do you have scars from lucid dreams? well i do!

**Leo Volont** · 01-14-2006 10:38 PM

Originally posted by hydraat_takiyah

YOu know, that is a very interesting point you made there, and most certainly true. Where did you read that at, I would really like some inlightenment on the subject. So are you saying I'm in the way of my own progress, email me, let's talk!

Oh I have dreamed of horses for years. In the first dreams, the horses were presented as powerful and intimidating, selfish and while appearing noble, were actually very pig-like. It was clear that these horses would have to be reined in, bridled and mastered.

The first step was always to ride them... simply to be able to stay on. In my first dreams, riders were lining up to ride this one particularly fast and difficult horse, and they were all thrown, and not so much by any wild bucking, as simply by their inability to hold on and stay comfortably on the horses back, but it would deliberately toss off anybody who annoyed it with bad technique. When my turn came, I made it a point to ride up high in the saddle, and to keep my weight in the stirrups, holding myself up with my legs, so that my weight would not bounce uncomfortably on the horses back. The Horse noticed immediately and made no objections to my further riding. Then the horse became hungry and we stopped at a Sandwich Shop. That is our point of control. We feed the Horse. We feed the Will.

At the end of the Dream, my father appeared to me like a Critic, in a smoking jacket, smoking a pipe, and he commented upon the Dream. he told me that the Secret of Horses was that they were just big pigs. That would mean that the Will is largely indiscriminate. It will devor anything before it. It will indulge itself with no concern for propriety or appearances.

And yet we can eventually exert our influences. Dreams went by and I found myself training horses in corrals, trotting horses in riding circles, and weaving around barrels. In later dreams, over the years, horses would appear with me in some of my Spiritual Dreams. The horse became my constant companion.

yes, just the other night I dreamt that I and another man were going through some exercise run and came across a group of people who were curious about what we were doing, and as I began to explain to them the purpose of our exercise, I suddenly noticed that I was upon Horseback and I continued by riding through the exercise.

Which brings up the point that to ride a horse represents Authority. Indeed, we can think of Knighthood, which was signified by one primary detail, that of being a Mounted Warrier. Being atop a Horse raises one above one's fellow man. It may sound elitest, but we should consider that our dreams are not so over concerned with being politically correct. But, practically speaking, a man who has harnassed the power of his Will and who has exercised some discipline over his will, such a man will invariably rise head and shoulders upon other men who haven't.

**wasup** · 01-14-2006 11:00 PM

Sometimes a horse is just a horse.

**Combine** · 01-15-2006 06:09 AM

hah this makes me think of like Evangelion where you feel what the eva feels because you are connected to it, also like in the matrix where your mind makes it real.

The weirdest thing ever would be if like scientists were examining some guy sleeping, and he dreams that he dies, and does physicaly.... would make a good movie

**Leo Volont** · 01-15-2006 06:35 AM

Originally posted by ataraxis
Sometimes a horse is just a horse.

And what is "just a horse"?

Horse's have too much meaning within our Culture to ever be juxtaposed to the words 'just' or 'only'. Why, just look at pants and slacks -- the reason that style arose in the first place was so that men could have cloths that would allow them to straddle horses. In many of the Cultures across the globe it is the possession of a horse which separates the 'common' classes from the 'Aristocratic'. Having a horse makes one a 'Gentleman'. And among Barbarians, the possession of a horse is what separates the 'Warriors' from those who are only thieves.

Therefore, it would be almost ridiculous to suppose that a horse could occur in a dream independent of any of these assigned values or associations.

Nowadays we can appreciate the kind of fervent intensity that men used to have toward horses when we examine the fixation that replaced it among at least one subculture -- that is the Bikers. The crazy attachment that Bikers have for their motorcycles, and the value they assign to motorcycle ownership gives us some idea of how horses used to be appreciated. Its a strong complex of motivation and emotion which borders upon almost the intensity of a new sexual urge (we often hear of men who love their cars or motorcycles more than they love their wives, and literature from before the last century says much the same thing in regards to horses). The symbiotic relatioship between the species of Man and Horse has developed some hardwiring, and now the two species can hardly be expected to ever forget each other (likewise with the Dog and the Cat who also appear often enough in Dreams).

**Awhislyle** · 01-15-2006 08:29 AM

Or a horse just could be something pretty, something ugly, something you like, something you hate, something you think is funny, something that kicked out your teeth

Im sorry but you cant go around and give values to things and tell people that it is impossible to not think the same thing

My best memory of horses is of the episode in MASH where that have to give it an enema, very noble ehhh?

