Thread: Middle Eastern Conflict

Originally Posted by Alric

This has nothing to do with terrorists. They are killing 10 civilians for every memeber of hizbollah, and a third are children. I can't believe there are still people who think this is about terrorists. You don't wipe out the population of an entire city if your trying to get some terrorists.
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Ok.SO what Hizbollah are? A charity organisation?
And yes you do wipe out the whole city if the terrorists are hiding amongst and being supported by the population.Now certainly many of the people there dont support Hizbollah by own free will but they are being forced.Hizbollah have the weapons or not?What would you do if they enter your house?You`ll say no?
Thats why they are called terrorists or now we have a new name for those people?

I fully support Israel in blasting all those teritories and Bush in his anti terrorism war.
The lands are in no need of people who support terrorists by own free will.The terrorists are using islamic religion for their goals.Why the leaders of the organizations dont go and blow up themselves with dynamite on their body just for example of how their followers should act?
NO! While the brain washed innocent people are trained in camps of how to use explosives on themselves the leaders sit in their chairs and record themselves on a tapes calling for the islamic world to raise up against the unbelievers."Blow up yourself and kill the others who are around you and you`ll go in heaven"
I mean common.....

No, they are terrorist. They are not the reason for the war however, they are only the excuse. If they weren't there they would be invading for some other reason right now.

Hi all,

You guys know what? Two weeks ago, former Speaker of the House Newt Gingrich went on "Meet the Press" and described the current war between Israel and Hezbollah fighters in Lebanon as "World War III." I don't know about you guys but I feel Newt's words are questionable and he's suspect.

the war between Israel and Hezbollah fighters in Lebanon is nothing at all like the world wars. The past conflict to which it is most analogous is, in fact, the Cold War. This is just once again a remake of the ongoing Cold War between Russia and the U.S.
And I'm sure we can all agree on this one.

They are calling it WW3 because they want to make it WW3, that is their goal. If israel starts invading more countries and the US jumps in and invades Iran, then we really do have a big war.

This debate is pretty badass...we've got some fucking real arab hating rednecks ( do you guys watch Nascar? ..yah i know insults are the lowest debateing form...but the republican's won the election maybe it works??)) here and some people who prolly just made the fucking NSA watch list...I'm also surprised ppl here take the media seriously?

Uh I'm gonna say it was damn stupid to put Isreal where it is...that was some good thinking. Couldn't the jews have their selfish little promised land somewhere where there were a few less people to steal it from? I'm sure there was somewhere in africa that was un-populated and has decent weather...maybe even a nice beach. SO yah thanks alot God for that stupid trash WMD bible...telling those gullible Jews that they are far better and deserve this land for being the chosen ones and it can't be anywhere else...goddamn.

...there are governments and extremists that fuck a lot of shit up, often there might be decent reasons w/e but the point is the civilians and the regular people are fucked over by all this more than anyone...the majority have to suffer.. and are often pawns/soldiers in the wars of leaders.

btw im not picking a side...fuck isreal, fuck america, fuck the promised land, fuck any suicide bombers or muslim fundys...Fuck anyone thats out to kill innocent people...fuck them. There might be good reasons to fight...but the way it's going will only work out for the Yuri Orlov's of the world...

...I'm starting to think someone should start The Weather Underground back up. Maybe not in the "fuckup" way they were before though...Who's in!!??

Actually thats a good point shark. They picked a horrible place to build a country and because they live right there in the middle of a desert they actually don't have much water. Infact one of the biggest reason they keep trying to steal land from other countries is probably because they want the water.

I confess I don't know as much about the current conflict as I probably should, if I'm to make any real comment on current affairs. So I won't. However, there was a news article about it on television recently. The scariest part, I found, was the interview with this eleven year old girl. She said, in perfect English and with the most serious of all faces to the camera:

"We will kill the Lebanese".

I don't know about you, but that phrase being uttered from someone who is barely double-digits in age scared me. That and it really drives home the point of free speech, of "proper" education and the real definition of the term "brainwashed".

