Religion & Afterlife

**Lucius** · 11-09-2003 02:26 PM

I was just wondering what kind of religion you people you belief,or at least which one is comes closest,as I think we all have our ideas..for example I consider myself closest to Buddhism..but with alot of my own ideas..for example I believe in reincarnation..but this proces doesnt go on forever,when a soul is born from the cosmos(god,everything, whatever you wish to call it) they first exist as a universal substance such as water or air, or earth(sand/soil) ,eventually they have enough experience to try a more complicated life form, like a leaf from a tree, which then becomes a small plant,then a tree going trough several flora forms until the soul is strong enough to finnaly take an animal form..after going trough several animal forms a soul can finnaly become human.
During the human stage a soul actually has a free will(more then when animal) and thus can make mistakes..

Accoring to my belief a soul goes trough several human stages and must learn and experience everything(poverty,ignorance,love,hatred and so on) and take everything as a lesson until they finnaly learned everything and become close to "perfect" (100% perfect is non-existant) you could call this Enlightment,nirvana,or reaching your personal heaven, but its all the same, eternal peace and rest in your own mind remerged with the cosmos(you would live the for you perfect world,examle no war,no raism,no materialism and so on..) .
But some souls actually never reach this state because they are simply to ignorant and foolish and not wish to evolve anymore(think your common materialistic dickhead or superplaya) .. when souls go real wrong they might deevolve into a bad condition(like being reborn in poor parts of africa,or even become an animal)..

This is what I belief and this will go on forever,I also belief that the planet might have been destroyed multiple times(humans destroy themselves) and healed by the cosmos to start over again an try again to be ultimately whiped again by themselves..which near i think to happen again,several 100rds of years perhaps? or mabey even less..

Well this is about what I belief in a tiny nutshell..so what do you people belief?

**azwe_echo** · 11-09-2003 11:01 PM

I believe anything is possible.
I could end it there, but being me...I just have to elaborate.

I've lived a typical American life in a Christian family, particularly my dad's side. But my thing isn't necessarily that I don't believe Christianity is real, it's more that I just don't feel anything for Christianity. I know people that would swear on their beliefs that God changed their life. I've tried to fit into what my dad has taught me, but part of what defines religion for me is the ability to so firmly believe in something that you're willing to live by and for it..this belief is what makes it real..but I just can't find that in Christianity, or anywhere for that matter. But I would say Buddhism is closest to my beliefs as well. The only real difference may be that I'm not sure about the afterlife yet.
I can only say for sure that I believe everything is energy, and this energy can transcend everything. But, I haven't really experienced anything that proves anything yet. I believe there is other intelligent life in the universe, for us to think otherwise tells me that there's actually more-intelligent life; I believe ghosts are real; I believe words are words and cursing isn't going to decide fate..speaking of, I don't believe in pre-determined fate or destiny. I do believe the energy that makes up everything can transcend everything and sometimes things happen that seem destined to be..and I think this might have to do with energy transcending to a higher power (one thing religions have in common is some "higher power")..but life is still a harmonial balance of what we do and what our energy does. It's very important to me that I do things for the right reasons. What you do doesn't matter as much as why do you it. When I was younger, I decided to make sure I focus on doing everything for the right reasons, as well as what I do. I try very hard to never regret anything, everything is an experience and helps make us who we are. I believe if it is my duty to live a certain way, it should be made clear to me, otherwise I'm just going to do what fascinates me and enjoy life as much as I can.

EDIT: Sometimes I do feel strangely compelled..perhaps by a higher power. But most of what I get a feeling of is feminine, like a goddess. I have a definite drive to better myself. It's very important to me to be able to live for myself, just being who I am. I don't think it's right for someone to go through life and see other people that they'd rather be. I believe if you can't live just for yourself then you'll never find anything else to live for. It's hard to explain, but it could almost seem materialistic or shallow that I sometimes dwell on this...but in actuality, the reason I dwell on who I am is because I have to feel like me on the inside and out...which, to me, is deeper than the reasons people go through life not worrying about who they are. I guess it all comes down to my belief that, in the end, you can only be sure of yourself...you only have yourself. You are the only thing that will be there from your beginning to your end...and it's important to be able to inspire your own happiness. But ironically, it's when you reach this point that you will no longer depend on it, because you will likely find something else inspiring to live for. And it's great to find and have that something. Then again, as I said, you can't be sure that you'll always have that "something else"...which is why all this is important to me.

