Thread: Remote Viewing / OBE / Astral Traveling - Experiment

The chances of your experiment working may not prove, or disprove anything.
Every week thousands of people guess random numbers with the odds stacked against them.
The national lottery in the UK has chances of 13,983,815 to 1 to win. But someone wins the money almost every week.
You should include an object of some kind placed next to your monitor. Also a food that you like that has a good smell to it.
Choose items that would stimulate each sense in your body.
Then make the experiment open to DV members. Even if you are not successful, another person may observe correctly.
Lots of fun trying too.

Originally Posted by TiredPhil

The chances of your experiment working may not prove, or disprove anything.
Every week thousands of people guess random numbers with the odds stacked against them.
The national lottery in the UK has chances of 13,983,815 to 1 to win. But someone wins the money almost every week.
You should include an object of some kind placed next to your monitor. Also a food that you like that has a good smell to it.
Choose items that would stimulate each sense in your body.
Then make the experiment open to DV members. Even if you are not successful, another person may observe correctly.
Lots of fun trying too.

I am doing it alone and I think chances of guessing the number are really small, taking the fact that I will turn to a random page every day. I could make more then 3 digits, but I think even with 3 digit number chances to guess are too small. Even if I guess once, I will know how I guessed it, the feeling, the method.. and I will try to follow the same step. If I will be able like you say "guess" it very often, you will still think that it is luck ?

I do not believe in shared experiments online, because to succeed at it you need to know the place where item is located very well, otherwise you wont be able to get to desired location.

I'm wildly speculating here Wildly!!, but I think when you look at your note pad you will see your number but not on the one correlating to the page you flipped too that night. I think you will see a number during your obe, wake up flip through a couple pages forward and see that same number you saw in your dream (obe) just on a totally different page. My line of reasoning is based on a precognitive nature. Maybe it's a totally different day forward then the one you fell asleep in and the number you see in your note pad during the ap is a reflection of what page you were going to flip to on that day when it actually arrives in your waking states.

Even if you get it right one time, which i doubt, you will not get consistent results. Experiments like this have a lot of variables to them for it to work..
The numbers that you see in the dream(if you read any numbers) are gonna depend on a lot of more stuff than what the numbers are in "reality". for example, you might have subconscious expectations about the numbers, you might mix a number with another because you subconsciously think they look like eachother and they remind you of eachother. With practice though, one could get a laser-focused intention of extracting the information that is desired, and even then there's still probably other things that influence the results.

NOT TO DISCOURAGE YOU. but rather give my point of view

Originally Posted by daban

Even if you get it right one time, which i doubt, you will not get consistent results. Experiments like this have a lot of variables to them for it to work..
The numbers that you see in the dream(if you read any numbers) are gonna depend on a lot of more stuff than what the numbers are in "reality". for example, you might have subconscious expectations about the numbers, you might mix a number with another because you subconsciously think they look like eachother and they remind you of eachother. With practice though, one could get a laser-focused intention of extracting the information that is desired, and even then there's still probably other things that influence the results.

NOT TO DISCOURAGE YOU. but rather give my point of view

Thanks, I appreciate any response. I already thought about what you said. Definitely if I get the numbers ones - it does not proof anything. My target is for the beginning to get it right at least ones, as soon as I will get the same number once, my target will change. I will have to learn to do it often, lets say getting the same number more then 3 times per week is a good proof, right ?

That is the reason why I wrote that I think that I am not gonna succeed during my main sleep, I will simply get a different number. There are plenty of possible theories of why would I get a different number. Might be our subconscious, might be different reality, might be something else. I believe that it might be possible during times that are between sleep and awake, I might be able to somehow stay 50/50 here and there.

Originally Posted by dreamcatcher81

I'm wildly speculating here Wildly!!, but I think when you look at your note pad you will see your number but not on the one correlating to the page you flipped too that night. I think you will see a number during your obe, wake up flip through a couple pages forward and see that same number you saw in your dream (obe) just on a totally different page. My line of reasoning is based on a precognitive nature. Maybe it's a totally different day forward then the one you fell asleep in and the number you see in your note pad during the ap is a reflection of what page you were going to flip to on that day when it actually arrives in your waking states.

I thought about it when I was writing this post and wanted to include in notes, but I got too confused and decided to leave it for future conversations. This is an interesting point, I also might get number that I had couple of days before. At this point people will think skeptically. But in case I will get a future or past number I will also update in post, might be interesting for somebody.

My first attempt was on 7th of September 2013, The correct number was 251, in my main lucid dream I wanted to know what number it is, got the number in my head but did not travel to look at the notebook. I felt that it was the wrong number and in the morning when I woke up - I went back to sleep and tried to walk into my living room, saw a notebook but it was blank. The number that I got in my main dream was 754. Two pages after 251 there is a 794 and two pages before 251 there is a 724.

I did one mistake that day, when I turned it to a random page I left the notebook facing down. Most probably its not connected to the results that I got but in future I am going to keep my notebook facing upwards so I could see the number without turning the notebook over. From today my notebook is going to be in the position as it is on the photo.

