Pedophilia - How wide spread is it?

[Sandform]

I was browsing through 4chan, I clicked on the random/misc section. So there I was, minding my own business when I run across a normal, adult (or at least someone who seemed near my age) in a "sexy pose." All seems normal right? Then, being the pervert I am, I click on it to see the thread that resulted from that pick. Little did I know it was going to be full of little boys. The thread was not something I thought very, um, good? It was full of pictures of LITTLE boys, like tiny, with guys or girls saying "moar" and etc. I didn't browse through it completely but there was one picture with a boy who was very little, and he was sitting in a pose with no clothes on and only a towel lieing on his crotch. So yeah. It must be pretty freaking widespread, when prompted as to "why' they didn't stop posting that kind of stuff after protest was already stated, they said no, when asked to go back to "12chan" they responded that it was down. The first time I heard about 12chan was when someone in the D.V. community told someone who was posting images of underage girls on here to "get their 12chan ass out of here." I've never seen 12chan, and I don't intend on seeing it any time soon. I'm amazed that something like that could exist, how that could possibly be allowed is just insane to me. I'm confused really as to what is going on here. I don't think that 15 year olds, for me personally, aren't capable of being attractive. But honestly, little tiny boys and girls? Really? So really I'm left questioning a few things. Is it better to have these things still up online to satisfy these people's lust without allowing kids to come into harm? These kids who are online, are they being sexually abused, or just abused in general? If so, how can anyone permit these things to go on? Sadly I know that if it isn't happening in your own country there is very little legally you can do, mainly because you wont be able to find out where it is happening, only that it is happening. Finally, in counter claim to my original statement, that it might satisfy their urges, will these instead create people who actually become abusive instead of pacifying them? I'm less worried about the fact that there are people who enjoy having thoughts of little kids in their head and more worried about what that might lead to actually causing to happen in the real world. Finally my question is, how wide spread is it? Is it occuring in so many people that it is becoming dangerous? Or are people who images on the internet attractive not something to worry about? So, for those of you who are studying psychology, or those of you who just have an opinion, what is it that can be done about these kinds of things, because apparently just "asking them to leave," or "go back to 12chan," isn't working.

[Mes Tarrant]

Sometimes humanity is downright disgusting. I don't know the answer to most of your questions, but personally, I doubt that looking at these pictures pacifies would-be aggressors. It probably makes it worse for them, if anything. In my psych class in college, we were shown a study where it was concluded that men who watch violent porn are more likely to be violent in person. I think maybe it's a similar situation here. I don't know what to do about this except just sit here and be fucking pissed off.

[Sandform]

Sometimes humanity is downright disgusting. I don't know the answer to most of your questions, but personally, I doubt that looking at these pictures pacifies would-be aggressors. It probably makes it worse for them, if anything. In my psych class in college, we were shown a study where it was concluded that men who watch violent porn are more likely to be violent in person. I think maybe it's a similar situation here. I don't know what to do about this except just sit here and be fucking pissed off. Uh, I didn't mean to piss you off, but I'm in the same boat with you. Sometimes I'm a little bit scared of being one of those creepy people since my grandfather was one...I read some information on the internet and some people claim they see a coorelation with genetics. If I ever got to the point where I would actually consider something like pedophilia as a viable option...I don't know I think I would kill myself.

[SKA]

Pedophelia seems to me like the only sexual orientation that is totally unacceptable. Gay people just find other gay people of the sex. Sado Masochists have a good deal going as 1 likes sodomising during sex and the other likes being sodomised during sex. But Pedophiles crave Children. Children have no sexual desire yet. Children have little knowledge of how sexuality works. Children have an underdevelped sexual awareness as well as underdeveloped sexual organs. So the argument of many Pedophiles "In greek and Roman ancient times it was very normal to have sex with little boys" means very little to me as in that time Mass slavery of conquered peoples was also very normal. No matter how they argue it, Pedophiles have intentions to do with Children what would do them alot of HARM. Maybe we should massively enslave them to pay the price for the harm they've done.

