Intrusion in dreams

Okay, i know there was a a thread here about someone being able to share a dream and being known that they both are.
But what i have is a intrusion shared dream and i am really mad about it, because i am really territorial in my dreams. I don't like someone coming in my dreams and control my dream and i can't do anything about it. So now i am at the brink of a fight with this person who showed themselves in very odd and scary situations. 1...the female can use telepathic communication, 2 she can come in my dreams and end it whenever she can, i am very steamed.
Read my updated DJ to know what's up, "Mysteries uncovered".

Ok I dont know what things you have tried but since noones said anything here I will try to help . I do believe you and the only thing I can think of sounds weird but put a piece of cayanee pepper into a ziplock baggy under your pillow its a general repel curse kinda thing witch helps on astral planes too the bag is to keep it out of your eyes if you toss and turn double bag it so really its the only thing I have to sugest sorry I cant spell for crap . I am so sorry to hear this is happening to you .As a shared dreamer I am mortified that anyone can do this then again I dont enter peoples dreams they enter mine . But I allow them to and they cant control my dreams . I have found I wake up when the person wakes up that was in there (thats usually the sign that someone was really there)But I do think before going to bed making sure to say you control your dreams might help on the subconcious level , You have the right to be pissed and I hope you can get rid of this unwanted person or spirit .I really haven ever heard of someone being able to do this kind of evil crap in a shared dream ,and it makes me sad because shared dreaming can be a beautiful experience and its sad some jerk screwed that up for you good luck to you and I hope you win your battles

Oh i definitely believe you about the curse crap. i know who it is intruding my dreams and telepathic communication! Read my DJ "Mysteries uncovered". Sounds odd but it really happened! I can control my dreams very well, and can defend myself if needed. But when someone makes my recurring lost love disappear in odd times and ending my dreams? That is and can happen! I know people don't think this can happen, but from someone like me who have lots of abilities and can manage it really is true and can happen.
People abuse shared dreaming at this kind of level. Thanks though for the advice.

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Originally Posted by Pixiedreamer

Ok I dont know what things you have tried but since noones said anything here I will try to help . I do believe you and the only thing I can think of sounds weird but put a piece of cayanee pepper into a ziplock baggy under your pillow its a general repel curse kinda thing witch helps on astral planes too the bag is to keep it out of your eyes if you toss and turn double bag it so really its the only thing I have to sugest sorry I cant spell for crap . I am so sorry to hear this is happening to you .As a shared dreamer I am mortified that anyone can do this then again I dont enter peoples dreams they enter mine . But I allow them to and they cant control my dreams . I have found I wake up when the person wakes up that was in there (thats usually the sign that someone was really there)But I do think before going to bed making sure to say you control your dreams might help on the subconcious level , You have the right to be pissed and I hope you can get rid of this unwanted person or spirit .I really haven ever heard of someone being able to do this kind of evil crap in a shared dream ,and it makes me sad because shared dreaming can be a beautiful experience and its sad some jerk screwed that up for you good luck to you and I hope you win your battles

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if you know it might be a curse use the pepper .I read your journal and just wow evil chick needs to pay that is so not cool . and when you know who it is you can put your energy on that person with the pepper . I used to enter other peoples dreams a long time ago. But couldnt after a tramatic experience kinda like yours actually and the pepper is what finally helped me .I am now currently trying to regain my powers but its baby steps because I let it slide for so long (about 15 years). good luck to you again

Yep, and it was her at that dumb and dumber couple DJ i wrote days before that happened. Realizing she has healing powers in dreams, i did kicked her ass but she can heal and come back, for me it's actually nothing, because i did fight against many hard battles that took forever to defeat them in dreams, better yet never could defeat me.
This pepper thing, is it in powder or the real pepper?

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Originally Posted by Pixiedreamer

if you know it might be a curse use the pepper .I read your journal and just wow evil chick needs to pay that is so not cool . and when you know who it is you can put your energy on that person with the pepper . I used to enter other peoples dreams a long time ago. But couldnt after a tramatic experience kinda like yours actually and the pepper is what finally helped me .I am now currently trying to regain my powers but its baby steps because I let it slide for so long (about 15 years). good luck to you again

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I actually posted a comment at "shared dreams etiquette part 2" in this beyond dreams thread and it does exactly tell you about nightwalkers/stalkers in dreams, they attack you and do whatever in dreams.

I havent read into shared dreams very much, and Im not a critic of anything I dont understand, but it is possible that this person annoying you is just your subconscious and because you expect them to do these things, it happens. Try going to sleep tonight not expecting this to happen, and truly believe that just for tonight. Then if after that, she still bothers you, you can know without a doubt that it isnt just your mind playing tricks on you

Good luck

Oh i truly didn't expect her to attack me in a dream few days ago. And didn't expect such a interruption thru telepathy communication with someone else atm. So far last night i got no dreams what so ever and don't even think of anything like someone annoying me. But when it comes down to dreams i'm always on my toes.

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Originally Posted by kurlie

I havent read into shared dreams very much, and Im not a critic of anything I dont understand, but it is possible that this person annoying you is just your subconscious and because you expect them to do these things, it happens. Try going to sleep tonight not expecting this to happen, and truly believe that just for tonight. Then if after that, she still bothers you, you can know without a doubt that it isnt just your mind playing tricks on you

Good luck

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I used a died whole pepper but as I said double bag it if you toss and turn it can burn your skin and cause a rash or get in your eyes ..And when it happened to me it was an out of body . kinda I couldnt move and i had just laid down It takes me hours to fall asleep I jhope this helps and do be careful with peppers under the pillow really they can hurt like crazy

Another possible strategy....If you make your own mentality less video-game-ninja-defensive-aggressive, you generally won't attract those kinds of people. If they try to get into your dreams, they'll go through you without affecting you, or will recoil back on themselves without you really noticing, because their minds will be on a different frequency, metaphorically speaking.

This is something I've grappled with a lot, I try to protect myself with a bear-like stance, but then many of my hassles tie into that. I've relaxed that in the past several years, and it seems I'm psychically stronger and more secure than I was when I was all combative.

You might also consider the possibility that you're mistaking another 'person' with a suppressed aspect of your higher self. There's a natural ebb and flow between you and it, and if you try to shut out parts of your greater spirit and have exclusive control of your mind, it will fuck with you like that.

My mentality is usually normal before i sleep, during a dream state etc, i don't make my aggressiveness known much in dreams, ONLY when i am attacked it will be known. I am very shrewd in dreams and reality. If it was my higher self, this female i fought in my dream days ago (in DJ) didn't faze me one bit and i actually had fun with her and her hitman XD so basically it wasn't my higher self.

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Originally Posted by shadowofwind

Another possible strategy....If you make your own mentality less video-game-ninja-defensive-aggressive, you generally won't attract those kinds of people. If they try to get into your dreams, they'll go through you without affecting you, or will recoil back on themselves without you really noticing, because their minds will be on a different frequency, metaphorically speaking.