Originally Posted by TiredPhil

The national lottery in the UK has chances of 13,983,815 to 1 to win. But someone wins the money almost every week.

That would be applicable here if there were tens of millions of people trying to use astral projection to identify numbers.

If he gets a few hits out of a dozen or two tries, the probabilities of that can be computed easily, and are very low. I think a larger problem might be subconscious bias when opening the notebook.

There was a flawed Cornell study not long ago where people seemed to be able to anticipate whether randomly presented images would be pornographic. I think that was a good idea. This goes along with what Phil suggested earlier, that it might be useful to work with something more interesting than numbers, unless you're particularly interested in numbers.

In all of my successful 'experiments', the content has had multiple tie-ins with stuff I'm deeply interested in, like personal relationships or philosophical questions. For me it wouldn't work without that, though it would be hard to do in a scientifically acceptable controlled experiment. But then I'm not an astral traveler either.

Originally Posted by shadowofwind

There was a flawed Cornell study not long ago where people seemed to be able to anticipate whether randomly presented images would be pornographic. I think that was a good idea. This goes along with what Phil suggested earlier, that it might be useful to work with something more interesting than numbers, unless you're particularly interested in numbers.

In all of my successful 'experiments', the content has had multiple tie-ins with stuff I'm deeply interested in, like personal relationships or philosophical questions. For me it wouldn't work without that, though it would be hard to do in a scientifically acceptable controlled experiment. But then I'm not an astral traveler either.

I need something simple that will not take lots of time, like numbers. Plus I live with my wife and I do not want her to know about my experiment. Before I had an idea to get a random number generator, but I did not find any. I think this experiment with notebook is hard enough.

This experiment is not the most pleasant thing to do in dreams, forcing my self to go to living room to see the same notebook every night. And this is against my understanding of lucid dreaming, forcing to do something will only do the opposite. First I need to learn how to do it in a relaxed way. Definitely I do not want to stick only to this experiment in my dreams, I am having other lucid dreams which are more interesting then this experiment. At the same time I really want to read those numbers, so I will try to do it every day.

About subconscious bias, for example today I did not get any number at all. That proofs that I can keep my mind clear from any prejudice.

You are experimenting with numbers written on a two dimensional surface.
The numbers are in sheets on top of one another.
One number under the next, under the next.

Let's say astral trave is 100% real for you, and you have mastered the ability to leave your body, and roam freely.
In astral form, you would be able to see through walls, and travel anywhere in the universe.
You can even pass through solid objects at will.
Also, you would not have physical eyes with which to perceive the world.

Then why would you only see the numbers on the surface of the notebook ?
With the slightest effort you could see through to any page.
If you are an astral traveller, and did see numbers, they may have been correct, but you aquired the information from multiple pages in the notebook.
This would lead you to the conclusion that your experiment failed, when in reality it succeeded.
Your experiment need to be refined a little more.
Perhaps taking Shadowofwinds advice, and add a little more life to your experiment.

Originally Posted by TiredPhil

You are experimenting with numbers written on a two dimensional surface.
The numbers are in sheets on top of one another.
One number under the next, under the next.

Let's say astral trave is 100% real for you, and you have mastered the ability to leave your body, and roam freely.
In astral form, you would be able to see through walls, and travel anywhere in the universe.
You can even pass through solid objects at will.
Also, you would not have physical eyes with which to perceive the world.

Then why would you only see the numbers on the surface of the notebook ?
With the slightest effort you could see through to any page.
If you are an astral traveller, and did see numbers, they may have been correct, but you aquired the information from multiple pages in the notebook.
This would lead you to the conclusion that your experiment failed, when in reality it succeeded.
Your experiment need to be refined a little more.
Perhaps taking Shadowofwinds advice, and add a little more life to your experiment.

In my dream I am not walking through walls, I open the door and walk to my table or I would simply appear there and I do not expect to see through all the pages. I need only the page which I left open, page which will be on the surface. As I said, I need to keep this experiment simple, I already experimented with daily life situations but now I want a solid proof for my self.

If I wont be able to see the surface only I would consider it as a fail. I already saw books and notebooks in my dreams and I never could see through them, I could see one page at a time.

Saying that you could see through all the pages does not make sense, you can also apply a theory that I might see page and number that I will pick in future or that I picked in past. My goal is to see a real physical notebook or maybe close copy of a non-physical notebook but with the same number, a real number in real life time.

However every time I will get a wrong number I will also check few pages forward and backwards, Also I would be able to track past and future numbers from this topic.

Then I hope others can give you some constructive advice.

Originally Posted by TiredPhil

Then I hope others can give you some constructive advice.

Sorry if I sound rude, I appreciate your advice and I am taking it into consideration. But to truly prove it for my self I want to reach a target that I initially wanted to reach. Why would I need remote viewing If I will have difficulties even reading a simple notebook.

