Thread: Meditation in LD- a free ticket to the Divine!

Originally Posted by beachgirl

waving on oceans, i've had some of the meditation experiences you describe. waking to the electricity fields (in amber and blue), like an Alex Grey painting, witnessing a black dot on white or white on black, shimmering, not to mention the HH stuff, visions of saints, etc. etc

for me, going into the void was a whole 'nother level. like sitting at the console of a space ship looking into vastness, and my thoughts - well, they were there, but, i chose to remain in the "void", beyond them. i could see them, like raindrops wanting to cross this bubble shield, and i was going, no thanks, i'm just going to hang in the void, here... it's so nice to be beyond thought.

my fear or concern about trying this while in an ld is that i might loose my lucidity pretty quickly, since every thing i've learned is that you are supposed to focus on details, sensory perceptions, take action, etc...

the closest i've come is that during one lucid, i asked "the above" to show me something i couldn't possibly imagine on my own, and i was transported to outer space, where i became a glowing orange dot among the universe of stars.

cool.

but, then what? how do you stay in that place without doing anything?

thanks,
bg~~~

Thank you for the post. Yes, I think what you are describing is similar to what I am. I think its so hard to talk about we all come back from those experiences trying to illustrate them with words... I have a hard time doing it myself. I think part of the reason this is the case is due to these experiences being in a way separate from the internal-monologue mind. They are so different, our minds actually choose to disregard them, as they don't agree with our usual internal-monologue's story. As you describe, being aware of your thoughts while being in the void you were still separate from them. Similarly, when i am in this space (or void- I still really don't know what to call it) my thinking is in a way disconnected or not registering. I would feel much more in the moment, both having experienced such states in wakeful and dreaming instances, and at the time of the experience my total attention is focused on the experience. I am surrounded by a buzzing of energy that i would "see" in pixels of glowing and vibrating patterns of light and shadow. I feel huge in these moments. As if I was a round spherical object filled with vibrating energy. There is a sense of exhilaration, and as I drift back from these moments there is a lingering openness and sense of peace. These experiences are followed by feelings of well-being.

As my entire attention is focused on this abstraction (void of information/sorting through thoughts) i end up in a state of mind where my attention is so caught up in this state it throws a wrench into my monologue-mind, shutting it down. When it goes down the experience doesn't stop. Immediately this other experience begins to become overlaid with the ending of the normal-awareness state. Assuming that this state is similar when I enter into it, and it appears to be a state multiple people have experienced (as what they describe sounds so similar) I would say that this is either 1) a state of mind accessible to everyone or 2) a state of mind all people carry around with them, that it is always online, and they just aren't aware of it.

That is another key idea I should stress: this meditation practice isn't to add things to yourself. I don't want people getting caught in the idea that we are improving our spirituality in the same way a baseball player would improve his batting score. Your spirituality is already perfect, its there in its entirety, just waiting for you to allow it. That idea took me a while to fully understand.

As to what to do when you are there: I would say that those states have a duration and depth of their own. When I am sitting in meditation and I feel I am entering into the spirit (which is what I really call it lol...) depending on just the flow of the universe, i don't know why, there is a variation in the amount of time there and the depth of intensity. Although I can say that since I have begun to understand what I've been doing...they have increased in clarity and depth with familiarity.

waving,

to some extent, you go into meditation, and i wonder if some of what we experience when we get the visuals and way cool experiences like body/mind shimmering is some form of HH?

like, is is some REM-laden, AcH-rich brain on its way to the "void"?

if so, could we argue that there generally there is a branch available to meditators who have set this up this way: you can either WILD into an LD, have an OBE, or stay conscious and eventually (if lucky) attain the void?

(my own teacher taught me that all the HH is in a sense, cool, but to go past it, for the void. so i had some specific programming along the way!)

but again back to the branching, ok, you go lucid... now, i wonder, how to remain lucid in the void? i get that you go to this place inside an LD... but is it hard to remain there? or does it become the same experience you have if you didn't LD in the first place?

such that... you wind up watching your thoughts roll off a bubble shield or the like....

or... are the thoughts outside the "bubble" like way cool dreamy stuff that is dream-appropriate and clearly not from waking life?

thanks,
bg~~~

@beachgirl-What is your meditation background? I had mentioned to lemmefly that it would be cool to see what everyone's background was on the subject. Just to get an idea of how many people have previous experiences and who will be new to the idea.