This is something I've grappled with a lot, I try to protect myself with a bear-like stance, but then many of my hassles tie into that. I've relaxed that in the past several years, and it seems I'm psychically stronger and more secure than I was when I was all combative.

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Originally Posted by hathor28

My mentality is usually normal before i sleep, during a dream state etc, i don't make my aggressiveness known much in dreams, ONLY when i am attacked it will be known. I am very shrewd in dreams and reality. If it was my higher self, this female i fought in my dream days ago (in DJ) didn't faze me one bit and i actually had fun with her and her hitman XD so basically it wasn't my higher self.

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Um... ? :)

What makes you think your higher self is trying to 'faze you'? It's all about learning, and learning can be fun. Maybe you should get diplomatic and try to resolve this situation peacefully?

I'm sure i know how my higher self is. Obviously more powerful.

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Originally Posted by telethiese

Um... ? :)

What makes you think your higher self is trying to 'faze you'? It's all about learning, and learning can be fun. Maybe you should get diplomatic and try to resolve this situation peacefully?

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Originally Posted by hathor28

I'm sure i know how my higher self is. Obviously more powerful.

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You're fine to do as you like, you're entitled to your experience and views, but I think you're making a mistake that many people in the world do in regards to 'spiritual matters'. People expect fireworks when it comes to the highest, but most of it's work is so subtle they completely miss the point. They think that if they're really in the wrong that the highest will correct them (abrahamic god, hell fire, vengeful zeus etc) but really, that's our responsibility... It writes the scenarios, and we can go along the rails or jump off the beaten path and examine the situation from all angles. If we don't, we may miss the diamond in the bushes.

Regardless, ;)

I did no mistake, someone did. If you thouroghly read my DJs, you would know.

just because you dont believe in her problem is what she says,,, that doesnt make it not real. She asked for help not to be told she is wrong and not to start a debate . I read her dj and did the best I could to help with my own knowledge I understand yall are trying to help but maybe reading her dj before you say something really might help

Yes, that's what i am saying, and really i don't have much DJ's to read about now that my dreams are all messed up ever since that last odd occurrence in both dream and non-dream state. I usually remember dreams, dream something long enough, and be lucid. Now, it's been very bad, if i do dream it will be a quick and short dream and once it fades away, i continue sleeping without dreams, which ends up in bad memory because i didn't wake up after the dream, i just continued being in a sleep state and that's when memory starts cleaning up from the last dream i had. Basically like clearing your caches from your computer.

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Originally Posted by Pixiedreamer

just because you dont believe in her problem is what she says,,, that doesnt make it not real. She asked for help not to be told she is wrong and not to start a debate . I read her dj and did the best I could to help with my own knowledge I understand yall are trying to help but maybe reading her dj before you say something really might help

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Originally Posted by Pixiedreamer

just because you dont believe in her problem is what she says,,, that doesnt make it not real. She asked for help not to be told she is wrong and not to start a debate . I read her dj and did the best I could to help with my own knowledge I understand yall are trying to help but maybe reading her dj before you say something really might help

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I did read her dream journal. What I'm saying (which she seemed to have misinterpreted) is that the hate you feel for this girl is the cause and the resolution to this entire situation. The hate is the channel that the girl moves through and the hate is the reason her mind allows the connection to be made - so that she can react to it, exacerbating the issue further. This is how it works in the mind-field, like attracts like. From my perspective this is an obvious emotional blockage caused by the mutual hatred of both of the girls. That's why I said she should resolve this situation peacefully.

The manifestations that psychic happenings take are still dependent on the personal self and are further censored, or even manipulated by the impersonal self. That doesn't mean they're not happening or are somehow 'less real', it means that they can be resolved through tying up loose ends and letting go. Acknowledging something as an emanation of your higher aspects accomplishes two thing; it undermines any power it may have over you, and seals the connection between the individual selves. Even if there is still leakage, your detachment will affect her mind moreso because you are acting from a position 'farther away' from the event horizon and 'closer to' the source.

Do you meditate, hathor? Unresolved feelings manifest themselves in reality, sooner or later. Particularly powerful feelings can become like 'demons'. When you cultivate psychic abilities, you must also cultivate detachment from psychic abilities, because there are many hidden trap-doors inside of our minds.. from which others can manipulate us.

In order to seal them up, first you need a sort of net, a sort of dreamcatcher-like term which has power, like god, buddha-nature, higher self, whatever. Something that is indeed more powerful, like you said. Then you weave it through all your experience and see it everywhere so that you can cultivate the impersonal perspective. Associate it with light, mercy, loving-kindness, whatever qualities you'd like. See through it's eyes.

Develop an intimate relationship with this dreamcatcher, allow it to work through you. I like to call it cultivating the godhead, because though it may seem that you are relying on an outside source, in reality you are developing your own godhood. This is a safety mechanism for psychic openness.

Thanks for such advice, but the main problem isn't me, it's mostly her side (I'm not pointing fingers) she started this whole thing 14yrs ago. Now she's starting again and cutting off communications and dreams. How can i "resolve" this? when last we seen each other was 14yrs ago, and she is the main reason why things are getting interrupted. Another reason is also she really don't want me communicating and sharing dreams with this guy we both knew in class 14yrs ago. It is some sort of war between us and like myself i don't give in to bullies and home wreckers. Yet this will still go on, but i do like dream catchers.

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Originally Posted by telethiese

I did read her dream journal. What I'm saying (which she seemed to have misinterpreted) is that the hate you feel for this girl is the cause and the resolution to this entire situation. The hate is the channel that the girl moves through and the hate is the reason her mind allows the connection to be made - so that she can react to it, exacerbating the issue further. This is how it works in the mind-field, like attracts like. From my perspective this is an obvious emotional blockage caused by the mutual hatred of both of the girls. That's why I said she should resolve this situation peacefully.

The manifestations that psychic happenings take are still dependent on the personal self and are further censored, or even manipulated by the impersonal self. That doesn't mean they're not happening or are somehow 'less real', it means that they can be resolved through tying up loose ends and letting go. Acknowledging something as an emanation of your higher aspects accomplishes two thing; it undermines any power it may have over you, and seals the connection between the individual selves. Even if there is still leakage, your detachment will affect her mind moreso because you are acting from a position 'farther away' from the event horizon and 'closer to' the source.

Do you meditate, hathor? Unresolved feelings manifest themselves in reality, sooner or later. Particularly powerful feelings can become like 'demons'. When you cultivate psychic abilities, you must also cultivate detachment from psychic abilities, because there are many hidden trap-doors inside of our minds.. from which others can manipulate us.

In order to seal them up, first you need a sort of net, a sort of dreamcatcher-like term which has power, like god, buddha-nature, higher self, whatever. Something that is indeed more powerful, like you said. Then you weave it through all your experience and see it everywhere so that you can cultivate the impersonal perspective. Associate it with light, mercy, loving-kindness, whatever qualities you'd like. See through it's eyes.

