Holding on to a thread of Consciousness

[SKA]

Okay there are sooooooo many different ways of Lucid Dream induction yet the basis of all these techniques is to accomplish one thing: To hold on to a thread of consciousness; a Continuous, undisturbed awareness of that you are sleeping. A way to stay in touch with Reality while falling asleep anyways. Now lets get back to that basic Idea and figure out some more ways to hold onto a thread of Consciousness while falling asleep and entering the Dreamstate. Any ideas, personal techniques, suggestions..etc should be shared here. Keep it oversightfull, ontopic and practical.

[RooJ]

Always like your threads SKA, not sure if you ever carry an idea through but you sure look into enough areas . Im about 50 pages into the book "The Tibetan Yogas of Dream and Sleep", One of the goals of dream yoga is to hold conciousness from waking to sleep, watching REM periods and dreams start and end etc. It seems, if what ive read is correct, that its possible to hold conciousness literally all night, not sure how good that would be for your mental health though. Id post methods but I havn't read that far yet, ill repost if i remember when i get to that point in the book.

[SKA]

Yeah the problem is: I have alot of Ideas and concepts but they're obviously far from usable and perfect. It needs the insight and enthusiasm of others which usually seems to be running short. The biggest problem with tehse Ideas is that people here, when they don't see immediate progress or practical success they lose interrest and start 100ds of new, useless Topics like: "Need help with WILD" so that my, potentially great, topic gets sent right off the first topics-page. Suckage. People can't stick to one Idea dn so: neither can I. As fast as my Topics come they are gone again. Replaced by long lists of bullshit, same-old-shit topics. Too bad. I have heard it said that Tibetan Dream Yoga Monks claimed it is possible to stay aware during all stages of sleep and that we dream at all stages of sleep, not just REM. Just WHAT is it they use to stay aware? If you've read up on that let me know anything usefull. Anything from a the Sensation of a Rubber band around your ankle to Focussing on Breath: Be creative and let me know anything that can help you maintain a thread of consciousness throughout the entire night's sleep. And maybe we could STICK to this topic, gather enough information, put our heads together and form them together into a technique: This way we will actually have some ILD-ideas that can become USEFULL. Cuz no other Topic I've read here has ever been sticked by and succesfully developped before the impatient people lose interrest again and dismiss the topic away. This way not a single ILD-idea will ever become practical and successfull. :/

[CymekSniper]

Unfortunately, SKA, there isn't much we can hope for in this super fast-paced world of communication and transportation.

[RooJ]

The thing about dream yoga is its a complete technique in itself, im not sure its going to be possible to rip part of the technique out, about staying aware while sleeping, without severly damaging your chances. Dream yoga is a heavy tech.. Its a whole way of life. The first things discussed in the book are about getting rid of emotions pretty much, the idea is to become aware in the now and not to let emotions and past experiences control your actions. From what ive read you become so aware that you begin to see the real world as just like the dreamworld. Your experiences are untouched by your thoughts, no internal voice, no internal imagery, just pure awareness. Its likely this awareness and concentration that helps a great deal when going to sleep. I think they use controlled visualisation when going to sleep, and they switch visualisation at each stage of sleep or something like that. So they will focus on something when first laying down, then change to something else during the onset of HI etc etc. Ill try to post a small section of the book when i get home just to show these techniques (I think i found the start of these techniques page 163). As i say, this is a life changing technique, not some miracle technique that anyone can jump straight into. Saying this Id still be interested in seeing if its possible to maybe incorporate it into a technique, or building on it to make a new one. Entering sleep conciously and consistently is a goal ive always been interested in trying to figure out.

[Alprazolam]

This should turn out to be a constructive thread... One thing I believe that helps me is either A. The constant hum of my fan or B. The constant sound of the babbling brook that my noisemaker makes I can somewhat put these in the back of my mind, sort of the same concept as focusing on your breathing, but I feel you get to direct full attention towards either because they are not coming from yourself or require anything from you but focus. They are relaxing (to me) and they can keep you connected to reality as you drift asleep, as you can still sense them weather you actually "hear" them or not.

[RooJ]

The concious deep sleeping i mentioned earlier is actually sleep yoga.. heres a link: http://www.swamij.com/yoga-nidra.htm Ill print and read it tomorow because i havnt got time now. Personally im ignoring the religious type talk and focusing on whats needed. It seems (going by the book) that much of the expectations and tasks in dream yoga are simply designed to build good concentration skills, allowing you to focus on one thing ignoring everything else competing for your attention. The ability to concentrate on an image for example that can hold your awareness during the falling asleep process and allow you to ignore the hypnogogic imagery. I found this but not sure how helpful it will be: http://www.successconsciousness.com/index_000004.htm Ill post more tomorow.

