2012 or not, what's the real issue?

**Thundercloud** · 02-18-2005 07:02 PM

If 2012 were to be the end as we know it, then how apparent would the signs have to be before we all started behaving as a collective organism? If the local prophet were to state that a tsunami like no other would decimate a part of the globe and lay waste to all life with no bias on the 26th of December 2004, would his message be heeded or would the society that we have created keep functioning as it always has? The billions of dollars that course through the arteries of modern society are becoming the lifeblood of a species destined for extinction. We destroy the Earth on a whim in order to generate profit, and expand corporations, while silent parties suffer on the behalf of humankind's greed. I know that there are people in this world right at this moment with more money than most people could ever fathom, wallowing in their decadence, while somewhere else at the exact moment a human dies from starvation. I have heard that obesity is becoming a major problem in most parts of the civilised world, while starvation is the leading cause of death in the uncivilised parts of our globe.........hello......can anybody notice something here.........does this seem a little out of balance to you? We destroy nature and marvel at our ingenuity whilst doing so......."aren't we so clever". Are we so highly evolved and so very intelligent that every other species of life is just plain ignorant in comparison? The human response to suffering is negligible so long as the individual concerned is the one that is suffering; except when the person suffering is a loved one. Well what about those who have no family or loved ones to gather by their side and ease the pain of suffering?, does it not matter because they are inconsequential to us. The breaking news story here is that; it seems as though HUMAN LIFE becomes inconsequential when the fury of Mother Nature cannot be contained and it erupts in the form of natural disaster. When nature rebels against human domination, and we no longer can find the bounty of life that sustains our needs it will be as if our own Mother has refused to come to our aide in our time of suffering. The pain of a species multiplied by our own forced rejection from the natural systems of biological organisation, and hence life itself, will leave us all truly alone in cold, infinite universe, where we are not wanted. Why do people nowadays find the concept of God so easy to digest? Why do most cultures view God as a masculine entity (I do know that many people believe God to be androgenous, and still feel comfortable referring to this God as, He, Him, The Father etc.)? In ancient Sumer, the populace commonly accepted the fact that there may be a female counterpart of God, Matronit, and payed respect to that force as well. Just as Eastern belief systems integrate the concept of yin yang into their philosophies, not good and evil each with a seed of the other in its' own; but, masculine and feminine each with a seed of the other in its' own, so to did the Egyptians incorporate the harmonious masculine and femine deity into their belief systems (Osiris and Isis). Moreover, a very great man whom we incorporate into our Western belief systems as The Son, had a female counterpart that the same Western belief system labelled a Whore; for the acquisition of power and wealth. When Mother Nature becomes terse with us for the blatant disrespect and abuse heaped upon Her and Her loved ones, it quickly becomes a natural disaster which decimates life. When Father God comes to the aide of his most beloved female counterpart, Mother Nature, what will we call it then; divine intervention? 2012 is not the issue, and the signs that are apparent are not the issue either, the issue is: Why is this all happening for in the first place?

**Kaniaz** · 02-18-2005 07:30 PM

What the hell are you talking about.

**TygrHawk** · 02-18-2005 07:41 PM

I think he's channeling Dennis Miller.

**Thundercloud** · 02-18-2005 08:02 PM

Originally posted by Kaniaz
What the hell are you talking about.

You honestly don't understand what in the hell I am talking about. My apologies.

**Thundercloud** · 02-18-2005 08:12 PM

Originally posted by TygrHawk
I think he's channeling Dennis Miller.

Who is Dennis Miller, and if I could channel, why would I channel somebody who I do not know...........are you making fun of me at my expense? hahahahah you are funny. Wow I'd love to see some more of this brilliant spiritual energy of yours put to use by making asumptions about other things as well.

**TygrHawk** · 02-18-2005 08:45 PM

Geez, it was just a joke. Sorry if I offended you (though I don't see how that's possible, if you don't know who Dennis Miller is).

If you're seriously looking for an answer to "why is all this happening" (assuming you mean hunger, greed, corruption, destroying nature, etc.) I think the answer is pretty simple. People are generally selfish and stupid.