**wasup** · 01-15-2006 05:59 PM

Originally posted by Awhislyle
Or a horse just could be something pretty, something ugly, something you like, something you hate, something you think is funny, something that kicked out your teeth

Im sorry but you cant go around and give values to things and tell people that it is impossible to not think the same thing

Yep... pretty much. I say sometimes a horse is just a horse because well... who says it HAS to have meaning attached to it? As Awhislyle said, it could just be someone who thinks they are funny, pretty, etc.

**Asclepius** · 01-16-2006 01:26 AM

In dream interpretation its a good idea to start with the dreamer's personal associations. However, if these are not strong or clear, why not look at broader cultural symbolism?

Certainly we talk about "horsepower", putting the cart before the horse, leading a horse to water, without necessarily owning a horse.

I like Leo's interpretation, that energy is riding Hydraat, that she should be riding. Maybe its will, maybe its lifeforce, maybe its emotions... As its Hydraat's dream she can find what fits for her.

In reading Ice Dawg's post about the purpose of this board being to increase lucidity, I'd like to suggest an interpretation of this discussion thread, which seems to readily cross over into non-lucid emotional reactionism.

I think there are 2 fears that are buried in the discussion.

The first is a fear that dreams CAN hurt us. Most of us hear prefer to believe that although dreams may frighten and even terrify us, they can't hurt us. This belief is not shared by everyone. I've heard many people state that if you die in a dream you will die in reality. On this Board you can find posts from dreamers who have survived those dreams, so that belief appears false. I think some people, rather than simply disbelieving Hadraat, need to deny her statement of getting scars from a dream to protect their own belief that dreams are safe.

(My personal belief is that dreams are safe, based on my own experiences to date. But I cannot speak to the experience of everyone)

The second element of this thread that I would like to interpret is the following situation. A person has a painful and frigthening experience, they tell others seeking support and understanding. The experience is either denied, or dismissed. This is adding insult to injury. I would hope that experiences from other areas would encourage us to at least listen compassionately, even if we don't personally believe in the experience or have not had comparable experiences. The denial or dismissal comes either from arrogance, or a need to repress one's own experiences of suffering.

**Chympara** · 01-16-2006 02:01 AM

I am posting this without reading the entire three-four pages before this.

Perhaps you were sleeping on your arm, and it started to really hurt? And the "teeth marks" could just be an imprint of the couch on your arm? My bedsheets/clothes/textiles sometimes do this to me when I sleep on them.

**Awhislyle** · 01-16-2006 10:54 AM

Originally posted by Asclepius

The second element of this thread that I would like to interpret is the following situation. A person has a painful and frigthening experience, they tell others seeking support and understanding. The experience is either denied, or dismissed. This is adding insult to injury. I would hope that experiences from other areas would encourage us to at least listen compassionately, even if we don't personally believe in the experience or have not had comparable experiences. The denial or dismissal comes either from arrogance, or a need to repress one's own experiences of suffering.

Are you suggesting that if someone had a nervous breakdown and also suffered from nightyerrors of werewolfs. Would you
1. Tell that person how the were wolfs cant exist and they need to accept that and move on
or
2. Dress up in were wolf costumes and throughout the night wake them up howling over their body, put fake scratch makes on their door,
(of course that would be an extreme case, but the same principal could apply to most things of that sort)
You can not go along with someones delusions, for it will only draw them into a deeper belief
I dont consider myself arrogant or in need to repress something, I think it would be best for hydraat to get over the experience

**Asclepius** · 01-17-2006 12:41 AM

Originally posted by Awhislyle

Are you suggesting that if someone had a nervous breakdown and also suffered from nightyerrors of werewolfs. Would you
1. Tell that person how the were wolfs cant exist and they need to accept that and move on
or
2. Dress up in were wolf costumes and throughout the night wake them up howling over their body, put fake scratch makes on their door,
(of course that would be an extreme case, but the same principal could apply to most things of that sort)
You can not go along with someones delusions, for it will only draw them into a deeper belief

I think it would be best

for hydraat to get over the experience

My verb was LISTEN

Your verb is TELL

How do you know how to 'help' people who have delusions or nervous breakdowns? Do you have some training in psychology or psychiatry?

http://www.selfknowledge.com/5904.htm

**Awhislyle** · 01-17-2006 07:26 AM

Originally posted by Asclepius

My verb was LISTEN

Your verb is TELL

How do you know how to 'help' people who have delusions or nervous breakdowns? Do you have some training in psychology or psychiatry?

http://www.selfknowledge.com/5904.htm

I asked you a question first, I will not answer your questions if you do not want to answer mine.

