Fall asleep too easily while WILDing.

Alright I've been trying to WILD for about a week and a half now and for the last couple of days as the title suggests I'm able to fall asleep too easily. I'm laying there counting to 10 and then pow! I'm in a dream and i completely forget everything about WILDing and it just becomes a normal dream. What's really surprising is i don't even seem to notice going into SP or anything, I'm just laying there for a couple minutes and then I'm in a dream. It's rather trouble some and i always forget that I'm dreaming the second i enter into the dream. About a couple hours ago i actually caught myself doing it while in the dream but instead of becoming lucid i just woke up!!! any advice or techniques you guys have would be helpful because this has happened a lot and I'm kind of getting pissed.

im the opposite
i cant fall asleep fast enough

I also had the opposite problem when starting WILD but now it seems I have your problem. The thing about WILD'ing is that they are not possible without you actually falling asleep, but you have to re awaken your mind quickly, shortly before entering sleep paralysis, when you get to SP you will know it, its unmistakeable and I doubt you will only experience heaviness. Try staying up for longer before going back to sleep if you are doing a WBTB

I didn't say i don't know if i went into SP I'm sure i did (i really don't know how to describe the feeling. for me its nothing like heaviness or HI its like my mind is going down deeper and deeper and of course my limbs get numb). I've experienced SP before (I woke up but kept my eyes shut and i couldn't move for a couple minutes) so i know what to look for its just i seem to be skipping a few steps whenever i try to WILD so i thought i would get some advice.

EDIT: i just tried to WILD again before making this post and it seems like i was at the last stage before i could enter a dream and then i had to swallow! which has never been a real big issue before and it was REALLY hard to do so because i was in SP. Has anyone had trouble like this before?

Just make your WBTB longer than you usually do. Increase the time before you go back to sleep

Maybe DEILD is more your thing Duffles?

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Originally Posted by fOrceez

Just make your WBTB longer than you usually do. Increase the time before you go back to sleep

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Yup...forceez is right, if you're falling out too early, lengthen your Back to Bed time. If your WBTB happens to be something like 30 minutes, then I would suggest sleeping a little bit longer than you normally do for your WILD attempts.

having the same problem .., can't sleep ''normally'' when trying a WILD .I think the ''trying'' is the problem and blocks the natural development of the sleeping process , but i don't find any other way to have it than ''trying'' to have it !

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Originally Posted by Duffles22

Alright I've been trying to WILD for about a week and a half now and for the last couple of days as the title suggests I'm able to fall asleep too easily. I'm laying there counting to 10 and then pow! I'm in a dream and i completely forget everything about WILDing and it just becomes a normal dream. What's really surprising is i don't even seem to notice going into SP or anything, I'm just laying there for a couple minutes and then I'm in a dream. It's rather trouble some and i always forget that I'm dreaming the second i enter into the dream. About a couple hours ago i actually caught myself doing it while in the dream but instead of becoming lucid i just woke up!!! any advice or techniques you guys have would be helpful because this has happened a lot and I'm kind of getting pissed.

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Perhaps you can try this... It worked for me and may work for you. This is a method I developed before I came across DreamViews, (which is where I learned that I had to allow the "energy" to take over).

When in pursuit of SP, don't try and force things to happen, don't block things out from your awareness; instead, let your mind bring them into your awareness naturally without trying to force them in. Just allow yourself to completely "zone out" and let your awareness take over in a thoughtless way, drifting from one focus to the next. Don't look towards a goal, don't think about a goal; instead, be aware of the darkness and on occasion, check how your body feels as you rest. As you continue with your WILD, your mind will naturally drop the unnecessary things it is aware of. and all that will remain will be the darkness, hypnagogic hallucinations, and the sensation of your body going deeper into a state of sleep paralysis.

Once sleep paralysis has been achieved, you need to relax yourself even further. You can accomplish this by mentally repeating something like "relax deeper" or "relax further". Every time you say this phrase, try and actually feel yourself sinking deeper and deeper, (don't repeat the phrase again until you have felt yourself sink deeper). Also, try and synchronize the phrase you use with your breathing. As you say "relax", breathe in, and as you say "deeper", breathe out. Then allow yourself to pause for about 3-4 seconds before breathing in again, (try not to count the seconds or you will fall asleep). Remember to be aware of this pause or you might fall asleep. Just keep repeating this for a while and stop for a minute then repeat. Eventually you will come to a point where you feel a surge of energy trying to take over your body, (it will feel like you are falling asleep), just let the energy take over.