If I'm missing the point, please enlighten me.

**Thundercloud** · 02-18-2005 08:51 PM

Does anybody have any paranormal/spiritual/philosophical/religious/theological thoughts as to what might be the reason for all the turmoil happening in the world?

**Kaniaz** · 02-18-2005 08:51 PM

For a start you could use paragraphs. Then perhaps I might get around to understanding you. Until then, you can use all the wise cracks you like and get nowhere. Cool with me.

**bradybaker** · 02-18-2005 09:00 PM

Originally posted by Thundercloud
Does anybody have any paranormal/spiritual/philosophical/religious/theological thoughts as to what might be the reason for all the turmoil happening in the world?

There has always been and will always be turmoil in the world. That's the way the world works. Hunger will never be cured, peace will never be reached, freedom will always be restricted. But don't despair, "without the sour, the sweet just ain't as sweet."

**TygrHawk** · 02-18-2005 09:05 PM

Originally posted by Thundercloud
Does anybody have any paranormal/spiritual/philosophical/religious/theological thoughts as to what might be the reason for all the turmoil happening in the world?

Ah, at least now I know the real question you're asking. I think the answer I gave would qualify as philoshophical, but since I don't really believe in that other stuff, I guess you'll have to wait for someone else to answer.

BTW -- http://www.valleyskeptic.com/dm_rants.html -- that should give you an idea. And again, please don't take offense, it was just a joke.

**Kaniaz** · 02-18-2005 09:20 PM

At least now I know what you're talking about. But I cannot be bothered to reply, so here's what my random quote program thing said:

The Army needs leaders the way a foot needs a big toe.
-- Bill Murray

**Shlumpeet** · 02-19-2005 03:43 AM

Originally posted by Thundercloud
If 2012 were to be the end as we know it

BAH! Its not the end, but the time we enter the 5th deminsion, get it right.

**Thundercloud** · 02-19-2005 02:14 PM

If you're seriously looking for an answer to \"why is all this happening\" (assuming you mean hunger, greed, corruption, destroying nature, etc.) I think the answer is pretty simple. People are generally selfish and stupid.

If I'm missing the point, please enlighten me.

Could it be said that humans are the only species on the planet that are generally selfish and stupid, and to be aware of the fact as well? If the answer to problems such as hunger (famine), greed, corruption, destroying nature and so forth is something as simple: People are generally selfish and stupid; then, shouldn't the answer to such problems be as simple as the underlying problem. For example: If the Earth is being destroyed by a generally selfish and stupid species, in the best interests of the planet, it would be wise to first try to wait for this species to evolve out of their state of general stupidity and selfishness.

Failing this, it would be prudent to send signals, signs, messages and mesengers, so that this species may have the further chance to evolve from this primal, stupid, selfish state of consciousness. If all else fails, and humans continue to ignore such blatant signs in the face of truth, then the Earth will have to defend itself, in the way that only nature knows how to.

If we can achcieve the things that we have in the last 100 years whilst still being in a state of stupidity and selfishness, then how much more can we accomplish once we are able to think in a way that can not be deemed as selfish or stupid.

I can not think of one reasonable explanation as to why there are people dying of starvation while others are dying of obesity, and moreover, I don't ever want to.[/quote]

**Thundercloud** · 02-19-2005 02:34 PM

Originally posted by Kaniaz
For a start you could use paragraphs. Then perhaps I might get around to understanding you. Until then, you can use all the wise cracks you like and get nowhere. Cool with me.

You are correct. I apologise fo not writing in paragraphs. I can see how the content of my written words become obscured when I haven't made multiple paragraphs. As to the wise cracks............what wise cracks?

**Kaniaz** · 02-19-2005 02:53 PM

That's okay. I'm just a lazy reader anyway, so when I was presented with that chunk of text I could of read it, but it would of been more of an obstacle course than usual.

You honestly don't understand what in the hell I am talking about. My apologies.[/b]

I assumed the above to be a wise crack. Assumptoins rule.