If you think that people only disgaree with hydraat because they either have something to prove, or they are afraid of the whole experience for personal reasons.... If you believe that, then you are ignorant.
http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=ignorant

**hydraat_takiyah** · 02-04-2006 01:43 AM

Originally posted by ataraxis

Well... in that case, I think we all pretty much know what's going on here *

Case closed...

And I would agree with anyone who says that you are trying to compensate for a couple of short comings

**hydraat_takiyah** · 02-04-2006 01:51 AM

Originally posted by Leo Volont+--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Leo Volont)</div>

<!--QuoteBegin-hydraat_takiyah

YOu know, that is a very interesting point you made there, and most certainly true. Where did you read that at, I would really like some inlightenment on the subject. So are you saying I'm in the way of my own progress, email me, let's talk!

Oh I have dreamed of horses for years. In the first dreams, the horses were presented as powerful and intimidating, selfish and while appearing noble, were actually very pig-like. It was clear that these horses would have to be reined in, bridled and mastered.

The first step was always to ride them... simply to be able to stay on. In my first dreams, riders were lining up to ride this one particularly fast and difficult horse, and they were all thrown, and not so much by any wild bucking, as simply by their inability to hold on and stay comfortably on the horses back, but it would deliberately toss off anybody who annoyed it with bad technique. When my turn came, I made it a point to ride up high in the saddle, and to keep my weight in the stirrups, holding myself up with my legs, so that my weight would not bounce uncomfortably on the horses back. The Horse noticed immediately and made no objections to my further riding. Then the horse became hungry and we stopped at a Sandwich Shop. That is our point of control. We feed the Horse. We feed the Will.

At the end of the Dream, my father appeared to me like a Critic, in a smoking jacket, smoking a pipe, and he commented upon the Dream. he told me that the Secret of Horses was that they were just big pigs. That would mean that the Will is largely indiscriminate. It will devor anything before it. It will indulge itself with no concern for propriety or appearances.

And yet we can eventually exert our influences. Dreams went by and I found myself training horses in corrals, trotting horses in riding circles, and weaving around barrels. In later dreams, over the years, horses would appear with me in some of my Spiritual Dreams. The horse became my constant companion.

yes, just the other night I dreamt that I and another man were going through some exercise run and came across a group of people who were curious about what we were doing, and as I began to explain to them the purpose of our exercise, I suddenly noticed that I was upon Horseback and I continued by riding through the exercise.

Which brings up the point that to ride a horse represents Authority. Indeed, we can think of Knighthood, which was signified by one primary detail, that of being a Mounted Warrier. Being atop a Horse raises one above one's fellow man. It may sound elitest, but we should consider that our dreams are not so over concerned with being politically correct. But, practically speaking, a man who has harnassed the power of his Will and who has exercised some discipline over his will, such a man will invariably rise head and shoulders upon other men who haven't.[/b]

No offense honey, but you missed the whole jist of what i said, maybe i wasn't clear enough. I was on my couch like lucid, it wasn't like a dream; but too lucid for words, I was in my home. This horse was standing over me like any other person would trying to get my atten. I felt him saw him felt his breath on me, It was hot and forceful: I had to literaly get up and come to full conscienceness before i could disspell of him; i don't expect you to understand what i mean, I'm just looking for a place to get it off my chest!

**hydraat_takiyah** · 02-04-2006 02:02 AM

Originally posted by Asclepius
In dream interpretation its a good idea to start with the dreamer's personal associations. *However, if these are not strong or clear, why not look at broader cultural symbolism?

Certainly we talk about "horsepower", putting the cart before the horse, leading a horse to water, without necessarily owning a horse.

I like Leo's interpretation, that energy is riding Hydraat, that she should be riding. *Maybe its will, maybe its lifeforce, maybe its emotions... As its Hydraat's dream she can find what fits for her.

In reading Ice Dawg's post about the purpose of this board being to increase lucidity, I'd like to suggest an interpretation of this discussion thread, which seems to readily cross over into non-lucid emotional reactionism.

I think there are 2 fears that are buried in the discussion.

