Thread: New to the term, not the practice

I somehow am in a similar position as you are, i was lucid dreaming and i knew only about reality checks, nothing more. Lucid dreaming almost every night and i always knew there are forums about lucid dreaming, but for some reason i never wanted to join them. Now when i came here i saw so many techniques and definitions that are far from what i am doing.

Have fun reading this forum, you will find tons of useful information that you can compare to your experience.

Originally Posted by bozoolie

I am in desperate need of guidance. Recently i was reading a work of fiction where a girl described an experience she called "lucid dreaming". I was in complete and utter shock. Not only did someone besides me have this debilitating "sleeping problem" but it actually had a NAME! As soon as I could I got on the internet to see what it was so maybe I could finally get some help. No words could do justice to my astonishment that there are people in great numbers studying tips and even paying for training in the hopes that they can achieve an episode of this phenomenon. I'm so afraid i don't even know where to start. From what I've been reading, it's very likely if i describe my "symptoms", you will all think I'm a fraud. But believe me when i tell you--i do NOT feel "gifted". I have so MUCH control it's interfering with my ability to succeed in my WAKEFUL life!! I finally have an answer to the biggest contributing factor leading to my chronic fatigue, insomnia, anxiety, catatonic depressive episodes, inability to get up in the morning--what i feel is very, very, scared.

bozoolie, you are not the first natural lucid dreamer to come to this forum saying that he did not want to experience lucid dreaming and had no choice and wanted it to stop. There was at least one other such, I don't remember his username right now but if I do I will let you know, who also wanted to no longer be in control of dreams, but could not help it. Natural lucid dreaming happens to some people, but only a few of them are like you bothered by it. I suspect that it is like everything else in life: moderation is best, and there is such a thing as too much - even of lucid dreaming - most of us have trouble fathoming it because we are at the other end of the spectrum of only having this ability occasionally, and for us it is pleasant. However, I can imagine that if you want to stop and cannot, that could be frustrating. For most of us learning how to lucid dream is about gaining more control over ourselves; whereas it sounds like for you, you would gain greater control if you could learn to limit lucid dreaming.

Have you ever sought out sleep study researchers? There are scientists studying dreaming and sleep, and they might be able to help you figure out how to get better control of your sleep. What you have is very unusual, and thus few people on a forum such as this one could help. However, scientists who research sleep might be able to help. Do you live close enough to a major university? You might want to find out whether any university near you does sleep research. If not, perhaps a good doctor nearby specializes in sleep disorders because it does sound like you may have a sleep disorder if it is interfering with your ability to rest.

I also wonder to what extent your inability to get enough rest is due to issues in NREM sleep rather than REM sleep. NREM is the deep sleep when we do not usually dream or at least not as intensely, but that is where most of the rest is supposed to take place. I wonder whether you are not getting enough rest in deep sleep, or not getting enough deep sleep. Lucid dreams like most or all other dreams happen in REM sleep (not NREM) and that kind of sleep usually is not very restful anyway, so dreams are unlikely the cause of lack of rest, unless they constitute too much of a percentage of your sleep or are too unpleasant (nightmares can tire one). However, I am not a doctor nor a scientist, and thus I suspect I do not know enough to help you.

The difference between what you are experiencing (I suspect from what you hinted) and what most people on this site experience as lucid dreaming, it is like the difference between regular rain and a hurricane. You live your life in a hurricane, and wonder how it is possible for some people to wish it would rain.

JoannaB, you are a very good person.

I for one am deeply confused. How can a person have "so MUCH control" and not be able to simply tone down their dream content, or, better yet, simply use that control to ignore their awareness? That may sound silly, but we all do it it waking-life every day. Also, if you're in so much control, what on earth is there to be afraid of? Not to mention that LD'ing has not been found, pretty much ever, to cause "chronic fatigue, insomnia, anxiety, catatonic depressive episodes, inability to get up in the morning." Sure, there can be some side effects from very long, very intense LD's, but they're limited to maybe a headache or being tired. And, of course, with all that control, long, intense LD's ought to be easily avoided.

I'm sorry, Bozoolie, but I'm afraid that your words simply do not line up with the actual nature of lucid dreaming. There might be something else wrong with you, which you should probably have checked by a doctor. Perhaps you may not have a clear understanding of what lucid dreaming is.