This discussion is Sick.. I love it. I feel the war between Israel and Hezbollah fighters in Lebanon is a "real" war, in the sense that Israel genuinely wants to eliminate or at least reduce the threat posed to northern Israel by Hezbollah fighters. Iran, the U.S., Syria and Israel are playing geopolitical Twister, and using poor Lebanon as the game board. Can you say left foot on Beirut...lol
Through its funding, arming and training of Hezbollah, Iran is using this war to warn the United States that any effort to force Iran to give up its nuclear program will have violent consequences. To me the current fighting only demonstrates how, with a nod, a wink and some Iranian-made missiles, Iran can use a relatively small Lebanese militia to push the Middle East to the brink of a full-scale regional war. A full-on, Middle East war could severely, if not fatally, undermine the United States' key regional allies (Israel, Egypt, Saudi Arabia), cripple the world economy with sky-higher oil prices, and put the 130,000 U.S. soldiers in Iraq at risk of being attacked by Iraqi Shi'ite militias allied with Iran. By giving Hezbollah medium-range missiles and the green light to use them on big cities like Haifa, Iran is attempting to warn Israel off launching air strikes against Iran's nuclear facilities. By hitting Hezbollah and Lebanon so hard, Israel is
communicating to Iran that even smallish attacks on Israel will be met with massive counterattacks.
Right-hand on democracy..lol
By supporting such a forceful Israeli attack on Lebanon, the U.S. is staring Iran in the eye and saying, "Iran, we're not afraid of your threats and we're willing to sit by and let Israel destroy Lebanon if that's what it takes to destroy your buddy Hezbollah and show you that we, too, mean business."
Left-foot on sovereignty...lol
So now where do we stand? There's only one other thing left to say.. Anymore Players? How about we change the rules and of course anyone associated with the NPT can get first dibs on the small fry.'
May the best Man (idiot) win.

With all the fuck everything stuff you post does confuse me, shark, but the point on Israel being poorly placed is well taken. Even though I am a jew, the crap about a promised land, and being a better religeon than anyone else because "god" says so pisses me off. This goes for all religions though. I can't stand it. If people got the fact that we are all just that, people, no matter the religion, there would be a lot less fighting and horrors in this world. In my opinion the stupidest move on the part of humanity, which is constantly repeated, is the fighting based on religion. I understand having religion, but killing people over such a trivial thing is plain dumb.

This all being said. Being of totally Israeli heritage myself, and considering I consider myself as much Israeli as I am American (though not enough to serve in the army) , I am with Israel on their response, as, if I am not mistaken, are most Americans, though I am not 100% sure about that fact. Also, I would like to remind everyone that I am not an arab-hating racist pig who wants to kill all arabs, and the only reason I wrote my first thing, which I erased, was that I was ultra pissed off and underinformed, causing me to write a post that does not reflect me as a person. While I am more saddened by an Israeli death, if a person isn't actively participating in terroristic activities, I don't want Lebanese or Palestineans to get killed any more than I want Israelis to get killed.

Originally Posted by PenguinLord13

...Even though I am a jew, the crap about a promised land, and being a better religeon than anyone else because "god" says so pisses me off. This goes for all religions though.
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No, it doesn't.

Judaism is an ethnically specific 'Tribal Religion'. It does not so much Worship a God or a Moral Ideal so much as it provides a mirror for a People to narcissistically worship themselves. It is a Low Religion. It is a great deal like Japanese Shintoism. And it is much like Englands informal Religion of Pro-Anglosaxonism, expressed in what they consider the semi-sacred writings of Sir Walter Scott.

But then we have the Higher Religions that cross national and ethnic boundaries -- Zoroastrianism, Christianity, Buddhism, and yes even Islam.

So don't go around pretending that all Religion is as shitty as your own. Not everybody is a Nazi. Not everybody is a KKK. Not everybody is a jew.

Originally Posted by Leo

No, it doesn't.

Judaism is an ethnically specific 'Tribal Religion'. It does not so much Worship a God or a Moral Ideal so much as it provides a mirror for a People to narcissistically worship themselves. It is a Low Religion. It is a great deal like Japanese Shintoism. And it is much like Englands informal Religion of Pro-Anglosaxonism, expressed in what they consider the semi-sacred writings of Sir Walter Scott.

But then we have the Higher Religions that cross national and ethnic boundaries -- Zoroastrianism, Christianity, Buddhism, and yes even Islam.