[Jeff777]

This is an excellent topic. Everyone's answers will be based from their internal programmings which are formulated from their values/beliefs etc. Anyway...pedophilia was not a "taboo" thing in the olden days. It was not uncommon for grown American men to marry young 15 yr. old and younger girls. However, in today's society...(given where we are) things have drastically changed...or have they? Grown men marrying very very young ladies and having sex with them is still being done in some villages and tribes. I don't think they have perverse intentions though. But let's step over to our society and how we view it...it's wrong by our perceptions, and us being in agreement with that makes it so. Do I condone pedophilia and having sex with minors? Hell to the no. However I find it's interesting how taboo some things have become. 300 years ago this conversation would never take place. So that begs the question...what about having sex/marrying underage minors is wrong? The fact that society now deems it unacceptable or that "God" does? Does society dictate what "God" sees as morally/legally right or not? Polygamy is another subject now seen as taboo. However hundreds of years ago it was not only condoned...but women as a whole didn't mind sharing their husband with other women (probably because it was acceptable by society's standpoint). Hypothetically speaking...what if 200 years from now wearing white becomes taboo...and our future ancestors will turn their noses up when they read history books about how people "back then" wore white quite frequently. I mean...whose authorizing these perceptual changes in how we are to view and not to view things?

[Mes Tarrant]

Jeff I think you posted before seeing SKA's post... I think he hit it on the nail.

[Sandform]

Jeff I think you posted before seeing SKA's post... I think he hit it on the nail. Agreed. Even in the U.S. today you can still marry a minor, provided they have had their parent give legal consent. The problem is not "oh it is taboo," the problem is that there are certain milestones children have to hit in order to become psychological undisturbed adults. One of them is to be a child and not worry about sex. Exploitation and damage are the frame we have to look at this through, not what is it that we find icky about it. For example as I posed in the O.P. "These kids who are online, are they being sexually abused, or just abused in general? " I have no doubt that the child who was taking a pose that was wearing nothing, and only having a towl not around, but PARTIALLY on his lap to cover himself up, had been molested. What are the Effects of Child Sexual Abuse? Children and adolescents who have been sexually abused can suffer a range of psychological and behavioral problems, from mild to severe, in both the short and long term. These problems typically include depression, anxiety, guilt, fear, sexual dysfunction, withdrawal, and acting out. Depending on the severity of the incident, victims of sexual abuse may also develop fear and anxiety regarding the opposite sex or sexual issues and may display inappropriate sexual behavior. However, the strongest indication that a child has been sexually abused is inappropriate sexual knowledge, sexual interest, and sexual acting out by that child. The initial or short-term effects of abuse usually occur within 2 years of the termination of the abuse. These effects vary depending upon the circumstances of the abuse and the child's developmental stage but may include regressive behaviors (such as a return to thumb-sucking or bed-wetting), sleep disturbances, eating problems, behavior and/or performance problems at school, and nonparticipation in school and social activities. But the negative effects of child sexual abuse can affect the victim for many years and into adulthood. Adults who were sexually abused as children commonly experience depression. Additionally, high levels of anxiety in these adults can result in self-destructive behaviors, such as alcoholism or drug abuse, anxiety attacks, situation-specific anxiety disorders, and insomnia. Many victims also encounter problems in their adult relationships and in their adult sexual functioning. Revictimization is also a common phenomenon among people abused as children. Research has shown that child sexual abuse victims are more likely to be the victims of rape or to be involved in physically abusive relationships as adults are. In short, the ill effects of child sexual abuse are wide ranging. There is no one set of symptoms or outcomes that victims experience. Some children even report little or no psychological distress from the abuse, but these children may be either afraid to express their true emotions or may be denying their feelings as a coping mechanism. Other children may have what is called "sleeper effects." They may experience no harm in the short run, but suffer serious problems later in life.

[ClouD]

Not everyone becomes more attracted to doing something because they watch it. I become less attracted to a specific genre if I watch it. With regards to what I have found attractive in people younger, has always just been innocence and 'openness', and not in a destructive way, but to relate to. I don't know what goes through the minds of other people, but I have no doubt that there's people out there that love the idea of raping children because of dominance etc. The only reason this is considered a problem is because people believe that the child has no power (similarly to men raping women). Children, are sexual from a younger age than much of society likes to acknowledge, not that that's excuse for abuse though. I say keep these sites up, whatever your stance. Most of the stuff on these sites is drawn, and the stuff that isn't is only suggestively sexual and not abusive. If it is, it is removed. For those on the one side of the fence, these sites are monitored by cyber-crimes divisions, removing them would remove the possibility of catching what could be paedophiles. There are much 'worse' places. General P2P programs (LW, Morpheus etc.) hold tonnes of child pornography that is distributed daily around the world. I would guess they are tracked too, though I don't know. It all comes down to intent. That is it, end of story. To supress an urge does only to increase the desire. If people want to masturbate to drawings and suggestive photos, fine in my opinion. That's where I draw the line. It's alike difference between mixing internet and real life or keeping them separate. Between something being expressed in a private or public environment. It is like policing dreams. What if there was a way for dreams to be policed? You can't police the imagination, the point is free will. We want people to be protected from other people that may limit their free will, and in doing that restrict their free will, but it is truly on a personal level in which all decision is made.

