Swallowing when inducing sleep paralysis

Hey everyone, I ran a quick forum search before making this topic but I couldn't find what I was looking for so I decided to throw up the thread. I hope I didn't miss the answer to my question in another thread because that would make me look quite stupid.

Anyway, I have been trying to inducde sleep paralysis to try a WILD. Now, I have done some reading on the subject, watched some youtube clips and read the basic information of dreamviews on it so I reckon I get the general gist of it. Movement wise I know you should lie still as much as you can, although you can roll over according to some videos, you should then just lie still after doing that.

Whenever trying this myself I notice that my mouth becomes dry and I begin to feel an urge to swallow to make the dry feeling go away. For as far as I can sense this does not affect anything, although I have never been able to induce a WILD yet. My question is: can you swallow while trying to induce sleep paralysis or will that also send a signal to your body that the mind is not yet asleep?

Swallowing is a no, just like movement :)

Also, you shouldn't focus on getting to SP, you should focus on getting into the dream itself. Check out Sageous' WILD courses: WILD (Sageous)

You CAN swallow! It affects nothing. This problem pops up frequently on this forum. Where did you get the idea that you can't swallow?

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Originally Posted by dms111

You CAN swallow! It affects nothing. This problem pops up frequently on this forum. Where did you get the idea that you can't swallow?

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I have a yes and a no here now. Which one is correct? :P
I never read anywhere that you cannot swallow, but just that you should try not to move and should ignore the sensations that tell you you have to roll over, etc. If you do give in you will tell your body that you are awake and no sleep paralysis will be induced. By that logic, swallowing would be moving which would tell your body that you are awake. The reason that I am in doubt is that swallowing is something that happens automatically as well (to my knowledge), so your body may think nosthing of it. Hence the question.

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Originally Posted by Coen

I have a yes and a no here now. Which one is correct? :P
I never read anywhere that you cannot swallow, but just that you should try not to move and should ignore the sensations that tell you you have to roll over, etc. If you do give in you will tell your body that you are awake and no sleep paralysis will be induced. By that logic, swallowing would be moving which would tell your body that you are awake. The reason that I am in doubt is that swallowing is something that happens automatically as well (to my knowledge), so your body may think nosthing of it. Hence the question.

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That's the thing. Swallowing also occurs automatically, but it's not the same as intentionally forcing yourself to swallow... i'm sure it affects the attempt of WILD just like other movements. It might take a while, but you can learn to keep yourself from doing it completely while doing WILD.

If you're trying to WILD without pre sleep you're doing it wrong and you will fail. No amount of laying still or not swallowing will fix that

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Originally Posted by FlyingIceCream

If you're trying to WILD without pre sleep you're doing it wrong and you will fail. No amount of laying still or not swallowing will fix that

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It's possible like that too, since i succeeded twice, but true that it's much much harder and will take longer than usual... and it's not even worth it, since when i succeeded i found myself in a NREM dream both times.

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Originally Posted by FlyingIceCream

If you're trying to WILD without pre sleep you're doing it wrong and you will fail. No amount of laying still or not swallowing will fix that

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Thank you. I knew that, but you're right of course. My question was focused mainly on whether or not I can give in to the urge to swallow if I feel that my mouth becomes dry or if it is wiser not to.

WILDing isn't about holding your body perfectly still. The more you move, the harder it will be to WILD, that much is true. But it's not a real important aspect of the WILD. Swallowing does nothing more than maybe prevent you from falling asleep at the moment you do it. It not like it resets some biological countdown clock. We all know that frequently moving will make it harder to fall asleep. But it's not as if holding still for a certain amount of time will get you a WILD.

You perform a WILD by doing nothing more than staying aware as you fall asleep. You're not tricking your body or anything. It's very simple, but still difficult to do because it appears to be a contradiction of everything we think we know about sleep.

