Trying Gravity RC for several weeks

Hi, I'm Zangetsu and I've been ghosting these forums for about a year now off and on. Finally decided to join so I could make this thread about trying Hukif's Gravity RC (if you don't know what that is, you should google it before reading on).

It seems like I've read everything there is online about LDing, but there is something interesting and different about the Gravity RC. Not only does Hukif get daily LDs from this, but he was able to teach it to someone else (Azul I think) and have similar results. This really made me wonder if Hukif hit the gold mine of LD techniques, and there's only one way to find out :wink:.

I plan to try his technique for several weeks and see how I fare with it. I'm hoping some of you would like to try it with me so we can help each other stay motivated and finally get some more data on this technique. It looks like we can expect at least a month of learning to be aware of gravity before any results show up, but who knows maybe we will get results sooner. Anyway, I'll post back on this thread whenever I have any type of results/questions/observations. If we get enough people trying this maybe we can finally see just how well it works for the average person.

Feel free to discuss the Gravity RC here. All I can really do is speculate and answer questions based on Hukif's tutorial, but maybe if he has time Hukif himself will be able to answer some of our questions. Wish me luck! :lol:

Good luck man, and I read that it took a few months for Azul to start getting results. The Gravity RC, to me, is really an altered perspective of awareness. But of course you've already read up on that Im sure so you know what I mean. I will say though, it took me a month of practicing self awareness to start seeing results, so I can imagine since the Gravity RC is a type of awareness it should pull similar time.

It does nothing in several weeks. Even for the king, it took him several months to get a lucid from it.

Welcome to DV, Zangetsu! Great to have you here.

I will definitely join you for this experiment! I have been intending to try incorporating Hukif's Gravity RC into my LD practices for some time now.
I'm not sure whether he has posted his tutorial on DV, and I can't link to the source I have.
With Hukif's permission, I would be happy to copy and format his tutorial for posting on DV.
I'll PM him with a link to this thread, I know he is always happy when people try his RC themselves.

The above advice is important, I think this is something we'll need to commit to trying for a decent period of time before writing it off as something that doesn't work for us. I've got all the time in the world, since I plan to be a lifetime lucid dreamer. So as far as I'm concerned, bring on the Gravity RCs! :meditate:

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Originally Posted by Sensei

It does nothing in several weeks. Even for the king, it took him several months to get a lucid from it.

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...and that's after 8 years of intense LD-training, while having dreams so vivid and realistic he couldn't otherwise tell them apart from waking. So if you have that as your starting point, yeah, maybe it'll only take 1-3 months...

I tried 3-4 months of ADA/RC-location, and just started having some solid location awareness beginning to appear in dreams, but it never really panned out and I stopped it as my main day work to focus more on general mindfulness/vigilance. Location may be just too vague and external, compared to gravity which is a physical body feeling, for ADA/RC to work. Or, it may just take longer.

Depending on how this next (my 2nd) year goes, I may switch to ADA/RC gravity for a year next year or maybe 6 months from now. That's the sort of long-term planning one should think of in this hobby :)

I don't have any illusions that I'll be daily LDing any time soon, but I'm still setting my goal at several weeks for the first result. Honestly if my goal was several months I'd probably get bored and quit. So maybe if I fall short I'll still keep at it with this goal.

Also something strange occurred last night. I had 4-5 LDs in one night! While most of them were mediocre, this is still weird for me, as I've only been getting 1 LD every week to 2 weeks lately. Also strange, none of them were WILD or DEILD. It started out with a DILD in which I realized that a date on a piece of equipment kept changing every time I looked at it. After that dream I had quite a few false awakenings, but the whole time I was really skeptical that I was awake and I would keep reality checking to find out that I was dreaming. I hadn't even really done any LD practices last night either. I got up for the bathroom this morning and went right back to bed, trying to focus on gravity hoping it would carry over to my dream. Don't think it worked, but it's been quite some time since I had such a chain of LDs without DEILDing.

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Originally Posted by ~ Dreamer ~

Welcome to DV, Zangetsu! Great to have you here.

I will definitely join you for this experiment! I have been intending to try incorporating Hukif's Gravity RC into my LD practices for some time now.
I'm not sure whether he has posted his tutorial on DV, and I can't link to the source I have.
With Hukif's permission, I would be happy to copy and format his tutorial for posting on DV.
I'll PM him with a link to this thread, I know he is always happy when people try his RC themselves.

The above advice is important, I think this is something we'll need to commit to trying for a decent period of time before writing it off as something that doesn't work for us. I've got all the time in the world, since I plan to be a lifetime lucid dreamer. So as far as I'm concerned, bring on the Gravity RCs! :meditate:

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Thanks for the welcome! Glad to have someone trying this with me.

I was reading on another site (which I found by googling Gravity RC) that Azul saw results after a month or so of practice. He said the practice was frustrating, but that the benefits now far surpassed the early frustration. Maybe it is possible for you to see results in 4-6 weeks as well? I've been paying more attention to the weight if my body now as well, though its by no means constant awareness. Maybe I will shoot for that 30% area hukif recommends elsewhere on the web :)

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Originally Posted by ThreeCat

I was reading on another site (which I found by googling Gravity RC) that Azul saw results after a month or so of practice. He said the practice was frustrating, but that the benefits now far surpassed the early frustration. Maybe it is possible for you to see results in 4-6 weeks as well? I've been paying more attention to the weight if my body now as well, though its by no means constant awareness. Maybe I will shoot for that 30% area hukif recommends elsewhere on the web :)

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Yeah I think around 2 months is how long Hukif says it took him to get the first result. In mere mortal time that's approximately 2 years :cheeky:. Bearing that in mind, if I told myself it would take x amount of time before seeing results, my subconscious would get lazy and take me up on the offer. So I'm just gonna go to bed every night expecting the Gravity RC to work for me in the following dreams. I'll try to combine with WBTB occasionally and see what happens.

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Originally Posted by ThreeCat

I was reading on another site (which I found by googling Gravity RC) that Azul saw results after a month or so of practice. He said the practice was frustrating, but that the benefits now far surpassed the early frustration. Maybe it is possible for you to see results in 4-6 weeks as well? I've been paying more attention to the weight if my body now as well, though its by no means constant awareness. Maybe I will shoot for that 30% area hukif recommends elsewhere on the web :)

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Its definitely possible man. I've been practicing self awareness for 2 months and am already almost becoming lucid in half of my REM dreams. I guess it depends on the person and the amount of effort they put into it.

