I was abused. Yes. No .yes. Maybe!?!?

[Howie]

Do you believe that false memories can be implanted in your brain? For example, childhood abuse could arise falsely after psychologists unknowingly plant these events in a patients head. Has this approach been used in the judiciary system yet? Maybe instead of pleading insanity.

[bradybaker]

It's not about whether you believe it or not, it's whether or not you accept the fact. Countless studies have confirmed that false memories can definitely be implanted (using techniques similar to the ones they use to try and 'uncover repressed memories') and it really doesn't take much effort.

[bradybaker]

I'll be happy to post summaries of some of the studies if you'd be interested.

[Howie]

Originally posted by bradybaker I'll be happy to post summaries of some of the studies if you'd be interested. Absolutely. I got my info from scientific American, MINDS. IS this similar to being susceptible to hypnosis? I think we all have child hood memories that may have become mixed up in the whole scheme of things. Perhaps certain things never happened. I would like to think all those times I have passed out drunk were all false memories. OR woke up next to this -----> I think people sometimes have the need to point to something for the problems that persist in their lives.

[justme]

But arn't if your being abused it's more of a continous thing? And if you were to plant false meomies for that wont u just forget your whole childhood?

[Howie]

Originally posted by justme But arn't if your being abused it's more of a continous thing? And if you were to plant false meomies for that wont u just forget your whole childhood? As suggested, it is just a series of events that your mind could manifest, Much like a daydream. So events are small fragments of made up false thoughts and not a whole Childhood. There are cases where the whole ordeal is so traumatic for an individual that they do suppress their memories. Even long term interactions. That is what makes this so F*#$! up because what do you believe and what don't you?

[justme]

[quote] As suggested, it is just a series of events that your mind could manifest, Much like a daydream. So events are small fragments of made up false thoughts and not a whole Childhood. There are cases where the whole ordeal is so traumatic for an individual that they do suppress their memories. Even long term interactions. That is what makes this so F*#$! up because what do you believe and what don't you? Umm so I'm confused, like if u get wacked on ever once in a while wont that be easyier to false memories instead of being abused controlling controlling ur life? and wheres summarie of this thingy never heard of false memories, least not for this reason.

[Howie]

Originally posted by justme Umm so I'm confused, like if u get wacked on ever once in a while wont that be easyier to false memories instead of being abused controlling controlling ur life? and wheres summarie of this thingy never heard of false memories, least not for this reason. It may be easier to create false memories with the power of suggestion. But our brains have a unique way of saving itself. So rather than have a mental breakdown your brain may instead subdue such memories as opposed to dealing with them. This often comes back to haunt people later. (Underlying reasons) But at the time your brain did what it felt was necessary to keep going. Does that make any sense?

[kichu]

[quote] It may be easier to create false memories with the power of suggestion. But our brains have a unique way of saving itself. So rather than have a mental breakdown your brain may instead subdue such memories as opposed to dealing with them. This often comes back to haunt people later. (Underlying reasons) But at the time your brain did what it felt was necessary to keep going. Does that make any sense? Yes, it makes sense. Or your brain keeps some of the memory and distorts it to the point where you're ok with it. I often wonder how much of some of my childhood memories are real and how much I changed to be ok with them.

[justme]

Originally posted by kichu Yes, it makes sense. Or your brain keeps some of the memory and distorts it to the point where you're ok with it. I often wonder how much of some of my childhood memories are real and how much I changed to be ok with them. Hey forgive me I'm an idoit and this false memories actually a scinefic thingy? Like chips or machine ray gun thingys, it seems to make more sense for it to be a pyschology thing like u said It may be easier to create false memories with the power of suggestion[/b]

[kichu]

Originally posted by justme Hey forgive me I'm an idoit :Laughing: and this false memories actually a scinefic thingy? Like chips or machine ray gun thingys, it seems to make more sense for it to be a pyschology thing like u said I'm not sure I understand your question. I believe psychology and science are linked, are they not?

[bradybaker]

I'll start with the general concept, then move into specifics. All information is paraphrased from the textbook 'Cognition 4th Ed.' by Mark H. Ashcroft (the text for my Cognitive Psych class this term). The Misinformation Effect Several studies have confirmed that people often claim to remember certain misinformation. The typical study invovles a video or slides of a car accident where one car runs a stop sign. Later, they are exposed to a narrative of the same accident. One group of participants recieves a neutral narrative account, no mention of any type of sign or traffic volation is made. The other group however is exposed to a specific narrative mentioning the presence of a yield sign. Then, both group perform a simple yes/no recognition task, at some point they are asked, "was there a stop sign or a yield sign?". The common result shows that the misled subjects have 20% lower accuracy on the recognition task than the groups not exposed to misinformation. Furthermore, the misled group shows faster reaction times in their incorrect judgements than in their correct ones. This suggests that their initial reaction is confidence in the misinformation, then they must take a second to think in order to come up with the right judgement. Misinformation Acceptance Basically this is an explanation of the Misinformation Effect. It posits that participants in such 'car crash' studies accept additional information as having been part of an earlier experience without actually remembering that information. For example, the participant might not remember seeing a yield sign, but they are more than willing to go along with the information in the narrative. In short, people often become quite certain about such 'secondhand' memories and disturbingly, these tendancies grow stronger as more and more time elapses. Implanted Memories Other work has shown how memories of events that never happened can be successfully implanted in participants. Early studies in this area involved telling participants some childhood stories about themselves that were supplied by the participants parents, however the experiment add in one story that is a complete fiction. A surprisingly large number of the participants eventually claim to 'remember' the fictional story. For example, none of the participants claimed to remember the 'pseudo-event' when first told about it, but by the third session of questioning, 25% claimed to remember it as true, often in detail. More recent work shows even more disturbing results. A group of researchers conducted a study where they attempted to implant a false childhood memory using a photograph. They used the same technique as in the earlier work (telling 2 childhood stories supplied by the parents and one fiction), but this time they used a photograph of one of the participants grade-school classes as a sort of 'memory cue'. In case you're interested, the pseudo-event used was a story about sneaking some Slime (that bright, gelatinous toy made by Mattel) into the teacher's desk. The participant were then asked to recall all that they could about the events in the stories and come in for more questioning after a week had passed. They were also encouraged to "work at remembering more about the events" during the week. I'll summarize the results here. After Session 1: 35% had no memories of the pseudo-event 30% claimed to remember the pseudo-event 35% claimed to remember some images of the event, but did not remember doing it. After Session 2: 21% had no memories of event 67% claimed to remember the pseudo-event 12% claimed to remember some images of the event, but did not remember doing it. Results were significantly lower in control groups that were not shown the photo as a memory cue (about 20% claimed to remember the event after session 2). Interestingly, the researchers also reported that after they told the subjects that the Slime event never happened, the subjects expressed surprise... "You mean that didn't happen to me?!"