Personally, I started meditation when I was 13. I guess I had been interested in it for a while and tried it. First couple times I didn't know what I was doing. I believe the second or third time where I was able to take a couple breaths and quiet my mind I felt a flood of noise that filled my mind. I had never heard such a loud noise- like every word I had ever heard, every tv clip, every noise from every videogame lol- all flooded my mind. At the time I viewed the experience as a release- it was the first time my mind had been quiet in a long time lol- and I guess when it did all the noise flooded out. I realized then that there was something to this, and that I should keep doing it.

I've got some reading to do as you suggested...even though I've been meditating off and on for many years with varying results, I haven't done that much reading on meditating itself.
I tried the first step several days ago, meditation to clear the mind. After several minutes I felt a deep relaxation, as well as a great sense of well-being, gentle buzzing in my extremities, and warmth. I'd love to learn more!

Hey Waving, what kind of meditation do you do? I just started doing Mindfulness meditation a few weeks ago. And sometimes I crank music on the headphones and try for a more active trance-state, similar to what can be induced by drumming or loud music. A very different approach, but it leads to the trance/ hypnotic state all the same.

Originally Posted by beachgirl

waving,

to some extent, you go into meditation, and i wonder if some of what we experience when we get the visuals and way cool experiences like body/mind shimmering is some form of HH?

like, is is some REM-laden, AcH-rich brain on its way to the "void"?

if so, could we argue that there generally there is a branch available to meditators who have set this up this way: you can either WILD into an LD, have an OBE, or stay conscious and eventually (if lucky) attain the void?

(my own teacher taught me that all the HH is in a sense, cool, but to go past it, for the void. so i had some specific programming along the way!)

but again back to the branching, ok, you go lucid... now, i wonder, how to remain lucid in the void? i get that you go to this place inside an LD... but is it hard to remain there? or does it become the same experience you have if you didn't LD in the first place?

such that... you wind up watching your thoughts roll off a bubble shield or the like....

or... are the thoughts outside the "bubble" like way cool dreamy stuff that is dream-appropriate and clearly not from waking life?

thanks,
bg~~~

Hey beachgirl- didn't see this before I signed off last lol...would have tried to get back to you faster. What your teacher said is also what I've learned about/been told- that the visuals and many of the more "trippy" aspects of the meditation are not the main focus- but I must say they are personally inspirational. Sorry I have to ask, what do you mean by HH?

As far as the attaining the meditation while LDing, I personally use dream ques that would alert me into being lucid. I usually find really abstract or bizarre items in my dreams...im usually examining these items and I will realize im dreaming. Now at this point my lucidity usually either leaps me into a flying dream or I have a very vivid dream where dream characters distract me and the dream flows into a non-lucid state. While I was trying to meditate during a lucid experience, similarly as how I would be shot into the air if I were trying to fly in a dream, I simply find myself in a deep meditative state once I go lucid.

I would suggest highly (I said this in the technique post) that 80% of the work here is in the waking life meditation prep. I think that if you work hard on the meditation end of it, when it comes time to put the full attention on MDLD (which is gonna take several weeks to even begin to learn) much of the prep will help to quickly jump-start a lucid meditation dream. I have seen that by culturing certain qualities we can sharpen many of the mental tools we use in dreaming.

Your question about how long you would be there or what your thought would be like is kinda hard to say- these experiences seem to be painted differently by my memory than say...having a talk with a friend. Your awareness is much more focused inwardly, on the body. For me, I feel that something stops internally and then I find myself in this other experience. I can't really define it in time, because I feel that time seems to stop. Its seems to have a duration and intensity of its own, not so much something I decide upon.

Personally I know my biggest hurdle is the getting to lucid stage. Once there I seem to have luck jumping into what im focusing on.

I hope that hit some of the talking points lol....im trying to be thorough

Originally Posted by oceanblue

I've got some reading to do as you suggested...even though I've been meditating off and on for many years with varying results, I haven't done that much reading on meditating itself.
I tried the first step several days ago, meditation to clear the mind. After several minutes I felt a deep relaxation, as well as a great sense of well-being, gentle buzzing in my extremities, and warmth. I'd love to learn more!