Nice! good luck with it and feel free to ask anything you may have doubts about. I'm not exactly the best writer out there, so I know just how confusing it can be to understand the thing.

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Originally Posted by Hukif

Nice! good luck with it and feel free to ask anything you may have doubts about. I'm not exactly the best writer out there, so I know just how confusing it can be to understand the thing.

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Well in that case...:D

The only thing I can really think to hone in on is the normal force the ground exerts on my feet/body as I'm walking/sitting/laying. I have no clue where or how to look for gravity in the rest of my body when I'm not touching something...

I have plenty of experiences with weird gravity in my dreams however. I often get slowed/weighted down by SP (yeah that's right I said SP :tongue:), and I also have had many OBE exits in which case my body felt light as a feather. Should I focus more on how dream gravity is weird or try to hone in on how waking gravity is normal? And I've tried the holding an item in one hand thing but I don't get much feedback from it...

Thanks for helping out, Hukif!

Good luck with this, I will say having prior LD knowledge and experiences will help out a bit. Don't get caught up with whether you're doing it "right or wrong" just do what feels natural to you. After while you'll find that you'll start to develop your own variation of Gravity RC. Since it's a different aspect of awareness it will take some to be learned, if you will. Side note: DO NOT USE LOGIC WHEN YOU RC!

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Originally Posted by Azul

Good luck with this, I will say having prior LD knowledge and experiences will help out a bit. Don't get caught up with whether you're doing it "right or wrong" just do what feels natural to you. After while you'll find that you'll start to develop your own variation of Gravity RC. Since it's a different aspect of awareness it will take some to be learned, if you will. Side note: DO NOT USE LOGIC WHEN YOU RC!

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Thanks for the advice! So this RC is more of an observation of your weight and the actual reality checking part is inherent to the process, right? I guess when you observe a strange gravity that should automatically clue you in that you're dreaming without having to think about it? I like the way that works! My least favorite part of traditional RCs is that you have to take the time to question everything in your head, so not thinking is fine with me :D.

Had an interesting "close encounter" last night. Did basic WBTB around 7:30 (college ftw!) and went back to bed. Set my intention to get lucid from questioning gravity in a dream. Had a string of dreams, and seemed to wake up after each one. This kept my task at the forefront of my mind I guess. Finally ended up in a dream where someone gave me a new board game, so naturally I started shaking it to see what's inside. For some reason, I thought about doing the Gravity RC to make sure everything is legit. I focused on how the board game felt in my hand while shaking it, but it felt perfectly real, even down to the individual vibrations made when each little game piece hits the box...Said no way this could be a dream, and kept on dreaming.

Guess I should've focused on my body instead of what I was holding. I'm sure my dream body would've been less convincing. Anyway I'm super excited that I questioned a dream with Gravity RC. Of course that's with WBTB involved but I'll take what I can get ;-).

Just a quick aside:

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Originally Posted by Zangetsu

...My least favorite part of traditional RCs is that you have to take the time to question everything in your head, so not thinking is fine with me

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In a "traditional" RC there is no need to question everything, and very little (if any) thinking involved. All you should be doing is checking a single physical object, like a clock or the back of your hand, and then rechecking it to see if it is the same as is was. The only question you ought to be asking yourself is "Is this a dream?" and if you are taking more than a few seconds to do your RC, then you are taking way too much time.

I'm not sure where all the complications about RC's came from -- probably from people feeling a need to make them more important, I suppose. Shame they (those complications) got so popular, as they've made state testing difficult and perhaps caused them to miss the point altogether.

As long as I'm here: Hukif's gravity RC is very much a traditional one, though with a most excellent twist.

... just sayin'

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Originally Posted by Zangetsu

Well in that case...:D

The only thing I can really think to hone in on is the normal force the ground exerts on my feet/body as I'm walking/sitting/laying. I have no clue where or how to look for gravity in the rest of my body when I'm not touching something...

I have plenty of experiences with weird gravity in my dreams however. I often get slowed/weighted down by SP (yeah that's right I said SP :tongue:), and I also have had many OBE exits in which case my body felt light as a feather. Should I focus more on how dream gravity is weird or try to hone in on how waking gravity is normal? And I've tried the holding an item in one hand thing but I don't get much feedback from it...

Thanks for helping out, Hukif!

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As humans we use two things the most, our eyes and our hands so have you tried using your hands as a starting point for these no-touching times? But I would say more on how waking gravity is normal; the rest comes through instinct since it is "abnormal".

Also, maybe you need a heavier object? lol
But yeah, that is just to get the basic idea of what makes something "normal/abnormal" rather than a way to practice the RC.

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Originally Posted by Sageous

Just a quick aside:
In a "traditional" RC there is no need to question everything, and very little (if any) thinking involved. All you should be doing is checking a single physical object, like a clock or the back of your hand, and then rechecking it to see if it is the same as is was. The only question you ought to be asking yourself is "Is this a dream?" and if you are taking more than a few seconds to do your RC, then you are taking way too much time.

I'm not sure where all the complications about RC's came from -- probably from people feeling a need to make them more important, I suppose. Shame they (those complications) got so popular, as they've made state testing difficult and perhaps caused them to miss the point altogether.

As long as I'm here: Hukif's gravity RC is very much a traditional one, though with a most excellent twist.

... just sayin'

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Very well put! I am of the opinion that "if a RC is life taxing, you are doing it wrong" but... yeah. I think it just went crazy after someone proposed making questions during a RC, and then people wanted to make the practice of questioning better and just added dead weight to it?

I think it was also after ADA that people started to correlate the all-day-awareness with gravity RC, I was at the time, unhappy with calling gravity RC an awareness excercise and now its just sunk on me that its normal.

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Originally Posted by Sageous

I'm not sure where all the complications about RC's came from -- probably from people feeling a need to make them more important, I suppose. Shame they (those complications) got so popular, as they've made state testing difficult and perhaps caused them to miss the point altogether.

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I know where they came from for me at least - from ETWOLD and Tholey's modified reflection-intention technique, where you do the RC, imagine everything is a dream and carrying out your goals. It did yield quick results for me, but was taxing my WL activities too much and killed my motivation (which led to my first drop off LDing), and also made me wonder about the nature of the LDs it produced as I felt I was dream incubating everything.
On the other hand the Gravity RC is probably one of the less taxing RCs around, although it is quite difficult to wrap your head around, and much more to practice it all day as Hukif does.