Develop an intimate relationship with this dreamcatcher, allow it to work through you. I like to call it cultivating the godhead, because though it may seem that you are relying on an outside source, in reality you are developing your own godhood. This is a safety mechanism for psychic openness.

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Assuming you're at least as powerful as she is psychically, or even in the same ballpark, it still seems to me that her interference with your dreams must be driven mostly by the way you are thinking about her. You should have incomparably more control over your own mind than another person does. If she is 'at fault' that doesn't change this, and standing up for yourself and what's right doesn't change this.

Your type of 'shrewd', however well it may work on other situations, isn't achieving what you want in this situation. We were trying to offer a different kind that we know will work, notwithstanding how poorly we may have explained it or connected it to your particular circumstances.

Its not just about tactics and appearances, how you act, what you intend to express, and what you 'show' to another mind that affects these things. Fates, so to speak, eventually find a way to push your weaknesses to the surface and screw you with them, and frequently use other people to that ends. Even if you win you lose - you have to change or it will go on forever. Certainly you know more about your situation than anybody else does, so only you can put it together. But I'm pretty sure this is a piece.

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Originally Posted by hathor28

I'm sure i know how my higher self is. Obviously more powerful.

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Higher self is guidance.Is not any form of power of ability that the self is not include.

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Originally Posted by hathor28

I did no mistake, someone did. If you thouroghly read my DJs, you would know.

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Persons and situations in dreams are projections that the self is making in any case.
even if a certain person exists in reality,in your sleep is a form of correspondence to the emotions and feelings you're carrying about that person not that person itself.

So when you're arguing with that person YOU'RE ARGUING WITH AN ASPECT OF YOUR SELF.

Oh except the hypnotizer two kinds of people can tap in non-concious realms.

The first is a psychiatrist with a stroboscopic light again a man that performs hypnosis.
A man who can do this with his mind is going to be definitely a very very talented person.
And if he can manage to enter non-concious realms he can block any memory from it too.
So you would have no idea.
And don't believe you can defend from this.
And he's not taping to anybody's dream.he can be able to give orders to the non-concious.

Higher self is not something recognizable.is an internal function within the self.
You're not communicating like that with the higher self,same way you're not communicating with your liver.

People who are doing hypnosis are very experienced.Or else you can just die through a hypnosis state.
And that through a lot of preparation.
And it can be no intrusion.
The man who is responsible for the hypnosis just repeats dreams (by making the person experiencing them again) and patterns in order to make an interpretation and reach to a conclusion.
Nobody is making any invasion on your dreams.this is not possible.

I think what people are trying to tell you here is to not function so self-centered about what you see in your dreams,and try to see that there is a pattern behind a dream
and an aspect of your self which is bringing you in that state.

Apart from the fact that higher self remains in atrophy to the vast majority of people and even if he's functioning, he's Corresponding to the reality and in very rare occasions in a dream.And not a dream in which you know you're sleeping.A dream which most likely see without even sleeping.

Well, i remembered a dream i had of her like 4 or 5 yrs ago, (i wasn't even thinking of her), she actually pissed me off so much in my dream (not physical) by verbally saying stupid things. Like really how DO i stop this when i don't even think of that sorry excuse of a person??? I was pissed off the whole day.
and yes only i know about the situation. And all i can say is what can i do? actually nothing, and fight back. :roll:

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Originally Posted by shadowofwind

Assuming you're at least as powerful as she is psychically, or even in the same ballpark, it still seems to me that her interference with your dreams must be driven mostly by the way you are thinking about her. You should have incomparably more control over your own mind than another person does. If she is 'at fault' that doesn't change this, and standing up for yourself and what's right doesn't change this.

Your type of 'shrewd', however well it may work on other situations, isn't achieving what you want in this situation. We were trying to offer a different kind that we know will work, notwithstanding how poorly we may have explained it or connected it to your particular circumstances.

Its not just about tactics and appearances, how you act, what you intend to express, and what you 'show' to another mind that affects these things. Fates, so to speak, eventually find a way to push your weaknesses to the surface and screw you with them, and frequently use other people to that ends. Even if you win you lose - you have to change or it will go on forever. Certainly you know more about your situation than anybody else does, so only you can put it together. But I'm pretty sure this is a piece.

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Then if higher self is a guide, why did shadowofwind tell me this female might be my guide?? like really read up ^there more before you quote me and correct me. Btw i know my guide, i have seen them once, and usually they are helpful by advice. I don't think guides attack you and intrude dreams.

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Originally Posted by tsiouz

Higher self is guidance.Is not any form of power of ability that the self is not include.



Persons and situations in dreams are projections that the self is making in any case.
even if a certain person exists in reality,in your sleep is a form of correspondence to the emotions and feelings you're carrying about that person not that person itself.

So when you're arguing with that person YOU'RE ARGUING WITH AN ASPECT OF YOUR SELF.

Oh except the hypnotizer two kinds of people can tap in non-concious realms.

The first is a psychiatrist with a stroboscopic light again a man that performs hypnosis.
A man who can do this with his mind is going to be definitely a very very talented person.
And if he can manage to enter non-concious realms he can block any memory from it too.
So you would have no idea.
And don't believe you can defend from this.
And he's not taping to anybody's dream.he can be able to give orders to the non-concious.

Higher self is not something recognizable.is an internal function within the self.
You're not communicating like that with the higher self,same way you're not communicating with your liver.

People who are doing hypnosis are very experienced.Or else you can just die through a hypnosis state.
And that through a lot of preparation.
And it can be no intrusion.
The man who is responsible for the hypnosis just repeats dreams (by making the person experiencing them again) and patterns in order to make an interpretation and reach to a conclusion.
Nobody is making any invasion on your dreams.this is not possible.

I think what people are trying to tell you here is to not function so self-centered about what you see in your dreams,and try to see that there is a pattern behind a dream
and an aspect of your self which is bringing you in that state.

Apart from the fact that higher self remains in atrophy to the vast majority of people and even if he's functioning, he's Corresponding to the reality and in very rare occasions in a dream.And not a dream in which you know you're sleeping.A dream which most likely see without even sleeping.

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For tsiou to read.:deal:
Btw i don't shut out my greater spirit. If anyone thinks i am bad in my dreams, that's actually wrong. I am a guide myself and help others.

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Originally Posted by shadowofwind

You might also consider the possibility that you're mistaking another 'person' with a suppressed aspect of your higher self. There's a natural ebb and flow between you and it, and if you try to shut out parts of your greater spirit and have exclusive control of your mind, it will fuck with you like that.

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I wasn't sufficiently clear about what I meant when I suggested your 'higher self' might be influencing the dream. I think the girl is involved also, and your thoughts about her, and your 'higher self' or something like that. A person can't draw an exclusive equivalence between any two of them. What I meant was generally compatible with what teletheise and tsouiz said.