Hi there, if you need to swallow just swallow, nothing will make you fail your attempt more than constantly thinking "ohh god I need to swallow" "shall I swallow or not" "ohh god I'll ruin my attempt" and so on. Just swallow, get it out the way and just carry on it won't affect anything it will only help you to swallow if you feel the need :)

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Originally Posted by Coen

Thank you. I knew that, but you're right of course. My question was focused mainly on whether or not I can give in to the urge to swallow if I feel that my mouth becomes dry or if it is wiser not to.

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Ya, swallow. Every time I've gone to SP I fell asleep very briefly and then suddenly found my head to be buzzing. You're either primed for SP or you're not

This question has been asked by many people, even recently. It's a common concern among people trying to achieve a WILD.

The best advice, from others and in my own experience, is to be as comfortable as possible...and that includes swallowing or scratching the itch if it's going to distract you too much.

Turning your head slightly to the side can make it easier to fall asleep without needing to swallow much. This also helps with the snoring issue some people experience.

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Originally Posted by littlezoe

That's the thing. Swallowing also occurs automatically, but it's not the same as intentionally forcing yourself to swallow... i'm sure it affects the attempt of WILD just like other movements. It might take a while, but you can learn to keep yourself from doing it completely while doing WILD.

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People like this should be banned from the WILD forum. Honestly dude, you don't know what you're talking about.

WILD is something you do while falling asleep. Anything you do when falling asleep normally can be done in a WILD attempt.

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Originally Posted by cmind

People like this should be banned from the WILD forum. Honestly dude, you don't know what you're talking about.

WILD is something you do while falling asleep. Anything you do when falling asleep normally can be done in a WILD attempt.

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Troll somewhere else. Shhhh. ;)

I swallow saliva all the time while doing WILD, hell I even cough from time to time. So as long as you don't worry about it there is no problem.

It helps if you try without swallowing. But if you feel the urge and you can't make it go away, there is nothing that can stop that and all it will do is drive you nuts and THAT will ruin your attempt. So go ahead and swallow. If I have an itch, I usually wait as long as I can without it distracting me, but sometimes it's better to just scratch and be done with it.

I think if you have the idea that you are not allowed to swallow or scratch, the urge will be that much stronger. So if you tell yourself you are allowed, the urge may not even come.

Hey, Coen, curious question...is the air real dry in your house?


Reason I ask is that here in Texas we run the air conditioner all the time and the air inside the house gets real dry. Sometimes it can affect people, particularly if they're not used to it. At times we have had to run a humidifier to add a little moisture back into the air. It really helps sleep.

Not sure if dry air is an issue for you but a humidifier may make the difference. It has worked for me though I never used it to aid me with dream attempts, just sleep and breathing.

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Originally Posted by littlezoe

Troll somewhere else. Shhhh. ;)

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No littlezoe, cmind is correct about the WILD.
WILD is nothing more than mantaining awareness throughout the sleep process until you end up in a dream and realise that it's a dream. Hence Wake Induce Lucid Dream. Inducing sleep paralysis to get to hallucinations is just one method - sleep paralysis isn't even necessary. As long as you maintain awareness and end up in a lucid, it's a WILD.

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Originally Posted by fOrceez

No littlezoe, cmind is correct about the WILD.
WILD is nothing more than mantaining awareness throughout the sleep process until you end up in a dream and realise that it's a dream. Hence Wake Induce Lucid Dream. Inducing sleep paralysis to get to hallucinations is just one method - sleep paralysis isn't even necessary. As long as you maintain awareness and end up in a lucid, it's a WILD.

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I know well what WILD is. I called him a troll for saying that i should be banned for that... kinda ridiculous.

Oh I know, I was talking about this.

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Originally Posted by littlezoe

That's the thing. Swallowing also occurs automatically, but it's not the same as intentionally forcing yourself to swallow... i'm sure it affects the attempt of WILD just like other movements. It might take a while, but you can learn to keep yourself from doing it completely while doing WILD.

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That's WILDs don't necessarily restrict swallowing.

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Originally Posted by fOrceez

Oh I know, I was talking about this.

That's WILDs don't necessarily restrict swallowing.