^^ I think there's nothing wrong with reflection/intention. In fact, I regard it very highly. It is closely related to the main day work of the Tibetan dream yogis, and the habits of natural/very frequent lucid dreamers who have a need to constantly evaluate their state (e.g., to determine if they're safe from nightmares). In fact, you could say that it currently forms my main day work, and I do it all throughout the day. My LD progress of late has skyrocketed, in large part I believe to my focus on mindfulness and all-through-the-day awareness ("ADA" has too much baggage as a short-hand, everyone takes it only to mean King Yoshi's precise approach). I think blaming reflection/intention for killing motivation should be a claim made cautiously. Maybe it truly is not for you based on your life particulars. But let me say that all-day type awareness activities take time to get used to. I started mine in November 2013 with ADA/RC-location, and have mostly kept it up since then -- while the target of my attention has shifted over time, I've maintained the day-long focus of maintaining a sense of my state.

I encourage you to take another look at it, and find a target/emphasis that works for you. Gravity as Hukif does it is ADA/RC: you must keep a sense of "is this gravity waking or dreaming?" constantly in your mind.

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Originally Posted by FryingMan

...Gravity as Hukif does it is ADA/RC: you must keep a sense of "is this gravity waking or dreaming?" constantly in your mind.

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Actually I think I'm finally starting to understand what Hukif and Azul mean about not thinking with this RC. The goal is to constantly monitor your gravity, and that's all that's needed. You just keep a sense of "this is what my current gravity feels like" in your head all day. If something weird happens to your gravity, you will notice, and then you can begin to question reality and possibly perform other RCs if the change isn't drastic enough. I believe Hukif has actually said before (in another thread) that he doesn't really question "am I waking or dreaming according to my gravity?". He just knows that "normal gravity = waking" and "weird gravity = dream".

Btw when I said "questioning everything" earlier that was referring to asking "Is this a dream?". I don't like having to muster enough energy (and care) to actually be able to answer that question, and if you don't put much thought in it some of the reality checks will fail anyway (not things like digital clock but I don't want to constantly be looking at one of those either). Hukif's RC seems to be RCing in its most barebones form, and that's definitely the type of technique I would gravitate to (PUN! :cheeky:). And I realize RC's aren't supposed to use much energy but I'm still pretty lazy so...yeah.

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Originally Posted by FryingMan

^^ I think there's nothing wrong with reflection/intention. In fact, I regard it very highly. It is closely related to the main day work of the Tibetan dream yogis, and the habits of natural/very frequent lucid dreamers who have a need to constantly evaluate their state (e.g., to determine if they're safe from nightmares). In fact, you could say that it currently forms my main day work, and I do it all throughout the day. My LD progress of late has skyrocketed, in large part I believe to my focus on mindfulness and all-through-the-day awareness ("ADA" has too much baggage as a short-hand, everyone takes it only to mean King Yoshi's precise approach). I think blaming reflection/intention for killing motivation should be a claim made cautiously. Maybe it truly is not for you based on your life particulars. But let me say that all-day type awareness activities take time to get used to. I started mine in November 2013 with ADA/RC-location, and have mostly kept it up since then -- while the target of my attention has shifted over time, I've maintained the day-long focus of maintaining a sense of my state.

I encourage you to take another look at it, and find a target/emphasis that works for you. Gravity as Hukif does it is ADA/RC: you must keep a sense of "is this gravity waking or dreaming?" constantly in your mind.

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Sorry, probably I didn't express myself accurately enough.
First of all, I was trying to share my personal experience (in line with what Sageous said, that RCing should not require too much thinking) not trying to say reflection-intention is bad for everyone.
What I wanted to point out that killed MY motivation was that, following LaBerge's reflection-intention, I used to do one or two RCs (the "reflection" part), then spend some time in order to imagine I was dreaming, then more time in order to imagine I was doing my goals and resolving myself to become lucid (the "intention" part). Doing that, for me, was taking too much time, energy and attention from other important things in my life, and I couldn't keep up with it.
That's why I think Hukif's technique is so clever, as you can RC in almost any circumstances.

Like I stated before, DO NOT use logic with this RC. Trust me I screwed myself when I did this, just get accustomed to waking like Gravity and you should be fine in the long run.

That's whole point of this RC, it's awareness is such a type that you don't have to question reality, Gravity pretty much tells you if you're dreaming or not.

RCs will actually require energy in the beginning, although they shouldn't like you said but since you're trying to make it a new habit it can drain you a bit. ADA is really good for that.

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Originally Posted by Azul

Like I stated before, DO NOT use logic with this RC. Trust me I screwed myself when I did this, just get accustomed to waking like Gravity and you should be fine in the long run.

That's whole point of this RC, it's awareness is such a type that you don't have to question reality, Gravity pretty much tells you if you're dreaming or not.

RCs will actually require energy in the beginning, although they shouldn't like you said but since you're trying to make it a new habit it can drain you a bit. ADA is really good for that.

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I think I've been falling for the same trap. It's hard to passively observe gravity without feeling like there is something I have to look for, but I'm starting to have a better grasp of the idea (at least I think so :)). Oh I've been using timers like you suggested, and they've been pretty taxing on my awareness. Started with minute timers, but think I'll swap to 2 minutes now and try to taper off. How long were your timers, Azul?

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Originally Posted by Zangetsu

I think I've been falling for the same trap. It's hard to passively observe gravity without feeling like there is something I have to look for, but I'm starting to have a better grasp of the idea (at least I think so :)). Oh I've been using timers like you suggested, and they've been pretty taxing on my awareness. Started with minute timers, but think I'll swap to 2 minutes now and try to taper off. How long were your timers, Azul?

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It will take some practice nonetheless so worries.

Oh I don't use a timer, I did think about it at first but I decided it wasn't....natural lol. I'd say set your alarm on intervals of 30mins to every hour.

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Originally Posted by Azul

It will take some practice nonetheless so worries.

Oh I don't use a timer, I did think about it at first but I decided it wasn't....natural lol. I'd say set your alarm on intervals of 30mins to every hour.

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Ohhhhh ok. The timer is definitely interesting (and definitely unnatural). I tend to dread things when they count down like alarms. Sort of a mild version of water torture I guess :tongue:. Good thing is that dread seems to keep my mind thinking about RCing. Bad thing is I can tell that too much of it will kill my motivation, so I'll have to practice moderation with it I guess.

