Conservative Republican

[MCM1013]

I have been looking around at some the topics in this part of the forum and some people's opinion just sicken me. I'm born and raised in the south and I'm a conservative republican, i own guns(a lot of them), don't like gay marriage(or gays for that matter) and I have a strong sense of patriotism. I just want to know if anyone else out there shares some of my opinions. Because I'm about sick of these liberals and democrats. And don't post to crititize my beliefs or berate me in anyway, because i dont really feel like argueing about it.

[Original Poster]

That was a very well done parody, you're right up there with Stephen Colbert my friend.

[dazed and confused]

I have been looking around at some the topics in this part of the forum and some people's opinion just sicken me. I'm born and raised in the south and I'm a conservative republican, i own guns(a lot of them), don't like gay marriage(or gays for that matter) and I have a strong sense of patriotism. I just want to know if anyone else out there shares some of my opinions. Because I'm about sick of these liberals and democrats. And don't post to crititize my beliefs or berate me in anyway, because i dont really feel like argueing about it. [/b] I thought I was the only republican. Can I borrow your avatar? At anyrate, I spent a good deal of my life to this point in the south. I think we have similar views on a good deal of things, including gay marrige and gun ownership.

[Nanten]

I'm born and raised in the south and I'm a conservative republican, i own guns(a lot of them), don't like gay marriage(or gays for that matter) and I have a strong sense of patriotism.[/b] I doubt that you've ever met a gay person. It's this kind of thing that annoys me. As George Bernard Shaw said, "Patriotism is your conviction that this country is superior to all other countries because you were born in it." If you were born in Chile, you'd feel like it was the greatest nation in the world. If you were born in Sweden, you'd feel like it was the greatest nation in the world. That's the flaw of patriotism. I just want to know if anyone else out there shares some of my opinions. Because I'm about sick of these liberals and democrats.[/b] It's not like the liberals and Democrats are in control. The Republicans have control over every branch of government. They've had control of Congress since 1994, except for the period between the 2002 and 2004 congressional elections. They've had control of the White House since Bush was inaugurated in 2001. There are more and more conservatives in the media. In fact, I haven't heard a truly "liberal" newscaster in the five years I've been paying attention to the news. How are the liberals/Democrats forcing you to do anything? They don't have the power right now! And don't post to crititize my beliefs or berate me in anyway, because i dont really feel like argueing about it.[/b] That's a wonderful attitude. "Don't post unless you agree with me."

[Howie]

I am a gun advocate, certainly a Republican and Liberals are not high on my list either. But in regards to stereo typing people or hating gays for example, I think you have to put some deeper thought into what you are saying. Do you believe gays choose to be gay? My belief is that they do not. Why, as so many gays do, lead a miserable life hiding their impulses if they had a choice?

[Amethyst Star]

I'm also a conservative republican, but that doesn't mean that I wouldn't vote for a democrat with integrity. I may own a gun some day, and while I don't think having a gun is a bad thing, I really don't see why an average person would need a semi-automatic or automatic weapon. I mean, you're not going to go hunting or fishing with it. As for homosexuals, I have met several and many of them have been very nice people. I do my best to love everyone and esteem them as I do myself, but I don't approve of their lifestyle. I believe that it is a choice, just as drinking or smoking is a choice. One may, for some reason, have the propencity (sp?) towards that way of life, but it is a choice. And just to clarify, my beliefs do not solely stem from my Christian beliefs. There are other reasons as well. I don't want to sound condemning or judging in any way and I apologize if I do. -Amé

[dazed and confused]

I am a gun advocate, certainly a Republican and Liberals are not high on my list either. But in regards to stereo typing people or hating gays for example, I think you have to put some deeper thought into what you are saying. Do you believe gays choose to be gay? My belief is that they do not. Why, as so many gays do, lead a miserable life hiding their impulses if they had a choice? [/b] I don't care what you do in the privacy of your own home, but what annoys me is having it shoved in my face. The whole gay marrige thing is all over the place now. I don't like it and do not approve of it. WTF ever happened to "Don't ask, don"t tell."?