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Some people believe it doesn't, some believe it does... :)

Personally i'd say it's better to try WILD-ing without it, just to be sure.
With some practice it's not hard to keep yourself from swallowing without it being a chore...

... and i'm on the opinion that it affects it, since you induce that swallowing directly and it doesn't happen automatically like it should.

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Originally Posted by littlezoe

Some people believe it doesn't, some believe it does... :)

Personally i'd say it's better to try WILD-ing without it, just to be sure.
With some practice it's not hard to keep yourself from swallowing without it being a chore...

... and i'm on the opinion that it affects it, since you induce that swallowing directly and it doesn't happen automatically like it should.

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^ You are giving people horrible, demonstrably wrong advice on how to WILD. That's why I said you should be banned from the WILD forum.

The fact is, WILD is about maintaining a thread of awareness while falling asleep, NOT 'forcing' your body to sleep by doing silly things like not swallowing.

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Originally Posted by cmind

The fact is, WILD is about maintaining a thread of awareness while falling asleep, NOT 'forcing' your body to sleep by doing silly things like not swallowing.

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The more active you are, the more you move is the slower you'll fall asleep.

Try again ;)

cmind, that's unnecessarily harsh.
But littlezoe, i still don't think that's necessarily true. I like to adjust my position a few times before getting comfortable enough to fall asleep. There have been a few WILD guides that say swallowing doesn't necessarily do harm to the WILD. The more you make a big deal out of swallowing, the harder it'll be on your WILD.
Swallow if you need to, in my opinion.

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Originally Posted by cmind

^ You are giving people horrible, demonstrably wrong advice on how to WILD. That's why I said you should be banned from the WILD forum.

The fact is, WILD is about maintaining a thread of awareness while falling asleep, NOT 'forcing' your body to sleep by doing silly things like not swallowing.

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Don't bother, dude.

She operates on the same logic you find in organized religion.

Discussion is impossible because she is unwilling to change or reconsider her viewpoint even in the face of insurmountable evidence and logic. If ever, in my life, I've encountered a genuinely close minded person, she would be it.

For instance, I can point out a direct logical contradiction: "Personally i'd say it's better to try WILD-ing without [swallow]...i'm on the opinion that [swallowing] affects [WILD], since you induce that swallowing directly and it doesn't happen automatically like it should."

And, watch, it won't even register.

It's actually really depressing, because I had high hopes for her when she first hit my radar. =(

At this point, I'm seriously considering breaking out the ignore list (something I've never done before), just so I stop wasting time and energy caring about the development of someone I don't even know.

@Forceez: Thank you for your input on this issue. I've been meaning to have a talk with Sageous concerning some points he brings up in his WILD course. His intentions were good, and I know where he was coming from, but I have some gripes with the teaching method he utilized given his audience and the medium.

Also, don't mind cmind. He's very passionate about the subject, but he's worn out from seeing and addressing the same few pieces of counterproductive advice being repeated in every thread.

On the bright side, there's been some progress these past few years. For instance, the "don't focus on NREM" adage wasn't the norm when I started 'teaching.' During my lurking days, you'd only see that sort of advice from pioneers in the art who had already begun deviating from the prevalent "how-to" models. Even then, they sometimes got flak for it.

I'm sure you'll agree, this "no movement or swallowing" thing is a step backwards.

As for my on-topic input here: everything I'd have to say on this topic can be found by following the link in my sig.

Now for reals. Sleep.

Your mouth will still produce saliva, even while you are asleep. Sure, your metabolism slows down, but it doesn't come to a screeching halt. You will still swallow, even while asleep.

The body will still move, roll over, breathe, heart beat, while you are asleep. You do not die while you are asleep.

Let's use our heads here.

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Originally Posted by Mindraker

Your mouth will still produce saliva, even while you are asleep. Sure, your metabolism slows down, but it doesn't come to a screeching halt. You will still swallow, even while asleep.

The body will still move, roll over, breathe, heart beat, while you are asleep. You do not die while you are asleep.

Let's use our heads here.

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This.

Plus, how do you expect to sleep if you're worrying about not swallowing and getting incredibly uncomfortable?