Also read this:

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On occasion, I also shout to myself mentally "I'm aware! I'm aware! I'm aware! I'm aware!" as I go deeper into sleep paralysis as well as during sleep paralysis. This keeps me aware enough to continue my WILD and not fall asleep and into unconsciousness. Trying this might lengthen the time in which it take to reach that "WILD" moment (as you put it), but it will decrease or eliminate the chance of failing your WILD.

You might want to memorize a single goal you want to accomplish before you begin your WILD -- play it out a few times and say to yourself, "I will be calm". Once you have entered sleep paralysis remember that goal and play it out again and say to yourself once more, "I will be calm".

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There is no right way or wrong way to WILD, so please be aware that I'm not forcing you to do anything. Just see where you get with what I've suggested.

Nice observations DynoTAP , my problem is that while I try to do what u said (relaxing myself in my own awareness and let things happen ) 2 things may occur : 1.i forget totally about my intention to have a WILD and to be aware of the hipnagogic state , which brings me to a normal dream , and 2. when vibrations and that feeling of ''energy trying to take over your body'' as u said comes on , i say to myself that i'm near the moment to ''enter'' into the dream and that makes those vibrations and so go off and returns me to the previous state . So , in conclusion , or I forget my intention of making a WILD and I normal dream , or I become too much ''excited'' when reaching the ''WILD'' moment and that returns me to the normal awaken state. Any solution?

In an attempt to answer your question,

On occasion, I also shout to myself mentally "I'm aware! I'm aware! I'm aware! I'm aware!" as I go deeper into sleep paralysis as well as during sleep paralysis. This keeps me aware enough to continue my WILD and not fall asleep and into unconsciousness. Trying this might lengthen the time in which it take to reach that "WILD" moment (as you put it), but it will decrease or eliminate the chance of failing your WILD.

You might want to memorize a single goal you want to accomplish before you begin your WILD -- play it out a few times and say to yourself, "I will be calm". Once you have entered sleep paralysis remember that goal and play it out again and say to yourself once more, "I will be calm".

actually , how many WILDs have u had?¿ I say it because my purpose is to find a method to have a lucid dream at my will , when I want , and It seems like the people who use WILD method have the same problems I have

I started learning about lucid dreaming, devising my own method as I learned -- this was just before joining DV -- I was able to go all the way to that burst of energy within one or two weeks. I joined DV because of that energy I felt. I didn't know if I it was supposed to take over or not. I managed to get one lucid dream in by accident, I attempted a WILD and what seemed like a minute later, I fell into a dream without a transition.

When I joined DV I started taking too much advice and began changing the way I practiced. Since doing so, Ive been unable to WILD. There is another side to the story though, I had been changing medications a lot and hadn't been able to focus on WILDing at all as I was just too sleepy.

I have no doubts about my first method though, (the one I've just written). It remains "untainted" if I may put it that way. I've only started practicing it again since a few days ago.

I used to have too that ''burst of energy'' as u called and for me it was something like the prechamber of the SP , nowadays I rarely feel that burst of energy and, honestly , I don't know why . The only conclusion more or less consistent that I made from those experinces was that even more I tried a technique or a procedure or a way to have lucid dreams , even more I felt difficult to fall sleep , to relax when I tried WILD and the tipical vibrations were less strong , so maybe the problem has more relation with us and our attitude than the thecnique or the steps used...really don't know u.U

That's a very true statement. In a series of later series of WILD attempts (but not so recent), I found that I was only "attempting" to have a WILD and not actually believing in myself. The key to success is not to "try" WILD, not to "attempt" a WILD, but rather to believe in ourselves in our journey with lucid dreaming.

To quote Mary Maddux "True meditation is effortless. When we're in a meditative state, we are without effort. We can't try to be effortless. The problem is when we sit to meditate, we feel that there is something we are trying to achieve, there's some right way to do it or wrong way to do it, right experience to have, wrong experience to have so it will be best to just let go of the goal of effortlessness. Just assume that in this meditation effortlessness will just happen.".

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Originally Posted by DynoTAP

That's a very true statement. In a series of later series of WILD attempts (but not so recent), I found that I was only "attempting" to have a WILD and not actually believing in myself. The key to success is not to "try" WILD, not to "attempt" a WILD, but rather to believe in ourselves in our journey with lucid dreaming.