So don't go around pretending that all Religion is as shitty as your own. Not everybody is a Nazi. Not everybody is a KKK. Not everybody is a jew.
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Fucking bullshit. What the hell makes Christianity, or Islam any better than Judaism. In Christianity you worship a human being as a "god", and look at all the destruction christianity has caused, and in Islam, it is in the koran that jews are infidels. I didn't even know there was such a thing as Zoroastrianism, so I can't say anything to that. The only exception is Buddhism, which unlike other religions is actually peaceful, and introspective, and concentrated on inner peace, instead of worshiping some theoretical entity (god).

Also, comparing the KKK and Nazis to Jews is ridiculous, as both the KKK and Nazis hate jews, and tried to kill them (Holocaust, ring a bell?). That is the most pathetic comparison I have ever seen.

Originally Posted by PenguinLord13

Also, comparing the KKK and Nazis to Jews is ridiculous, as both the KKK and Nazis hate jews, and tried to kill them (Holocaust, ring a bell?). That is the most pathetic comparison I have ever seen.
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Okay your reasoning is that because the Jews were once victimized, that they are now entitled to take their turn being the Super Race.

And you call me Bullshit?

Remember that 20 Million People died in the so called Holocaust... the primary reason being that Churchill and Roosevelt had imposed an embargo over all of Europe, suspending all the traditional imports of food stuffs on which had become dependent. People everywhere were starving. In the Camps they starved to. Sometimes, where food shipments were simply dried up and no food was on sight, there was exterminations simply to preclude the expected rioting and long sufferings of Mass Starvation.

So it is that Churchill and Roosevelt killed over 20 Million people.

So why is it that only the Jews have some entitlement to be the only People that have a right to complain? And then to use it as an excuse to commit genocide against others?

And then we need to wonder just how bad the Holocaust was, when we are endlessly hearing about Survivors, Survivors, Survivors. How is it with so many survivors that ANYBODY was actually killed. With so many Survivors, the Holocaust could not possibly have been intentional, planned and systematic. If the Germans wanted the Jews dead, they had 6 complete years of total political jurisdiction in which to carry out these executions and genocide. Instead we have survivors, survivors, survivors. A whole damned country full of Genocide Survivers. Am I the only one to see the paradox there?

Then we need to look at German Law. It is against the law to do any Historical Research on the Holocaust. I wonder why?

All we know of the Holocaust is what the Prosecuting Lawyers at Nuremberg presented. Lawyers. Lawyers are not likely to give both sides of any story. And History does not record what the Defense Attorneys had to say.

but this we know.. that even years after the War, Europe was still starving and America had to institute the Marshall Plan to rush food to the starving masses. Would we not expect the starvation to have been worse during the War?

But the Jews were just a minority of those who died.

If the Jews suppose that this makes them SPECIAL, then this is more a sign of the same problem, that Jews think they are better than everybody else.

What would a Jew then expect from the rest of the world but a deep and abiding RESENTMENT.

The way blacks resent KKK. The way Jews resent Nazis. So the World has every right... every 'Goyum'... has an absolute right to resent the Jews.

And then when the Jews have evinced a tendency to attack all other peoples, and to expand their Territories by no other right but through violence and aggression, does not the World have a right to defend itself?

Historically economic predators. Now military predators.

And then Jews are surprised when everybody does not universally love them. But the irony is that if the Whole World was as eager to defend itself as the Jews, then Israel would be erased off the map, with the same instant and total aggression that Israel does not hesitate to slam down on their victims. But the World wants to be Peaceful and Civilized. And that Barbaric Tribe simply takes advantage.

Well if you ask most of the people who thinks Judaism is bad they will tell you that the Jewish teachings says nonjews are not even considered human and so its acceptable to cheat, steal, murder and rape people as long as their not jewish, and even promotes that stealing from them is good. They will also say that it is all written down in their religious texts. Now most Jewish people will tell you that is totally untrue.

I guess the only real way to find out is to actually read them.

Originally Posted by Alric

Well if you ask most of the people who thinks Judaism is bad they will tell you that the Jewish teachings says nonjews are not even considered human and so its acceptable to cheat, steal, murder and rape people as long as their not jewish, and even promotes that stealing from them is good. They will also say that it is all written down in their religious texts. Now most Jewish people will tell you that is totally untrue.