The first is a fear that dreams CAN hurt us. *Most of us hear prefer to believe that although dreams may frighten and even terrify us, they can't hurt us. *This belief is not shared by everyone. *I've heard many people state that if you die in a dream you will die in reality. *On this Board you can find posts from dreamers who have survived those dreams, so that belief appears false. *I think some people, rather than simply disbelieving Hadraat, need to deny her statement of getting scars from a dream to protect their *own belief that dreams are safe.

(My personal belief is that dreams are safe, based on my own experiences to date. *But I cannot speak to the experience of everyone)

The second element of this thread that I would like to interpret is the following situation. *A person has a painful and frigthening experience, they tell others seeking support and understanding. *The experience is either denied, or dismissed. *This is adding insult to injury. *I would hope that experiences from other areas would encourage us to at least listen compassionately, even if we don't personally believe in the experience or have not had comparable experiences. *The denial or dismissal comes either from arrogance, or a need to repress one's own experiences of suffering.

thankyou so much, i really needed to hear that

**hydraat_takiyah** · 02-04-2006 02:05 AM

Originally posted by Chympara
I am posting this without reading the entire three-four pages before this.

Perhaps you were sleeping on your arm, and it started to really hurt? *And the "teeth marks" could just be an imprint of the couch on your arm? *My bedsheets/clothes/textiles sometimes do this to me when I sleep on them.

i agree, but do your sheets make you bleed? Contrary to the badcock commercial, I don't need new furniture! lol
thanks for your feedback lots of love pal

**hydraat_takiyah** · 02-04-2006 02:08 AM

Originally posted by Awhislyle

Are you suggesting that if someone had a nervous breakdown and also suffered from nightyerrors of werewolfs. Would you
1. Tell that person how the were wolfs cant exist and they need to accept that and move on
or
2. Dress up in were wolf costumes and throughout the night wake them up howling over their body, put fake scratch makes on their door,
(of course that would be an extreme case, but the same principal could apply to most things of that sort)
You can not go along with someones delusions, for it will only draw them into a deeper belief
I dont consider myself arrogant or in need to repress something, I think it would be best for hydraat to get over the experience

Hello, I'm not the one that seems to be dwelling on MY experience pal
So, what about people who have repressed memories that resurface during dreams, are they insane aswell?

**hydraat_takiyah** · 02-04-2006 02:16 AM

I just want to thank everyone for their feedback whether it be positive or negative. I'd just like to let everyone know that i'm not looking for validation; just thought i'd share my experiences with total strangers than my friends and family because they all think i'm nuts too! I often have prophetic dreams where people are often sorry they didn't listen to me when i tell them they're home's gonna be burglarized or they are pregnant, or miscarry etc. Maybe, in a sense, i'm just looking in the wrong place for people like myself. I've been an outcast amongst my peers for as long as i remember and i'm tired of hiding it you know. I just want to know people like myself and not feel like i'm the wierdo for a change. I know i'm not wierd, just need to find people like me. thanks for everything. I won't be posting here anymore because it's just not worth the ridicule; which is why i came here in the first place; to find exceptance but i ran into the same ole shit on a different day. May GOD bless you all. Farewell

**wasup** · 02-04-2006 02:22 AM

Originally posted by hydraat_takiyah

And I would agree with anyone who says that you are trying to compensate for a couple of short comings

Your "only evidence was your sanity." Need I say more? I don't think it's "short coming" not to argue against that... I can say "An elephant gave me the gift to fly... but my only evidence is my sanity" all I want, but that doesn't make it true.

**hydraat_takiyah** · 02-04-2006 02:37 AM

Originally posted by ataraxis

Your "only evidence was your sanity." *Need I say more? *I don't think it's "short coming" not to argue against that... I can say "An elephant gave me the gift to fly... but my only evidence is my sanity" all I want, but that doesn't make it true.

I never asked you to believe me pal, i was just sharing. My world isn't gonna come crashing down if you your omniscient highness doesn't believe me. To believe is ignorance anyhow. I don't blame you for discrediting my experience because you were not there to experience it. You are absolutely right not to believe me tell you it's raining outside without looking for yourself! The point is, i'm not trying to convince y ou, i'm only sharing, and for you to question my sanity, someone who you don't even know is a little ingnorant if i might ad. Leave me alone ok pal, i'm not sharing anymore, not starting anymore threads, so you can go and question someone elses sanity ok buddy! Leave me the hell alone!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!