To quote Mary Maddux "True meditation is effortless. When we're in a meditative state, we are without effort. We can't try to be effortless. The problem is when we sit to meditate, we feel that there is something we are trying to achieve, there's some right way to do it or wrong way to do it, right experience to have, wrong experience to have so it will be best to just let go of the goal of effortlessness. Just assume that in this meditation effortlessness will just happen.".

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So you're saying once you are in SP, go into a meditative state?

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Originally Posted by fOrceez

So you're saying once you are in SP, go into a meditative state?

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I was merely replying to genzor's statement.

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I used to have too that ''burst of energy'' as u called and for me it was something like the prechamber of the SP , nowadays I rarely feel that burst of energy and, honestly , I don't know why . The only conclusion more or less consistent that I made from those experinces was that even more I tried a technique or a procedure or a way to have lucid dreams , even more I felt difficult to fall sleep , to relax when I tried WILD and the tipical vibrations were less strong , so maybe the problem has more relation with us and our attitude than the thecnique or the steps used...really don't know u.U

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To answer your question:
You would already be meditating before you even get to sleep paralysis -- or at least you should be. WILDing by itself could be considered a form of meditation.

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Originally Posted by fOrceez

Just make your WBTB longer than you usually do. Increase the time before you go back to sleep

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I haven't been doing WBTB. lol. i've been trying WILDing at around 8 pm without any prior sleep before. And before you scream at me and tell me its almost impossible to WILD without sleep before whenever i do do a WILD at around 8 i either fail and stay up or fall asleep and go RIGHT INTO A DREAM. so i don't think its my REM cycle that is screwing it up. The problem is i fall asleep too easily.

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Originally Posted by Duffles22

I haven't been doing WBTB. lol. i've been trying WILDing at around 8 pm without any prior sleep before. And before you scream at me and tell me its almost impossible to WILD without sleep before whenever i do do a WILD at around 8 i either fail and stay up or fall asleep and go RIGHT INTO A DREAM. so i don't think its my REM cycle that is screwing it up. The problem is i fall asleep too easily.

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Do you start your WILD with the intention of being aware by the time you enter your dream?

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Originally Posted by DynoTAP

Do you start your WILD with the intention of being aware by the time you enter your dream?

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Apparently not, i just tried a WILD at around 8 and I'm just waking up from a normal dream! GAHHHH! i remember even starting it. I work at a library and the dream was basically me re shelving books for an hour! Lame.... Although funny thing i woke up and heard my roommate typing on his laptop and remember that it was the sound one of the people in my dream was making on the computer. 0.o

If your gonna try it at that time without prior sleep, and you say that you always dream but just non lucidly, maybe try DEILD'ing right after waking

I've never tried DEILDing but i think it would be hard to train myself not to move after i wake up. I usually roll around almost automatically. You know, wake up, punch the pillow a couple times, turn to the other side, go back to sleep, kind of cycle.

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Originally Posted by Duffles22

I haven't been doing WBTB. lol. i've been trying WILDing at around 8 pm without any prior sleep before. And before you scream at me and tell me its almost impossible to WILD without sleep before whenever i do do a WILD at around 8 i either fail and stay up or fall asleep and go RIGHT INTO A DREAM. so i don't think its my REM cycle that is screwing it up. The problem is i fall asleep too easily.

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It is possible to WILD that way, but it can be much harder. It's very interesting that you go right into REM sleep when you first go to bed. That's pretty unusual. Normally NREM sleep is what you begin with and it dominates for the first half of the night. However, in the very first sleep stages before you totally black out, it is normal to experience some dreamlike images and sounds. Even though you're getting REM right away when you sleep, I'd recommend at least trying WBTB after sleeping 6 hours, or else trying WILD during a nap. If you're falling asleep within ten seconds of laying down, it's going to be an uphill battle to try to WILD in that state. It pretty much means you're too tired. So my advice is try to WILD when you're not quite so exhausted.

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Originally Posted by Duffles22

Apparently not, i just tried a WILD at around 8 and I'm just waking up from a normal dream! GAHHHH! i remember even starting it. I work at a library and the dream was basically me re shelving books for an hour! Lame.... Although funny thing i woke up and heard my roommate typing on his laptop and remember that it was the sound one of the people in my dream was making on the computer. 0.o

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How far do you usually get before you start drifting off? I found that I really needed a heightened sense of awareness. If you're not getting very far, trying KingYoshi's "Dry Spell Killer: The Actor's Technique", may work wonders. Using autosuggestion as a tool during the daytime and perhaps even while WILDing will become very helpful in your quest to have your first WILD experience.

