KonchogTashi's workbook

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Originally Posted by KonchogTashi

Text is never a big component in my dreams, but I think the more I use the test, the more text will appear in dreamland

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Why try so hard to get text in your dreams, why not use it as a dream sign. When you don't see text maybe your dreaming, so check next time you don't see a single sign on a street, no warning labels etc, maybe your dreaming.

I often find myself riding on buses or trains, they are covered with text in the real world and buses have lots of mirrors, but dream trains and buses lack these things for me. Obviously the larger dream sign for me is the bus/train itself, but the lack of these things is another layer of dream sign.

Progress 12/26/-1/5

Daytime:

I have been keeping up with daytime practice. I have found my awareness fluctuates. Some days it is easy to remain vigilant and perform RCs very frequently and very thoroughly. Other days remembering is less frequent and the checks feel less powerful and thorough. I feel like this is OK, and natural. It reminds me very much of my experience with regular meditation practice over a long period of time, ups and downs in awareness. I can say that I have done a minimum of 5 checks everyday, and the vast majority of days many more than that.

Additionally, after the experience of stabilization in the last LD i documented here I have followed Fryingman's advice and added a "lucidity rehearsal." At the end of each RC I repeat aloud "this is a dream, I am dreaming, everything here is my mind." I simultaneously rub my hands together and pat down my chest and legs. This has been really helpful and out of habit I was able to repeat it in a subsequent LD.

In short, all goes well here.

Nightime:

I have continued to naturally wake up after 4.5-5 hrs. sleep. Generally, I have no recall here but this does not concern me as I have been using it as prep time for the remaining 2-4 hours of sleep. I have been getting up, rousing myself a bit (max 20 min awake) and returning to sleep practicing MILD. Mostly this has resulted in excellent recall of vivid dreams, about 2 each night in the post WBTB periods. Some of them I have frankly been to lazy to record although I clearly recalled them upon waking.

I have had 1 more LD, a rather strange one that began with a seamless reproduction of my bedroom and sleeping situation from the wakefulness that immediately preceded it. DJ entry follows:

1/4/15 in final REM cycle after about 6 hours sleep:
I am in bed with wife and littlest one. Little one is crawling about disrupting things. I'm fading in and out of sleep. I catch a glimpse of a figure who out of the corner of my eye appears to be someone dressed as George Washington quickly exiting my bedroom and heading down the stairs. "Who was that??" I say to my wife. She mumbles something unintelligible. I start to fade out but then decide that this is something that I should attend to. I get out of bed and head downstairs. A light is on in the kitchen and I can hear the sink running. I get ready for action and quickly turn the corner into the room. I see a woman in a brown sweater standing at the sink with her back to me. I think for a moment it's my wife...mope she is in bed, then i think "mom"... Nope. I put my hand on her back and she turns around, a stranger. I step back and know I am dreaming. I say to her "I am dreaming! This is a dream! I am dreaming!" She just silently looks at me. I start to rub my hands together and the realization becomes stronger, my awareness gradual increases . I pat down my chest and thighs and say " more clarity!" "More lucid awareness!" The room seems to sharpen slowly and I feel more present in the dream. I continue rubbing my hands together saying "more clarity!" The effect is gradual but definite. I look around, forgetting the lady. My cabinets are different, taller and brown. This distracts me and I go out of the kitchen, sort of flying/running toward my meditation room. " I will attain enlightenment for the benefit of all beings!" I shout two times. My house is dark. I enter my meditation room, it's very dark. In sort of hovering/flying., doing two flips. I say the mani mantra a few times. My shrine is a single long shelf as opposed to the three tiers it actually is. It's dark but I can make out some objects, maybe statues or stupas, but they are indistinct. I wake up.

WBTB 20 minutes up/MILD I was lucid for about 1 minute.


In this dream I fell immediately in to the actions from the "lucidity rehearsal." This was really encouraging. I can also see that at least right now, the hand rubbing and stabilization is probably going to need to be done constantly. I really saw how the combination of the hand rubbing and verbal commands sharpened up the dream. I even felt my voice becoming stronger and stronger. The last 2 LDs have been really productive for me in terms of learning more about how lucidity works (for me).

I have started back to work and been sleeping in an extra 2.5 hours a day, I essentially just performed a "reverse CAT." I am expecting a bit of a transition back to my regimented, shorter sleep schedule. I had no recall this am. I figure it will take a week or so to adjust. I am just planning on keeping up with general day and night practice.