**Silver Sphere** · 11-09-2003 11:18 PM

I try not to take the existence of anything that can't be proven for granted. I was raised Christian but I guess it didn't really take.

**Serinanth** · 11-10-2003 02:20 AM

Ok... heres the deal.
I think its good for us to talk about what we beleive, it may enlighten somone else , and you might learn something as well..

[SIZE=2]BUT</span>

There will be <span style="color:red">NO

The moment that happens this thread will be locked and or deleted.

I dont have much time right now, I will post some of what I beleive a little later... I will say that my thoughts are close to yours lucius.

**Lucius** · 11-10-2003 11:37 AM

I am no person that says my god is better then yours as i belief everybody should belief what he wants,because look at what kinda situations that kinda attitude creates,almost all wars are about religion, whatever you believe what kind of god makes you go to war and slaughter innocent people..

I personally think that life without anykind of faith/believe just isnt worth anything at all,I feel rather worthless if I know I will simply disapear when I die..

As for God,in the end we actually are our own gods..but THE god according to me is like I said not a person, but everything,the cosmos.So you could better refer to him,as it. It is what we are all born from and it is what we shall all return to..(yet again according to me) when we do so we would live like..an ethernal lucid dream sort to speak..
But some people refuse to believe anything at all and it think thats a pity.

When we are talking about christians i'd say its a pretty good religion..because if everybody was a loyal christian we would have realised world peace(then again if everybody believe the same..whatever,would it happen aswell)
But there a just certain things about Christianity that is just wrong,their laws are way to strict and utterly rediculous,because why would a unbaptised child burn in hell because of the mistake its parents made..,like a baby is not baptised and he dies at age 1, would he be punished then? accoring to them yes, thats just one of the many errors in their ways,yet again I do not wish to offend anybody but thats just the way I look at it..the bible also jsut twisted around many things jezus actually never said..and in the past the church even aske money from people to be forgiven from their sins(now what kind of idea is that)

Also some other rather old fashioned idea is just dispise is the christians attitude towards certain groups of people like gays and lesbians(im not one but I respect other people) ,i think when two people love eachother what else matters..just another example..

Another thing I dont like is the constant treathening of people telling them they burn in hell if they do this or dont do that..just dont agree with it all..

Please anybody tell me if im offending you,ill delete it all..but this is just the way I feel..

EDITED: I wasnt bashing anybodies beliefs now was I? Else please dont delete the topic!

I mean its just that there are certain things I simply cannot agree with..are there actually some christians here? if so mabey that would give interesting(friendly) convos

**jill1978** · 11-10-2003 04:31 PM

I dont think it's possible to say one god is better, we all have the same god no matter what you may call it.....I do agree with the past posts 100% I was brought up christian(like 99% of america) but I think my parents never even bought into it, it was just the right thing to do to send me to religion classes and be baptised ect....I agree that it feels right that life or lives would be a process of learning, and maybe we work our way up to different lifeforms many universes away from earth...I've always thought of it this way god is part of us all, we are all pieces of one whole, so god is perfecting itself through us.
I also think the next steps in human evelution will bring us closer to all these subtle energies we really beleive are there, but cant prove like ghosts, and esp...I think some of us are more intune with these energies.

**Second Attention** · 11-10-2003 05:00 PM

Well if your me, it's really an irrelevent thing to argue about because I believe all gods/goddesses are the same, just as we are all part of God and God is in everything. Gods/goddesses are all just a different face of the same infinite being that we are all a part of. I'm a pantheist, but I generally refer to my belief in everything being a part of the infinite as being part of God because it's just a lot better communicated that way, I've come to learn. That is the foundation of my system of beliefs, another way to put it would be the holographic universe theory. To make a hologram one must use two lasers to etch an image into a glass/crystal/whatever. Now, when you shine one laser at the image etched in the object it will recreate the hologram. Now, the interesting part. If you cut a small piece of the glass/crystal off, and then shine a laser through, it will still recreate the whole hologram, ie, the information for the whole image is stored in ever single piece of a hologram. Now, compare that to the universe, life, DNA, and all that. I believe that every single piece of this universe is a piece of the infinite, or God, and therefore has all the information pertaining to the rest of the universe. We just have not learned to interpret everything we see/feel/know. Just a couple ways of interpreting it. Although, I think religion has become sort of impertinent in the coming days of the Fall, simply because we need action and action on a scale never before heard of and we need to dissolve all our hatreds and fears and prejudices to come together and fight for the same ideal, FREEDOM. I'll have to explain an interesting experiment at some point... but I don't have time now.

