Video - World's Largest Hatchery - Um, wow.

[Mes Tarrant]

This is essentially a video of what happens to male baby chicks in the world's largest egg-laying breed hatchery. Now, I eat meat and cannot STAND vegans/vegetarians who shove their way of life down my throat, but this thread isn't really about food choices... It's more about, what can I do about this?? Know exactly where I'm getting my eggs from, for a start, I guess. I suppose if these and other factories were more humane, the price of animal products would soar, which is fine with me and a lot of people because it means better treatment of animals. I wonder how long other consumers would put up with that, though. Or even if we achieved a level of humane treatment of animals across the board, I wonder if some companies would try to sneak in bad treatment to lower the price of the products. Edit: AHA! I forgot to post a link. Brb. Ah ok there we go.

[no-Name]

Umm, can we see the video, please? EDIT: I hate videos like this, worse than shockers :\ There's a line between pulling people into your cause with fear, and using evidence to try and take a stand against something. I think this video toes that line quite nicely. I'm a vegetarian myself, but won't tell anyone unless they directly ask, or tell me to eat something I'd rather not. There are better ways to do anything, but I won't pretend I know the perfect way to fix this problem. For the moment, it feels like being vegetarian is the best I can do. People are always going to want more money, for less work. I don't have much faith in the greater part of humanity because of it. Thoughts~

[Mes Tarrant]

Yeah sorry I posted it.

[Descensus]

The part where the male chicks are ground alive is fucking terrible...But the end of the video killed it. "Adopting a vegan diet," yeah fuck that.

[Sornaensis]

Yes, well, that's life. If you want to change it then open your own goddamn factory and use a more humane approach. See how that works for you. Honestly, it is of absolutely no consequence. It isn't like they are obliterating an ecosystem or making large areas of land useless; they're killing off the portion of animals that would otherwise bog down the production of the food. Could you imagine the cost of euthanaizing all of those chicks? Thats hundreds of chicks per minute. And I mean come on; they're CHICKENS. There are MILLIONS of them there, and they expect the workers to handle them carefully? Again, start your own hatchery if you're so concerned about proper treatment of BIRDS. Anyway, I raise my own free range chickens, so this REALLY does not affect me

[Universal Mind]

Damn. That's awful. I just sat down after eating supper. Guess what the meat part of my supper was. Rotisserie chicken and a hardboiled egg. Now I feel guilty. I think that chicken factory situation might be the worst case of sexism I have ever heard of. It seems like the animals that have it best before becoming meat are animals that are hunted in the wild. A lot of types of farm raised animals end up getting tortured at some point.

[DrunkenArse]

It's more about, what can I do about this?? Know exactly where I'm getting my eggs from, for a start, I guess. I guess another thing that you can do is try to spread information about animal awareness and that their suffering is as real as ours. People get away with this sort of stuff because the attitude seems to be that the victims are "only" animals. Some people just really don't care about the suffering of others though.

[grasshoppa]

"A compassionate vegan diet..." Oh stfu, that isn't going to do anything...

[Mes Tarrant]

But the end of the video killed it. "Adopting a vegan diet," yeah fuck that. Yes! Honestly, they need to keep that stuff to themselves - bah, if only they knew how much that turns a lot of people away! Yes, well, that's life. If you want to change it then open your own goddamn factory and use a more humane approach. See how that works for you. Honestly, it is of absolutely no consequence. It isn't like they are obliterating an ecosystem or making large areas of land useless; they're killing off the portion of animals that would otherwise bog down the production of the food. Could you imagine the cost of euthanaizing all of those chicks? Thats hundreds of chicks per minute. And I mean come on; they're CHICKENS. There are MILLIONS of them there, and they expect the workers to handle them carefully? Again, start your own hatchery if you're so concerned about proper treatment of BIRDS. See... I like animals, especially cute fuzzy little things, but... you definitely have a point! And I completely agree with you - just imagine the cost of keeping all those other chicks alive, just so at the end of the day people could have some eggs. But there's really no way to say that without sounding insensitive, even though it's totally true. Would people have a problem if those thicks were killed humanely, no pain or suffering?