Once again, thanks so much for all the support, encouragement, and excellent advice. It is really helping out tremendously.

^^ So glad to hear things are going well, it sure looks like you're making wonderful progress. Performing your "lucidity ritual" right on cue is a great sign that it's getting well established in your memory. Yes, hand rubbing works magic for me for stabilization, although I've never tried verbal commands. Well done, keep it up!

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Originally Posted by KonchogTashi

I can also see that at least right now, the hand rubbing and stabilization is probably going to need to be done constantly.

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If you believe it, it will become so. Instead believe that your pockets are full of awesome tasting stabilizing candy, and reach in and pop it in your mouth.

^^ I, too, really want to do the stabilizing candy/gum thing. I remembered in one LD but only found coins in my pocket. Of course, I should have popped the coin into my mouth and started chewing it anyway but oh well :). Another suggestion from Sensei is to bite off a finger and chew it like gum.

This is great that the lucidity rehearsal came through into your LD so well KT! Congrats on the LD!! It sounded like you had good awareness too.

In regards to your concern that the stabilization may need to be done constantly...that definitely need not be. You may have just been at the end of that final REM cycle. Also watch out for FA's in situations like that one where you were fading in and out of sleep. I will often get short dreams in similar situations (late morning and waking activity around me) and subsequent FA's. Definitely continue the lucidity rehearsal routine but try to think of it as something you do without worrying about stability. Eventually we should all be able to consistently just "be" in the dream and flow freely without concern until the cycle is done.

In the long run the lucidity ritual probably helps most with remembering goals. Don't do it with fear, as fogelbise says, or like it's a requirement, but it's just something you do to get started. I've had many many excellent LDs where I totally bypass the ritual (by forgetting it) and just jump right in to the dream. On the other hand, I've had a number of LDs that started out unstable/"dizzy" that solidified up nicely after doing the hand-rub / pat-down.

And I can heartily second the notion of watching out for FAs. I think we all experience them way more than we may think, because they can be sooooo convincing. Especially in that in-and-out-of-sleep dozing time in late morning. Probably in most FAs we just "turn over and go back to sleep."

In times of heightened lucidity, I have a much higher frequency of FAs….or, at least, I notice them more (usually in retrospect after waking up).

Hello DILD class member,
I'm making a one-time announcement to individual recently active workbooks to let you know about the new DILD class announcement thread. Please subscribe to the announcement thread to see notifications of activities and other threads of particular interest/importance to DILD class members!

The first announcement is about the upcoming Sensei dreaming competition (starting on Thursday [in 2 days!], look for the official rules and scoring post on Wednesday).

http://www.dreamviews.com/dild/15591...uncements.html

Hi KonchogTashi,
From your recent "Dream in one sentence…" (that thread's not for discussion)

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Originally Posted by KonchogTashi

2. I am in a car with my oldest friend telling him about DMT. (I dream about riding in cars almost every night, can't believe I miss this DS)

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This is great, you may want to spend some daytime MILD visualizations on seeing yourself in your car. See the dream image from your recall, pretend you're back in the dream, and tell yourself over and over "I'm dreaming! I'm dreaming! This is a dream! Being in a car means I'M DREAMING!". Naturally you should also do this during the waking day when you're in a car ,k as well, since no effort is needed to visualize! (Careful if you're driving, though!)

I also notice you're in your temple a lot and see teachers a lot in dreams: that's another one to really work on during the day. Maybe you can even have your teachers help you by telling you something confusing/odd (not that this is unusual!) from time to time :).

Don't get frustrated, I've had probably dozens of significant (usually long and quite vivid ) "crazy racquetball" dreams, and I have *yet* to catch one, even with occasional daytime MILD affirmations where I visualize the scenes and do just what I mentioned above. I've had coffee cake in my hand instead of a racquet, raw steak instead of a ball, Christmas trees on the court, assorted wooden furniture on the court, crowds of 20+ angry opponents, totally bizarre shaped courts, glow in the dark rackets, rows of CRT computer monitors lining the court ceiling, it goes on and on.

Add to that at least a couple dozen crazy baseball dreams (the players are 15' tall giants, the stadium is in a rocky volcano, a player is a centaur, there are little ground lights on the baselines, etc., etc.) including one just the other night where I caught two balls which flew off of the field, and I've NEVER caught one.