I guess the only real way to find out is to actually read them.
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The Jews have a joke... "Why did God create Gentiles?"

BECAUSE SOMEBODY HAS TO PAY RETAIL.



Thinking of yourself as the Chosen People of God... the inferences are obvious. Everybody else ISN'T.

It is similar to the way that the Calvinist Protestants think about the difference between the Elect of God and the damned reprobate. The way they see it, if somebody becomes Rich and Wealthy and Powerful, then this signifies that God had chosen them to be the Elect. Everybody else is damned and can very well be treated that way. This is why the Calvinists and the Protestants could be Slave Traders without batting an eye and being able to get a good nights sleep. They thought of themselves as above and beyond ordinary normal human beings.

Also there was the Book of Judges and the Book of Kings in the Old Testament which layed out the Campaigns of Genocide against the Canaanites and the Philistines. These are sited as the Zionist's Authority for possibly killing any and every person on Earth that would occupy any piece of Real Estate that a Jew would rather steal than pay for.

Originally Posted by ;289616

Uh I'm gonna say it was damn stupid to put Isreal where it is...that was some good thinking. Couldn't the jews have their selfish little promised land somewhere where there were a few less people to steal it from? [/b]

Were do you suppose we go then? Europe? Well experience taught that isn't a very safe or friendly place for jews to live, In africa on the Desert Sands? Perhaps the last of the Jews who survived the Holocaust will surcome to heat and hunger there.

Or perhaps you should Deport us to America: Then the world will say ''SEE? them jews ARE taking over America and with it the WORLD! It's a Jewish Conspiracy!''

Maybe if you would Ship us to the NorthPole ...would the World Community be happy then?
I think the Jewish people have been through enough deportation, death and exile and the only Hystorically Correct place for them to live is Israël, where their roots are. Now they wanna move us around again? Can you imagine the big Jewish Middle Finger Being raised towards hypocrits in the World Community?

We Jewish people have to take care of ourselves and fight for our righ to exist. You can't just move people around. And had the arab population of Israël been more Tolerant towards the Jews moving in since 1945 than Jews and Arabs would have lived as neighbors in Yerushalayim and the rest of Israël. Too bad the Local Arab Population didn't want to share the land they lived on with Jewish immigrants who just escaped doom.

No one cares what happens to the Jews. Only we ourselves do. So WE shall be taking care of ourselves. And if some Islamo-Insane Religious Terrorist faction Fires Missiles on us. We'll fire back at their possition. NEED I EVEN EXPLAIN WHY Even if the Hizbollah Target is in the middle of a suburb we shall eliminate those who seek our destruction. This is because Hizbolla use their own people as a shield: they hide behind lebanese Children while they shoot at Israëli army posts and Northern Israëli villages. Needless to say what the newspaper reads after Israëlis return fire: ''ISRAËL KILLS 20 CHILDREN IN LEBANESE SCHOOL''

But who's fault is it really that those 20 children got killed? Hizbollah hides amongst children or in Hospitals just SO that the newspapers will say just that and form Public opinion AGAINST Israël. Of course a Soldier who is being shot from afar will return fire NOT KNOWING he's firing at a school full of children.

Hizbollah would only be SOMEWHAT ''brave'' if they targetted armed Israëlis only and when they would go out in the field when they fire at Israël so that when Israël returns fire, the civilian children wont be in the Crossfire. It is Hizbollah who puts them there in the Crossfire

Originally Posted by Alric

No offense but you sound delusional. Its easy to say everyone is racist and evil but have you ever considered the reason for what they do? The entire "We have to crush all terrorist at all costs and if your not with us your a terrorist" crap is the same propaganda Bush spews out every time hes on TV. You don't agree, your a terrorist sympathiser, what a bunch of bull.How do you do that? How do you make your head empty of thoughts?[/b]

Who said I am Pro-Bush cuz I'm Pro-Israël? I hate Bush. He and the previous american presidents sponsored Israël to the point where they are DEPENDANT on US-support. The US have done that to all of the Western world. Fuck Israël doesn't have any choice but to take the support or go down in flames. They would have gone down in flames if i wasn't for the US-Militairy, Political and economic support. The US only sees Israël as yet another powerbase in ''Their'' Middle East.