In other words, if you are naturally LD'ing with such great control, you would have nothing to be scared of, would easily be able to avoid all those waking-life problems, and would have mentioned at least once that you are actually aware in your dreams (what LD'ing is).

You might want to do a little research into what LD'ing is, or perhaps take a moment to better describe your experience, rather than the symptoms.

I won't call you a fraud, because you could certainly be telling the truth -- it just might be the truth about something that has nothing to do with LD'ing. I wish you luck in your search for an answer to your problem, but I have a feeling that you won't find it on a lucid dreaming forum.

I have been self-reporting 15+ hrs a day of "sleep" during depressive and anxiety/stress episodes years. For this out of control sleeping, I have had sleep studies, a million medication changes,hospitalizations, even ECT treatments when I was "sleeping" 20 hrs a day and not responding to any other treatments. I also have reported very vivid nightmares that carry over into my day and make me oversleep on a regular basis that severely interferes with daily living. They have explained to me that vivid dreams are simply a side effect of psych meds and given me more meds and at times anti-psychotics that make me have nasty side effect. I admit that being bipolar to begin with brings together a bizarre confluence of circumstances that makes me a one in a gadrillion case. But make no mistake, lucid dreaming has been ruining MY life in MY case.

Because when I am under stress or depressed, I go to bed. And I lay down, and pick from an infinite selection of "DVD's","start" it with my thoughts, and as I experience a sensation of heaviness pulling my body embedded half into half out of my mattress, off I go. I'm dreaming and I am the director of my own private film. If I feel well, I take a relaxing 45 min-1 hr nap. If I am very distressed, I repeat the process for 15-20 hours a day and have been self-reporting it as "sleeping", fatigue, major depression, etc.

So why am I afraid? Because in light of what I've been reading about LD, I seem to have no real coping skills, abuse LD like a drug, then idiotically am being mistakenly "treated" for it! And it's pretty hard to learn a whole new way of coping with life and mental illness at my age, so how do I discipline myself not to "sleep" when I am at the end of my rope a lot of the time? What am I going to do--detox from my own imagination? Get an LDANON sponsor? It's absurd. Now I feel like it's hopeless, no psychiatrist is ever going to find the right combination of drugs. My problem is I've inadvertently ruined my own life...

Thank you for clarifying; that helped.

I still don't understand why, if you're the director of your own dreams, you cannot reduce your distress with your lucid dreaming skills, but I'll chalk that misunderstanding up to my own ignorance and assume you know better (as you of course do). I'll still believe that LD'ing seems a perfect therapy for your condition rather than a cause of it, but that's neither here nor there, I guess. I do suggest, though, that you do some research into the practice; perhaps there is something you can learn about LD'ing to at least make it less scary.

Also, for what it's worth, in spite of its name, lucid dreaming is not about vividness.

So good luck to you, Bozoolie, and I hope you find solutions somewhere.

[EDIT: My post went up before your second one was there, so forgive any inconsistencies -- and thanks again for clarifying; I fear your issues transcend anything available on these forums, and any help for you will need to come from within. I hope, in time, you gain the discipline to control yourself]

Lucid dreaming is so much more wonderful than bipolar disorder that I realize I've been exacerbating my illness and bringing some pretty severe medical treatments onto myself by being like the birth mother in Huxley's "Brave New World", who doses herself into oblivion with Soma, and everyone thinks, why shouldn't she? Even if it's killing her it's more humane than the horror of BEING her...

Y'know, lives can be unruined. Just putting that out there.

I realise this isn't very helpful in terms of a step by step guide, but it's your life. You definitely haven't ruined it until the end of time, mistakes can be fixed, all that jazz. You can fix whatever may have happened or whatever you may have done, but I can't tell you how, it's a journey you'll have to make alone.

^^ What he said!

Thanks for the insightful post bozoolie, now I am more convinced constant lucid dreams are possible and will be more diligent in my efforts to attain them
Also effect does not equal cause, I'd consider something else causing your bad moods and other side effects like lucid dreaming.
Tried taking melatonin to see if it puts back your biological clock in place?