[Sandform]

What I saw were not drawings. What I saw were children who were obviously being exploited off camera, and probably on camera as well. The only reason I didn't (some) of these children being abused is because I think the pedophiles know if they post too much they get caught. One of the boys I have seen video footage of on youtube before(so sue me I like to look at hot people, and the pedo vids pop up) and I know there is more going on than what I'm able to see. I'm less worried about pedophiles viewing pictures of kids and more about the kids who are being photographed.

[ClouD]

I was referring to 12Chan and the like. 4chan is a pile of teenagers, and fat, testosterone pumped old men. I'm not so worried about the children nor the paedophiles, and typing this brings me to a pretty deep apathy for expression.

[drewmandan]

EXTREMELY widespread. Pedophilia is a part of all cultures, not just some aberration. Read: http://www.psychohistory.com/htm/05_history.html

[Bearsy]

It's so widespread that there's a video game about it. http://www.molleindustria.org/en/operation-pedopriest

[Neruo]

I believe 4chan isn't really representative of the rest of the internet. Probably kiddy-porn isn't all that rampant on the internet. From what I see in the news, I think there are more 'underground' (non-public) internet kiddy-porn sites. But meh, kiddy porn (on the internet) isn't as much the problem as the assholes making the kiddy porn. It is pretty unique that sexual abuse of children is the Only crime that is also illegal to watch. But it's quite logical. You don't want to give the fuckers another reason for makking the kiddy porn (namely money). Anyhow. Just give em kiddy fiddlers a great fat bunch of mind-numbing shit or something. Anti-viagra, whatever.

[arby]

"Pedophilia" really wasn't discovered until the internet. Back before the internet, taking baby pictures of your kid running through the house naked and screaming was parenthood. Now its pedophilia. Society sucks.

[Sandform]

"Pedophilia" really wasn't discovered until the internet. Back before the internet, taking baby pictures of your kid running through the house naked and screaming was parenthood. Now its pedophilia. Society sucks. I would disagree with almost all of what you just said... But meh, kiddy porn (on the internet) isn't as much the problem as the assholes making the kiddy porn. I would agree, I'm more worried about what is happening to the kids who are being photographed. The odds are they are being abused beyond just being taken advantage of on the camera, and their minds are being warped.

[Neruo]

I would agree, I'm more worried about what is happening to the kids who are being photographed. The odds are they are being abused beyond just being taken advantage of on the camera, and their minds are being warped. Indeed. But some silly people at 4chan or whatever aren't really going to increase the amount of children that get (emotionally) abused. As far as I can see.

[Sandform]

Indeed. But some silly people at 4chan or whatever aren't really going to increase the amount of children that get (emotionally) abused. As far as I can see. These 4chan guys were the ones that were exiled from 4chan and all the other chans until they went to 12chan. The reason they were there is because 12chan was down.

[Merlock]

Which begs the question...what kind of lifeless husks sitting at their PC monitors do they have to be to "have to" resort to visiting and posting on an image board (not a task vital to survival or even well-being in general) while the one they tend to visit is down? As for my view on the topic at hand...slaughter them all. The sooner we start slaughtering for immorality, the sooner society will stop being so "disgusting". But will anyone listen? Nooo. Got to have tolerance...always with the tolerance.

[ClouD]

12chan is far from the only chan containing that sort of material.

[Sandform]

12chan is far from the only chan containing that sort of material. Agreed, but I was led to believe that 12chan was "created" by pedophiles. As to Merlocks statement, I am not disgusted by pedophiles, I'm outraged by them. It isn't the idea of adults lusting after children that gets me, it is the idea of children being abused that does it. I can understand if you can't help but be attracted to kids, whatever you're messed up in the head or something, I don't care really. What I can't understand is that you would abuse a child to get what you want.