It's fine to train yourself at first but try not to rely on it as much. Build up that awareness naturally and you'll be a lot more happy.

Now I'm quite curious to see how you'll progress in the early stages with the assistance of that alarm hmmm....

I guess I left out the fact that I only have been using the timer for an hour each day. Don't think I could handle much more than that.

So I take it you're still getting daily LDs with this? How much effort does it take for you now to focus on the RC, or is it completely internalized now? Sorry for all the questions, just trying to take in all the data I can find on this :D.

Just 1 hour out of the time you're awake? or 1 hour of using the alarm?

Not with Gravity but more so yes, I'm currently experimenting with another RC I've discovered. But I stand 100% behind Gravity RC, it's really only for the dedicated.

I myself have not abandoned it, I just put it on hold for a while for the sake of my experimenting.

I've only been using the alarm for 1 hour at a time. Found an app that would do 60 repetitions of a 1 minute timer (2 minute timer today). I still try to keep the RC as constant as possible though, just not always with the timer.

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Originally Posted by Azul

It's fine to train yourself at first but try not to rely on it as much. Build up that awareness naturally and you'll be a lot more happy.

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Couldn't agree more. I feel that this is essential when really trying to master awareness. You have to make it a "Second Nature" type of thing, as well as a mindset. Practice is useless when you keep forcing your mind to do be aware, you have to take the patient route and eventually your awareness will come on its own, and not only that, but when it does come naturally after some practice, that awareness will automatically be molded to fit you perfectly. My point is Zangetsu, be patient with this man, and you will reap the rewards after some time.

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Originally Posted by OneUp

Couldn't agree more. I feel that this is essential when really trying to master awareness. You have to make it a "Second Nature" type of thing, as well as a mindset. Practice is useless when you keep forcing your mind to do be aware, you have to take the patient route and eventually your awareness will come on its own, and not only that, but when it does come naturally after some practice, that awareness will automatically be molded to fit you perfectly. My point is Zangetsu, be patient with this man, and you will reap the rewards after some time.

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You guys are making a lot of sense, I think I'll drop the timers. I definitely don't want to take the cheap route on this one. I can see how timers would almost remove your natural awareness because there wouldn't be a need for that if the timer did the job for you. Guess I'll have to try the ultimate dreaded task...patience. [cue dramatic sound effect:cheeky:]

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Originally Posted by Zangetsu

I've only been using the alarm for 1 hour at a time. Found an app that would do 60 repetitions of a 1 minute timer (2 minute timer today). I still try to keep the RC as constant as possible though, just not always with the timer.

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I did something similar like this. I had an alarm go off with a minute snooze. I wasn't trying to RC every time that I heard it go off, but have thoughts about dreaming every time it went off. It was working well, but I got a consistent headache after 3 weeks, and then my sleep schedule went to crap. It has been a while, but I think I am going to try that again. I got to a point where I could move the timer to 5 minutes apart and not lose thoughts about dreams at all, and I think it has helped me a lot since then as well. My mind sort of reverts back to LDing at all times and is always thinking about it somewhere.

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Originally Posted by Sensei

I did something similar like this. I had an alarm go off with a minute snooze. I wasn't trying to RC every time that I heard it go off, but have thoughts about dreaming every time it went off. It was working well, but I got a consistent headache after 3 weeks, and then my sleep schedule went to crap. It has been a while, but I think I am going to try that again. I got to a point where I could move the timer to 5 minutes apart and not lose thoughts about dreams at all, and I think it has helped me a lot since then as well. My mind sort of reverts back to LDing at all times and is always thinking about it somewhere.

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I actually got the idea for minute timers from your Secrets thread (btw merely reading that thread pretty much broke my lucid dry spell a month ago, thanks!). Honestly your way is probably the best way to do timers i.e. the dream thoughts (ideal would probably be smallest amount of LD thoughts that you could have and still produce an effect). I know what you mean about how taxing it can be on your brain, almost even stressful. I think the bad thing about the way I was doing it was that my RC would've probably ended up being predicated on the existence of the timer, although I did kinda get the fluid dream thoughts between the timer like you describe. It's definitely an interesting thing to consider, may even be worth some experimentation (did I hear someone say Timer Induced Lucid Dream??? :cheeky:)

Also, brief update on my Gravity RC status (not that anyone cares, this is mostly for me :D): I've more or less got an idea now of what to observe when doing the RC. I usually fixate on any normal force I'm currently experiencing, and I've also been trying to get an idea of my arms' gravity since they are usually in the air or holding something. Today I also was able to somewhat perceive the gravity of my head and how much effort it was actually taking to hold it upright (no big head jokes thank you :)). Hopefully this combination of different 'expressions' of gravity will give me a more diverse RC.

As for consistency, it's getting more and more frequent that I remember to RC, at least when I'm doing something in my normal routine. When I do something engaging or different from normal, I rarely remember to RC at all, but I'm thinking that's normal for this stage.

No more interesting dream activity so far. I'm still doing small WBTBs on my sleep-in days, and I'm hopeful that will increase my chances. Not that it really matters, since this RC is all about the ingrained unconscious RCing, but a gravity-induced LD could only help my chances even if I kinda cheated for it, right? :tongue:

OK, sorry if I'm butting in here, but I have a question about the Gravity RC. I was thinking about trying it out, because it sounded very good, and I'm well aware of the fact that it could take a few months, even longer to reap the benefits. So my question is, if I'm carrying around a backpack or something that will make me feel heavier, and I'm carrying it a lot, will that make the RC useless?

I thought I read that in Hukif's thread about the Gravity RC. Anyways, thank you guys in advance, and sorry if I kinda just cut in to the thread. I didn't want to start my own thread about this to waste space :P

Also, I read earlier in this thread that while doing RC's, you don't need to ask a lot of questions. You just need to ask, "am I dreaming?" and then do the RC. So right now, I am doing a thing where I am aware and I notice something, and then I ask myself, "Did that work correctly?" or "Why is that there?", something like that. So are you guys saying that I don't need to do that? I just need to ask if I'm dreaming and then do the RC? And if I do that randomly throughout the day that will work just as well as what I'm doing now?

