take you to get them etc, a full description of your capabilities would be really useful for motivational purposes :wink:.

Thanks for taking the time to share the tutorials, ill begin them tomorow.

Roo

ok, i have the method i want to use, but there is still one problem. i can create the dreamscenes but i can not enter them. i think i cannot enter them, because my eyes are STILL OPEN. if i close my eyes, i can get the scene back almost immediately, but then i can't fall asleep.

i can't explain it. you would have to experience it yourself, it is FREAKY. i can see the scene, and it looks almost real. the scene will have color and everything, and i can control it. the only thing is, I AM STILL AWAKE.

there is another weird thing i seem to be able to do. i can take a scene i create, and MORPH IT into a totaly different scene. i can also take a scene i make, and ADD TO the scene if i wish. i made a scene one time, and i added an ENTIRE room to the scene. without even meaning to, i even added an object to the scene.

i wonder if i could add myself to the scene? the only problem is, i am not sure what i look like in my dreams. when i dream, i seem to always be in a first person style view. the only problem i have is getting to a state where i am dreaming. if i could get there, i could enter my created scene i am sure, and almost instantly be lucid.

Hi my name is Kiko and I became interested in this forum after experiencing sleep paralysis. I didnt know about it at the time and was completely freaked out one night upon trying to fall back asleep because I felt a great vibration heat and couldnt move and had an OPENED EYE hallucination where I levitated in the air and flipped over and I was going for another flip but one of my hands got loose and I started slapping myself to get out of the paralysis. I washed my face in water and could no sleep supine because I felt the energy coming again and I had to stay vigilant all night ready to slap myself if I felt that again. This was about 2 and a half years agoand I told some friends but since it was so out of the ordinary I stopped talking bout it. It happened to me again about once every 4 to 5 months while waking up in the middle of the night and I was always terrified because I felt I was being possessed or something so I always fought it and developed the ability to stop it easily when it started happening. Once I had an auditory hallucination with a strange robotic harmonic like voice (like Jack in Donnie darko) but I fought it off before it could finish the first word. I posted a message on another forum and they told me about sleep paralysis and directed me to a wiki page that had links to lucid dreaming. And here I am! Im pissed that I didnt know how to control all those wasted occassions but I was always panicked because it actually felt like a presence was coming into me and I never heard about sleep paralysis so I fought it. It happened once again since learning about sleep paralysis but I freaked out again. My sleep paralysis is so strong I feel sucked back and I really need to flex and strain to gain control. I tried the reverse blinking last night but I have a wife in my bed and her moving around and my barking dog keep breaking my concentration so no WILDing. But last night I woke up several times and remembered an incredible amount of vivid dreams! But as far as I can remember ive never had LDs. I have good visualisation and last night I remembered a dream from way back when and I can explore that dreamworld in my head right now thats how vivid it is. But ive had no lick self inducing sleep paralysis. I WILL start doing the visualisation techniques during the day as I find it very relaxing and will continue to explore dreamworlds in my mind (there not that big). Hopefully I will find some time to lock myself in the bathroom in the darkness to try the other techniques listed. I did that once a while ago and found it scary because my worst fears seemed to come out (being at the bottom of the black ocean facing a silent enourmous white shark) and I felt a strange warmth in my body. Anyway just saying hi. Anyone in the NYC area?

I am sorta getting something. I haven't practiced with the circle recently, however I can vaguely make the after-image of it appear in front of my eyes when they are closed. Also, I can create white blurry lines in any direction, and foggy general shapes. For some reason, though, it's all like an after-image: it's not clear and colours are usually inversed.

Anyway, I still haven't had a LD yet :(

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Originally Posted by RooJ

Wow... amazing posts Sythix, Im printing the entire thing out tomorow now that its finished :).

A while back i spent time developing my visualization skills too, got to a point where i was getting exactly what you mentioned while fully concious: "flashes of a crystal clear, breathtakingly vivid imagery for a split second", usually in the form of a tropical island which i was aiming for (never exactly as i was trying to imagine it though).
Im wondering what stage you are at? can you hold those vivid images while conciously visualizing? can you move around them? how long does it take you to get them etc, a full description of your capabilities would be really useful for motivational purposes :wink:.

Thanks for taking the time to share the tutorials, ill begin them tomorow.

Roo
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For motivational purposes

:D. I have developed my ability to visualize so far that I can create a vivid image at will even with my eyes open and I'm able to see it as if seeing it with my physical eyes. For example I can imagine an apple in front of me right now and pick it up, feel it, and take a bite out of it and hear the sound of biting into it and taste it as well. Now if I have my eyes closed I can very well see an image after a few seconds of concentrating in the area in which visualizations occur - for example in Dream Yoga it is required for you to be able to visualize the Tibetan letter 'A' before your eyes - with practice the A becomes vivid, stable and clear. Well I can already do that willingly and keep consciousness on the letter 'A' as I drift to sleep and therefore trigger lucidity (in case of falling asleep instead of completing a WILD) due to my consciousness concentrated on the letter 'A'. Read up on dream yoga and you'll see what I mean. I can vividly perceive all other senses as well, move them at will, whatever I like. I can create an inner 'meditation' area in my visualizations - though this isn't no where near close to a Lucid Dream but very very entertaining. I can induce HI in a few seconds due to an NLP anchor I put on the HI state, and many other things. I hope this motivates you all to developing these great abilities because they are really useful in achieving lucidity and many other things.