**Seeker** · 11-10-2003 06:29 PM

The existance of god and the afterlife has been a troublesome point for me. I am an engineer and therefore know quite a bit about science.
I have had all of the critical thinking classes when in college. Here goes:
Being a scientific person, I have a lot of difficulty in accepting things that cannot be proven with the scientific method. I have trouble swallowing psychic stuff, OBEs, eternal life, and god.
But being an engineer, I know that highly complex systems do not come into being by themselves. There is no way that evolution could have produced such a rich ecosystem as on Earth, even in the 20 billion years the universe has been present.
I also know that entropy is a real force in the universe and that systems degenerate over time.
So from a scientific point of view, god cannot exist. But looking at it from an engineers point of view, this could not have existed unless god had created it.

As for personal beliefs, I was raised Christian, and do believe in god on some level. I also know that the other religeons of the world have much to offer, like Buddhism. These two play well together when you consider how to conduct yourself in daily activities. However, they are at odds somewhat in spiritual matters and the afterlife.

**azwe_echo** · 11-10-2003 06:41 PM

Originally posted by Lucius+--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Lucius)</div>

But there a just certain things about Christianity that is just wrong,their laws are way to strict and utterly rediculous...[/b]

I agree. In many cases, everything I want to be and enjoy would mean being a bad follower of a lot of religions.

<!--QuoteBegin-Second Attention
I believe that every single piece of this universe is a piece of the infinite, or God, and therefore has all the information pertaining to the rest of the universe. We just have not learned to interpret everything we see/feel/know.

That's kinda like what I was saying about our energy. Its transcend throughout, I believe, is what binds everything to everything. I also agree that "God" is more of an absolute, like the entire cosmos/universe, rather than some being that has an unexplained higher position.

**nerve** · 11-10-2003 07:59 PM

I'm not even going to get into it. if you want to know what I believe THAT BAD, PM me. in fact, I'm not coming back to this thread. I think Seri should delete it.

**Seeker** · 11-10-2003 08:12 PM

Such a strong reaction! Bad childhood memories Paperdoll?

**Lucius** · 11-10-2003 08:49 PM

Why should it be deleted, its an interesting thing to talk about and I think religion and lucid dreams can blend pretty well..

**Seeker** · 11-10-2003 09:03 PM

Originally posted by Lucius
Why should it be deleted, its an interesting thing to talk about and I think religion and lucid dreams can blend pretty well..

Especially since in the Lucid world, you are essentially a god.

**Second Attention** · 11-10-2003 09:14 PM

Paperdoll: There won't be getting out of hand in this, Seri already said that. If you would like to express your views, I don't believe anyone here will have any problem with that. Just thought I would say so, since I was mainly the one whom instigated trouble in this sort of discussion last time(sort of). Any ways... feel free to say what you wish, Seri already pointed out there will be no arguments or flame wars in this thread, or it will get shut down. Though... your beliefs and opinions are your own, so if you feel they should be kept to pms, then I think we will all respect that decision.

**Lucius** · 11-10-2003 09:16 PM

Especially since in the Lucid world, you are essentially a god. [/b]

I suppose to a certain altitude we are gods in our lucids yes,but of course there is still much to achieve,as there is always

**nerve** · 11-10-2003 09:27 PM

(ok, so I came back.)

I just know I could not share my beliefs without including some of the crap people have said in here. personally, I only read a few lines and it made my blood boil. I think some of you push out religions without knowing enough about them, you say well that's too "-----" for me, no couldn't follow that because I heard "------". It makes me SICK. anyway I'm not going to go on, there is no point I will eventually start bashing peope or something...I am after all the 'big goth bitch'. so if you want to hear from me then send me a PM.

**Lucius** · 11-10-2003 09:33 PM

Paperdoll, if I somehow offended you in anyway then please say so,I dont mean to offend anybody im just stating my opinion,and its obvious you dont agree,so why dont you just tell me why im completely wrong here,thats why the topic is here,i wanna hear about others people opinions,im an open mind and respect all religions and beliefs but that doesnt mean I agree with them,it would be boring if we'd all agree,but if you dont wanna share thats no problem,then lets leave it at this then..