To the extent that the girl is actively altering your dreams, I think you and your subconscious are picking up on her obnoxious thoughts and putting them in the dream. Your subconscious attitudes about her form that connection, and can remain unchanged in the back of your mind even if you haven't thought about her consciously for many years.

I hope you can pardon our attitudes here, I think an essential point of what we're saying is right, even if its not obvious and is mixed in with our own egotistical bullshit. If you want to understand it you sort of have to filter that out.

Guide and higher self, are two different meanings to me, so basically tele, tsouiz and you needed to clearify that to me whenever you say higher self. OR maybe you 3, didn't say it specifically to me so i can understand what you guys meant.

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Originally Posted by shadowofwind

I wasn't sufficiently clear about what I meant when I suggested your 'higher self' might be influencing the dream. I think the girl is involved also, and your thoughts about her, and your 'higher self' or something like that. A person can't draw an exclusive equivalence between any two of them. What I meant was generally compatible with what teletheise and tsouiz said.

To the extent that the girl is actively altering your dreams, I think you and your subconscious are picking up on her obnoxious thoughts and putting them in the dream. Your subconscious attitudes about her form that connection, and can remain unchanged in the back of your mind even if you haven't thought about her consciously for many years.

I hope you can pardon our attitudes here, I think an essential point of what we're saying is right, even if its not obvious and is mixed in with our own egotistical bullshit. If you want to understand it you sort of have to filter that out.

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http://someonenue.com/wp/wp-content/...12/06/lols.png

Maybe this will help decipher my posts. :)

This actually looks like the funny part of intruding. :lol:

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Originally Posted by hathor28

Guide and higher self, are two different meanings to me, so basically tele, tsouiz and you needed to clearify that to me whenever you say higher self. OR maybe you 3, didn't say it specifically to me so i can understand what you guys meant.

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Neither of the ideas "higher self" or "guide" fit very well to my personal experience, so I tend to throw such words around sloppily, using them as if they're synonyms when they're not, because I don't have any words that do fit. When I referred to 'fates' I was pointing in the same general direction. I think there is a reality which in some contexts seems to be described reasonably well by the idea "higher self", and in other contexts "guide" or muse or daemon, or God, or many other ideas. But then in other contexts none of those words are quite the right ones, something seems real which seems to partially embody characteristics of several of them.

The reason I don't think in terms of a "higher self" is mine seems to have an identity which is partially distinct from my own. It referred to itself as "higher kin" once. Its like a spirit guide, but it's not totally separate from me either. I'd call it my subconscious, but its more than just a part of myself, and its more personal, intelligent and active than what Jung called the collective unconscious. I don't call it God because that implies universality and infallibility, which it is not in relation to me. I agree it is confusing, and the way I describe it is not clear.

I meant funny version lol

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Originally Posted by hathor28

This actually looks like the funny part of intruding. :lol:

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Anyways, i used to read lots of spiritual books, so, "guide" would mean angel, or spiritual guide, mostly protector (for everything even dreams).
Now higher self, meant to improve your higher self through meditation, energy, etc.

Not the higher self.The self as it is.
Yourself is Projecting an aspect of you in a shape of another person.
And guide is always the self not an entity.

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Originally Posted by shadowofwind

Neither of the ideas "higher self" or "guide" fit very well to my personal experience, so I tend to throw such words around sloppily, using them as if they're synonyms when they're not, because I don't have any words that do fit. When I referred to 'fates' I was pointing in the same general direction. I think there is a reality which in some contexts seems to be described reasonably well by the idea "higher self", and in other contexts "guide" or muse or daemon, or God, or many other ideas. But then in other contexts none of those words are quite the right ones, something seems real which seems to partially embody characteristics of several of them.

The reason I don't think in terms of a "higher self" is mine seems to have an identity which is partially distinct from my own. It referred to itself as "higher kin" once. Its like a spirit guide, but it's not totally separate from me either. I'd call it my subconscious, but its more than just a part of myself, and its more personal, intelligent and active than what Jung called the collective unconscious. I don't call it God because that implies universality and infallibility, which it is not in relation to me. I agree it is confusing, and the way I describe it is not clear.

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I wasn't arguing in any way with you i just believe that the man is confused.
And we all born and drawn in the collective which is carrying tremendous force activity and intelligence on it's core.

Man? who's the man confused???

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Originally Posted by tsiouz

I wasn't arguing in any way with you i just believe that the man is confused.
And we all born and drawn in the collective which is carrying tremendous force activity and intelligence on it's core.

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Ok, then why didn't you specifically say, "yourself is projecting an aspect of you in a shape of another"?. Btw i don't believe i am stalking myself and my own mind, the female isn't me, i don't usually like to piss myself off, it's actually a no-no to me because i can be a crazy female. Read my DJ for today, tell me why she is continuing this since years ago? I'm sure you don't have the answer, and i'm sure no one does, because i think this is something personal that probably no one really gets this because no one actually "listens" to their dreams. But i truly listen, and wonder about it.

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Originally Posted by tsiouz

Not the higher self.The self as it is.
Yourself is Projecting an aspect of you in a shape of another person.
And guide is always the self not an entity.

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All of the people we see in our dreams is a projection of ourselves.
It can be a way of behaviour that annoy you but most likely is a part of you.
It projects a way yourself is working towards others through you to make it clear to yourself.
Maybe this is the way YOU are dealing with people around you.
You gonna be suprised how many behaviour patterns we are carrying hidden from ourselves.

I agree that we project our impressions of other people in dreams, and that those impressions are strongly qualified by who we are.

But its also possible at least to some extent to perceive other people how they are. If this weren't true, people could never actually communicate or share with each other, each individual would be trapped in his own narcissistic choreographed house of mirrors forever. And if sharing is possible in waking life, it is possible in dreams, because although the supporting images are generated in a different manner, the underlying emotional and mental content is the same. The words I write align with and point to what I mean, but to understand me you have to feel and think the thought behind them. If you can do that now, then you can do it in a dream also, though in the dream you may supply much of the word and picture content yourself.

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Originally Posted by shadowofwind

I agree that we project our impressions of other people in dreams, and that those impressions are strongly qualified by who we are.

But its also possible at least to some extent to perceive other people how they are. If this weren't true, people could never actually communicate or share with each other, each individual would be trapped in his own narcissistic choreographed house of mirrors forever. And if sharing is possible in waking life, it is possible in dreams, because although the supporting images are generated in a different manner, the underlying emotional and mental content is the same. The words I write align with and point to what I mean, but to understand me you have to feel and think the thought behind them. If you can do that now, then you can do it in a dream also, though in the dream you may supply much of the word and picture content yourself.

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for a start plato book called republic (badly translated there is no word en english to describe the title) would be could for a person to see if he can truly see himself and his enviroment (story of the man trapped in the cave).
So every person is literally trapped in his own narcissistic choreographed house of mirrors.