[MCM1013]

ok guys, I'm not a bad person and i dont want any harm to anyone. At the time i wrote that post i was a little POed at some liberals making some awful comments about a conservative and comparing him to a nazi and the likes. As for gays i really dont HATE them and i'm not scared of them or w/e, but i am against gay marriage. I believe that a marriage should be between a man and woman. Basically i think i was kinda wrong about some of the things i said earlier, some i do believe, but some things were said in anger and not really meant. Y'all have a way of making me feel like a really bad person. The thing about patriotism is that i was seeing at the time a lot of unpatriotic things, which i felt strongly against. As for homosexuals, I have met several and many of them have been very nice people. I do my best to love everyone and esteem them as I do myself, but I don't approve of their lifestyle. I believe that it is a choice, just as drinking or smoking is a choice. One may, for some reason, have the propencity (sp?) towards that way of life, but it is a choice. And just to clarify, my beliefs do not solely stem from my Christian beliefs. There are other reasons as well. I don't want to sound condemning or judging in any way and I apologize if I do.[/b] This is what i believe. But in regards to stereo typing people or hating gays for example, I think you have to put some deeper thought into what you are saying.[/b] i did That's a wonderful attitude. "Don't post unless you agree with me." [/b] At the time I was more thinking that i wanted to know if anyone had the SAME beliefs. I go to a school, where i am almost the only one with conservative political beliefs and i am sick of arguing my point...i dont like to argue and i hate making enemies, which i not what i wanted. i wanted to make friends with some people that had similar beliefs. That kinda backfired...now i have gained more enemies. I dont know how to fix this and by talking more i feel that i am just digging myself deeper...so i'll shut my mouth now and concentrate on dreaming and leave my beliefs out of it.

[Alric]

Well I would say I might fall under that. It depends on what meaning you link to it. Todays republican isn't what a republican was 15 years ago. I normally just say I am a libertarian. Basicly I just believe in smaller government.

[Original Poster]

I say live and let live, you can believe whatever you want. Of course no one will ever take you seriously unless you give them proper respect, and saying you're either a gun owner or a victim, wearing your prejudice with pride and then swinging some murdered word like patriotism around as your excuse for it is hardly respect.

[Tsen]

I couldn't disagree with you more. I'm an ex-Republican, now Independent. The biggest disagreement is with your view of gays. It isn't a choice for most of them, it's a natural attraction to those of the same sex. And if it is a choice, it's no concern of you--a person being gay hardly does anything negative to you. And why stop them from being married? It's not like it would hurt the sanctity of marriage--greater than 50% divorce rates and all. I know several gay people, some on this forum, but most in real life. My mom's best friend was gay, and I think he's one of the coolest guys in the world (and MAN, does that guy put out some cool art. I'll post some of it sometime). I've got friends who are gay, and I must say, I can't understand why people are denying them the right to marry. Why not? Just because they can marry somebody of the same sex doesn't mean YOU have to marry somebody of the same sex. The whole "don't ask, don't tell" thing just reminds me of China, where religion isn't explicitly banned, but public display of religion is heavily monitored and generally negatively regarded--being religious in China earns you the label "politically unreliable" and permanently relegates you to the very lowest classes of jobs, and in some cases can prevent you from having children. And that's all you're really doing to gays--telling them that they can technically still be gay, but they can't tell anybody about it, they have to pretend not to be in public, and they can't ever formally announce their love, at risk of serious negative social pressure. That's something called FASCISM, and I'm going to tell you that the right wing's actions on that issue are just that, FASCIST, whether you like it or no. On the guns thing, I'm not as inclined to disagree. I own my share of guns, most prized of which is my Weatherby 12-guage auto shotgun. I think that it's perfectly fine for a civilian to own a gun--but I'm definitely in favor of tighter restriction on gun ownership, and I really don't mind the additional paperwork to recieve a gun. Criminal background checks for those who own guns is perfectly logical, and that sort of program needs to be expanded. But I'm not for the removal of guns from society--there's no point. On the patriot bit, I'm a patriot, too. You DO realize that one can have moderate or liberal views and still be a patriot, right? I respect this country for the freedoms it has. I enjoy the democratic nature of the government, and I wish to increase the level of democracy, making it a place where the minority doesn't feel opressed, where every Joe average has a say in what's going on.

[Alric]

I am probably at an extreme when I say there should be no restrictions on guns. Except for violent criminals, anyone who has served their time should be able to get a gun too.

[shark!]

+++I've always wondered why conservatism is the strongest where education is the weakest???+++ Doesn't it seem strange how rural america, or back woods type places vote republican, places like alabama and louisianna type places are high on conservatism? you know where education isn't great. I'm not trying to say anything by this or anything...but doesn't it make you wonder? why is it that conservatism is well embraced where education is weak? I'm sure some of you conservativs have a good answer for this, it's been confusing me for awhile now...it just doesn't make sense does it? where Education is bad = more people that agree with you. Hmm im sure there is a reasonable explanation.