**icedawg** · 11-10-2003 09:51 PM

...

**Serinanth** · 11-11-2003 07:10 AM

....*looks around*
I guess, we are unlocked...

Lucius just be carefull what you write, if I were a christian I would have found what you said about the religion a tad irksome like paperdoll did, saying that some of their basic tennants is ridiculous is kinda harsh no matter what you beleive.

Lets try this... Speak of what you beleive, not the faults that you see in other religions beleifs, I think if we can stick to that we should be all set?

Sound good to you guys? if not just wing a tomatoe at me... wait no.. nevermind that, last time I said that I got a face fulla tomato.... and yes I just spelled it both ways...=P

Seeker.. I have a little experiment for you to try... some things are NOT provable by scientific methods and yet they exist...

All of you... as you read this you are listening to a voice in your head, if you know me, it might even sound like me at the moment, if not, it could be the normal voice you hear that is your thoughts.
This voice, your thoughts, prove to me that it exists, prove without doubt and with hard evidence that this voice in your head actually exists. It does not matter that I know its there, because I too can hear this voice...we wont get into what is actually listening to the voice to hear it right now.

If you hook up an EEG to the brain (think its EEG or is it EKG) or better yet an fMRI when you think the brain shows activity... when you think the same thing a few moments later, there is again activity but according to the readout its slightly different, sure the same area is active, but its never the same.. why not? why dosent thinking the same words in your mind always produce the same actvity in the brain?

So with that you cannot tie your thoughts to exact brain functinality and activity...

So prove to me that that little voice is there, if you do you get a cookie.
Remember no assumption, just kuz I know its there and everyone else that is aware of self knows its there, dosent mean it is...

Or does it?

**Tim** · 11-11-2003 10:15 AM

all i know is that i dont know nothing

**A Lost Soul** · 11-11-2003 10:47 AM

Originally posted by Serinanth

So prove to me that that little voice is there, if you do you get a cookie.
Remember no assumption, just kuz I know its there and everyone else that is aware of self knows its there, dosent mean it is...

Or does it?

I answer your question with one of my own, Mr. Scientistman: how can you prove that you are actually there? How do I know for sure, being one aware of Self, that you actually exist? Everything to everyone is real, because that's what they perceive. It's like you said before about two people looking at the same object, but seeing different things. Which one is real?

As for religion and stuff, I'm a bit strange in that department. I don't really like giving religion a name, but it's how our mind can organize things. I have my own set of beliefs but I also respect yours. I'm pagan, for lack of a better term. I believe in a god and a goddess, but I also understand and respect that my god and goddess are not yours. Just as your god (or goddess) is not mine. For example, take Christianity since that's such a prominent religion. If you ask two Christians what 'god' feels like to them, I'm almost certain they will answer differently. Why? Because religion, no matter how mainstream, is a personal thing. One Christian may worship in a different way than another. This world would be a much better place if we could all just realize and respect that. I believe that all religions are intertwined somehow. I mean, no offense to anyone, but it kind of bothers me when a Christian friend of mine constantly tells me that I and a billion other people on this earth are going to hell because we don't conform to his idea of religion. That's a bit harsh, isn't it? Condemning all the Muslims, all the Jews, all the Buddhists and Zoroastrians, so on and so on, just because they don't conform to one person or group's point of view?

I don't know... maybe I'm just ranting in a post-traumatic haze (they set the bone in my foot today... ouch freaking ouch) but I hold strong to my belief that religion is--and should be--a personal thing. So there.

**Lucius** · 11-11-2003 01:50 PM

I have to say I agree with Lost Soul about the Condemning thing..but I probaly shouldnt say that lol..but really I think we should all develope our own beliefs..and another time i say, I respect all religions but that doesnt mean I agree with them..anyway..shouldnt say that either..

*head cracks*

Ill just shut up..

**Seeker** · 11-11-2003 01:59 PM

The one thing that has bothered by about this thread was intolerance.
Like you Lucius, I have my beliefs. They will change only when I am ready for them to change, not because someone is in my face trying to tell me how wrong they are.

I like to discuss, compare and contrast different ethos and religeons. Occasionally, I will pick a piece of fruit from one belief or another and incorporate it into my system of beliefs.
True, mine does look like a patchwork quilt to some people, but it is mine