There is no need to apologise at all.
If anything, I should be apologising to you.
I have come onto your thread, and tried to put my point of view accross, but it was not accepted.
This seems to have bruised my annoying little ego, and I have tried to alter your experiment too much.
If you do get any results, of any kind, please post them, as this sort of experimentation is very interesting to me.

Update:

Usually in my OBE's I see most of the details in my flat, however after setting up this experiment things changed.
Sometimes I cannot even see my table, and nothing at all in that corner. When I come to the living room that corner is simply empty, no table, no computer, no wires and no notebook.
Sometimes I see my table, but my notebook is missing. Sometimes I can see the notebook and it is open the way I usually open it, but the front page is empty.

Like some of you said, I also expected to end up with some numbers that my mind throws to me during OBE's. But it is going in a different direction now.

At the moment most of my dream thinking is dedicated to the shared dream that I had, maybe that is the reason why I have missing parts of my flat in my dreams.

Anyway I will keep trying to read those numbers...

What is your method for inducing Obe's. If you are RTZ ( real time zone projection) your note pad ,desk, and speakers should be just as you left it before you went to sleep.

Originally Posted by dreamcatcher81

What is your method for inducing Obe's. If you are RTZ ( real time zone projection) your note pad ,desk, and speakers should be just as you left it before you went to sleep.

For me OBE is just a part of lucid dreaming. Sometimes I appear inside my sleeping body, having few FA's and then I start my OBE. Sometimes I appear already in my room and see my self sleeping in the bed. Funny part is that if I walk to my own body and lay down inside it in the same position as it is then they will synchronize and become one body, next time when I stand up I cannot see my sleeping body in the bed anymore.

And 3 different times when I can do it, 1st when I fall asleep I will try to enter my dream without loosing lucidity, 2nd when I fall asleep normally and realize that I am dreaming only inside the dream and the 3rd one is when I wake up in the morning and going back to dream. It is pretty hard to get OBE when going 1st way, 3rd one is the most accurate in my experience.

Just a quick question.
Who do you think is responsible for taking the desk away, and why ?

Originally Posted by TiredPhil

Just a quick question.
Who do you think is responsible for taking the desk away, and why ?

I am not sure, but I think I gave it too much attention and broke my main rule of lucid dreaming. Not to force my self to do something in dream, too much thoughts instead of actual intention.

Originally Posted by flowofmysoul

For me OBE is just a part of lucid dreaming. Sometimes I appear inside my sleeping body, having few FA's and then I start my OBE. Sometimes I appear already in my room and see my self sleeping in the bed. Funny part is that if I walk to my own body and lay down inside it in the same position as it is then they will synchronize and become one body, next time when I stand up I cannot see my sleeping body in the bed anymore.

And 3 different times when I can do it, 1st when I fall asleep I will try to enter my dream without loosing lucidity, 2nd when I fall asleep normally and realize that I am dreaming only inside the dream and the 3rd one is when I wake up in the morning and going back to dream. It is pretty hard to get OBE when going 1st way, 3rd one is the most accurate in my experience.

Maybe the indirect techniques would be beneficial to your experiments. When I successfully perform them my room is just how I left it. Nothing is taken out of my environment just added. I remember projecting from my family room one time and walking to my kitchen. The only thing out of place was my brother in-law sitting on the family room sofa he always sits in. It's just that he wasn't present while i was awake. If I leave a tv or light on that too can be observed while projecting. If you want to Immediately upon awakening physically rollover on your back with the intention to separate. You will notice vibrations and your environment unchanged.

Originally Posted by dreamcatcher81

Maybe the indirect techniques would be beneficial to your experiments. When I successfully perform them my room is just how I left it. Nothing is taken out of my environment just added. I remember projecting from my family room one time and walking to my kitchen. The only thing out of place was my brother in-law sitting on the family room sofa he always sits in. It's just that he wasn't present while i was awake. If I leave a tv or light on that too can be observed while projecting. If you want to Immediately upon awakening physically rollover on your back with the intention to separate. You will notice vibrations and your environment unchanged.

Sorry I forgot to mention, when I did usual OBE's before, I also had similar environment, almost everything was the same. Things started to disappear only when I tried to OBE for this experiment.

My favorite hobby in morning OBE's was to go to my kitchen and find what is my wife making for breakfast That was random, sometimes fail, sometimes success. But I agree I could smell and realize what she cooks and then my mind could guess.

Originally Posted by flowofmysoul

Sorry I forgot to mention, when I did usual OBE's before, I also had similar environment, almost everything was the same. Things started to disappear only when I tried to OBE for this experiment.

My favorite hobby in morning OBE's was to go to my kitchen and find what is my wife making for breakfast That was random, sometimes fail, sometimes success. But I agree I could smell and realize what she cooks and then my mind could guess.

I wish I could one day be successful in OBE's and I that I will be able some day to do it

Originally Posted by Karloky

I wish I could one day be successful in OBE's and I that I will be able some day to do it

Keep practicing and you will definitely do it