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Originally Posted by Sharpshoey

OK, sorry if I'm butting in here, but I have a question about the Gravity RC. I was thinking about trying it out, because it sounded very good, and I'm well aware of the fact that it could take a few months, even longer to reap the benefits. So my question is, if I'm carrying around a backpack or something that will make me feel heavier, and I'm carrying it a lot, will that make the RC useless?

I thought I read that in Hukif's thread about the Gravity RC. Anyways, thank you guys in advance, and sorry if I kinda just cut in to the thread. I didn't want to start my own thread about this to waste space :P

Also, I read earlier in this thread that while doing RC's, you don't need to ask a lot of questions. You just need to ask, "am I dreaming?" and then do the RC. So right now, I am doing a thing where I am aware and I notice something, and then I ask myself, "Did that work correctly?" or "Why is that there?", something like that. So are you guys saying that I don't need to do that? I just need to ask if I'm dreaming and then do the RC? And if I do that randomly throughout the day that will work just as well as what I'm doing now?

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Lol you're not the first person to ask about the backpack situation. You still focus on the weight of it because in dreams it will be either heavier than usual or lighter than usual.

Ok, first you just have to really get out of the duality mindset. An RC isn't necessarily a matter of asking a question, it's when you primarily bring your focus or attention to something.

Therefore, the RC is GRAVITY and nothing else. Gravity is what you focus on, and depending on the weight of things is what your answer will be; awake or dreaming.

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Lol you're not the first person to ask about the backpack situation. You still focus on the weight of it because in dreams it will be either heavier than usual or lighter than usual.

Ok, first you just have to really get out of the duality mindset. An RC isn't necessarily a matter of asking a question, it's when you primarily bring your focus or attention to something.

Therefore, the RC is GRAVITY and nothing else. Gravity is what you focus on, and depending on the weight of things is what your answer will be; awake or dreaming.

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So when you say I have to get out of the duality mindset, do you mean that I shouldn't be asking those types of questions all day? So I only need to be aware during my RC's and only use the RC's to answer if I'm dreaming or not?

Yes exactly, you shouldn't have to question because the abnormal gravity will confirm if you're dreaming or not. That's the whole point of the Gravity RC.

The only thing Gravity RC requires is your awareness to the matter at hand. It should be kept simple but if you do decide to practice it, you will probably realize that later on.

Then again you could possibly be as hardcore as Hukif, I will say his way isn't for the light hearted.

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Originally Posted by Azul

Yes exactly, you shouldn't have to question because the abnormal gravity will confirm if you're dreaming or not. That's the whole point of the Gravity RC.

The only thing Gravity RC requires is your awareness to the matter at hand. It should be kept simple but if you do decide to practice it, you will probably realize that later on.

Then again you could possibly be as hardcore as Hukif, I will say his way isn't for the light hearted.

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OK I see, I always try to over-complicate things because it seems that it would give you better results like that. I have to keep reminding myself to just keep staying with the basics. Thank you very much for the help :)

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Originally Posted by Sharpshoey

OK, sorry if I'm butting in here, but I have a question about the Gravity RC.

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No problem, feel free to use this thread whenever you want seeing as we don't have an actual Gravity RC thread here on DV (does anybody know the status of copying the original tutorial that was mentioned earlier?)

Made some amazing progress last night, I actually got to use the RC to get lucid for the first time (not in the unconscious habit way, I cheated with WBTB but still a good experience:)).

Spoiler for My LD:

I'm in some strange college class. There's a lot of people from my high school there too. My junior high principle comes in and starts talking to the class, saying something intimidating. Since it's college, most of the people get up and leave while he's talking. I stay around along with a few other people. Then we are walking around the classroom for some reason, some guy comes up and gives me a peppermint. It tastes nasty and he tells me it's baked potato flavored. I start to gag and spit it out, and decide to go to the bathroom to spit it in the sink. While I'm at the sink I have a sudden burst of suspicion, for some reason I just think this is a dream. I use the Gravity RC to test and I get weird results. The left and right sides of my body have different gravity and it almost seems to be fluctuating. I conclude that I'm dreaming and try to think of what to do next. Suddenly my vision is gone and I'm imagining everything that I should be seeing, instead of seeing it through my own eyes. I eventually go into a non-lucid dream.

Now I know this was not a true Gravity RC lucid dream but it was still cool to get some more experience of what gravity feels like when I scrutinize it in a dream. It was definitely a dead giveaway that something was fishy, and I don't think I even needed another RC to confirm it, so I guess it was just that convincing. This RC is very promising!

I have noticed today when doing the RC that it is very hard to focus on the gravity of each individual body part. The main thing I'm focusing on that feels right is my feet and them being pulled to the floor. I try to focus on every other body part but it is very hard and I usually forget about focusing on them very shortly.

I read earlier in the thread that Azul said not to get caught up in if your doing it right or wrong. So I'm just doing what feels natural to me and hopefully later on it will get easier to focus on other parts of my body and the RC will make more sense. Because right now, the RC is kind of hard for me to understand and hopefully I will start to understand it with time.

Also, Do I need to be saying a mantra still? Or is that not needed? I have been saying "I'm dreaming" throughout the day.

Anyways, I really like the Gravity RC because with the way I was practicing before, it felt like I couldn't enjoy WL. I would constantly be asking myself and wondering if I was awake or dreaming, and I felt like I was too focused on dreaming so I couldn't enjoy life. So I didn't like that, but I'm loving this Gravity RC.

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Originally Posted by Zangetsu

No problem, feel free to use this thread whenever you want seeing as we don't have an actual Gravity RC thread here on DV (does anybody know the status of copying the original tutorial that was mentioned earlier?)

Made some amazing progress last night, I actually got to use the RC to get lucid for the first time (not in the unconscious habit way, I cheated with WBTB but still a good experience:)).

Spoiler for My LD:

I'm in some strange college class. There's a lot of people from my high school there too. My junior high principle comes in and starts talking to the class, saying something intimidating. Since it's college, most of the people get up and leave while he's talking. I stay around along with a few other people. Then we are walking around the classroom for some reason, some guy comes up and gives me a peppermint. It tastes nasty and he tells me it's baked potato flavored. I start to gag and spit it out, and decide to go to the bathroom to spit it in the sink. While I'm at the sink I have a sudden burst of suspicion, for some reason I just think this is a dream. I use the Gravity RC to test and I get weird results. The left and right sides of my body have different gravity and it almost seems to be fluctuating. I conclude that I'm dreaming and try to think of what to do next. Suddenly my vision is gone and I'm imagining everything that I should be seeing, instead of seeing it through my own eyes. I eventually go into a non-lucid dream.