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Originally Posted by RooJ

Hi my name is Kiko and I became interested in this forum after experiencing sleep paralysis..
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Hi Kiko,

Sounds like you experienced a common episode of suddenly waking up in sleep paralysis and experiencing hypnagogia. I've had this many times before and yes they can be controlled if you develop your visualization abilities. For example in times where you're scared you may visualize a white and comforting light or something that reminds you of being safe. I have a meditation specifically tailored to induce the feeling of being safe and/or paranoid according to the person's amygdala, you may experience either or. It's called Sensed Presence meditation and basically it comes from the 'sensed presence' feeling that there is some one or some living thing close to you, but when you turn to look, you don't find anybody there.

This experience only occurs when a person is in an altered state of consciousness. To facilitate the state, it begins with paying attention to the breath. After you have your attention drawn there, you now imagine that you are experiencing a presence, and that the feeling is emanating from a point behind you, and to your left. The sensed presence is an amygdaloid experience. This only means that when a person is having this experience, their amygdalae will be found to be either the most active structure in their brain, or one of the most active. The most common sensation it created was a feeling of being safe and protected. You're also likely to suddenly imagine the presences - such as a guardian angel, or your parents, etc. I've also noticed that Reverse Blinking has led to vivid dreams...not just in me but others as well, this is very interesting. Good luck in developing your abilities and let us know how it's going!

BTW, the bathroom is a perfect dark place to exercise visualization - I've practiced in there too! Haha :D

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Originally Posted by RooJ

ok, i have the method i want to use, but there is still one problem. i can create the dreamscenes but i can not enter them. i think i cannot enter them, because my eyes are STILL OPEN. if i close my eyes, i can get the scene back almost immediately, but then i can't fall asleep.

i can't explain it. you would have to experience it yourself, it is FREAKY. i can see the scene, and it looks almost real. the scene will have color and everything, and i can control it. the only thing is, I AM STILL AWAKE.

there is another weird thing i seem to be able to do. i can take a scene i create, and MORPH IT into a totaly different scene. i can also take a scene i make, and ADD TO the scene if i wish. i made a scene one time, and i added an ENTIRE room to the scene. without even meaning to, i even added an object to the scene.

i wonder if i could add myself to the scene? the only problem is, i am not sure what i look like in my dreams. when i dream, i seem to always be in a first person style view. the only problem i have is getting to a state where i am dreaming. if i could get there, i could enter my created scene i am sure, and almost instantly be lucid.
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I know what you mean, but I think the problem is you're not tired enough to fall asleep. I think you should try doing a WBTB (without getting out of bed) and try to visualize and enter a visualized scene as you drift off back into sleep - you'll have much better chances that way. Try not to see yourself in the 3rd person perspective unless you want a really strange videogame type of dream, instead try to interact with your visualization and 'feel' it so to speak. Reach your hand out into it and eventually you'll find yourself in a dream.

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Originally Posted by Metroid48

I am sorta getting something. I haven't practiced with the circle recently, however I can vaguely make the after-image of it appear in front of my eyes when they are closed. Also, I can create white blurry lines in any direction, and foggy general shapes. For some reason, though, it's all like an after-image: it's not clear and colours are usually inversed.

Anyway, I still haven't had a LD yet :(
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Sounds like you're making very good progress if you can willingly make the after-image appear before your eyes without looking at the image anymore. I strongly suggest doing this before sleeping (along with reverse blinking to enter trance state) as both these techniques can enhance the vividness of your dreams thus increasing the chances of lucidity.....and making non-lucid dreams more pleasant and memorable :). Plus its very good practice, especially if its a dark room, if not you can close your eyes and do it that way but expect to fall asleep so then you just do it in a different posture or sitting up, w/e floats your boat. (So yes, practicing isn't only useful to develop these abilities but also to induce lucid dreams!) Clarity of the visualizations will come, all it takes is more practice.

Wow!
That will help a bunch!
Thank you so much!
:D

*clap*

Last night I did some reverse blinking for a few minutes than decided to stop. i watched tv for a second than decided to do the apple visualization. after no more than 30 seconds i started to get hypnagogic imagery. i opened my eyes quick because i couldn't believe how quick it came. i got like the outline of time square in ny and a picture of my thumb. it's like the visualization just broke through right in front of me. i practiced the apple visualization 10 times the day before so that is probably why this came so easy to me.

Sometimes I will daydream and the sensations are VERY vivid. They just kind of "overlap" over my normal vison, although thats not realy the right word for it. I only relize this is happening after it ends though, and never thought anything of it until reading this. Im going to try it tonight in the dark and see what will happen :) . Thanks for posting this as it is very in depth.


Also another fun visulization technique is to use someting like a desk, and visulize a miniature battle over it. Have the people use erasors and stuff for cover. Sometimes it gets relly epic :) .

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Originally Posted by Adanac

Also another fun visulization technique is to use someting like a desk, and visulize a miniature battle over it. Have the people use erasors and stuff for cover. Sometimes it gets relly epic :) .
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That sounds cool... Do you play CS?

Now this is what I like to see... Gonna go and try it right now I'm so excited about it! I love the lucidity of your expressions/sentences-- it's very easy to read and remember.

Thank you, for sure!

i read your guide and it fascinates me, but after weeks of practise i still cant bring vivid imagery into my vision. The best i can make is a blueish silhouette of the image i want, but i cant make it any clearer than that. Do i just need more practise? if so, how should i go about this?