Link to KingYoshi's Wild Technique (scroll down to find the "Dry Spell Killer" technique): http://www.dreamviews.com/f79/yoshis...chnique-82529/

Just takes practice like anything else.
But if you don't want to yeh, it's what works for you.

alright I'm going to post in this thread because i really don't want to make a new one. A little update. I think my problem was i was falling asleep to early in my SP for a successful WILD. I just tried to WILD again, and this time i did hear a LOUD snoring sound (not coming from me) but i got to excited and the SP wore off. For conformation that it wasn't me, i asked my roommate who was in the room when i was trying this if he heard me snore and said i wasn't! I've heard this loud snoring a couple times before, when i didn't know about lucid dreaming and i was just trying to get to sleep and i thought it was myself. Apperently my SP is a sneaky bastard and my brain likes to play tricks on me! >:O

Well now i know. going to try again tonight! =D

Super! You're getting somewhere. Was the feeling comparable to dunking your head into a tub of icy cold water? If so, that was the transition.

i couldn't tell. it seemed like as soon as it started it stopped. i can't maintain it! any advice there?

The only advice I can give you, is to do your best to give in to the sound, mentally tell yourself "I don't care, what happens.. happens.". It's the only way I was ever able to attain lucidity. I've only experienced the sounds twice and it was all in one go - I reached transition but was overwhelmed by it. I was still in sleep paralysis so I tried once more. You won't always be greeted by a loud noise when you transition though I'm not very sure about how true that statement is... I may have to ask around and perhaps do some of my own research.

I haven't asked enough about it so I myself don't have much advice for you.

in my own experience , excitation makes those vibrations go off , and indifference makes the normal process (it's a normal process that goes on every night, with the difference u are aware of it when u do WILD) go on . It's difficult not to go excited because we usually make that kind of feelings like SP , vibrations or hypnagogic as a ''goal'' or a sign to lucid dreaming, and that makes us to get excited , so the solution is to know that's a sign that we're doing things well , but also to know that our excitement about that will make those vibrations or whatever to go off .

Heck, I think I need to take coffee out of my diet. I've been unable to attain sleep paralysis for too long.

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Originally Posted by Duffles22

alright I'm going to post in this thread because i really don't want to make a new one. A little update. I think my problem was i was falling asleep to early in my SP for a successful WILD. I just tried to WILD again, and this time i did hear a LOUD snoring sound (not coming from me) but i got to excited and the SP wore off. For conformation that it wasn't me, i asked my roommate who was in the room when i was trying this if he heard me snore and said i wasn't! I've heard this loud snoring a couple times before, when i didn't know about lucid dreaming and i was just trying to get to sleep and i thought it was myself. Apperently my SP is a sneaky bastard and my brain likes to play tricks on me! >:O

Well now i know. going to try again tonight! =D

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Nice job. :D

A big part of mastering WILD is getting to know your body's own personal cues. Next time you hear loud snoring noises, you'll know to keep relaxing and you might want to try visualizing a scene or your hand in front of your face or something.

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Originally Posted by Naiya

Nice job. :D

A big part of mastering WILD is getting to know your body's own personal cues. Next time you hear loud snoring noises, you'll know to keep relaxing and you might want to try visualizing a scene or your hand in front of your face or something.

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The big problem I'm having now is whenever i do hear loud snoring noises i snap out of it. It's hard to explain but usually whenever i hear loud noises from SP I'm already seeing images and my mind has already made a plot for it (just like in a dream) so whenever i do recognize these noises I'm already so wrapped up with this dream that i basically wake up and the noises stop and the SP gets less intense.
Every time i try a WILD this happens. I'm kind of stuck. any advice there?

Have you tried mentally preparing yourself for the sounds in your spare time?

Here's something I dug up from an older thread of mine:

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Originally Posted by Raphael

Just relax, and realize that you're perfectly safe. If you start to freak out then your chances of getting through it are pretty slim. I don't know if that's the problem you have though.

Basically I treat it like some more HI, and at the point of SP I start to visualize a dream scape so that I can VILD.

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And another (not quite what you're looking for though):

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Originally Posted by Hyu

During my first WILD attempts I thought that I had to visualize a dreamscape in order to transition into a dream.
I tried to do this rather forcefully as soon as I thought my body was fully paralyzed, which was too soon as I found out later.