Now I know this was not a true Gravity RC lucid dream but it was still cool to get some more experience of what gravity feels like when I scrutinize it in a dream. It was definitely a dead giveaway that something was fishy, and I don't think I even needed another RC to confirm it, so I guess it was just that convincing. This RC is very promising!

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@Zang, Although it was Gravity initiated, you still did carry out the Gravity RC regardless which confirmed it. Just keep at it and you'll love the results.

@Sharp, Yea that's going to happen in the beginning. I struggled with the same thing but I discovered something that worked for me after while. If you're more comfortable with focusing on your feet then do that. Like Hukif told me, focus on a body part that you use a lot.

Just try and get accustomed to the gravity IWL, focus totally upon it. It's definitely going to take time, stress will be inevitable with this technique lol. As for the mantra, that's totally optional. A mantra is a way to program your brain in such a manner that you will eventually start to act that way. It's not required for lucid dreaming.

Gravity RC is definitely not an easy technique at first. It require great patience and discipline but if you stay dedicated you will be rewarded, I cannot stress that enough. What you put in is what you'll get out.

Would some exercises help with this technique? Something like, set a timer for 5 minutes, and in those 5 minutes you would try to maintain a continuous awareness of gravity/weight. Would that be of any help, or overkill? Just an idea..

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Originally Posted by mimihigurashi

Would some exercises help with this technique? Something like, set a timer for 5 minutes, and in those 5 minutes you would try to maintain a continuous awareness of gravity/weight. Would that be of any help, or overkill? Just an idea..

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Well if you think about it like this, setting a timer to go off every 5 mins and trying to remain aware you would probably end up RCing into the next timer. Then it would just make the timer pointless at the point.

I'd totally say that's an overkill, maybe like every 30mins-1hr is a lot more reasonable. Just don't make it a habit to where you have to rely on the timer but you can definitely use it.

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Originally Posted by Azul

Well if you think about it like this, setting a timer to go off every 5 mins and trying to remain aware you would probably end up RCing into the next timer. Then it would just make the timer pointless at the point.

I'd totally say that's an overkill, maybe like every 30mins-1hr is a lot more reasonable. Just don't make it a habit to where you have to rely on the timer but you can definitely use it.

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Lol I definitely didn't mean every 5 minutes, that would be crazy.

So this gravity thing is basically constant habit to search for dream sign (in this case unusual gravity), which itself works as RC - like 2in1?

Although it can count as a dream sign, you aren't searching for it in waking. Instead you are supposed to be aware of your own (normal) weight/gravity while awake so that it becomes a habit and so in the dream you will do the same constant awareness and realize it is not normal/become lucid; it is less of actively searching and more of passively knowing.

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Originally Posted by Hukif

Although it can count as a dream sign, you aren't searching for it in waking. Instead you are supposed to be aware of your own (normal) weight/gravity while awake so that it becomes a habit and so in the dream you will do the same constant awareness and realize it is not normal/become lucid; it is less of actively searching and more of passively knowing.

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I think I get it... It's constant habit of perceiving your gravity without thinking, with two possible outputs - 1. normal = waking, 2. wierd = dreaming. The second one is classic dreamsing which works as RC as well. That's brilliant! Why gravity?? Why not use for example light or body temperature or whatever we always ''have with us''?

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Originally Posted by Nfri

I think I get it... It's constant habit of perceiving your gravity without thinking, with two possible outputs - 1. normal = waking, 2. wierd = dreaming. The second one is classic dreamsing which works as RC as well. That's brilliant! Why gravity?? Why not use for example light or body temperature or whatever we always ''have with us''?

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That's just the very thing, YOU CAN use those things as RCs preferably use what's more natural to you. Hukif discovered gravity in his own revelation therefore he started taking advantage of it and perfected it for his own use.

gravity check has failed me many times. the one that has NEVER failed me is plugging my nose and checking to see if I can still breathe through it.

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Originally Posted by Runeword

gravity check has failed me many times. the one that has NEVER failed me is plugging my nose and checking to see if I can still breathe through it.

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Yeah that's the thing about Gravity RC, even if you do remember to do it, you're not guaranteed to be in a dream with weird gravity so it seems like it may not work 100% of the times you remember to do it. But if you can get into a habit of constantly monitoring gravity, you should catch any dreams that do have weird gravity, so still seems like a high percentage of dreams will be caught without the need for any kind of nighttime practices. That's what makes it so appealing to me.

On a side note, I've been having a hard time sticking with it lately. Got pretty busy with school lately and it just seemed to fade out of my life for a few days. Hopefully I'll get it back going strong now and be able to keep going til I get some results. It's so promising I can't afford to give it up! :D

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Originally Posted by Zangetsu

Yeah that's the thing about Gravity RC, even if you do remember to do it, you're not guaranteed to be in a dream with weird gravity so it seems like it may not work 100% of the times you remember to do it. But if you can get into a habit of constantly monitoring gravity, you should catch any dreams that do have weird gravity, so still seems like a high percentage of dreams will be caught without the need for any kind of nighttime practices. That's what makes it so appealing to me.

On a side note, I've been having a hard time sticking with it lately. Got pretty busy with school lately and it just seemed to fade out of my life for a few days. Hopefully I'll get it back going strong now and be able to keep going til I get some results. It's so promising I can't afford to give it up! :D

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The same exact thing has been happening with me, it just keeps seeming to fade away with school starting. I just force myself to keep remembering it and like you I can't afford to give it up either!

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Originally Posted by Runeword

gravity check has failed me many times. the one that has NEVER failed me is plugging my nose and checking to see if I can still breathe through it.

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Alas, gravity and nose plug have both failed me at various times. I have yet to find an RC that is foolproof. I've started to think it is less about the specific RC and more about the mindset behind it. If you let yourself be too easily convinced that you aren't dreaming, you might be wrong, but if you keep an open mind and keep paying critical attention, you're more likely to pick up on the cues. Unless you actually aren't dreaming. But... never let yourself be too sure...

>.>

<.<

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Originally Posted by Verre

Alas, gravity and nose plug have both failed me at various times. I have yet to find an RC that is foolproof. I've started to think it is less about the specific RC and more about the mindset behind it. If you let yourself be too easily convinced that you aren't dreaming, you might be wrong, but if you keep an open mind and keep paying critical attention, you're more likely to pick up on the cues. Unless you actually aren't dreaming. But... never let yourself be too sure...