[Folqueraine]

Well, I'm not sure if it helps, since the topic seems to have deviated to sleep yoga, but a technique I use to hold to consciousness is reciting a poem over and over in my head... It must be something you really know by heart because if you start trying to remember what the words are it distracts you. I suppose it's a bit like a super long mantra. It works better for me than counting, anyway. I am word person.

[SKA]

Hmm I've got a couple of Poetic/prophetic sayings of myself I might be ablt to use it for. Also I know a Jewish tribal sung Melodie which I found to be very entrancing and apeacing. I really know it from the heart so maybe I can "sing" this Melodie over and over in my head while falling asleep. That sounds like a Good Idea. The Lucid Conditions are also favorable: -I am stoned beyond words. Smoked about 5 Joints this evening. -I drank 3 cans of Red Bull which lifts me "Up" from the Marijuana "Down" while still leaving me high with a dreamy but clear mind and a very strong concentration. -It's 02:17 and I'm naturally sleepy. -Earlier this night I took a 120mg Ginkgo Biloba Capsule and a 500mg DL-phenylalanine Pill. The 2 days before today I took 1 OMEGA 3 Fishoil pill, 1 Ginkgo Biloba pill and 1 Vitamin B-complex Pill both days in the morning and had really incredibly vivid, clear and well recalled Dreams both nights. My Dreamrecall has been scrambled and blank for over 5 months now so that was pretty rare.

[sourcejedi]

there are sooooooo many different ways of Lucid Dream induction yet the basis of all these techniques is to accomplish one thing: To hold on to a thread of consciousness; a Continuous, undisturbed awareness of that you are sleeping. A way to stay in touch with Reality while falling asleep anyways. ...lets get back to that basic Idea and figure out some more ways to hold onto a thread of Consciousness while falling asleep and entering the Dreamstate. Not all techniques are based on maintaining awareness while falling asleep - those are only the WILD based techs. You're forgetting DILD! I think its interesting to compare the two. In WILD, as you say, you're trying to hold on to a thread of consciousness while falling asleep. In DILD, you're trying to regain a hold on consciousness while you're dreaming, so you have to imprint yourself with an *unconscious* trigger - train yourself into doing something so automatically that you end up doing it when you're dreaming. I.e. noticing dream signs or doing reality checks. Ontopic of WILD tech; I think a catchy tune can probably work in the same way as a poem. I've been listening to Ammonite's album Reconnection on magnatune.com (free to preview in full!); last night I ended up drifting in and out of sleep hearing it in my head. Didn't manage to WILD but I had my first lucid in a while this morning.

[sourcejedi]

As fast as my Topics come they are gone again. Replaced by long lists of bullshit, same-old-shit topics. Topics like: "Need help with WILD" Cheer up. I know it sucks, but it should be obvious why it happens - theres lots of newbies, and it takes much longer to get a considered topic going than to post "help I can't WILD", regurgitate answers from tutorials, or play Senseless Banter. I think you'd need a much more focused site to fix that; a very well thought out FAQ, etc. Even then, just the volume of post makes keeping any order difficult. Its hard to see a solution that doesn't smack of elitism. Having said that, splitting the forum into different sections with moderators moving topics certainly does some good. Perhaps the next step up from what we have would be a convenient way to see new posts in a given sub-forum, so you can at least choose to look for new posts under Lucid Dreaming and ignore Senseless Banter and Beyond Dreaming. Actually its not possible to do this at all right now because you can't use Search without entering a search phrase...

[RooJ]

Well, I'm not sure if it helps, since the topic seems to have deviated to sleep yoga This wasnt the intention, im not really interested in the subject at face value, i was simply trying to look beneath the surface and find out how their techniques allowed for the type of sleep control they manage. When it comes to "holding a thread of conciousness" while falling asleep these people are the masters. and as the quote that howie posted says: "Learn from the skillful. He who teaches himself hath a fool for his master " -Ben Franklin

[cygnus]

Great topic! I think anybody interested in this should read The Tibetan Yogas of Dream and Sleep. I would be open to an entire discussion board just for its interpretation. I'm tired of so much western bullshit and acronyms.