Now don't confuse dreams with reality as least to the point we perceive her.
Yes some times if for example your sister is behaving bad to you,might see a dream where you're hitting her,
as part of the anger of a person who is repressing it may express it on a dream.
And yes could be the case that the his sister doesen't represent a state of the self nessesairly but the source of anger.
But dreams are filters.
Filters of emotions desires fears ect.
And are always coded from subconcious.

Is rare the occassion that a finesse part of the self is going to play a role in a dream.

The possibility of people sharing a dream is plain stupidity.
Lower filters of the concious are so complex that only the non concious of the person can project it.
Infact we are not even able to understand and co op with the lower layers of ourselves.

Even a psychiatrist with a stroboscopic light can give directions for a dream that is already there and only.
Even if there was a man who can hypnotize or give commands to the non-concious again who a person is going to dream or perceive that dream is completely personal.

I've read all of Plato's existent dialogues except for some parts of The Republic, but I am familiar with that allegory.

Every week I directly share information in dreams with other people. Yes its confusing to discern what's me and what's them, but a lot of it is definitely them, and information provably comes straight through from them, not from prior sensate experiences of them. That you don't believe this, on account of it being outside of your own immediate experience and understanding, is an illustration of a house of mirrors. But the trap doesn't have to be total. All you have to do is relax your thought that other people can't know stuff that contradicts what you think you know, then other things can start getting through.

Have you tried reconciliate with this person peacefully? Asking her whom she represents, why is she acting the way she is? Offer her love and acceptance? "The Gateway to Inner Self" by Robert Wagonner talks about just that - to conquer the disturbing characters with love and acceptance. It's based on the assumption, that "bad entities" are parts of ourselfs, like maybe some bad trait we have, that we for some reason don't like and thus don't want to accept as being part of us. He provides many stories, when dreamer sends love towards the "bad entity" and this entity changes into something non-threatening and in some occasions "melts" into the dreamer to form one whole character. Fighting our bad traits won't make them go away, accepting them and working on them will.

I agree with you on this but this is a fight for a male that i am sharing/telepathically dreaming with, i know why she's doing this been doing it for a very long time, I have asked who she is and she given me images and examples, it's all in the " Dream/telepathic state" DJ i wrote down, ever since that, dreams been hay-wired and controlled by her, it is all because i am share dreaming with a guy we both knew in grade 7-8. She fully pissed me off in a dream 4 years ago and til this day will never forget how pissed i was the whole day.
The thing is i cant stop him from coming in my dreams, Because it's something that isn't intruding me and my dreams, other than that she is actually disrupting everything, OR the next chain dream she comes up intruding it. She said so her self (not in dreams) but in telepathic commune that she don't want him near me and that i can't have him. ALL I KNOW is he is coming in my dreams, i am not making him to come lol it's all a kid game here that never stopped since grade7, I can't believe she still is jealous up til this day!

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Originally Posted by gab

Have you tried reconciliate with this person peacefully? Asking her whom she represents, why is she acting the way she is? Offer her love and acceptance? "The Gateway to Inner Self" by Robert Wagonner talks about just that - to conquer the disturbing characters with love and acceptance. It's based on the assumption, that "bad entities" are parts of ourselfs, like maybe some bad trait we have, that we for some reason don't like and thus don't want to accept as being part of us. He provides many stories, when dreamer sends love towards the "bad entity" and this entity changes into something non-threatening and in some occasions "melts" into the dreamer to form one whole character. Fighting our bad traits won't make them go away, accepting them and working on them will.

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Well i am not replying to Tsiou anymore all he thinks is that in every dream it's a projection of yourself, when not ALL dreams are, there is interpretations and meaning behind it. His beliefs are so blant. I really can't agree with him sorry. I have read many books about dreams. :silent:

Shouldn't the man you're fighting over step up and make some choices that clarify the situation? If he doesn't do that because he's a jerk, or because he's not really involved, then recognizing that should help you adjust your feelings?

Not that this is easy - I've have problematic attachments that have lasted longer than that.

He really doesn't like her either, like i do. If she can't intrude on a same dream we both are in, she can go to the next dream and control whatever. This female is spontaneous we can't just expect her.

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Originally Posted by shadowofwind

Shouldn't the man you're fighting over step up and make some choices that clarify the situation? If he doesn't do that because he's a jerk, or because he's not really involved, then recognizing that should help you adjust your feelings?

Not that this is easy - I've have problematic attachments that have lasted longer than that.

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Originally Posted by shadowofwind

I've read all of Plato's existent dialogues except for some parts of The Republic, but I am familiar with that allegory.

Every week I directly share information in dreams with other people. Yes its confusing to discern what's me and what's them, but a lot of it is definitely them, and information provably comes straight through from them, not from prior sensate experiences of them. That you don't believe this, on account of it being outside of your own immediate experience and understanding, is an illustration of a house of mirrors. But the trap doesn't have to be total. All you have to do is relax your thought that other people can't know stuff that contradicts what you think you know, then other things can start getting through.

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There are two directions to the subconcious.
The first is coming from the concious when the persons emotions and "watery thoughts" are getting connected with it.
The other is when archetypical patterns emerge from the collective.
And as the collective non-concious moves slowly patterns emerge from the collective to the non-concious.
Which top up to the subconcious coded as dreams.
And as we are all connected together patterns that emerge taking shape in dreams.
And this is why many people "Share" dreams.
This is how jung knew about ww2.
It is because the german collective started to throw to the surface patterns.
And now that you see today in the world a lot of events in a rapid movement
you know that the collective started slowly to move again.

And i bet that at least ten times more people are "sharing" the same or a similar dream.

blah blah blah. you're all so pretentious. kick her ass or make friends.

tsiouz....

These patterns from the unconscious take form in ways that are personal and specific to the individuals who experience them however. And any time two people have a relationship with each other, there is a interrelationship in how the wave breaks over both of them. Because of that interrelationship, one person learns or experiences something of the other, even though the medium which connects them is universal in some sense, and the pattern they are a part of us part of a much larger pattern.

Here's a connected dream experience that illustrates this, as an example I have posted before. I was thinking about Greek elements, earth, water, air, and fire, as being passive, passive-active, active-passive, and active. The 'phases' of matter, solid, liquid, and gas would have a correspondence to the first three. However, the phases are collective statistical properties, an individual molecule doesn't actually have a phase, and doesn't have kinetic energy except in relation to another molecule. The difference between a cloud of gas and several blocks of ice traveling in different directions is one of arrangement only. If so-called astral matter is said to be passive-active relative to ordinary matter, which is passive, how does that make any sense? There are not really different phases of matter even in the physical realm. Such was my thinking. That day I also encountered an image in a book of a mouse biting the talon of an owl. The mouse is a sort of spirit messenger, and the owl is the moon-like muse which stands behind it. That night my sister dreamed of a mouse biting her finger, and of it raining because of acidity being anisotropic, which didn't seem to make any sense. Her dream included a couple other related details which I'm leaving out for brevity. I didn't get my usual 'teaching' dream that night, which was highly unusual, but instead just silence and a simple musical image that fit into my sister's dream.