Originally Posted by Alric

For every rocket a palestinian shoots into israel, israel fires back 4. So don't say they started it with that. Israel never stopped their rocket attacks either, they are just as guilty. How do you do that? How do you make your head empty of thoughts?
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Excuse me? Israël withdrew all of it's defence forces from Southern Lebanon in 2000 as a result of negociations between Israël, Lebanon and the UN council. A good Deal don't you think?

Well Hizbollah didn't and continued it's Ballistic attacks on Northern israëli Civilians. Tell me that I'm wrong: My family called me many times between 2000 and now that they were in bombshelters again because Hizbollah was busy again. And many times before 2000. Basically they are pretty frequently underfire. Something you haven't Heard or Seen on the News isn't any less Real. It's just Informantiion you were deprived of. No wonder your concept of this conflict is so far from reality.

No if you want to believe Hizbollah are saint and the Israëli army are brutes that just, for no reason at all, invade southern Lebanon....Continue believing that. whatever man. People are so ignorant.


BTW: You don't know how increasingly Dangerious it is to be Jewish unless you yourself are Jewish I guess.
If you're white have blue eyes and blond hair: Yeah the world may seem pretty Racism-less.
I have Dark Blond hair, light Blue eyes and white/slightly tainted skin. Too bad my heavy black Middle Eastern eyebrows give me away.... And wearing a DavidStar Pendant may prove to be really Dangerious....I speak from experience. INTOLERANCE. here there fucking everywhere. You watch: This good sovereign world is an illusion. always has been.

No why don't you continue to believe this world is free of racism...Only I, and millions of other Ethnic Minorities, know it's all around us since I have been confronted with it a 1000 of times here in ''free'' Holland. The West. It's a fucking joke Hizbollah are seen as Charity here. but the Anti Jewish Hizbollah-sentiment is spread out throughout the muslim-minorities throughout the western world.

You watch this world as it becomes more and more revealed so you can see what it really is: Filled with Racist hatred. more than you could have ever imagined.

Originally Posted by SKA

Were do you suppose we go then? Europe? Well experience taught that isn't a very safe or friendly place for jews to live, In africa on the Desert Sands? Perhaps the last of the Jews who survived the Holocaust will surcome to heat and hunger there.

Or perhaps you should Deport us to America: Then the world will say ''SEE? them jews ARE taking over America and with it the WORLD! It's a Jewish Conspiracy!''
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Thank you SKA for mentioning a point I forgot to make in my last post. While putting the jews betweeen a ton of Arabs is pretty illogical, putting them in the middle of Europe isn't much better (and there weren't any british territories which could be given to them to my knowledge), they'd probably stay where they are before moving to Africa, where sadly there is much hunger and starvation, and who says that the Africans wouldn't attack Israel too. And America, would be a "Jewish Conspiracy". Also, now that the jews are in Israel, they are in Israel, and there is nothing you can to about it unless you want another Holocaust (which brings me to my next point)...

...Leo Volont, just shut the fuck up you ignorant pig. Who do you think you are saying the holocaust never happened. What the fuck do you think the gas chambers were for? A big gas oven? No you idiot, they were for killing the masses. And while there were survivors, what about the many people we know died, and NOT of starvation. Take Auschwitz for example. Over a million people (over 90% jews) died there. I don't care how little food there was, over a million people don't die of starvation in one place like that. Are you fucking serious. They were forced into the concentration camps by train, and then either put to slave labor, or killed in one of the many ways the Nazis killed people. My grandma is a peaceful person, but if she got her hands on you, considering she barely survived the holocaust, I get a feeling you'd be lucky if she just killed you

Also, what Israel is doing is not genocide. Taken from The Free Dictionary:

gen·o·cide Pronunciation (jn-sd)
n.
The systematic and planned extermination of an entire national, racial, political, or ethnic group. [/b]

Israel is not systematically trying to eradicate the entire lebanese nation, the entire muslim religeon, or all arabs. While Israel is trying to destroy Hezbollah, that is not genocide, as their goal isn't to kill everyone, but to get rid of active terrorists, destroy the military capabilities of Hamas. Israeli has a reason to do it, they were attacked, and they are not trying to commit slaughter, so it isn't genocide. The holocaust was genocide, as it was a total slaughter for no reason other than that the people being killed were "different". While Israel is shooting more rockets than Hezbollah, Hezbollah shot off the first ones, so Israel has a right to respond harder. Saying Israel is wrong by shooting more missiles than Hezbollah is like saying that if someone punches you in the face in the aim of taking you down, you are wrong by slamming them to the ground, and knocking them out in self-defence.