[Placebo]

Interesting brady, reminds me of an episode on Discovery Channel that discussed the way we think. At the end they made the point that we aren't nearly as aware of things as we think, and are far more selective than we'd care to admit. As part of the proof... they asked the viewers if they noticed anything strange in the program. I certainly hadn't, and neither had my wife. They proceeded to show snippets of the program, and showed numerous times that a wierdo in a gorilla suit was doing some pretty obvious things. And all of this took place on the screen without us noticing it.

[justme]

A group of researchers conducted a study where they attempted to implant a false childhood memory using a photograph. [/b] how they use the photograph thingy? like in there sleep?or they show the photograph but it pictuced something that might remind them of that experiance? I'm not sure I understand your question. I believe psychology and science are linked, are they not?[/b] Ha! now who's confused! lol jk, i mean like a person can use psychology just by saying a certain thing at a certain time like Howetzer said like the power of suggestion, but i mean i dont think they can created a false memory by just planting some scince chip in ur mind, think human mind a little too complex for that but that's justme

[bradybaker]

Originally posted by justme how they use the photograph thingy? like in there sleep?or they show the photograph but it pictuced something that might remind them of that experiance? They just showed it to them while they were asking them to remember the childhood stories to cue up more memories of the events.

[kichu]

Originally posted by justme Ha! now who's confused! lol jk, i mean like a person can use psychology just by saying a certain thing at a certain time like Howetzer said like the power of suggestion, but i mean i dont think they can created a false memory by just planting some scince chip in ur mind, think human mind a little too complex for that but that's justme I haven't read this entire thread but I'm pretty sure nobody is talking about implanting a chip in your brain. When we talk about false memories we mean by way of power of suggestion/hypnosis, etc. You guys should read the book "Strangers" by Dean Koontz. Kind of fluffy reading but so entertaining and it deals exactly with what we're talking about here. In regards to our brains being to complex to allow a chip to create false memories, I highly doubt that's true. We're doing crazy things technologically. They're now talking about video games in the near future where a device would be inserted into your cerebral cortex so that you can manipulate the characters in the game through your brain activity. And if we can create false memories by the mere power of suggestion, it stand to reason that some sort of man-made device implanted into your brain would be highly superior in terms of creating false memories.

[justme]

Originally posted by bradybaker They just showed it to them while they were asking them to remember the childhood stories to cue up more memories of the events. cool have the photo? I haven't read this entire thread but I'm pretty sure nobody is talking about implanting a chip in your brain.[/b] ya thats what i figured i think its a subconius thing like the photo has things that makes u think other things but ur not really thinking other things thats why i think seeing the photo might be cool see if we can macth em up if thats the case. They're now talking about video games in the near future where a device would be inserted into your cerebral cortex so that you can manipulate the characters in the game through your brain activity. And if we can create false memories by the mere power of suggestion, it stand to reason that some sort of man-made device implanted into your brain would be highly superior in terms of creating false memories.[/b] cool that might have something to do with the refelxes of brain more than actual thoughs but thats justme

[bradybaker]

cool have the photo?[/b] No...the photo was an actual photo of the participants grade school class, supplied by their parents. So it was different for each person.

[Howie]

Thanks for that Bradybaker! Research has also shown that our real memories can get distorted over time. That coupled with suggestion, can cause issues with identifying suspects and fabricating things in the court room.

[justme]

Originally posted by bradybaker No...the photo was an actual photo of the participants grade school class, supplied by their parents. So it was different for each person. whoa cool they edit it? or it have something else to do with the false mermoy thing?

[Howie]

Originally posted by kichu In regards to our brains being to complex to allow a chip to create false memories, I highly doubt that's true. *We're doing crazy things technologically. *They're now talking about video games in the near future where a device would be inserted into your cerebral cortex so that you can manipulate the characters in the game through your brain activity. *And if we can create false memories by the mere power of suggestion, it stand to reason that some sort of man-made device implanted into your brain would be highly superior in terms of creating false memories. They are up to some crazy stuff. There is discussion now of deleting memories. I have not read the article yet. I will follow up on it after I read it. Nice avatar kichu

[bradybaker]

Originally posted by justme whoa cool they edit it? or it have something else to do with the false mermoy thing? Nope, just a regular picture.