Then I tried to do it without visualizations at all, just letting the HI form into a dream, which resulted in my first successful WILDS.
I noticed that during my first attempts, where I tried to visualize, I was nowhere near full SP, which I assume is why it didn't work.

After feeling paralyzed, there are more stages where I gradually loose the sensation of gravity and finally, of having a body at all.
I also feel extremely lightheaded at this stage. (this is where I start trying to visualize)

Keep in mind that these are my own experiences though, and SP is somewhat different for everyone.

As for "scary sensations", I sometimes get some sort of a feeling of uneasiness.
I visualize a very peaceful and calm scene if this happens, usually a beach at dawn.

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Any new updates on how you are doing with your WILDs?

Well i tried to WILD during a WBTB last night and i entered into almost full SP in a minute or two (hearing the sound of water being poured) but then i spent the next hour and a half in that state. Although i did feel a slight vibrating feeling a couple times but each time it came it only lasted around 5 seconds. After a while the sound stopped and i had my arm up over my head and it was KILLING ME! so i gave up. I've never felt the vibrating feeling before and I've heard from other more successful WILDers that its a good thing so i guess another step in the right direction.

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Originally Posted by Duffles22

The big problem I'm having now is whenever i do hear loud snoring noises i snap out of it. It's hard to explain but usually whenever i hear loud noises from SP I'm already seeing images and my mind has already made a plot for it (just like in a dream) so whenever i do recognize these noises I'm already so wrapped up with this dream that i basically wake up and the noises stop and the SP gets less intense.
Every time i try a WILD this happens. I'm kind of stuck. any advice there?

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Hmm. Sometimes a random loud noise will happen and it can startle you. There's really not much you can do about that. As for the noises in general, you might try practicing some relaxation or meditation exercises outside of WILD attempts....that way it'll be easier for you to keep your cool and maintain your relaxation state when you do see and hear things. Meditation will also help you strengthen your focusing skills so your mind doesn't lose lucidity in the middle of the WILD.

Hi Duffles22,

any update as to how your lucid dreaming attempts are doing?

Hello duffles22, have there been any improvements concerning your WILDs? I've been meditating a lot lately, but am quite out of practice with WILDing. I am now having a similar problem to what you have described in this thread.

Cheers, hope all is well

Still struggling a bit. I been trying WBTBs with my WILD but I'm having the same problem. Seems like whenever I try to WILD I usually just accidentally fall asleep into a non-lucid dream.
Although I seem to be better at WILD during naps. I guess I'm way to sleepy during the night. I've gotten to SP but as soon as it kicks in my body tenses up and my heart starts racing. Grrrrrr!

Hi Duffles22,

I'm glad to hear that you're still at it. You could try this: Once you're in SP, start to imagine you head or (upper-body) floating downwards while "looking through" the back of your eyelids.*

One question before I go, how are you getting to SP? I'm struggling here.*

I've been doing too much meditation and too little WILDing. Recently, I combined the two together and now I fall asleep in 5 minutes - too easily in my opinion...

I found another technique that is like mine except the explanation is way better than mine, (there are a few differences though, ie. I focus on exhaling), so here it is: http://www.dreamviews.com/community/...ad.php?t=42110

A lot of the time when I try to WILD I try to not think to much. If you think about getting to SP or getting to successfully WILD you'll prevent yourself from doing it. Last night I woke up around 5 am and I was just trying to go back to sleep and maybe 2 minutes of just closing my eyes I realized that I was in SP, but when I realized I was that far my heart rate increased and I snapped out of it.

When I am trying to WILD I usually try to let myself daydream but not to get so wrapped up in it that the daydream I'm trying to passively observe doesn't turn into a non-lucid dream before I get past SP.

It's harder than it sounds. =D

Thank you for replying so soon! :)

It is indeed harder than it sounds which is why I want to conquer the WILD - hehe.. Get it? WILD/world? Nevermind :P. I no longer know what Im supposed to do before SP. I think the reason I started to meditate, I was hoping it would solve my problems and to a point, it did. I'm now able to get to feel "comfortably numb" :P. I certainly am getting closer to SP and am able to stay "thoughtless" during my meditation/WILD. In my mind the two are so closely linked that it just seems right to combine them into one practice... I just haven't succeeded yet.

Shucks I need to go somewhere I'll speak later and correct my mistakes after I get back.

Cheers, talk soon. :)