Dozens of "my favorite lake" in the mountain dreams, camping with the boy scouts, NEVER caught one, not once.

At least I finally started catching childhood home dreams, which is my #1 dream sign, and I MISSED it just the other night, and a week ago, too. I've missed them MUCH more than caught.

OK, now I feel like I need to go lie down and do some MILD dream sign work !!!!

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Originally Posted by FryingMan

Hi KonchogTashi,
From your recent "Dream in one sentence…" (that thread's not for discussion)



This is great, you may want to spend some daytime MILD visualizations on seeing yourself in your car. See the dream image from your recall, pretend you're back in the dream, and tell yourself over and over "I'm dreaming! I'm dreaming! This is a dream! Being in a car means I'M DREAMING!". Naturally you should also do this during the waking day when you're in a car ,k as well, since no effort is needed to visualize! (Careful if you're driving, though!)

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Sorry for the slow reply. This is excellent advice! I have taken your advice and started doing state tests every time I get into a car, and then again once I have been driving for awhile. I check my digital display in the car, if a passenger I check my hands.

The night after I first read this suggestion I took some galantamine and alpha-gpc. (I am experimenting and have yet to form a solid opinion about this approach) I had a dream where I was in a parking lot with my wife, I looked down and saw a miniature car (like a shriner's car) I immediately recognized I was dreaming. Funny how the car showed up in the dream. I had another car dream last night, but failed to recognize.

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Originally Posted by FryingMan

also notice you're in your temple a lot and see teachers a lot in dreams: that's another one to really work on during the day. Maybe you can even have your teachers help you by telling you something confusing/odd (not that this is unusual!) from time to time :).

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I had two Dharma dreams the night before last. One I was sitting with a teacher and they were explaining a text to me. I almost got lucid, the dream became very vivid and I was "there", but I didn't rouse critical faculties enough to do a state test. I haven't seen any of my teachers in a couple of weeks, but next time I do, or visit my temple, I will do many state tests.

Thanks for your continued support and excellent advice!!

galantamine with cholines (bitartrate and alpha-gpc is a good mix that spreads out the "high" over several hours) is an amazing mixture. If you can think of them as occasional "special events" but that you can get lucid just fine and have amazing experiences without them as well, it's probably a good way to think of them.

I've taken it 4 times. Once I figured out how to get back to sleep I have gotten lucid on every attempt. However, the lucidity has not been stable, and has had a different "feel" than non-supplement induced lucidity. I have noticed FAs every time I have taken it. In short, it definitely works, but the results have not been as enjoyable as my other lucids. Additionally I wake up with a bit of a "hangover." I have no desire to take more supplements to counteract this.

I've taken it perhaps 20+ times now, and have yet to figure out how to get back to sleep in a reasonable time. WHAT IS YOUR SECRET!?

I suspect what it is: resist with every fibre of your being the urge to daydream about all the awesome dreams coming soon, and "let go totally and entirely." Basically, do what I know needs be done: relax mind and body totally. Easier said than done, on galantamine + choline I find my mind starts to race immediately and I see HI like fireworks, very distracting. I usually spend a tortuous 5-7 hours trying to get back to sleep, sometimes getting up then returning to bed a few hours later, for dreams on the "fumes" of the supps.

I too do not like taking pharmaceuticals in general, and I too do feel a hangover the next day usually. I do not want to take pircetam (drugs to get you high and drugs to bring you down).

I get a bunch of FAs on G as well, some with very trippy results (being ejected out of bed headfirst into a downwards sloping tunnel on my back…wow…TWICE in the same night!). I have not noticed a different quality to the dreams themselves, though.

I've gotten back to sleep and had amazing lucids maybe 5 times. I have Galantamind which contains B5 as well which is supposedly quite bad for getting back to sleep, so I may at some point try to acquire pure galantamine.

Regarding getting back to sleep: I use .5-.75mg of melatonin, added to the crushed galantamine Choline Bit, and alpha gpc. It works like a charm. i grind everything but the choline b and add it to water. quickly drink it and take the choline b, then I lay on my back close my eyes, and relax, putting my attention on the breath. After about 20 minutes or so I roll over and set my intent a few times. Since I added the melatonin I have fallen asleep in less than an hour 3/3 times, and that is with 8mg galantamine, 500mg choline b., & 600-650 GPC. This is telling as I am susceptible to WBTB insomnia. Should you ever resume supplement experiments, I recommend the addition of melatonin.