Hezbollah does not give a shit about the Lebanese people. They don't care if Lebanese civilians die, as long as they kill as many jews as possible. All Hezbollah wants is to hurt Israel, and to make the world hate Israel, and even if it means they get hurt twice as hard. They aren't fighting for Lebanon's rights, many Lebanese blame Hezbollah, not Israel. Yes, you heard me, a large portion of Lebanese citizens want nothing to do with Hezbollah, and blame them for the fighting. As I said before, the terrorists are hunkered down in civilian areas, so when you attack the terrorists, you are also attacking innocent civilians.

Oh, and by the way, I hate Bush too, and agree with SKA on the analysis that America supports Israel the way they do in order to have controll in the middle east.

Originally Posted by Ne

This discussion is Sick.. I love it. I feel the war between Israel and Hezbollah fighters in Lebanon is a "real" war, in the sense that Israel genuinely wants to eliminate or at least reduce the threat posed to northern Israel by Hezbollah fighters. Iran, the U.S., Syria and Israel are playing geopolitical Twister, and using poor Lebanon as the game board. Can you say left foot on Beirut...lol
Through its funding, arming and training of Hezbollah, Iran is using this war to warn the United States that any effort to force Iran to give up its nuclear program will have violent consequences. To me the current fighting only demonstrates how, with a nod, a wink and some Iranian-made missiles, Iran can use a relatively small Lebanese militia to push the Middle East to the brink of a full-scale regional war. A full-on, Middle East war could severely, if not fatally, undermine the United States' key regional allies (Israel, Egypt, Saudi Arabia), cripple the world economy with sky-higher oil prices, and put the 130,000 U.S. soldiers in Iraq at risk of being attacked by Iraqi Shi'ite militias allied with Iran. By giving Hezbollah medium-range missiles and the green light to use them on big cities like Haifa, Iran is attempting to warn Israel off launching air strikes against Iran's nuclear facilities. By hitting Hezbollah and Lebanon so hard, Israel is
communicating to Iran that even smallish attacks on Israel will be met with massive counterattacks.
Right-hand on democracy..lol
By supporting such a forceful Israeli attack on Lebanon, the U.S. is staring Iran in the eye and saying, "Iran, we're not afraid of your threats and we're willing to sit by and let Israel destroy Lebanon if that's what it takes to destroy your buddy Hezbollah and show you that we, too, mean business."
Left-foot on sovereignty...lol
So now where do we stand? There's only one other thing left to say.. Anymore Players? How about we change the rules and of course anyone associated with the NPT can get first dibs on the small fry.'
May the best Man (idiot) win.
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Wow how well said Couldn't have said it better myself.
Yeah I think too many people are way too enthusiastic to participate I this Twister And the one that spins the wheel is the US. Now the majority of this Topic (even it's Title) is referring and discussing the PROBLEMS and the causes in this Conflict.

I want to know if any of you Twister-players have an idea of what might be the solution in the Israëli Palestinian Conflict? ( I count the Israëli/Lebanese Conflict as part of the ''palestinian cause'' since that's what they seem to fight for too )


I for one am a Great Supporter of the 2-State Solution. But in order to achieve that first there needs to be a Stable, Responsible Palestinian Authority that keeps it's own people in check first.
And as for Hizbollah in Lebanon: I say Establish a Mega Mega UNMilitairy Force in Southern Lebanon and Northern Israël Too!(So it becomes clear to the UN what it's like living in Northern Israël too ) And form an excellent bufferzone between the 2 parties: Hizbollah would either STOP terrorising just so the world will think ''Hey see? they ARE rightious'' PR reasons OR they would continue attacking Israël and have the UNforce and the World Community on their backs.