Thats great to hear oceanblue!! What you were experiencing is what I know to be sensory deprivation...by quieting the mind you shut down the amount of outer sensory input your brain processes. As far as what I can tell, this creates a distortion where the brain doesn't have enough information coming in to collaborate with it...and somehow spacial distortions begin...like sensations of moving or vibrating hands. Just as I was talking about with beachgirl- these things aren't the goal...but they are definitely markers...tells me you were focusing on the task...keep it up!

Try doing the first meditation exercise (Quieting the Mind) for 15 minutes each day (or once in the am and once in the pm would be even better). I think the short sessions are best when you are first starting out. This is only if you want, but its most likely what I will suggest when the class starts

Originally Posted by Darkmatters

Hey Waving, what kind of meditation do you do? I just started doing Mindfulness meditation a few weeks ago. And sometimes I crank music on the headphones and try for a more active trance-state, similar to what can be induced by drumming or loud music. A very different approach, but it leads to the trance/ hypnotic state all the same.

Hey Darkmatters-

My Meditations have been evolving I guess...I have tried a lot of different things. The ones I thought were the most helpful I talked about a little bit in my post. For the past few months I have been meditating when I would feel compelled...basically I haven't been on a regimented schedule, but I am just about to start lol...getting ready for it. I will post more on that soon lol...but its mad late here haha

Yea I have played music while meditating- can definitely be an excellent experience. Try and see what you experience from it. I would say using both techniques (with and without music) would be good to try and see if they make a difference for you. Sometimes I have turned music on when I had trouble quieting my mind, and that would usually help.

Originally Posted by beachgirl

for me, going into the void was a whole 'nother level. like sitting at the console of a space ship looking into vastness

Beachgirl, I absolutely looove that description you use :bravo:
Even though I never had an experience quite like this, I can absolutely feel into this and imagine what this would feel like. Just having that image in the back of my head will probaby help me get to a similar state much faster. Thanx for that!

One thing I wanted to ask you more experienced guys: How much meditation practice did it take you until getting into these advanced stages of emptiness and high-level mindfulness? I am aware that being too results-oriented and impatient will only slow down my progress, but I still wanted to hear some of your personal experiences. I mean are we talking about months, years, decades??

Thanks for everyone participating in this thread, this is really inspiring for meditation newbies like myself trying to really get started

Hey beachgirl- didn't see this before I signed off last lol...would have tried to get back to you faster. What your teacher said is also what I've learned about/been told- that the visuals and many of the more "trippy" aspects of the meditation are not the main focus- but I must say they are personally inspirational. Sorry I have to ask, what do you mean by HH?

waving, i know just what you mean, the visuals and sensuals are amazing - almost like lucid dreaming while conscious... who wouldn't love this? but teachers... that's their job to lead us through to the big bonanza! <grin> but if someone just wants to enjoy this stuff, why not? if i had to choose, for example... hmmm... i don't know, i like the void and the other stuff, too. would hate to have to pick.

thanks for your description, you answered my question.
and your descriptions are in general motivating and well written, thanks!

lemmefly, glad you liked what i said too. like waving said, it's about something that just "happens". being very still and going ever more deeply into relaxation is an excellent start, for going deeper and letting go.

and, by the way, i think results vary from time to time, no matter how good i think i am at this. i do it just to do it, and appreciate any gifts i get a long the way, i don't take this for granted. i am grateful.

being goal oriented will definitely not mix with relaxation and going deeper, and deeper...

Yes, there is definitely a little finesse to it. First you have to convince yourself to try something new, then you have to have the will power to do it repeatedly (even if you don't fully know what you are doing) and then your not supposed to expect something to happen lol...I hear Willy Wanka (the original, sorry Johny Depp) singing in the background, "a little nonsense now and then is relished by the wisest men."

Ah, here's another exercise I was going to talk about (and it will be interesting to see how the meditation we will be doing may spark some of these memories) but I will be asking for everyone to try and remember things from your young childhood. These should purposely be memories that you haven't been mulling over recently. Try to think of several little memories, things that used to be common-place, but aren't anymore. This task will make more sense eventually...

Hey Everyone!!

I know this thread has been idol for a while, but I just wanted to post here so everyone gets a chance to sign-up, the DVA semester is about to begin. The classes being offered will be:

DILD
WILD
Dream Control
Beyond Dreaming
Meditation During Lucid Dreaming

Sign-up sheets are now posted in the DV Academy section of the forum.

Thanks!!