would it be a sin?

If you hate them enough that you really want to kill them, that's when it becomes like murder and is a sin.

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Originally Posted by Jeremysr

If you hate them enough that you really want to kill them, that's when it becomes like murder and is a sin.

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If you had a valid reason to hate someone to the point where you wished he would die (e.g. he raped and/or murdered your wife, mother, or sister), would you consider yourself a sinner? I find a lot of these religious interpretations a bit far-fetched.

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Originally Posted by Lonewolf

If you look at the context and cross-reference you can tell which parts of the bible is symbolic. I can show you an example if you want. Also, where in the bible does it say to kill homosexuals? Please quote it.

If you feel bad about yourself you feel guilty and that would mean something hurt your conscience--which would be your morals,
Definition of conscience: the inner sense of what is right or wrong in one's conduct or motives, impelling one toward right action
Also, yes God is forgiving, everyone sins and he forgives them. What he hates is people who PRACTICE sin, who actualy seek it out.

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Really, God doesn't hate anyone, but just has a righteous anger towards that person who seeks out sin. People who practice sin normally don't do it on purpose. For example: porn. It's not my weakness, but some of my friends, and they don't want to practice that sin, yet they still do because they're only human. My point is: people who seek sin out, God doesn't hate; he's probably just disappointed or angry at that person.

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Originally Posted by lagunagirl

answer to first question: God has that right, he's the person who commanded people NOT to do that until they're married and to only do that with the opposite gender
second question: no, being bisexual wont give you an eternity in hell, because there are ways to get to heaven even if you do sin, if that wasn't true then EVERYONE would be damned to hell because it's absolutely IMPOSSIBLE to go a lifetime without doing one wrong thing. also, one sin isn't enough to damn you to hell unless it's very serious like murder or suicide, and still even after that if you feel bad enough about it and repent there are still ways

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Even if you murder, you can still be forgiven for that sin. If it's suicide, you can probably still be forgiven for that and go to heaven for that. I'm pretty sure that's right; I should check it out.

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Originally Posted by dsr

If you had a valid reason to hate someone to the point where you wished he would die (e.g. he raped and/or murdered your wife, mother, or sister), would you consider yourself a sinner? I find a lot of these religious interpretations a bit far-fetched.

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Yes, because I'm sure that if you hate them it must be because they sinned in some way. It's all a problem of sin. We shouldn't focus so much on sin anymore though, because we've been freed from it!

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Originally Posted by Jeremysr

We shouldn't focus so much on sin anymore though, because we've been freed from it!

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I keep having the feeling to say "right on brother/sister" When anyone says that.

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Originally Posted by dsr

If you had a valid reason to hate someone to the point where you wished he would die (e.g. he raped and/or murdered your wife, mother, or sister), would you consider yourself a sinner? I find a lot of these religious interpretations a bit far-fetched.

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Absolutely. While I consider myself very religious (I practice regularly and follow it constantly), much of what the old/new testament says I don't believe is supposed to be taken literally or to the extreme. Plus, with all the years that have passed, re translating, and the gap of time between when the teachings were spoken to when they were written down, how can one trust the holy books 100%. I'm sure that the basic meaning is still there, but, especially in Catholicism where corrupt popes revised the bible, the bible and such can't be completely accurate and therefore should not be interpreted the way some do.

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Plus, with all the years that have passed, re translating, and the gap of time between when the teachings were spoken to when they were written down, how can one trust the holy books 100%.

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Because it is God's Word, and his Word never changes. The Old Testament was only translated twice by the way: Orginally Hebrew > Greek > English. The New testament, I think was originally in Greek, and translated right from Greek to English.

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Originally Posted by Aphius

She's not talking about it's relevance to Lucid Dreaming, she's referring to the amount of religious talk within this thread.

In regard to lucid dreaming or not, things regarding religion are kept in the religion section usually for good reason.
Anyway, "would it be a sin?" how much more of a religious thread is there? We've kind of figured out that it's subjective. Each person thinks something different, and you're not going to get a definitive answer to such a question.

Personally I think this does need moving.

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i didn't know there was a religion section! sorry, i guess i'm a bigger noob than i thought i was

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Originally Posted by lindsey609

Even if you murder, you can still be forgiven for that sin. If it's suicide, you can probably still be forgiven for that and go to heaven for that. I'm pretty sure that's right; I should check it out.

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oh yeah, sorry i should have been more clear, that's what i meant when I said "there are still ways"

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Originally Posted by Jeremysr

Because it is God's Word, and his Word never changes. The Old Testament was only translated twice by the way: Originally Hebrew > Greek > English. The New testament, I think was originally in Greek, and translated right from Greek to English.