Either way it would be a good thing to have a buffering UNforce to keep the situation stable, untill LEBANON has disarmed Hizbollah ( which wil take hell to freeze over...but nothing's impossible ) and removed from Southern parts of Lebanon which they now use as a misslie base to launch ballistics on northern Israël, Haifa and now even BEYOND Haifa.

I hope to god my family who had just Fled from Northern Israël to Tel Aviv WILL actually be safe in Tel Aviv.
I am one of the only who still sees hope here.

hey Leo volont sad person guy who's over 60 years old and still not a day wiser,

I read in PenguinLord's post you are one of those denying the Holocaust? Have you seen UFOs too? And do you have an Astral Master Named Zoltain that ''Speaks'' to you from the Universe or something? What kind of person are you? A Cult member?
Well if the Holocaust is such a FearyTale can you tel me what DID make my Jewish grandmother's Family ''dissappear''? Man This type of sentiment is so airheaded.

Funny you present yourself as an intellectual. However you are must be so weak minded to actually believe these insane theories that denie the overly obvious Genocide: The Holocaust ( In which family of mine had been killed too, lots of them ) The Russians Uncovered many many Nazi SlaveryCamps where Jews had been working in slavery and later ending up being Transported to the special ''DEATHcamps'' where they were GASSED with ZYKLON-B and their bodies Burnt on a large scale. The Nazis tried to blow up and erase the tracks of this Genocide but the Russians were just advancing too fast and Indeniable Evidence was kept intact: Gas-Chambers, Survivers tales, Zyklon-B gas canisters, mass-cremation ovens....You would make for a Terrible Lawyer BTW.

People who denie the Holocaust are the same people that would, if they lived in I.E. The Netherlands during the Outbreak of WW2, Collaborate with the Nazis. It is just plain out loud Ridiculous to Denie the Holocaust. I think all of these people should just ''disappear''. And then we'll all pretend nothing ever happened.
Have you been to a psychologist yet? Cuz you seem to be Socially retarded too. I seem to be not the only one you've pissed off on these boads. You say the Jews in Camps Died of Starvation due to Trade Embargos made by the allies which caused lack of overall foodsupplies?
Ever Heard of ZYKLON-B, Joker? Genocide in it's purest form.

By telling about ''The Jews have a Joke'' , Leo Volont, you Generalise and appearantly assume Jews all share the racist sentiment of that joke. Off course there are Jews with racist and Superioristic Views, No Different than Europeans, Arabs or any People in the world: Racists are everywhere amongst every ethnic population( SEE?! it IS everywhere;P ) Jews not excluded. But To generalise is to shove the privilige in my face that I am a Jew and would Probably feel superior and laugh about that joke.

I am half-Jewish by race, Liberally Jewish by culture and am NOT religious. I was raised with Hanuka and Pesach N stuff....But I don't see nonjews as ''Gentiles'' or even as Non-Jews.

PEOPLE ARE PEOPLE Persons Individuals, That's how I, an INDIVIDUAL with a Jewish Background see it. So please Leo Volont, keep your FILTHY PREJUDICE away from me.


If only Hamas, Hizbollah and Friends would see i the same we wouldn't have this conflict in the first place, the Jews would have migrated to israël without a fuss and Chaim could have been Ahmed's neigbor...see?

Too bad that wasn't so and the radical core of the local Israëli arabs revolted against the Jewish migration. They need to be taught Hospitality I guess.