[Wuollet]

Not all techniques are based on maintaining awareness while falling asleep - those are only the WILD based techs. You're forgetting DILD! I think its interesting to compare the two. In WILD, as you say, you're trying to hold on to a thread of consciousness while falling asleep. In DILD, you're trying to regain a hold on consciousness while you're dreaming, so you have to imprint yourself with an *unconscious* trigger - train yourself into doing something so automatically that you end up doing it when you're dreaming. I.e. noticing dream signs or doing reality checks. Ontopic of WILD tech; I think a catchy tune can probably work in the same way as a poem. I've been listening to Ammonite's album Reconnection on magnatune.com (free to preview in full!); last night I ended up drifting in and out of sleep hearing it in my head. Didn't manage to WILD but I had my first lucid in a while this morning. Err.. about this you say, I cannot agree at all. Since, if you are in a heavy sleep, not concious in any way, how are you even supposed to notice the dreamsigns? It IS a vital thing in every aspect of Lucid dreaming, to have som awareness, and this is probably what SKA's after. A technique, that doesn't leave him in a heavy sleep where you wouldn't notice a Flying car with some awkward alienbreed driving it, and at the same time you've changed appearence. If this ought to happen in a dream, and you're not "aware" you'll have no chance of getting lucid. So to the point, being aware during night is a VITAL thing of lucid dreaming. And doesn't have to do with the technique WILD, only. Or am I wrong maybe? Edit* And by the way, great topic SKA. Hopefully this Topic wont float away, and the same questions appear. " help with wild" and whatever topics that's been created about a thousand times before. Too bad I aint got anything to add on this. Not now at least. Good luck!

[sourcejedi]

I cannot agree at all. Since, if you are in a heavy sleep, not concious in any way, how are you even supposed to notice the dreamsigns? It IS a vital thing in every aspect of Lucid dreaming, to have som awareness, and this is probably what SKA's after. The previous thread I saw "thread of consciousness" was about WILD, and thats what SKA was talking about when starting this thread: lets get back to that basic Idea and figure out some more ways to hold onto a thread of Consciousness while falling asleep I think you're right to say that if your doing DILD you need to be aware in some way. Thats what I was trying to say: that with DILD you're still trying to "stay in touch with Reality", but that the type of awareness is different. Instead of consciously lowering yourself into sleep and holding on to a "thread", you go to sleep normally but with the aim of grabbing hold of a "thread" you hung up earlier, if you see what I mean :-). Different types of thread, no? I hope I'm not derailing your thread any more than the Tibetans, SKA .

[Wuollet]

The previous thread I saw "thread of consciousness" was about WILD, and thats what SKA was talking about when starting this thread: I think you're right to say that if your doing DILD you need to be aware in some way. Thats what I was trying to say: that with DILD you're still trying to "stay in touch with Reality", but that the type of awareness is different. Instead of consciously lowering yourself into sleep and holding on to a "thread", you go to sleep normally but with the aim of grabbing hold of a "thread" you hung up earlier, if you see what I mean :-). Different types of thread, no? I hope I'm not derailing your thread any more than the Tibetans, SKA . yeh well, as i understand, this wasn't just about the WILD-part, but in general a technique that works for people to be aware in general during sleep, so it gets easier to gain lucidity, not just through WILD, but in general? I'm sorry If i missunderstood the thread. Gonna re-read it as soon as I can, but right now I'm in class.

[person-person]

sadly, i'm all for the 'quick fix' ideas. For me, having a Yoga lifestyle is just too impractical, what with school... Give up all emotions? I doubt I could do that lol. Weird, it'd be like being a robot. I can't WILD. All attempts failed at it. Looks like it's just for the occasional DILD. But for those who can stick at it, try clearing your mind every night. That way your dreams won't be clouded by emotions. I dunno if that would help... ill be quiet now...

[Stoat]

Reading the line "Thread Of Consciousness" made me visualise some white, electrical like thread through a whirling rainbow pool. So I am wondering, perhaps if you use a visualising technique (is there such thing as VILD Visual induced lucid dream?) to visualise a symbol to represent your consciousness, and you only think about this symbol, do you think this symbol could carry you into the dream world? If this symbol is incorporated and fused with your mind, do you think that during Sleep Paralysis, all that imagery you see, maybe you could place your thread of consciousness symbol in that imagery and just focus on it? Just and idea Keep up the awesome threads SKA Stoat