[ClouD]

Does this feel right, killing these living creatures that may feel and think as we do, that live. No, it doesn't. Is it the right thing to do for humanity, which thrives from selfish consumption. Yes, it is. You or the chicken?

[DarkLucideity]

If you think about it, if you saw fish being dropped into a grinder like that, chances are you wouldn't feel quite as sorry for them. They're not cute. Thus you have none of that parental instinct to protect them.

[LucidFlanders]

I am having a hard time trying to know what is worse. These hatchery guys, or the person talking in the video, the kind who try and make you feel sorry by stabbing you in the heart, just like those guys telling you to feed a starving kid faggots who steal 99% of the money you give them. Probably half and half. Atleast the male chicks die somewhat fast. I used to be bugged by these videos, but i'm pretty used to seeing and knowing these things now. I'm not going to stop eating what i eat, why should I? shit happens, and there is no way to stop it. For every vegan there are 10 more non vegans, it's a useless battle that can't be won, so just accept it, it's bigger then all of us. If you think these chicks suffer you have not seen the fur industry, they skin animals ALIVE! that shit is hard to watch, REALLY hard to watch. It's not like we don't do this to humans anyway. I have absolutly no heart for human kind, i lost it a long time ago. If i had the choice to pick my life or the existance of every human in the world (meaning the end of human kind), i'd pick mine easily without regret. Seriously do the chics even feel pain? seems they are born prematurly. If you really wanna worry about this, worry about the city you live in, not some place far far away in neverland.

[LucidFlanders]

Yes! Honestly, they need to keep that stuff to themselves - bah, if only they knew how much that turns a lot of people away! See... I like animals, especially cute fuzzy little things, but... you definitely have a point! And I completely agree with you - just imagine the cost of keeping all those other chicks alive, just so at the end of the day people could have some eggs. But there's really no way to say that without sounding insensitive, even though it's totally true. Would people have a problem if those thicks were killed humanely, no pain or suffering? No i would not because it's a quick painless death, but i guess whatever works best/cheaper is the better option. We are all going to die anyway, they just get born before they are supposed to be born and die before they are supposed to be born. Life is not fair, life is a sack of shit so adapt and move on or cry about it.

[Mes Tarrant]

Do they really do that in the fur industry... I mean, is it common? Or do people just say that to scare people farther away from animal products? Well anyway, that's a different issue altogether, but I'm just curious as I know nothing about it. Well... except for one of the Kardashians posing for PETA and then wearing leather at the conference or whatever that followed. Good point about the fish. Reminds me of self-proclaimed "vegetarians" eating fish. Bunch of nut jobs, imo. ClouD, hmm, yes. It's like, a lion wouldn't care about how much pain you suffered when he chowed down on you, right? Humans make their own lives very complicated, analyzing all of these things. Yeah. Still not sure what my final stance is though.

[LucidFlanders]

The fur industry is brutal, just brutal. Go find some youtube videos of them slicing off the furs of animals, and beating them up, and making them as much pain as possible, then comes living conditions. Atleast chics get it easy. No, a lion wont care. A lion can't care...we can care if we wanted, but it's impossible to even stop all this for a more humane way of doing it. There is just WAY too many and it would make production come to a really slow pace, people will be demanding their food because alot of places will not have much because we are all doing humane ways of killing animals. We care but only because we are made to have these feelings, billions of years of evolution. We are just animals like the rest of the animals, just smarter ones. Look at war? we are savages.This is in us because we are raised this way, to think this way, to be this way, but also even without the training we have survival instincts which takes no training. It's a thing in everyone...do whatever it takes to survive or you will die. Just think of it this way. The pain may be great, but they are free of pain now. They are dead.