My galantamine lucids have felt "faded", or "washed out". It's probably just me. As I mentioned I'm still forming an opinion about supplements, but as of now leaning slightly negative.

Been having a rough go lately for a couple of reasons.

a. I am indecisive regarding my dream journal. I have been using my phone which was fine for awhile, but my recall has gotten much more detailed, and I am remembering more dreams. I was finding that I was loosing a lot of detail and even whole dreams due to the limitations of typing on a tiny keyboard. I switched to pen and paper, but have had a bit of trouble getting it going as it is much more cumbersome and uncomfortable to write in. It requires a flashlight, rolling over, etc.. On the nights I have used it, It has solved the problems I was having with the phone. I just need to keep up with it and get the new habit rolling.

b. my youngest child has been sneaking into my bed at night, which results in many wakings due to being kicked, rolled into, etc.. very poor sleep. Last night I bailed on my bed and got into hers, full of frustration and about to throw the towel in with dreaming. Once I calmed down I fell asleep and was rewarded with a nice, but short LD. DJ:http://www.dreamviews.com/blogs/konc...ucid-31-64681/
The LD had me waking up full of confidence and renewed determination to continue diligently with dream practice.

I have been doing very well with daytime practice, but have realized I have gotten lax with my night time practice. I need to put some more effort into this side of the equation.

I just thought I would check in as I have found posting here to be very helpful. THANKS!!

Hi KonchogTashi!
I've enjoyed reading your one-sentence summaries: as I mentioned on that thread, your dream signs of Dharma center/teachers and car trips do seem really reliable!

For the night-time writing: you may want to try voice recording on your phone for a while to see how it can work for you. I like it far more than night-time writing because: 1) you can speak far faster than you can write, 2) you can do it in the dark once you start recording (no flashlight to hold/fumble, no light to wake you up, make sure you turn down your screen brightness before bed), no fumbling for pencil, etc., no physical movement once you grab the phone [so quite minimal]). I then transcribe during the day. I've found though that over time, as long as I speak the full dream [or even the summaries/key words] into the recorder, I need to use the recorded notes less and less, and now I rarely refer to them unless I forget a dream/scene (maybe 1/5 nights), even if I sleep multiple more sleep cycles. But recording does give me the added confidence that I won't forget them, and I don't then bother with running over earlier dreams mentally to refresh them upon later wakings.

Oh, I've been there many times regarding throwing in the towel and frustration. I don't have a bed-climbing child at this point in life, but I have a snoring wife. Makes WILD/DEILD darn near impossible, WBTB pointless, if I wake up or try to fall asleep again at a time when she's sawing logs. Earplugs don't block out enough. Very very very frustrating. But I've resolved myself that I will live with it and do my best with dreaming. Doesn't effect non-lucids much, but for lucids it really messes things up at times. Focusing on enjoying my non-lucid recall is what keeps me going.

Keeping up the night practice is the key thing. I think I'd be lucid a bunch more if I noticed night-time wakings more and went back to sleep with WILD/MILD (where I can).

I hear ya, but I know that you know that dreaming is just too awesome to give up. And besides, I'm no Buddhist, but isn't frustration at interferences and lack of results a form of "grasping?" Heck, be glad you have a kid who likes to climb into your bed and kick you. Before you know it that time will pass and he/she will be a teen, rolling his/her eyes at you and you'll be wondering what happened to your wonderful little kid :). Those teen times have their benefits too (you may have to look hard to find them), but enjoy the moment, even if that moment is kicking you in the kidneys while you're trying to dream.

The important thing in the end is to keep up everything you can keep up: daytime work, as much nighttime work as you can, and dream recall. That way, the other legs of the foundation of lucid dreaming are still standing there waiting for you to shore up the missing one when you're ready to do so.

Good luck, you can do it! Love all your dreams!

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Originally Posted by FryingMan

Hi KonchogTashi!
I've enjoyed reading your one-sentence summaries: as I mentioned on that thread, your dream signs of Dharma center/teachers and car trips do seem really reliable!

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Thanks, and ditto for your posts on this thread. I look forward to reading it each morning and am disappointed when I have poor recall. Its a really great thread!

