Practicing SP not tired

[LittleBuddy]

so apparently you should never WILD before bed because you are too awake. but say i want to practice reaching SP (not trying to WILD at all) so i can get used to it, being sleepy or awake does not effect the time it takes to reach SP right? its just a matter of staying still? am i right or wrong?

[Barns]

Completely wrong I am afraid. The reason you don't WILD before sleep has absolutely nothing to do with tiredness at all. It is all to do with the REM stage of sleep. You only reach this stage after about 5 hours of actually being asleep or so. The REM stage is the point at which you start to dream. You cannot dream before you have reached this stage. The whole point of a WILD is that you are re-entering the REM stage which you have ALREADY REACHED! If you have not already been asleep you will never, ever reach SP. You are wasting your time trying, it is physically impossible.

[LittleBuddy]

really? huh, i always thought that if you just lay still your body thinks to go to sleep. thanks, i never knew SP was related to REM at all. i wonder how i experienced the wave of heaviness and numbness last night then

[Vex Kitten]

Your body can get heavy or numb without being in actual sleep paralysis. Think of any time you're foot or leg or maybe an arm 'fell to sleep' while you're still awake. You're not in sleep paralysis when such things occur. Same thing as the whole body feeling heavy and weighted. It means you're body is begining to rest but doesn't necesarily mean you're in the midst of sleep paralysis.

[LittleBuddy]

so there is no way u can go into SP when ur body wasnt just in the REM cycle? meaning u can only go into SP after a few hours of sleep?

[Vex Kitten]

I don't depend waiting for the sensations associated with SP to lucid dream. I think if you're really REALLY tired sp can happen. It can happen during naps too. I remember a long time ago when I'd be tired enough to nap I'd experience shocking bouts of SP and it'd cause me to jolt awake a few times before actually sleeping. Why would you want the SP without the ensuing possible LD? A couple of times when I was very very tired, I went right to a lucid dream when I laid down at my usual bed time. I mean I was so tired I barely remember staggering to bed. One time I had really vivid HI and decided to try a WILD and it worked. The other time I just slipped right into 2 lucid dreams. They were very unstable and dark dreams though with low control. It is possible, from my experience, but not a very enjoyable type of lucidity. And I'm not a person who uses sleep paralysis to lucid dream. Usually I lay down and intend to WILD and I eventually slip into a dream. I dont experience the sleep paralysis or the vibrations or other sensations associated with WILDing.

[LittleBuddy]

ok thanks for the help!

[yay]

Completely wrong I am afraid. The reason you don't WILD before sleep has absolutely nothing to do with tiredness at all. It is all to do with the REM stage of sleep. You only reach this stage after about 5 hours of actually being asleep or so. The REM stage is the point at which you start to dream. You cannot dream before you have reached this stage. The whole point of a WILD is that you are re-entering the REM stage which you have ALREADY REACHED! If you have not already been asleep you will never, ever reach SP. You are wasting your time trying, it is physically impossible. ummm, like Vex Kitten said, it is possible. I have done it before, in fact, it happened my first time, and also my latest time (two nights ago), so I don't know where you heard that but it's wrong. Also like Vex Kitten said, you don't need to experience SP, I usually don't. I usually feel a strange sensation in my head though. It's like I'm going inside of my head, it's really weird. The first time I had a WILD I didn't even know what WILD was or anything. I described it as being on the border of dreaming and being awake, I could choose to enter the dream, or to wake up, but I chose to enter it and I am so glad I did. Good luck with you WILDing, and don't worry about trying it before your usual bed time, it's definitely possible

[LittleBuddy]

yay, yay. lol, thanks, that helps me out a lot!

[unseen wombat]

I can see where OP is coming from. I can't get into SP to save my life. I would loev to have a vampire sitting on my chest, but I just can't get it. So I think the original question is still unanswered. Does SP only happen with the onset of REM, or with the onset of sleep itself? Meaning, if we were to try to WILD at the beginning of the night, would we reach SP (not the lucid state, just SP) at the same time we would usually fall asleep? Or would we have to wait til the 90 minute mark REM phase to start?