A point that I understood from my sister's dream was that the difference degree of "imbalance" that is said to separate astral from physical matter is more analogous to a difference in valence electrons rather than a difference in kinetic energy. This wasn't something that had occurred to me previously. It is true that many other people might have had a similar dream that same night, with rain and confusion and maybe a mouse biting a finger, and that these dreams would have been part of the same pattern that joined us. But how many would have been trying to relate Greek elements to modern physics that day, and how many would have had the understanding which was in the dream? Very few to none. Her dream specifically connected to my thoughts, irrespective of how many other people's thoughts are connected also. Similarly with a lot of other connected dream experiences.

In my mind, what you said was quite insightful, and it fits with what I described here. But the way you try to restrict what is possible in dream to the scope of your own awareness and understanding is confining and misleading. Yes there are two directions to the subconscious. But those two directions are not exclusive of other directions, so to speak.

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Originally Posted by WakingNomad

blah blah blah. you're all so pretentious. kick her ass or make friends.

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Hi WakingNomad. I agree I'm pretentious - its a personality feature that I'm stuck with for now. Your manner of wearing ignorance as a badge of honor is pretentious also. So I guess we're in good company. In any case, thanks for your input, I think you make a good point.

Here's a question for you Hathor...Since no one can tell you whether it is real or not, why does it matter? It obviously only has specific import to you alone, so all we forum posters are doing is giving context to the drama. You dont need us...You want us...but why...and when you read that, you will immediately come up with "the answer" but the truth is there is no answer, only more questions. That is because everything is subjective when you are interacting with other objects/subjects.
If you really want to figure this thing out you need to delve into the dream. Become lucid within this dream and find the answers for yourself, no one here can help you anymore.


oh btw, Waking Nomad, word :)

As if it was that easy to do either which i tried

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Originally Posted by WakingNomad

blah blah blah. you're all so pretentious. kick her ass or make friends.

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Not worth talking to him, lol. He will continue this thread until the sun goes down :lol:

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Originally Posted by shadowofwind

tsiouz....

These patterns from the unconscious take form in ways that are personal and specific to the individuals who experience them however. And any time two people have a relationship with each other, there is a interrelationship in how the wave breaks over both of them. Because of that interrelationship, one person learns or experiences something of the other, even though the medium which connects them is universal in some sense, and the pattern they are a part of us part of a much larger pattern.

Here's a connected dream experience that illustrates this, as an example I have posted before. I was thinking about Greek elements, earth, water, air, and fire, as being passive, passive-active, active-passive, and active. The 'phases' of matter, solid, liquid, and gas would have a correspondence to the first three. However, the phases are collective statistical properties, an individual molecule doesn't actually have a phase, and doesn't have kinetic energy except in relation to another molecule. The difference between a cloud of gas and several blocks of ice traveling in different directions is one of arrangement only. If so-called astral matter is said to be passive-active relative to ordinary matter, which is passive, how does that make any sense? There are not really different phases of matter even in the physical realm. Such was my thinking. That day I also encountered an image in a book of a mouse biting the talon of an owl. The mouse is a sort of spirit messenger, and the owl is the moon-like muse which stands behind it. That night my sister dreamed of a mouse biting her finger, and of it raining because of acidity being anisotropic, which didn't seem to make any sense. Her dream included a couple other related details which I'm leaving out for brevity. I didn't get my usual 'teaching' dream that night, which was highly unusual, but instead just silence and a simple musical image that fit into my sister's dream.

A point that I understood from my sister's dream was that the difference degree of "imbalance" that is said to separate astral from physical matter is more analogous to a difference in valence electrons rather than a difference in kinetic energy. This wasn't something that had occurred to me previously. It is true that many other people might have had a similar dream that same night, with rain and confusion and maybe a mouse biting a finger, and that these dreams would have been part of the same pattern that joined us. But how many would have been trying to relate Greek elements to modern physics that day, and how many would have had the understanding which was in the dream? Very few to none. Her dream specifically connected to my thoughts, irrespective of how many other people's thoughts are connected also. Similarly with a lot of other connected dream experiences.

In my mind, what you said was quite insightful, and it fits with what I described here. But the way you try to restrict what is possible in dream to the scope of your own awareness and understanding is confining and misleading. Yes there are two directions to the subconscious. But those two directions are not exclusive of other directions, so to speak.

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Wait a sec, did he mean the female in my dreams or me??? :lol:

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Originally Posted by shadowofwind

Hi WakingNomad. I agree I'm pretentious - its a personality feature that I'm stuck with for now. Your manner of wearing ignorance as a badge of honor is pretentious also. So I guess we're in good company. In any case, thanks for your input, I think you make a good point.

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Well it's not about being real, i just want to know if this happens to other people, having night stalkers dream walkers etc. I did read in a thread somewhere that it does happen and there is such a thing to happen and people do "learn and train" themselves to do stupid things like these. Guess i got to learn and train as well, i know i am rusty because it's been years since i last fought in dreams and etc. So basically i just wanted an inside story about other peoples experiences like i do, not having people coming here and saying they don't believe or say it's not possible, only because they are entitled on their own beliefs. NOW that i see no one says anything about it, i just have to wait a bit more. Not asking for help though.

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Originally Posted by Chimpertainment

Here's a question for you Hathor...Since no one can tell you whether it is real or not, why does it matter? It obviously only has specific import to you alone, so all we forum posters are doing is giving context to the drama. You dont need us...You want us...but why...and when you read that, you will immediately come up with "the answer" but the truth is there is no answer, only more questions. That is because everything is subjective when you are interacting with other objects/subjects.
If you really want to figure this thing out you need to delve into the dream. Become lucid within this dream and find the answers for yourself, no one here can help you anymore.


oh btw, Waking Nomad, word :)

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we all give what we have, nothing more. We cant give you truth though, that is yours to find. Take some time, like several minutes, and deeply contemplate your feelings about these dreams. Eventually, you will either go full circle or come to a dead end. When that happens, repeat. Each time you will discover something new...

Ok, so I just read the OP's DJ. Not a lot of detail in the dreams for me to work with, and I didn't really see anything to lead me to think it was a shared dream. Or at least not a shared dream with someone skilled at control. I need more details. You say this person can wake you up from the dream, how do they do that?

Just from what I've read in the DJ, I'm leaning towards this being a regular dream. I didn't see any evidence of anyone messing with your attention. Knowing someone is outside waiting to attack does not sound like a shared dream. Sounds like something you are sustaining this dream character by focusing on it. It also sounds like a pattern you are reusing over and over in your dreams.

First rule of dreaming is that everything requires your attention to exist. If it's just a regular dream character, then you should be able to get rid of it by ignoring it.