>.>

<.<

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That's exactly it, there isn't an RC that's "foolproof." Gravity AND the nose plug RC have failed me multiple times but the nose plug isn't an actual RC per se more like a confirmation that you're dreaming.

Thing is you have to find an RC that works for YOU, you have to make it work. The best quality lucid dreaming has to offer is the creativity aspect.

Bottom line is that lucid dreaming all comes down to your state of awareness period and it only takes place after many repetitions and practice.

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Originally Posted by Azul

the nose plug isn't an actual RC per se more like a confirmation that you're dreaming.

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Have to disagree here, that's precisely what a RC (reality check) is: a quick state test to determine if you're awake or dreaming.

To use it in its full description: ADA/RC-gravity is *more* than just an RC using gravity. It is a continuous awareness-boosting practice meant to produce lucidity, focused on the personal experience of gravity in waking vs. gravity in dreams. A "gravity RC" is basically like a "nose plug RC": something you do once you already suspect that you're dreaming. But that doesn't mean "nose plug" isn't an RC. It means "nose plug" is not a continuous awareness-boosting practice (although some days I do nose plug so often it feels like it practically becomes one :) ).

Although that may be true, from my experiences I personally wouldn't recommend the nose rc simply because it CAN screw you over not saying it will though. I had not one doubt in my mind that the nose rc would fail me but it actually did a few times and that's when I decided it was time for me to just strengthen my overall awareness. I don't really like relying on one particular RC for the fact that it can misdirect you if you're not seasoned with it, then again even if you are misdirection still could happen.

An RC is only what you make of it, we're all different when it comes to lucid dreaming. Since we all think differently our thoughts and actions will obviously vary.

Awareness is clearly the key. Over time, I RC less and less in dreams, I just know I'm dreaming. But for those times where that little confirmation is needed, I find nose pinch nearly perfect. It's good to have several in mind in case one is ambiguous, though.

That's exactly it! That's what we should be striving for, to simply automatically know that we're already dreaming. Lately that's how most of my lucids have been occurring, we should be building our awareness to a state where we don't even have to "RC."

Of course it will take time and practice but the results are well worth it.

Well I may be the weird person here but the RC itself is what makes me lucid and not so the awareness; as having awareness but normal gravity makes me as lucid as a rock <.<

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Originally Posted by Hukif

Well I may be the weird person here but the RC itself is what makes me lucid and not so the awareness; as having awareness but normal gravity makes me as lucid as a rock <.<

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Wishing I could be your brand of weird!!!

Seriously, there's a chicken/egg thing at work here that's tricky (if not impossible, since it may originate far, far below our conscious thoughts) to discern precisely what comes first. It very well could be the awareness that kicks in without you "feeling" it that gives you that tiny little push to notice the gravity.....or not, like I said, it's tricksy.

Well my point of reference comes from when I am aware of gravity in dreams but don't become lucid? Always happens when its normal gravity, so despite all my awareness will just accept it all as reality.

Sorry for the double post, but I'm interested in how things are going here?

I am currently not practicing the Gravity RC anymore but it isn't because I don't think it works. I fully believe that it works really well, but I've decided that the Gravity RC isn't for me. I find that it takes a lot more effort for me than self awareness. Self awareness feels more natural to me and it comes easier, and I've heard people say to do what feels natural to you so I decided to stick with Self Awareness (I guess it's kind of like mindfulness too). I've been working on Self Awareness with random RC's (and RC's when something weird happens) throughout the day.

I periodically think that if I would've stuck with the Gravity RC I'd be LDing frequently already but I don't know if I would because it didn't feel natural to me. I'm super happy with my success and I'm proud of myself for sticking with LDing, even though I'm still not seeing many results. I usually would give up on something like this but this time, I decided that I wouldn't let myself give up. Anyways, sorry for rambling on, just updating you on what I've been doing :)

(sorry for the double post but I thought this thread should be bumped back up...I want to revive it maybe.)

Over the past two months, I have been working on mindfulness in my daily life. (Or self-awareness whatever you call it) It hasn't been working for me very well and I've noticed now my practices seemed to be all jumbled and disorganized and I really don't know what I'm doing anymore for practice. I've lost a ton of motivation to practice, though I still want to lucid dream really bad. I think the reason is that mindfulness isn't for me, I've found it very hard to constantly try and keep it up.

I've been thinking of alternative awareness practices to do, and my mind always comes back to the Gravity RC no matter what. So maybe this is the technique for me? I'm mad that I stopped using this technique, but this time I think that I am more dedicated and more prepared to start using it. I know now that it will take a while to train but I know the benefits are worth it in the end.

So I'm going to start practicing this technique again, and I just refreshed my memory on it by reading Azul's post on the Gravity RC. Hopefully some people come back to this thread and more people try out the Gravity RC and we can motivate each other. We can maybe even do an experiment and see how successful the RC actually is to the normal person?

Anyways, when I'm doing this RC I'm just going to be focusing on my legs or feet when I'm walking, and then the weight of my body when sitting. So basically I'll be focusing on the weight of whatever body part I'm using at the time, that seems the most natural to me. I will also say the mantra "I'm dreaming" Throughout the day as I want that thought to carry over into my dreams.

I do have a question though. I have been doing the MILD technique before bed. With the Gravity RC, would you recommend that I continue doing the MILD, or is the RC good enough that I don't need to do any technique before bed and I can still get a DILD every night after practice? Also, I don't need to be doing any other RC's like the nose-plug or counting fingers right? And is what I'm practicing seem to be sufficient? All I'm doing is the gravity RC, DJ, and a mantra, and now I'm doing a WBTB most nights of the week. Will that, after plenty of practice, start getting me tons of LD's? Also, do I need to do meditation with this? I try to meditate a few times a week but lots of times it is a hassle and I really don't have the time for it usually. (I keep editing new things in..I have never ending questions :lol:) With this RC you also don't need to find any dream signs right? I have never really heavily used dream signs in the past because you can only become lucid when you see that dream sign. I use dream signs a little, but not heavily.