[Mes Tarrant]

I just thought of something, reading your post. Maybe we care so much because our life is too easy. I mean, if we were all fighting for our food rather than waltzing into the grocery store and then complaining that that one brand of cereal with the strawberries is out of stock, then none of us would care about this. Or at least, the vegans would keep their mouths shut. In fact maybe there wouldn't even be any vegans.

[LucidFlanders]

I work at a grocery store, i've heard it all.

[DarkLucideity]

Good point about the fish. Reminds me of self-proclaimed "vegetarians" eating fish. Bunch of nut jobs, imo. lol, yes. "I'm a vegetarian... except for fish." Well apparently you're not a vegetarian then. I must be a vegetarian too, except for meat.

[Invader]

You or the chicken? That decision doesn't need to involve the senseless torture of other creature.

[Alric]

I don't see how leaving half dead chickens laying around is very sanitary either. They should be checking for ones that fall off far more often. As for grinding up all the baby males, that is pretty gross. Though it might seem even more gross if you found out what they did with all the ground up babies. I am sure they sell the meat to someone. Probably to feed to other animals.

[dajo]

Or at least, the vegans would keep their mouths shut. In fact maybe there wouldn't even be any vegans. Don't you think that there might be vegans, who actually know what they are doing, not pushing anything down anybody's throat and having valid points? For crying out loud, where is the tolerance here? Especially when you admit not knowing anything about it. Well anyway, that's a different issue altogether, but I'm just curious as I know nothing about it. Food industry is actually a complicated, big topic. Don't be so quick to judge.

[Mes Tarrant]

O ho! Well excuuuse me! You're right, there are vegans who don't get in anyone's way. But the ones who do stick with you for a while.

[Taosaur]

Most of the time, DV draws a great mix of perspectives, with sharp, creative, open-minded people in abundance. On this one topic, however, you reliably turn into a pack of whining hypocrites, seizing on pat answers to avoid thinking through a subject that makes you uncomfortable. It's understandable, food being a highly emotional topic, thoroughly tangled with love and guilt and oedipal whatnot in most people's psyche, all of which colors our decisions and responses before we can even consider things like nutrition and ethics. Nearly everyone goes on the defensive when they feel their food choices are under scrutiny, overreacting to perceived slights and creating conflict where there need be none. Honestly, the "I'm vegetarian BUT..." crowd is probably the most relaxed and secure in their diet of anyone, and least hypocritical in its defense. For the ethics of omnivory in general, I'm with the Buddha: if you didn't kill or otherwise cause the death of a specific creature, you've done no harm. You can't do harm retroactively by eating the flesh of something already dead. It is, however, perfectly appropriate to express disgust at disgusting practices, as in the video above. Current practices in industrial animal agriculture are not remotely necessary to our nourishment, and in fact DO NOT nourish us. The overabundance of animal products at artificially deflated prices impacts our health in ways that ultimately cost us a lot more than a certified organic, grass-fed steak; the facilities themselves are often as bad or worse than a steel mill in their output of solid waste and noxious gases, impacting the long term nourishing capacity of our environment; and employing people to essentially torment the damned eats away at our culture. Then there's the simple matter of quality--the products of an automated death camp come nowhere near the standards of an actual farm, and the pervasiveness of a cheap, crap standard limits both the viability of better producers and consumer access to their products. Rather than employing our collective will to look the other way, why not make the decision to demand that our food industries actually nourish our health and humanity?

[Universal Mind]

Uh, I don't understand your complaint. Both sides of the coin have had both sympathy and disgust expressed for them in this thread.

[Xei]

For the ethics of omnivory in general, I'm with the Buddha: if you didn't kill or otherwise cause the death of a specific creature, you've done no harm. You can't do harm retroactively by eating the flesh of something already dead. Pretty much the most ridiculous argument I've ever heard. Of course you caused it to die. Do you think that the food industry produces a fixed number of animals each year and if people don't eat them then they just rot..? No, you demand more meat, so the supply increases, so they kill more animals. It's entirely your fault.