[Nanten]

By the way, Shark, I love your sig. Where did you find it?

[Alric]

+++I've always wondered why conservatism is the strongest where education is the weakest???+++ Doesn't it seem strange how rural america, or back woods type places vote republican, places like alabama and louisianna type places are high on conservatism? you know where education isn't great. I'm not trying to say anything by this or anything...but doesn't it make you wonder? why is it that conservatism is well embraced where education is weak? I'm sure some of you conservativs have a good answer for this, it's been confusing me for awhile now...it just doesn't make sense does it? where Education is bad = more people that agree with you. Hmm im sure there is a reasonable explanation. [/b] Actually thats not true at all. You just picked out two of the worst states. I could name say california which has a horrible school system but thats not a fair representation of the party because people there are nuts. So I can see why it might confuse you, possibly because you never actually looked up the stats.

[Howie]

I don't care what you do in the privacy of your own home, but what annoys me is having it shoved in my face. The whole gay marrige thing is all over the place now. I don't like it and do not approve of it. WTF ever happened to "Don't ask, don"t tell."? [/b] This is a very touchy subject. It seems evident to me but apparent that our society views gay/lesbian to be socially acceptable. I don't say it is wrong because I view being gay as a flaw in nature. No different than someone with any other mental or physical trait that is not anatomically correct in the animal kingdom. I don't see how anyone can argue that it is not correct. The parts do not fit. You can not procreate. This tells me it is a defect. You would not choose to NOT love someone if they were autistic. And it should be the same way for any gay person. It is who they are. But it is not recognized as a defect. as far as gay marriage, again someone with a defect has limitations. There is a role for a father and a role for a mother to natural play that two same sex people can not provide. The Big question is is it nurture or nature? Gay marriage. If two people love each other then it should be recognized by the courts. It may sound a little contradictory that I feel gay marriage is OK but not for gays to have a family. Take into consideration that I feel they can provide for each other's needs but a child should have what nature intended. IMO.

[Original Poster]

Well arguing homosexuality, though I do disagree with you howetzer, seems a little off-topic. Educational thing does seem on topic, however. I think you guys are generalizing the same way the rest of society sort of generalizes. It's not that education strikes better in cities that rural areas, it's that education generally sucks, but in cities you are exposed to people of all sort of backgrounds, and in rural areas you're pretty isolated. The difference between most conervatism and liberalism is the exposure, the difference in perspective. It's not that conservatives receive bad education, just that they have a narrow perspective. I have a friend from Virginia who lives in Redneck land, and he has never even seen an Asian person except on TV. That is a narrow perspective. Or like me, I lived pretty close to San Fransisco, but California is full of both republicans inland, and democrats coastally, and when I grew up in the inland area I used to think saying gay was just fine, and I used to think gays were lower people, I didn't have any problem with gay bashing or anything. Then I moved to San Fransisco and almost automatically three people in my circle of friends were gay, and they didn't like the way I talked sometimes, so I changed my language, without even noticing actually. I just stopped calling things gay, I don't remember consciously doing so, one day I was just talking to a friend from back home I realized I was getting a little offended by the language he was using. So yeah, rural people don't have worse education than Urbanites, they're both pretty ignorant, as poor people tend to be kept ignorant, they just aren't exposed to anything that would give them a little perspective on matters like these.

[Alric]

Since when has gays been the dividing line between parties? The politics in this country is a joke. People argue over which one is better when the party only actually disagrees on about 5 subjects and are nearly identical for everything else. The best example was the last presidental election. How many times did you hear people saying their exactly the same?

[Tsen]

Alric--that's pretty much exactly what I was going to say. Both parties are stuck in the mindset that the other party is "stupid", and wrong on every count. Now, a party's opinion on an issue could be wrong, but by and large, the Republican party and the Democratic party both have, for the most part, identical views. On the differing points, both have viable viewpoints. If you disagree on a major issue, vote accordingly, but don't vote unerringly Republican because you're pro-guns. Don't vote Democrat because you're pro-choice. ONE issue is no reason to vote for a party. Two issues isn't either--there's no reason whatsoever to consistently and unerringly vote for a single party. That's why I'm independent--I vote liberal on most issues, but I'm not about to tie myself up to a party. Anyway, on the education bit, it's quite irrelevant. For one, even IF all Republican states offered poorer education that Democratic states, you've got a serious case of correlation/causation on your hands. Just because A and B both happen at once doesn't mean A causes B. It's a famous logical fallacy, one that they've always taught in statistics classes in the first week. It was the VERY first lesson I got in my statistics class, and the teacher had a handout to go with it: "Did you know that 99.9% of convicted felons are bread eaters? Ban bread today!" That's more or less the same thing you're suggesting.