[Never]

As for my view on the topic at hand...slaughter them all. The sooner we start slaughtering for immorality, the sooner society will stop being so "disgusting". But will anyone listen? Nooo. Got to have tolerance...always with the tolerance. Don't know how serious you are, but I agree. As it stands one could do some research, and spend months on end killing such people being absolutely certain of their guilt. There are that many whom are guilty and nothing is done. In the small neighborhood where I grew up, approximately 80% of the females I knew had been molested at a young age by a particular man who lived at the north end of my street. Not only that, but he had done the same to several of my female family members even before I was born. Of course when I found out the whole truth about this later in life through the suicidal actions of many of the females I had grown up with, and saw that nothing was being done on account of "lack of evidence", notwithstanding the 30 or 40 cases of which I currently knew about or had heard about occurring 20 or so years past and so on into the present. I had to eventually resolve to murder him or move away forever. It is a tough situation when everyone around you is a coward and they tell you that "you have no right to do something", as if he had the right to go around ruining the lives of the innocent. Backwards. Not everyone has a right to life. Why is this so hard to understand? What happened to the town getting together with torches and pitch forks to go burn the monster in the woods?

[Merlock]

What happened to the town getting together with torches and pitch forks to go burn the monster in the woods? Now considered extremists, zealots and/or mental patients. Apathy reigns. P.S. I don't stand for cynicism. So, yes, I'm always serious on such topics.

[DNK]

Children have no sexual desire yet. Children have little knowledge of how sexuality works. Children have an underdevelped sexual awareness as well as underdeveloped sexual organs. So the argument of many Pedophiles "In greek and Roman ancient times it was very normal to have sex with little boys" means very little to me as in that time Mass slavery of conquered peoples was also very normal. Well, I'd have to disagree. It's common (not sure howso) for children to sexually experiment at young ages. I know personally that I did, and I was sexually active as early as 7. Many other kids in my neighborhood were. In fact, I'm not aware of any that weren't. No, children are not aware of "sex", because "sex" is a culturally-created idea, but I can guarantee you the basic foundations for sex, emotionally and physically, are present at young ages. You're not making that necessary distinction between sexual activity and bonding and the complicated set of social and intellectual complexes that are involved in the modern, inherently cultural, definition of sex. And this is why I hesitate to pass judgment on the ancients for their practices, because I simply don't know what their societal definition was or how they psychologically approached the subject. From what I can tell, the Greeks and Romans were fairly... liberated in that respect. But there's such a massive, massive gulf between modernity and the Classical Age that moralizing is nearly impossible to do in any sincere and significant way. Now, to connect this with modern pedophilia. I don't think it's appropriate, if not solely because of current social attitudes towards it and sex in general. I would have to assess it on a case-by-case basis, really, and realize that what I do know of pedophilia has come from the media, which is so heavily biased against the act that I am not even remotely assured that my opinion is valid based on what little I know about its current form. So, so much of who we are, what we see ourselves as being, and how we interact and socialize is cultural. Sex is something so intricately interwoven with that culture that separating the two is extremely difficult. In the end, all I can say is that in the given culture, if it's acceptable, and if the two people are truly consenting, then I can't see a problem with it. Being able to dissect "consent", though, is difficult...

[DNK]

The problem is not "oh it is taboo," the problem is that there are certain milestones children have to hit in order to become psychological undisturbed adults. One of them is to be a child and not worry about sex. "Milestones" are inherently culturally-defined. The concept of "childhood" is likewise culturally-defined. "Psychologically disturbed" also, so defined. I don't want to sound like I'm defending modern, Western pedophilia, because like I said I don't know it well enough to defend or attack, but lets try to have some perspective, yeah? And, personally, I'm not a pedophile. I stop being attracted to girls after a certain age in their mid-teens. I certainly find some minors attractive. In this state, that's not necessarily illegal either, just so long as you don't take pictures (lovely double-standard, isn't it?).

[Sandform]

"Milestones" are inherently culturally-defined. The concept of "childhood" is likewise culturally-defined. "Psychologically disturbed" also, so defined. Everything is defined by humans, that doesn't mean the definitions aren't correct. Psychologicaly disturbed simply means that you are incapable of living in society normally based on your mind and not your body. (like some people are too big to move or are otherwise handicaped is a body problem) These milestones are necessary for them to exist functionally in society. They are not "inherently culturally-defined." For example, learning how to shower appropriately, or learning to cook. These are milestones.