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You have to keep in mind that although it is the word of God it is written by the hand of man. So while the overall message is still there, there will be imperfections. The writings in the Old Testament were often written so long after the event it would be the equivalent of writing the first account of the battle of Hastings today!!
The Bible is still very important and should be used as a guide but I do not think everything in it should be taken as literal fact.


As for committing a sin in a LD I think it comes down to respect of a fellow human being. We are told to love one another and so any act of violence, lust etc towards another human being is disrespectful and so a sin. It is not hurting anyone no, but it is disrespecting that individual, a child of God.

Violence in a game or against random DCs cannot be seen as sinful because not only is it not harming anyone it isn't disrespecting anyone either.

as for being dammed to hell - I do not see hell as a "place" rather a state of being. I do not see a day of judgment from God (I cannot see God condemning or there being separation from God) rather our spirits living with that we have created e.g. negative thoughts creates negative outcomes (cause and effect, Karma....). You may then ask what is the point of forgiveness if we are not judged, I see it as removing the sin removes the negative state of being aka hell. One last point on this subject I cannot agree with the fact that we don't have to worry about sin anymore, if that were true Jesus would not have sent his disciples to teach and forgive sins.

On the effect of violence or sex in a game or an LD;

"All that we are is the result of what we have thought. The mind is everything. What we think we become." - Buddha.

It has been proven our thoughts alone effect everything. Anger can turn body fluids acidic (this has even caused lactating woman to unknowing kill their babies). We surround ourselves with happiness we will become happy, we surround ourselves with violence we will become violent. How many times have you wanted to smash your fist through the PC screen when you keep dying in a game?

Wow my longest post yet!! sorry about that!
Bushido

Well, although I'm agnostic, and really don't have a religious stance, other than I'm not sure what happens in the hereafter, I don't think it is a 'sin'. But, I think you're pretty much lowering your character, if you do something you would not do in real life...I mean, either way if you feel it is wrong, why do it at all? I mean, when you can do anything, why would rape or murder feel appealing? The violence that resides at the subconscious level can be more dangerous than the violence on the forefront of your mind.

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Originally Posted by lindsey609

Really, God doesn't hate anyone, but just has a righteous anger...

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That's classic! I don't want to kill you I'm just giving you a righteous dose of death. Not even close to the same thing at all :rolleyes:

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Originally Posted by Gwendolyn

...I don't think it is a 'sin'. But, I think you're pretty much lowering your character, if you do something you would not do in real life...I mean, either way if you feel it is wrong, why do it at all? I mean, when you can do anything, why would rape or murder feel appealing? The violence that resides at the subconscious level can be more dangerous than the violence on the forefront of your mind.

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Well spoken, Gwendolyn.

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Originally Posted by Jeremysr

We shouldn't focus so much on sin anymore though, because we've been freed from it!

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but it's still our responsibility to do the right thing and try not to sin, because the only way we ARE freed from it is through repentance. It's not like we can just go around doing whatever we want thinking that we wont have the sins. We would have to repent after we sin and it's not right to just go around doing bad things thinking "it's ok, i can just repent" that's a sin in itself

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Originally Posted by -Almost

I think this question all makes no sense.
Becuase it is all personal opinion to decide if something is a sin to you.

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I wanted to know what people thought about it... so yes it does make sense that I would want to know people's opinions on it, why else did I post this thread?

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Originally Posted by Oneironaught

That's classic! I don't want to kill you I'm just giving you a righteous dose of death. Not even close to the same thing at all :rolleyes:

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actually what lindsay said about God having righteous anger towards people makes sense. He really doesn't hate anyone, he just has good reason to be mad at some people. He didn't hate hitler because hitler was his child, but he definately had reason to be angry with him!
"i'm just giving you a righteous dose of death" ? that didn't make sense

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Originally Posted by Nefarious

Religious people are quite simple minded

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did you know Albert Einstein was religious?

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Originally Posted by a_pirates_life_for_me

did you know Albert Einstein was religious?

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What religion was he and what sort of things did he practice?