Thanks for your insight Cusp, but my thread here is only for people who experience dream intrusion from someone else they know in real life or knew. I am not asking questions, i am now seeking others who dealt with this same problem.
And that is only when i know if it is really a dream intrusion by shared dreaming, and heard people out there are training on going to someone's dreams and some are abusing this method.
This isn't JUST a DC i am dealing with, i had to become 2nd party to deal with this person and make them vanish.
Some how no one is investigating my DJ's the way i do because it's my dreams and i know what feelings and senses i get in them, this is not a projection of me or my bad side because i have to deal with this negative person in 2nd party in a dream. How do i really ignore a mad and envious person in my dream? It is impossible to do so, because this person is there to interrupt my dreams and FADE them and make this male i am interacting with disappear whenever i get close. Plus certain telepathic communication also topped the cake with this problem.
Over 7yrs on and off with this experience, this female i see is someone i knew long ago. I never become envious in dreams, and in real life i don't be envious often so why is this something i am forming in my dreams and beating myself up for? Makes no sense whatsoever consciously and subconsciously because i am figuring this stuff out in waking life and not. It's something only i know what is going on, because of my extra ability to read minds. Something probably you didn't think of because you are based more in dreams.
How can i ignore a negative vibe? i never do and never will! I don't let my guard down in dreams, it could be a trick from this dream female to make me ignore and catch me off guard when i do, and when i think she is nothing but a faze. Remember dreams want to trick you (even DC's and people) the more you forget about them the more they come, and the more you are ready the more they hide, or vice versa. My dreams,CUSP is a testing place this is why i want to hear from others if this intrusion for this long is capable when someone you knew HATES you and envys. If no one is capable of having their own experiences like mine then i guess i am the first one having this odd experiences.
In case you didn't know i was a pro in my dreams when it came to DC's.
I do not focus on this female, in waking life and dreams, the only thing i focus on is someone she doesn't WANT me to focus on in dreams or commune with at all is the recurring male i knew long ago in real.
LIKE i said SHE can't run my dreams, i focus on who and what i want! this is what i am trying to tell everyone about this female controlling, intruding, AND coming in my dreams without permission. Whenever i get telepathic meditated communication with this male that's dream sharing in my dreams, she either controls that very dream or make havoc on the next DEILD i get. When 1 person can dream share a 2nd can also, many people can come in dreams, we all just don't know it. But i believe it! And i also believe in abusing dream meetings!

I think i found my answer yet people don't believe this crap! And i can't believe what i just read!!! >Dream Spell? - Magic Forums
http://www.spellsofmagic.com/spells/...2108/page.html If this is all you got to do, then it's easy to do often :?:

I think part of what has been at at play is that there's no clean line between a dream character and a dream intruder.

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Originally Posted by hathor28

In case you didn't know i was a pro in my dreams when it came to DC's.

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Just out of curiosity, does this imply you have had a gap in your dreaming habits over time?
Im just wondering if this journey in your dreams is like a reconnection with your youth. Perhaps coming at it from that angle would help some. These dreams could be reactions to regret or anxiety related to lost opportunities/irreversible mistakes.

btw. I said we cant help you, which is true but i think we are the only ones that can ever really help ourselves especially when it comes to accepting others.

You could also say that these characters are using a weakness in you and exposing it to infiltrate and do harm. Ironically, the best thing to do in these situations is to stay calm and respond with rational confidence. I say ironic because most people would react by stamping out the intruder. The decisions we make in dreams are metaphors for decisions in life. We do not always make the same choices in dream life versus waking life. This is the wiggle room we have to imagine new possibilities. Using this utility of the imagination, you can do all sorts of cool stuff in dream. The same is true for waking life. Reality is polarity, and truth is a paradox.

You still haven't told me how she makes your dreams fade.

Ok, if she is a dreamer and not a dream character, then ignoring her won't work. But ignoring the things she does will still work. She could drop a sky scraper on your head, and if you are capable of ignoring it, it won't even phase you.

When shared dreaming occurs, each party involved experiences their own unique dream. It doesn't happen on a shared astral or dream plane. You interact with her from within your dream, and your nemesis messes with you from within hers. You are wrong when you say she controls your dream. You are always in complete control of you dream, even in a shared dream, even if you don't realize it. She can't control your dream at all, or hurt you in any way. What she can do however is manipulate your attention to trick you into turning your own dream against yourself.

Likewise, if you want to challenge her, then you need to manipulate her attention. She comes into your dreams because she is focused on you. What you need to do is give her something to distract her, so that she is forced to shift her focus from you to something else. I can't say what will capture her attention, that depends on the individual, but try to come up with something that can't be ignored.

I made a thread on Dream Combat in relation to shared dreaming at some point. Do a search for threads by me with "Dream combat" in the title, that might help. It also doesn't sound like this woman is very skilled at dream control, so familiarizing yourself with the basics should give you a huge advantage. Check out my thread titled "The nature of dream control" in the dream control forum, or any of Mzzck's threads on the subject.

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Originally Posted by hathor28

I think i found my answer yet people don't believe this crap! And i can't believe what i just read!!! >Dream Spell? - Magic Forums
http://www.spellsofmagic.com/spells/...2108/page.html If this is all you got to do, then it's easy to do often :?:

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BTW, none of the stuff in that spell is necessary. All you need is the intent. I've experimented with trying to insert things into people's dreams from a waking state. I spent hours trying every method I could think of, yet my best result came from doing nothing other than deciding on what I wanted to send. I was tired and told myself I'll do it tomorrow, and had just decided on what I wanted to inject into my target's dream. Afterwards I felt kinda dumb at having wasted so much time putting so much effort into it.

That's not to say that spell wouldn't work. If may even be helpful in focusing your attention on the task at hand, but it's not necessary.

Well i did handle the intruder well after all the disasters she did from my DJ. http://www.dreamviews.com/blogs/hath...penings-34677/
The reason why we keep dreaming of each other is meant to be more of a telepathic connection and also the mind has powers to cause the other person to dream and think about the other. It's all about that and also not only 1 side has regret, both sides do, that's the point of all this. It will keep going until we solve it in real life, which will be hard to do because we both moved away and lost contact.
I actually found another thread here about intruding dreams, but it's a different story about my experience. I think what i am going through is actually beyond "beyond dreams". I know no one can help but i am answering people questions here and other peoples doubts of what is going on with me. Many think it's just a projection, when i think it's not. These are not just memories, these are memories all mixed together and it makes one wonder, why is this person here when they never were?
And this last dream i recently had, the person i last time seen didn't drive a car at the time. So one wonders if this is telepathic dreams we both are sharing, despite also telepathic connections in waking life.

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Originally Posted by Chimpertainment

Just out of curiosity, does this imply you have had a gap in your dreaming habits over time?
Im just wondering if this journey in your dreams is like a reconnection with your youth. Perhaps coming at it from that angle would help some. These dreams could be reactions to regret or anxiety related to lost opportunities/irreversible mistakes.

btw. I said we cant help you, which is true but i think we are the only ones that can ever really help ourselves especially when it comes to accepting others.