[Invader]

I don't even know why we have political parties, it seems as if it were meant only to distract people from what matters. And your right, the politics here are a joke. Our president is a prime example, and the fact that he got voted in a second time made me want to explode in utter disbelief behind the majority of our nations stupidity. One of the biggest flaws in our system is the fact that a leader can be voted in when half of the country opposes them... Does that sounds logical to you? "Hey mr Bush, you won the presidential race, but half of the voting population still despises you. Oh, and the people that didn't vote for you probably couldn't give a damn about you anyways." So in Bush's case, that makes out to be more than half of the population. But be serious here, what do you gain by siding with one political party over the other? Nothing. That's right folks, you don't gain a thing. Be yourself, makes your own decisions based on who YOU are. And if you dont, I'm only going to reffer to you as "Republican" or "Democrat" from now on, instead of using your name.

[MCM1013]

ummm...i'm gonna start a new topic on political parties, just without all the bad comments in the beginning.

[shark!]

Anyway, on the education bit, it's quite irrelevant.[/b] (((how is education irrelevant when talking about the way people think? I'd think that different education makes people think different ways?)))) For one, even IF all Republican states offered poorer education that Democratic states, you've got a serious case of correlation/causation on your hands. Just because A and B both happen at once doesn't mean A causes B.[/b] (((well fuck yah of course, but sometimes A does cause B, that is my point.)))) It's a famous logical fallacy, one that they've always taught in statistics classes in the first week. It was the VERY first lesson I got in my statistics class, and the teacher had a handout to go with it: "Did you know that 99.9% of convicted felons are bread eaters? Ban bread today!"[/b] (((but isn't something like education different than fucking buying bread??? doesn't education teach people, and change their views? how is eating bread anything close to education?)))) That's more or less the same thing you're suggesting. [/b] wait what are you telling me I was suggesting? All I was doing was taking a really big shot at conservatism, clearly. But imnsho there is a direct cause and effect correlation between education, (ignorance, narrow mindedness, and lack or perspective, as that other poster points out) and conservatism in general. btw my sig. is from a Propagandi song Nanten.

[Howie]

Well arguing homosexuality, though I do disagree with you howetzer, seems a little off-topic.[/b] Off Topic? The initial post reads I have been looking around at some the topics in this part of the forum and some people's opinion just sicken me. I'm born and raised in the south and I'm a conservative republican, i own guns(a lot of them), don't like gay marriage(or gays for that matter) and I have a strong sense of patriotism. I just want to know if anyone else out there shares some of my opinions. Because I'm about sick of these liberals and democrats. [/b] And in response to: I don't care what you do in the privacy of your own home, but what annoys me is having it shoved in my face. The whole gay marriage thing is all over the place now. I don't like it and do not approve of it. WTF ever happened to "Don't ask, don"t tell."?[/b] Actually it is the education issue I do not see as addressed. But anyway.. Who cares. It just goes round & round anyway.

[Tsen]

No, really shark, you've got a major correlation/causation problem there. Utah, where I live, has a very good education system, compared to other states. We've got very good high school graduate levels, and similarly high college entrance and graduation levels. Our ACT scores are higher than average, typically. We've got one of the best engineering universities in the world: Utah State, and University of Utah and Weber State are both respected Universities as well. And guess what? Utah is probably one of the MOST conservative states IN EXISTENCE. It's a correlation/causation problem because there are MANY, MANY other effects in play. Utah, for example, votes conservative because ~70% of the state is of a religion that heavily promotes conservative political views. We're also conservative because we have a very low population, and hence, are much more in favor of a republic type system rather than a pure democracy--we don't have enough people to get a really powerful say in the House, so we're really focused on the Senate.

[shark!]

oh ok maybe Utah is different, I think you over estimated my post. I was only taking a shot at conservatism, nothing more then that. Wait didn't you say Utah was small? Small exception then? (heh anyways I include religious as ignorant and uneducated. wow btw you have to live in utah? oh yah pfft I know there are many reasons ppl are conservative, I didn't even mean to have a debate from my first post.