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Originally Posted by Lonewolf

First of all, I don't believe in hell. The teaching of a literal hellfire where people burn eternally is unscriptural actualy. (Hell in the bible is actualy reffered to as the grave)

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Hell isn't a literal fire where people burn eternally. Most people dont have the right idea about heaven and hell and they think that those are the only places you can go after you die. this part, lonewolf, i'm not referring to you, but to anyone who would care to read. There are actually 4 "kingdoms of Glory"
1: Heaven, of course, referred to as the sun (figuratively) for any righteous people that have accepted God and Jesus, People that didn't ever learn of the gospel, but God knew they would accept it if they did, children before they reach the age of 8, and mentally handicapped people.
2: The Terrestial Kingdom, the second highest level, represents the moon (again, figuratively) for righteous and good people that did not accept the gospel
3: the Tellestial Kingdom, of course, the third highest level, represents the stars for people such as theives, drug users-dealers sometimes murderers and rapists, adulterers, etc. that felt guilt and remorse after their sins but did nothing about it. The tellesial kingdom is actually said to be so beautiful that it would be absolute paradise compared to the world we live in today
4: Hell represents outer darkness... (which is another name for it) for murderers, rapists, etc. that didn't really care that they sinned and did it consistently and ISN'T a place where people burn eternally, but is pretty much just like the world we live in today, and not much better (which would be hell enough for me, with all the crap we have going on in this world)

even if you would fit into the tellestial kingdom "category" (hopefully there are no murderers or rapists here on this thread) you could still repent and be saved and still go to heaven during the millenium, which is a long topic that I'm not going to explain.
Just a little insight there, wow with people like me making posts like this, this thread really SHOULD be in the religious section. that didn't have anything to do with lucid dreaming, sorry luv2dream

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Originally Posted by Mes Tarrant

What religion was he and what sort of things did he practice?

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He was jewish and practiced some of their religious traditions, but through adulthood he wasnt part of a specific religion, he just believed in God. He was against athiesm (if I spelled that right) (and being religious doesn't mean that you are part of a certain religion to the point where you can call yourself a lutheran, catholic, mormon, etc. but that you simply believe in God - not that there's anything wrong with being in a specific religion)

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Originally Posted by a_pirates_life_for_me

did you know Albert Einstein was religious?

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And did you know that Einstein slept with - and eventually married - his cousin? So, religion isn't a free pass by any stretch of the imagination. And this is coming from a guy who has deep respect for Einstein's brain and works.

Oh, and did I mention that by doing so, Einstein ruined what he had with his REAL wife? Praise God. I'm glad religion saved yet another soul.

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Originally Posted by Oneironaught

And did you know that Einstein slept with - and eventually married - his cousin? So, religion isn't a free pass by any stretch of the imagination.

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Was I talking about who he slept with and married? was I saying that religion is a free pass? No. Nefarious said "religious people are simple minded" well einstein - a not so simple minded person - was religious. I said nothing whatsoever about anything else in einstein's life besides the fact that he - and other people - can be religious and NOT simple minded at the same time

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Originally Posted by a_pirates_life_for_me

He was jewish and practiced some of their religious traditions, but through adulthood he wasnt part of a specific religion, he just believed in God. He was against athiesm (if I spelled that right) (and being religious doesn't mean that you are part of a certain religion to the point where you can call yourself a lutheran, catholic, mormon, etc. but that you simply believe in God - not that there's anything wrong with being in a specific religion)

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No, he was actually an atheist in the sense that he didn't believe in the Judeo-Christian-Islamic God. He did believe that a greater force possibly existed -- i.e. true intelligent design (as opposed to creationism masked as intelligent design) -- but he explicitly said that he did not believe in the "God" who rewards the righteous and punishes the wrongdoers. Unfortunately, his quotes are often taken out of context by creationists. Although he was Jewish and partook in the traditions, he did not believe in religion. Interestingly though, when he attended Catholic school (go figure) as a young boy, he was so good at the religion classes that the other (Catholic) students often came to him for help.

Thank you, dsr.

a_pirates_life_for_me: I was pointing out that your argument of "Einstein's being religious" was moot because he obviously wasn't religious in the traditional sense.

Oneironaught, your welcome.

a_pirates_life_for_me, although Einstein was not a good example, there have been many religious people who were not simple-minded. One such example is Sir Isaac Newton, one of the most brilliant minds ever in science and mathematics. I think Newton serves your point fine. Judging by the Church's treatment of many other scientists during the Scientific Revolution, Newton would never have been knighted in his day if he hadn't been so religious.

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Originally Posted by dsr

Oneironaught, your welcome.

a_pirates_life_for_me, although Einstein was not a good example, there have been many religious people who were not simple-minded.

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I don't want to somehow get lumped into people thinking that I've somehow claimed (even by omission) that religious=simple-minded. The two have nothing to do with each other. I have very good [highly-religious] friends who are brilliant people.

On the other hand, I would never use "being religious" as a basis for any one's validity on any issue. I think intellectual endeavors require intellectual processes, not a foundation of faith.