You could also say that these characters are using a weakness in you and exposing it to infiltrate and do harm. Ironically, the best thing to do in these situations is to stay calm and respond with rational confidence. I say ironic because most people would react by stamping out the intruder. The decisions we make in dreams are metaphors for decisions in life. We do not always make the same choices in dream life versus waking life. This is the wiggle room we have to imagine new possibilities. Using this utility of the imagination, you can do all sorts of cool stuff in dream. The same is true for waking life. Reality is polarity, and truth is a paradox.

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Manipulate her attention, like becoming 2nd party in the dream, right?

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Originally Posted by The Cusp

You still haven't told me how she makes your dreams fade.

Ok, if she is a dreamer and not a dream character, then ignoring her won't work. But ignoring the things she does will still work. She could drop a sky scraper on your head, and if you are capable of ignoring it, it won't even phase you.

When shared dreaming occurs, each party involved experiences their own unique dream. It doesn't happen on a shared astral or dream plane. You interact with her from within your dream, and your nemesis messes with you from within hers. You are wrong when you say she controls your dream. You are always in complete control of you dream, even in a shared dream, even if you don't realize it. She can't control your dream at all, or hurt you in any way. What she can do however is manipulate your attention to trick you into turning your own dream against yourself.

Likewise, if you want to challenge her, then you need to manipulate her attention. She comes into your dreams because she is focused on you. What you need to do is give her something to distract her, so that she is forced to shift her focus from you to something else. I can't say what will capture her attention, that depends on the individual, but try to come up with something that can't be ignored.

I made a thread on Dream Combat in relation to shared dreaming at some point. Do a search for threads by me with "Dream combat" in the title, that might help. It also doesn't sound like this woman is very skilled at dream control, so familiarizing yourself with the basics should give you a huge advantage. Check out my thread titled "The nature of dream control" in the dream control forum, or any of Mzzck's threads on the subject.



BTW, none of the stuff in that spell is necessary. All you need is the intent. I've experimented with trying to insert things into people's dreams from a waking state. I spent hours trying every method I could think of, yet my best result came from doing nothing other than deciding on what I wanted to send. I was tired and told myself I'll do it tomorrow, and had just decided on what I wanted to inject into my target's dream. Afterwards I felt kinda dumb at having wasted so much time putting so much effort into it.

That's not to say that spell wouldn't work. If may even be helpful in focusing your attention on the task at hand, but it's not necessary.

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Can I be a little rude and interject a thought?

First, this is an excellent thread; kudos to you Hathor for holding it together while the gist of your thread slowly and finally bubbled to the surface! And Cusp, great last post, period. But that's not the thought:

Hathor, forgive me if someone already asked you this, but is there no way you can track this person down in waking life? A renewed physical connection seems the key to this whole thing.

Sorry to interrupt!

Yes i already told about the need for renewed connection while answering chimps questions. Thanks for adding. I think (not sure) i found him in facebook but from the looks of it he doesn't seem to go on facebook or is a fan of it quite much. Been trying all sorts of ways online but it's not working. This is why we both use telepathy connections/communications.

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Originally Posted by Sageous

Can I be a little rude and interject a thought?

First, this is an excellent thread; kudos to you Hathor for holding it together while the gist of your thread slowly and finally bubbled to the surface! And Cusp, great last post, period. But that's not the thought:

Hathor, forgive me if someone already asked you this, but is there no way you can track this person down in waking life? A renewed physical connection seems the key to this whole thing.

Sorry to interrupt!

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^^ Oh. Okay -- I had a feeling you already discussed, and tried to reach this person; sorry I was too lazy to find that out myself!

I suggest though that you keep up your search. To me this seems, oddly, a waking world issue, and not a dream issue at all.

As a result of this discussion, I'm coming around a little bit more to the 'intruder' interpretation for my own experiences. I still don't think that anyone is consciously interfering with my dreams. However, its almost as if my subconscious is or has a compacted sum of everyone else's thoughts. For example, a few weeks ago I dreamed an iambic poem mocking me for trying to understand my dreams, or expecting that I can find answers to such questions by seeking them. I could interpret that voice as springing from my subconscious, in a conventional psychological sense. But sometimes a thought like that distinguishes itself from the mass of thought a little bit more, so that I can objectively tie it to a specific individual. Its seeming to me that its all the same sort of thing. Most people think that almost any kind of persistent self-examination is pointless, and my internal experience would not be the same if they did not think that. Its as if 'I' am a sum of everyone else, but filtered and focused in a particular way.

Sadly it was both of an issue, if this 3rd party will stop intruding.

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Originally Posted by Sageous

^^ Oh. Okay -- I had a feeling you already discussed, and tried to reach this person; sorry I was too lazy to find that out myself!

I suggest though that you keep up your search. To me this seems, oddly, a waking world issue, and not a dream issue at all.

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sounds like you like the intruder

From my DJ you read? no i am just kind-hearted, i don't know the intruder but some how felt sorry. Because the image was cruel-some and anyone could've done this if you had the dream also if it was a girl bounded @ wakingnomad ;D but yes i am known as a hero in dreams and help people. So intruders are bound to take advantage of that.
But if you think this intruder is my dream guy, then no, because i caught an intruder just recent in my dreams trying to trick me again, but didn't work ;) seems like someone is coming in my dreams and knows my dream life :laughhard: good luck to who ever is trying :D

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Originally Posted by WakingNomad

sounds like you like the intruder

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I dont believe anyone can intrude dreams or far less share them.
Lucidity is nice stuff but i wouldnt go as far as saying you can share dreams or intrude them
id say it was a projection like everything else in dreams.

If somebody can show me proof that shared dreaming is possible, go ahead.

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Originally Posted by LSDgarfield

If somebody can show me proof that shared dreaming is possible, go ahead.

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You'd have to want it to be proved to you, in other words you'd have to be willing to let somebody or something into your dream who is capable of doing that. You might also have to be patient and make a lot of choices in that direction, if you've made a lot of incompatible choices previously. Otherwise you're just making an 'if I've covered up my eyes the world doesn't exist' argument.

Whoever says they don't believe in shared dreams and intruders and want proof, means they are blind in dreams and are easily tricked. Now i want to know if that person is going to agree to what i just said :) I really do investigate my dreams hard core, i want to know to whoever investigates their dreams very hard and say that nothing but subconsciousness lives in dreams.

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Originally Posted by hathor28

Whoever says they don't believe in shared dreams and intruders and want proof, means they are blind in dreams and are easily tricked. Now i want to know if that person is going to agree to what i just said :) I really do investigate my dreams hard core, i want to know to whoever investigates their dreams very hard and say that nothing but subconsciousness lives in dreams.

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That, Hathor, is one of the better arguments for shared dreaming I've read in a while!

Oh crap i had to edit my dream a bit, forgot what i had to put there. :)

Shared dreaming will not be proven, so give up trying to get others to prove it to you. Prove it to yourself, or don't.