Thank you, and I hope many more people join in on practicing the Gravity RC :)

I think I can contribute something to the discussion, as I have been trying this technique too. Well, actually my personal experience is so similar to yours, Sharpshoey, but we can probably learn from that, maybe find common mistakes, or common challenges/pitfalls and what can be done about them.
On the other hand this is a thread about a personal experiment, so I think it would be better for other people interested in this technique if we move the discussion to the "official" Gravity RC thread here: http://www.dreamviews.com/induction-...-tutorial.html

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Sharpshoey

(sorry for the double post but I thought this thread should be bumped back up...I want to revive it maybe.)

Over the past two months, I have been working on mindfulness in my daily life. (Or self-awareness whatever you call it) It hasn't been working for me very well and I've noticed now my practices seemed to be all jumbled and disorganized and I really don't know what I'm doing anymore for practice. I've lost a ton of motivation to practice, though I still want to lucid dream really bad. I think the reason is that mindfulness isn't for me, I've found it very hard to constantly try and keep it up.

I've been thinking of alternative awareness practices to do, and my mind always comes back to the Gravity RC no matter what. So maybe this is the technique for me? I'm mad that I stopped using this technique, but this time I think that I am more dedicated and more prepared to start using it. I know now that it will take a while to train but I know the benefits are worth it in the end.

So I'm going to start practicing this technique again, and I just refreshed my memory on it by reading Azul's post on the Gravity RC. Hopefully some people come back to this thread and more people try out the Gravity RC and we can motivate each other. We can maybe even do an experiment and see how successful the RC actually is to the normal person?

Anyways, when I'm doing this RC I'm just going to be focusing on my legs or feet when I'm walking, and then the weight of my body when sitting. So basically I'll be focusing on the weight of whatever body part I'm using at the time, that seems the most natural to me. I will also say the mantra "I'm dreaming" Throughout the day as I want that thought to carry over into my dreams.

I do have a question though. I have been doing the MILD technique before bed. With the Gravity RC, would you recommend that I continue doing the MILD, or is the RC good enough that I don't need to do any technique before bed and I can still get a DILD every night after practice? Also, I don't need to be doing any other RC's like the nose-plug or counting fingers right? And is what I'm practicing seem to be sufficient? All I'm doing is the gravity RC, DJ, and a mantra, and now I'm doing a WBTB most nights of the week. Will that, after plenty of practice, start getting me tons of LD's? Also, do I need to do meditation with this? I try to meditate a few times a week but lots of times it is a hassle and I really don't have the time for it usually.

Thank you, and I hope many more people join in on practicing the Gravity RC :)

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A question for you: do you feel weight in your dreams? I'm asking because I tried this technique for over a month until I realized that it won't be very useful for me since the realistic feeling of weight is present fairly often in my dreams. At first I was looking forward to this technique too because I did not recall gravity existing in 99% of my dreams, but that was only because I was not lucid/did not care/did not notice it. When I got more LDs I noticed how present and realistic the feeling of weight/gravity is in my dreams, so after a fairly long try I realized I kind of wasted time. Everyone's dreams are different, some techniques work for some and do not for others, that's why I'm saying you should think about how your dreams are beforehand.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by mimihigurashi

A question for you: do you feel weight in your dreams? I'm asking because I tried this technique for over a month until I realized that it won't be very useful for me since the realistic feeling of weight is present fairly often in my dreams. At first I was looking forward to this technique too because I did not recall gravity existing in 99% of my dreams, but that was only because I was not lucid/did not care/did not notice it. When I got more LDs I noticed how present and realistic the feeling of weight/gravity is in my dreams, so after a fairly long try I realized I kind of wasted time. Everyone's dreams are different, some techniques work for some and do not for others, that's why I'm saying you should think about how your dreams are beforehand.

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I haven't had very many LD's and in the ones when I tried things that focused heavily on gravity, it was different. Like when I jumped for instance, I could jump a long ways, and when I was climbing a tree, it was really easy. Also, I heard hukif say that in some dreams gravity may be perfectly normal. But I've decided that I'll never know if I don't try this technique whether it will work or not, so I'm giving it a go anyways. Even if it doesn't work, there are other things to be learned from it as the Gravity Rc Tutorial by Azul states. One thing learned is discipline and patience, and that will help me out in the long run of practicing LDing.

Quote:

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I think I can contribute something to the discussion, as I have been trying this technique too. Well, actually my personal experience is so similar to yours, Sharpshoey, but we can probably learn from that, maybe find common mistakes, or common challenges/pitfalls and what can be done about them.
On the other hand this is a thread about a personal experiment, so I think it would be better for other people interested in this technique if we move the discussion to the "official" Gravity RC thread here: Gravity RC Tutorial

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Glad to see that you decided to join! That sounds like a good idea to move the discussion to that thread. And hopefully we can help each other out to overcome any challenged we may be having.

I think you are going to have difficulty achieving results with such a vague goal, especially with a task like this. When you have a difficult and long-term goal project, it helps to take advantage of what people have already discovered about goal-achieving behaviors, and break it down into easier chunks:

SMART acronym for goal setting:

Specific, Measurable, Achievable, Realistic, Time-related.

Specific: Target a specific area of improvement. LD isn't a pass/fail assignment, rather it's a confluence of several skills that take time to build up independently of each other. Focus on just one aspect for your goal.

Measurable: You need to be able to point out tangible indicators of progress to yourself, or you will lose motivation. This is probably the second most important thing.

Achievable/Realistic: If your goal is specific and measurable but too difficult, you are wasting your time. Small-chunk it. Start out really small so that you can actually get there.

Time-related: Set yourself a deadline. A slog with no end in sight is discouraging. If you can imagine a light at the end of the tunnel you will want to reach it.



Get scientific about this project and you will find results come much easier. For example, your goal might be something like:

- Every time I remember to do a gravity RC I will record the event (on my smartphone with a tracking app)
- I need to build up to an average of one RC an hour within two weeks.
- Every few days I will keep a log of my progress and any differences I notice.

Now you have a short term, achievable goal, and you can look at some concrete numbers and journal entries to see if this technique is useful at all. The goal isn't even to have LDs, the goal is to reach a stage of practice where it might be consistent enough to start to cause LDs further down the road.

I will add that I am using this method with a different RC and, unlike previous attempts, I am not getting discouraged because I can look at a graph of how often I'm doing the RC and it's slowly creeping up higher and higher. Before an RC works in your dream, it has to become a habit. If you think about it, the goal is not to have an LD, it's to develop a new habit. Thinking about it that way has made this much easier for me because there are all sorts of operant conditioning tools that suddenly make sense to use.