Thread: Turning Point for MS?

Dell did that once before, last time they used RedHat. I think it's a major advancement for Linux, but Dell isn't the only one doing this. IBM desktops can also come with Linux preinstalled.

No, Microsoft is going to dominate the market for a long time to come, there just isn't enough unity in the Linux community to take them over. Ubuntu is great, I have it on my PC but it lacks software for the everyday user.

Remember that Vista was designed for be a minor upgrade to XP and a stepping stone to Vienna. If you look at the files in Vista, it is still XP with a shiney GUI and minor OS "upgrades." It's similar to what Windows Me was to Windows 2000. I don't think it will catch on, but keep people interested until Vienna, it's just too expensive for the minor upgrades.


Steve Ballmer made fun of the iPhone for being $499 while you can get a Windows Mobile PDA for $199. Vista Ultimate is $399, Leopard will ship for $129... Ubuntu is free.

Out of curiousity, how much does the Ubuntu Dell cost compared to an XP Dell of the same model?

Dell also shipped computers with Debian on them at one point if I'm not mistaken. It's definitely a plus, and helps the general public see the advantages of Linux. Like ninja said though:

Microsoft is going to dominate the market for a long time to come, there just isn't enough unity in the Linux community to take them over. Ubuntu is great, I have it on my PC but it lacks software for the everyday user.[/b]

Linux is free, so you can't expect it to compete with big giants like Microsoft. It's not Linux's job to take over... that's Apple's job.

By the way, I don't have an apple, wish I did, and will be saving up money for when my phone contract expires in a year or so... I'll be getting an iPhone fo surr! That thing is amazing!

Originally Posted by ninja9578

Ubuntu is great, I have it on my PC but it lacks software for the everyday user.[/b]

Well, to be objective, it's not Linux that lacks software for everyday users, it's the developers of commercial software that lack software for anything but Windows. (Yes, huge generalisations but you get the point.)
Because "everyday software" is plenty present, from text editors to office programs. It's the commercial software produced by large companies that casual users seek and don't find on Linux for a large part.

One thing I've noticed is, since Vista's release, nobody has been ranting and raving about DRM and whatnot anymore. Heh.

Well, I have a linux box and a windows laptop, and "everyday use" differs widely between the two :-).

Originally Posted by MSG

One thing I've noticed is, since Vista's release, nobody has been ranting and raving about DRM and whatnot anymore. Heh.[/b]

you obviously haven't seen what's been going on at Digg in the last 48 hours......

Ubuntu? Lets just call it 'CANCER OS' right away. Besides this name I am not fond of, I do hope Microsoft's crap monopoly will somehow get ass-raped by lunix and dell. Dell is a good market, Dell still supplies a lot of companies, they don't need Microsoft to game or have other software. Or at least less then regular people.

If Ubuntu is more successful, maybe Microsoft will try harder to make a better OS.

Originally Posted by Ynot

you obviously haven't seen what's been going on at Digg in the last 48 hours......

Oh God, save yourself Ynot

I used to visit digg ritually until it started become a retarded sensationalist manifesto of twelve year olds who believe that open-source software is, by default, the best software ever created and that anything with even a speck of DRM is the work of the devil and should be eradicated immediately. Unfortunately their weapon of choice is the blog, so sadly for digg, nothing ever gets done.

Also, the population of digg's ideas hardly constitute as 'public opinion'. When I said people had generally stopped ranting about DRM I spoke from personal experience - pre-release, any mention of the word "Vista" or "Windows" triggered a slurry of "omg i feel sorry for you, so much drm lol", "u micro$oft fanboi", "lol get with the times, linux is best" etc. Nowadays, people seem to have generally accepted it as just another operating system, and flames have withered down to a minimum, the few remaining anti-vista soldiers of open-source can easily be slain.

As much as I hate to admit it, I was a digg user and I used to be like that - Hell, I went deep enough as to actually believe the whole net neutrality thing. One day it dawned on me though, that not everybody was like digg and that I had a choice - either follow the digg crowd and be part of a hateful and sad army, or follow my own will based on experience, not public acceptance. Why did I use Linux? Because digg told me to. Why do I use Vista? Because it works for what I do, and I chose it. And choice, my friend, is golden.

Well, as far as Vista goes, I'm not planning on running it until at least SP1 (or even SP2 if my laptop can survive long enough) comes out. That seems to be the pattern with Windows anyway, and it dates all the way back to Windows 98, which sucked balls, until Windows 98SE came out, which was the best of the non-NT variety (I feel bad for anyone who got stuck with ME at the time).