**Thundercloud** · 02-19-2005 03:00 PM

Originally posted by bradybaker
There has always been and will always be turmoil in the world. That's the way the world works. Hunger will never be cured, peace will never be reached, freedom will always be restricted. But don't despair, \"without the sour, the sweet just ain't as sweet.\"

There has always has been turmoil in the world is a very true statement; but, as far as there always will be turmoil in the world......you said it, not me.

That's the way the world works........in turmoil? I don't see the universe as living in turmoil. I believe that turmoil is something that humans have created for themselves. We live a life that is full of different types of stress and anxiety, and we strive for things are are empty and without essence until we find ourselves trapped in an empty, stagnant existence. This is turmoil.

Hunger will be cured, peace will be reached, freedom will not always be restricted; but, don't despair, "the sour taste of opression, famine, and war will only make the truth all the much sweeter for it".

**Thundercloud** · 02-19-2005 03:16 PM

Originally posted by Shlumpeet+--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Shlumpeet)</div>

<!--QuoteBegin-Thundercloud

If 2012 were to be the end as we know it

BAH! Its not the end, but the time we enter the 5th deminsion, get it right.[/b]

I said: "If 2012 were to be the end as we know it, then how apparent would the signs have to be before we all started behaving as a collective organism"? Not 2012 is the end of the world; but, it will be the end of the world as we know it once we enter the 5th dimension. However, I can't see how a species that are generally selfish and stupid will be granted access to the 5th dimension in the first place. Maybe 2012 is an opportunity to be granted access to the 5th dimensions if, and only if the pre-requisites have been met. Do you honestly think than a species that can destroy itself as well as other things will be allowed to have the opportunity to enter another dimension of reality so that they may screw things up there too?

**Thundercloud** · 02-19-2005 03:43 PM

Originally posted by Kaniaz
That's okay. I'm just a lazy reader anyway, so when I was presented with that chunk of text I could of read it, but it would of been more of an obstacle course than usual.

You honestly don't understand what in the hell I am talking about. My apologies.

I assumed the above to be a wise crack. Assumptoins rule.[/b]

I heard that assumptions are the mother of all stuff-ups, and that you shouldn't assume; because it makes an ass out of u and me. But I have never heard that assumptions rule.

The Army needs leaders the way a foot needs a big toe.
-- Bill Murray

Why does a leader make the mistake of thinking that they are more important than whom they are leading. In the analogy of the foot and the big toe it would be like the toe thinking it is more important than the rest of the foot and body it is attatched to. I have seen people survive the loss of one or both big toes; but, I have never seen a big toe survive without a foot.

"This is your life, and it's ending one minute at a time."

I am sure of it. This is why the current hourly rate of pay for the average worker (an exchange of money for the minutes of your life that you will never get back) pisses me right off.

"Sticking feathers up your butt does not make you a chicken."

True. However, while sticking feathers up your butt does not make you look like a chicken, it does make you look like a person with feathers sticking out your butt.

Wayne Coyne for President!

Who is Wayne Coyne? Was he the person that figured out that sticking feathers up his butt didn't make him look like a chicken? Is this sort of accomplishment a pre- requisite for becoming a President?

**Kaniaz** · 02-19-2005 05:55 PM

What just happened?

**Thundercloud** · 02-19-2005 06:30 PM

Originally posted by Kaniaz
What just happened?

?????

On the first page of this thread bradybaker listed some quotations:

"This is your life, and it's ending one minute at a time".

"Sticking feathers up your butt does not make you a chicken."

Wayne Coyne for President!

I think I need to ask you what do you mean by saying: "What just happened"?

**Kaniaz** · 02-19-2005 06:40 PM

Oh. That's part of his signature, not his post. In other words, the part under that line "____________" dosen't matter, it's under all their posts.

**wasup** · 02-19-2005 10:56 PM

Originally posted by Kaniaz
Oh. That's part of his signature, not his post. In other words, the part under that line \"____________\" dosen't matter, it's under all their posts.