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Originally Posted by FryingMan

the night-time writing: you may want to try voice recording on your phone for a while to see how it can work for you. I like it far more than night-time writing because: 1) you can speak far faster than you can write, 2) you can do it in the dark once you start recording (no flashlight to hold/fumble, no light to wake you up, make sure you turn down your screen brightness before bed), no fumbling for pencil, etc., no physical movement once you grab the phone [so quite minimal]). I then transcribe during the day. I've found though that over time, as long as I speak the full dream [or even the summaries/key words] into the recorder, I need to use the recorded notes less and less, and now I rarely refer to them unless I forget a dream/scene (maybe 1/5 nights), even if I sleep multiple more sleep cycles. But recording does give me the added confidence that I won't forget them, and I don't then bother with running over earlier dreams mentally to refresh them upon later wakings.

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I like this method quite a lot. I actually voice recorded the LD I had last night. Normally I do not know how possible it will be as I fear it would wake the wife. I will give it a shot and see if I can get it away with it. It really is ideal as it combines the ease of the phone with the stream of consciousness(ness) of pen and paper journaling.

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Originally Posted by FryingMan

hear ya, but I know that you know that dreaming is just too awesome to give up. And besides, I'm no Buddhist, but isn't frustration at interferences and lack of results a form of "grasping?" Heck, be glad you have a kid who likes to climb into your bed and kick you. Before you know it that time will pass and he/she will be a teen, rolling his/her eyes at you and you'll be wondering what happened to your wonderful little kid :). Those teen times have their benefits too (you may have to look hard to find them), but enjoy the moment, even if that moment is kicking you in the kidneys while you're trying to dream.

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This is really really good advice. I think I was just getting down contemplating the effort v. success ratio I have encountered in dream practice. I think mostly it was the cumulative effect of several consecutive nights of very poor sleep. The LD I had got my head firmly back in the game. I could see I am doing just fine and just need to keep plugging away and not worry about immediate results. You are too correct about reframing my view of my little one invading my sleep space. In 50 years I am sure I would trade every LD I ever manage to have for a single moments sleep with my beautiful child. THANK YOU!

You are very welcome :). Oh, I'm right there at the effort vs. success ratio thing getting you down from time to time. But you have to take the long view in this discipline. Long view means years/decades, not months. I'm proof positive that dedication to recall can reap great results. And in a relatively short period of time! The consistency matters. And being down hinders results, so celebrate the successes. Some people spend years trying to get lucid once and here you are with several at least of them in the last few months, with growing recall and recognition even of common dream signs to help guide you. Lots of positives! Just have to hit that winning recipe for lucidity...I'm still searching for that as well, but I know one thing: as long as I'm breathing I will be dreaming, and have that as part of my life.

edit: yes you have to find the ideal volume of speaking so as not to bother the bed partner. I've lost a dream on occasion for speaking too quietly. But the %age success compared to reading chicken-scratch nighttime writing and all the other advantages still are heavily in favor of voice recording. Leaving on a fan in the room to filter out the sounds can help. If I have a particularly detailed awesome or lucid dream I really want to fully record, I'll just get up and go to the bathroom with the phone and record there.

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Originally Posted by KonchogTashi

Rolled over, grabbed that notebook, pen, and flashlight and was handsomely rewarded with the most recall I have had in 10 days, feeling great!

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Woohoo! Congrats. There's nothing like a big night of dreaming after a run of weak recall. Sometimes you just gotta force yourself to roll over. I myself did mental journaling last night but it took so much time I should have just recorded and gone right back to sleep, and still some of the earlier dreams are just weak impressions. I love those nights that fill the DJ's pages.

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Originally Posted by FryingMan

Woohoo! Congrats. There's nothing like a big night of dreaming after a run of weak recall. Sometimes you just gotta force yourself to roll over. I myself did mental journaling last night but it took so much time I should have just recorded and gone right back to sleep, and still some of the earlier dreams are just weak impressions. I love those nights that fill the DJ's pages.

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Thanks for the props! It did indeed feel really great to realize that no matter what, if I sleep, I dream. Even if recall gets rough for awhile all I have to do is set up the right conditions and apply a bit of effort and the dreams will be there to tune into. Daylight savings time change really screwed up my sleeping schedule and I truly feel I am just getting back on track. I have slept through full nights, despite setting my intent to wake for recall/MILD. After a couple of days I figured I needed the sleep and just let it unfold. The last couple of nights I have been waking up with good recall and journaling a page or two. of dreams, really satisfying. Now, back to LUCIDITY!

^^So true! This tip may be useless until the next spring forward time change, but going to bed an hour earlier this year (when possible) made the transition much easier than usual for me.