By the way, how is Vista's backwards compatibility? Does it have compatibility mode, at least with older windows products? For one, I've got Office 2K, and don't want to get a newer one, since they're WAY too expensive, and I'm perfectly happy with what it offers. But then, I also have all kinds of old games and sometimes I get nostalgic. I'd be pissed if I couldn't play some of those old favourites.

Oh of course, as far as backwards compatibility goes, I've found hardly any problems with it. Probably much much fewer than 2000/XP, even.

The only programs I've tried that don't work are Flash MX (Flash 8 works just fine, however), Ethereal (can't seem to find my ethernet card), and some others I can't remember off the top of my head (so I doubt I'm missing them). Some programs are annoying in that they kill Aero when you use them - Quicktime's in-browser plugin, Trillian, and VLC media player being the most annoying culprits.

I wouldn't count on some program from the 90s to work, however, if it was designed for NT you can pretty much guarantee it works on Vista.

Just a little update
http://biz.yahoo.com/rb/070726/dell_linux.html?.v=1

Dell to expand Linux PC offerings, partner says
Thursday July 26, 4:36 pm ET

BOSTON (Reuters) - Dell Inc will soon offer more personal computers that use the Linux operating system instead of Microsoft Corp's Windows, said the founder of a company that offers Linux support services.

Mark Shuttleworth, who created a version of Linux software named Ubuntu, said Dell is happy with the demand it has seen for Linux PCs that were introduced in May.

Dell, the world's second-largest PC maker after Hewlett-Packard Co, now offers three consumer PCs that run Ubuntu Linux.

"What's been announced to date is not the full extent of what we will see over the next couple of weeks and months," Shuttleworth said an interview late on Wednesday.

"There are additional offerings in the pipeline," he said. Shuttleworth founded Canonical Inc to provide support for Ubuntu Linux.

A Dell spokeswoman, Anne Camden, declined comment, saying the company does not discuss products in the pipeline.

She added that Dell was pleased with customer response to its Linux PCs. She said Dell believed the bulk of the machines were sold to open-source software enthusiasts, while some first-time Linux users have purchased them as well.

Open-source software refers to computer programs, generally available over the Internet at no cost, that users can download, modify and redistribute.

The Linux operating system is seen as the biggest threat to Microsoft's Windows operating system.

Shuttleworth said sales of the three Dell Ubuntu PC models were on track to meet the sales projections of Dell and Canonical. He declined to elaborate.

Companies like his privately held Canonical Inc, Red Hat Inc and Novell Inc make money by selling standardized versions of Linux programs and support contracts to service them.

There are dozens of versions of Linux, available for all sorts of computers from PCs to mainframes and tiny mobile devices.

Shuttleworth said his company was not in discussions with Hewlett-Packard or the other top five PC makers to introduce machines equipped with Ubuntu.

Well... to say Windows Vista is just XP with a few upgrades is a bit wrong. It's really Windows 3.1, '95, '98, ME, 2000, and XP. Don't forget that on the bottom of all of that is DOS. And people wonder why we have to get new PCs when Mircosoft ships a new os.

Anyways... Dell selling Linux PCs is not a general threat for MS. Currently, it's all about marketing. Linux does not really have a marketing buzz to it unless you are a medium to large business. Linux is an amazing operating system.

The interesting thing though is that Microsoft is gaining grounds in the server software market. It doesn't make much sense to me. More than likely its due to support or something.

Originally Posted by bitness

Well... to say Windows Vista is just XP with a few upgrades is a bit wrong. It's really Windows 3.1, '95, '98, ME, 2000, and XP. Don't forget that on the bottom of all of that is DOS. And people wonder why we have to get new PCs when Mircosoft ships a new os.

If you mean that Vista is built on all those previous then that's simply wrong. They made a clear cut starting with 2000 and XP, when they ditched the DOS-core and went over to the NT-kernel. ME is the last of the DOS-based ones.


Anyway, my biggest issue with linux is the lack of standards. Makes it a real pain to make software for it. (And personally I prefer BSD anyway.)

Originally Posted by bitness

Well... to say Windows Vista is just XP with a few upgrades is a bit wrong. It's really Windows 3.1, '95, '98, ME, 2000, and XP. Don't forget that on the bottom of all of that is DOS. And people wonder why we have to get new PCs when Mircosoft ships a new os

That's not entirely true, ME, 2000, and XP have the NT core, not the DOS core.

ME was the last of the 9x line, and was built from 98 SE
but anyhow...

http://www.pcworld.com/article/id,13...e/article.html

dot dot dot...

http://www.news.com/8301-10784_3-978...?tag=nefd.only