Originally Posted by Ne

This discussion is Sick.. I love it. I feel the war between Israel and Hezbollah fighters in Lebanon is a "real" war, in the sense that Israel genuinely wants to eliminate or at least reduce the threat posed to northern Israel by Hezbollah fighters. Iran, the U.S., Syria and Israel are playing geopolitical Twister, and using poor Lebanon as the game board. Can you say left foot on Beirut...lol
Through its funding, arming and training of Hezbollah, Iran is using this war to warn the United States that any effort to force Iran to give up its nuclear program will have violent consequences. To me the current fighting only demonstrates how, with a nod, a wink and some Iranian-made missiles, Iran can use a relatively small Lebanese militia to push the Middle East to the brink of a full-scale regional war. A full-on, Middle East war could severely, if not fatally, undermine the United States' key regional allies (Israel, Egypt, Saudi Arabia), cripple the world economy with sky-higher oil prices, and put the 130,000 U.S. soldiers in Iraq at risk of being attacked by Iraqi Shi'ite militias allied with Iran. By giving Hezbollah medium-range missiles and the green light to use them on big cities like Haifa, Iran is attempting to warn Israel off launching air strikes against Iran's nuclear facilities. By hitting Hezbollah and Lebanon so hard, Israel is
communicating to Iran that even smallish attacks on Israel will be met with massive counterattacks.
Right-hand on democracy..lol
By supporting such a forceful Israeli attack on Lebanon, the U.S. is staring Iran in the eye and saying, "Iran, we're not afraid of your threats and we're willing to sit by and let Israel destroy Lebanon if that's what it takes to destroy your buddy Hezbollah and show you that we, too, mean business."
Left-foot on sovereignty...lol
So now where do we stand? There's only one other thing left to say.. Anymore Players? How about we change the rules and of course anyone associated with the NPT can get first dibs on the small fry.'
May the best Man (idiot) win.
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That is well put. How true it is. Regardless of sides, and who I support, I agree with the analysis. Entertaining and to the point. Great post Ne-yo

Of course the holocaust happened, just like 9/11 was commited by terrorists from the middle east and not the US government. There are facts that back up both the cases. Actually, thats a great example. Now I am not saying the holocaust didn't happened, but there is an instant knee jerk reaction people give when ever anyone brings up the subject. In cases like that it can be impossible to talk to someone because they won't listen to the facts, they don't need them, they have already made up their mind.

Also people need to calm down. No offense but you don't come across as very rational when your cursing at people.

As for lebanon, it would be fair to call it genocide, as per your defintion there seems to be a systematic and planned extermination of an entire national group. Mainly everyone living in south lebanon.

Originally Posted by Alric

As for lebanon, it would be fair to call it genocide, as per your defintion there seems to be a systematic and planned extermination of an entire national group. Mainly everyone living in south lebanon.
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That's where you are wrong. Israel isn't trying to kill everyone in south lebanon. They could attack lebanon much harder than they are now if they wanted that. They are using, as an Israeli official put it, "only 5% of their military power". If genocide was the goal, then there would be no one alive in southern lebanon by now.

No offensive but they are not using 5%, and I believe they are trying to kill everyone. They are totally leveling the towns. They are attacking everything, theres reports that they are blowing up every car that moves, they have hit red cross ambulances, they hit schools. The first thing they did was destroy all the roads so no one could get in or out to cut them off so they could wipe out the entire population. Heck they even blew up the UN building, Can't leave any witnesses to the genocide.

Oh wait I forgot the UN was hiding terrorists inside their peace keeping building. Hey I hate the UN like anyone but even I don't believe that.

Originally Posted by Alric

No offensive but they are not using 5%, and I believe they are trying to kill everyone. They are totally leveling the towns. They are attacking everything, theres reports that they are blowing up every car that moves, they have hit red cross ambulances, they hit schools. The first thing they did was destroy all the roads so no one could get in or out to cut them off so they could wipe out the entire population. Heck they even blew up the UN building, Can't leave any witnesses to the genocide.

Oh wait I forgot the UN was hiding terrorists inside their peace keeping building. Hey I hate the UN like anyone but even I don't believe that.
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You know what the problem is with this Discussion? People don't actually take the time to consider THINKING about other people's different views and arguments. Instead they're already preparing to ''Return Fire'' since they see that they are on the ''One Side'' of this conflict and others arre on the ''Other Side''.

We would be starting our own conflict. I think if we would listen to eachother, especially when our Opinions differ most, we should remain OPENMINDED to suggestions of others: Not simply saying: ''Bullshit! You're Wrong!'' Cuz what If I'm not? Or the person you are Disagreeing with? Do you people even CONCIDER eachother's contradictions to Possibly Contain some Truth?


If people here would stop ''immidiately returning fire'' and STOP throwing Racist, Religiously fanatic and other hate carrying remarks around here, this Discussion may actually have some high intellectual level and it may actually enrich our minds with new views and info.

People are too conservative: They stick to what they have chosen to believe. Open your Minds to Eachother people.....And be nicer towards eachother. I think we are to Treat eachother with respect here, no matter how different our opinions may be.

Remember it's a Discussion about War, not a War