Thread: How long can Lucid dreams be?

Originally Posted by moonshine

Laberge studies show that counting down in dream time and counting in real time (monitored via eye movements) were roughly on a par. There is a fair amount of concensus on this.

http://daniel.erlacher.de/index.php/...n_lucid_dreams

Atkins513 appears to have it backwards. The motor activities study indicated that dream exercises took approx 45% longer in perceived dream time than they would physically take in real time.
This would actually reduce the perceived dream length, not increase it.
i.e. 30 mins of dream squat thrusts would waste 60 mins of REM time.
Cutting your perceived dream time in half.


I'm really not sure how a dream can "seem" to last years.

I presume when Robot_Butler refers to "false memories" he means that when he ponders gaps in time, his brain then takes the time to rationalise the experience. Meaning we're still stuck in an approximate real time.

Those compelled to boast about literally living years in a dream, based on their zen like mastery of the cosmic dream arts...well putting it diplomatically lets just say they're "mistaken".

No, think about this for 1 minute without jumping to the conclusion of automatically knowing... if a jump in a dream takes 44 percent LONGER, than a jump in real life, YET the jump in the dream still feels exactly the same, then that would mean that a LUCID JUMP in LUCID TIME is 44 percent LONGER, than a real time jump in REAL TIME. Comparing the two side by side would show that LUCID TIME is 44 percent longer than REAL TIME. Hypothetically, once again, the lucid time frame would have to be 44 percent longer, per minute, per hour. So that would mean, that I do not have it backwards at all. If you and I both where to jump up and down at the same time, and it seemed to be the exact same jump and that jump lasted the same amount of time as it was perceived.. I am lucid, and you are not. Yet my jump takes 44 percent longer, that would mean when you land, i would just be starting back down from the jump... so in all, my jump took 44 percent longer, for the exact same 3 seconds in perceived time compared to real time.. therefore, THE TIME PERIOD IS PERCEIVED TO BE LONGER IN LUCID TIME... Your making the assumption that time is slowed down and perceived as slowed down to the brain, which it is not. When I jump up and down lucid, it is perceived exactly the same, not slow-mo... which means, once again, lucid time lasts longer according to the dreamer... Who else see's the logic in this? How could it be that the lucid time is slower?

Originally Posted by atkins513

No, think about this for 1 minute without jumping to the conclusion of automatically knowing... if a jump in a dream takes 44 percent LONGER, than a jump in real life, YET the jump in the dream still feels exactly the same, then that would mean that a LUCID JUMP in LUCID TIME is 44 percent LONGER, than a real time jump in REAL TIME. Comparing the two side by side would show that LUCID TIME is 44 percent longer than REAL TIME. Hypothetically, once again, the lucid time frame would have to be 44 percent longer, per minute, per hour. So that would mean, that I do not have it backwards at all. If you and I both where to jump up and down at the same time, and it seemed to be the exact same jump and that jump lasted the same amount of time as it was perceived.. I am lucid, and you are not. Yet my jump takes 44 percent longer, that would mean when you land, i would just be starting back down from the jump... so in all, my jump took 44 percent longer, for the exact same 3 seconds in perceived time compared to real time.. therefore, THE TIME PERIOD IS PERCEIVED TO BE LONGER IN LUCID TIME... Your making the assumption that time is slowed down and perceived as slowed down to the brain, which it is not. When I jump up and down lucid, it is perceived exactly the same, not slow-mo... which means, once again, lucid time lasts longer according to the dreamer... Who else see's the logic in this? How could it be that the lucid time is slower?

The perceived time of doing squat jumps is the same in both dreams and reality.

Rem periods are measured in real time.
If you spend a 60 minute REM period doing squat jumps,
the perceived time in the dream is going to be much less that 60 mins.

So in fact its reducing the perceived length of your dream.
Which, in terms of what you experience, means a shorter dream.

I would say the salient point is that this - very limited - area of research cannot be used to justify dream elongation, as it in fact demonstrates just the opposite.

Originally Posted by moonshine

The perceived time of doing squat jumps is the same in both dreams and reality.

Rem periods are measured in real time.
If you spend a 60 minute REM period doing squat jumps,
the perceived time in the dream is going to be much less that 60 mins.

So in fact its reducing the perceived length of your dream.
Which, in terms of what you experience, means a shorter dream.

I would say the salient point is that this - very limited - area of research cannot be used to justify dream elongation, as it in fact demonstrates just the opposite.

I do not agree at all on this, but I respect your opinion just as I am sure you respect mine.. Afterall, it is all a matter of how you look at things as well... in different examples, both ideas could seem correct...

I think it's totally safe to say 20 minutes. Though I had a freakish experience where I would have put the dream at 2 hours, as it's been said there is no way to be sure. That hasn't happened again btw. I had it recorded on a tape recorder that broke, but still remember basically what happened. Felt freakish when I woke up, but it was a very good dream in itself.

Originally Posted by atkins513

I do not agree at all on this, but I respect your opinion just as I am sure you respect mine.. Afterall, it is all a matter of how you look at things as well... in different examples, both ideas could seem correct...

Fair enough but its not so much opinion as simple maths that resolves this one.

If you have a clock, you DEILD, fall into a WILD in seconds, then force yourself awake, you can get a pretty decent idea of how long your dream was.

Funny I had two experiences related to what I read on dreamviews yesterday.

This was dumb luck, but I fell asleep with my voice recorder recording and held up to my mouth. I was trying to do a recall so sleepy, it overcame me and I just stopped. Funny I am talking and then 5 seconds later you hear the breathing of sleep that continues for 5 minutes.

The dream was short to, but a good bit happened in that 5 minutes. At first I was walking around a "Base" like in a RPG, I was killing easy mobs for exp and to practice my abilities (Which were sort of lame, I seemed to have a lot of hand grenades and a rifle) I was mostly trying to see how many I could take out with area damage from a grenade, practicing my throwing, my placement. Then I run into one of my friends and we talk a bit, then a conversation on cell phone, then I woke.

So it was like it lasted 5 minutes, but not a moment of time "wasted" of course if you were to truly waste time in a dream for more than a few seconds the dream would probably be lost.

That's one characteristic of most dreams, something always has to be happening that is meaningful, moving, a picture, anything to occupy the mind's attention. So as in real life, things that actually take up our attention may be rare overall, while in a dream something has to be happening every moment almost. I know that's not cut and dry but you can see what I mean. It could really feel like you got a lot done in a shorter period of time.