Thread: DVD Copy Protection Ruled "Ineffective"

OK, that was a no-brainer, CSS has been a joke since it was first released.

However, CSS protected or not, you can still do jail time or be fined for copying copyrighted material.

I think you miss the importance of this

1) legally (and rightfully so) able to make backups of media you have purchased

2) legal resolution to DVD's on linux machines

anyway, Happy Days

You've always been able to make legal backups of DVD's you own, protected or not.

There was a ruling in the US that it was illegal to read the encryption keys to break CSS encrypting, but people found a way to programatically determine the encryption keys. I think maybe DVD Decryptor has this ability???

As for #2, I don;t mess with linux, so I don't know anything about those issues

It's always been illegal to break the CSS
no matter how you do it
The DMCA made sure of that

and, as for linux
no bastard would license any players for decryption

Originally Posted by Ynot

as for linux no bastard would license any players for decryption

That's grossly inaccurate. There was no way anyone was going to bother trying to _sell_ a legal CSS player for linux. Some people would refuse to buy it because it wasn't Free Software (in the sense of being distributed along with the right to modify and redistribute like most other linux software), most people would refuse to buy it because it wasn't free 'as in beer' software. CSS could be licensed to a linux player, and I believe there was an attempt to, but it would be under the same terms as every other player, and definitely wouldn't allow the player to be released for free (because the license would cost), let alone in a modifiable form (because if the user can modify the decryption software there wasn't any point encrypting the things in the first place).

Being illegal hasn't stopped the Free, libre DeCSS from being popular, and no commercial proprietary software could compete against it in the linux environment.

Originally Posted by Seeker

You've always been able to make legal backups of DVD's you own, protected or not.

In Antarctica, maybe. The rest of us have to live with a DMCA that allows denial of fair use, the EU equivalent that this ruling affects (in *Finland* only so far). If you have my luck and live in the UK you're also subject to antiquated copyright law that provides no fair use rights making it illegal to take the unprotected audio CD you've paid for and play it on your MP3 player without explicit permission. Explicit permission which AFAIK has only been granted in the sense of saying "we've decided we're not going to sue people for this".

(Thats significance 3. of this ruling btw, the ability to shift content so I can use it how I like - on my phone, off my computers hard disk to the living room TV to save sticky children's fingers on shiny DVDs, etc).

Originally Posted by Seeker

There was a ruling in the US that it was illegal to read the encryption keys to break CSS encrypting, but people found a way to programatically determine the encryption keys. I think maybe DVD Decryptor has this ability?

I don't think so. I'd be interested to know what you're talking about, but from what I know of the US law it doesn't matter *how* you circumvent "copy protection". The only get-outs are on the basis intent, and the only one I can remember is for academic research; backups certainly isn't one of them. There are industry spokespersons quoted as saying that if you want a backup, you should buy a second copy.

Originally Posted by Ynot

anyway, Happy Days

Do not be alarmed. You have nothing to fear. Turn AWAY from the computer with your hands on your head and make no efforts to impede this routine search for copyrighted material. The evidence recovered from your home will be returned in all due time.

--

Sorry, this thread just struck a nerve. Everyone should have something they feel oppressed about. Just human nature :-).

Originally Posted by sourcejedi

That's grossly inaccurate.

well, slightly slanted, maybe

Originally Posted by sourcejedi

There was no way anyone was going to bother trying to _sell_ a legal CSS player for linux.

exactly,
even though most stand-alone DVD players use embedded linux as their OS, they couldn't profit from releasing the source - so they withheld it

Originally Posted by sourcejedi

Some people would refuse to buy it because it wasn't Free Software (in the sense of being distributed along with the right to modify and redistribute like most other linux software)

Well....yeah, but so what?
More importantly, it couldn't have been distributed by linux vendors - which is a far more pressing issue
basically, in the linux world, if something isn't free (as in speech) you are on your own as to obtaining, installing and running it on anything bar licensed enterprise servers
DVD playback isn't exactly aimed at the enterprise market
it's aimed at the home market

Originally Posted by sourcejedi

most people would refuse to buy it because it wasn't free 'as in beer' software.

if you bought a DVD, how happy would you be if you couldn't play it, and had to pay even more for the ability to play your bought disc?

Originally Posted by sourcejedi

CSS could be licensed to a linux player

Yes, it could
but it wasn't

Originally Posted by sourcejedi

and I believe there was an attempt to, but it would be under the same terms as every other player, and definitely wouldn't allow the player to be released for free (because the license would cost), let alone in a modifiable form (because if the user can modify the decryption software there wasn't any point encrypting the thrings in the fist place).

Them's the breaks
if they knew that having the source would allow for "unauthorized" decryption
did they really think that withholding it would protect them?
A crappy encryption system is a crappy encryption system

Originally Posted by sourcejedi

Being illegal hasn't stopped the Free, libre DeCSS from being popular, and no commercial proprietary software could compete against it in the linux environment.

And thank god

The whole DRM issue is flawed
it really is

Think of a safe
it's designed to let people in that have the key
and keep people out if they don't have the key
it's pretty much as secure as it's possible to get

but with DRM, you buy a safe (the encrypted disc)
but they have to give you the key as well (else you can't open the safe)
but you can only use the key in an authorized way.....

my banana's aren't moving.....

Originally Posted by Ynot

my banana's aren't moving.....

WTF? They're not moving for me either. I'm sure they were OK a few minutes ago, right?

Somehow they found a way to prevent Handbrake from copying. I have backups of every DVD that I own, but for some reason Saw 3 just won't do it, I don't know what they did differently.

I found a program to do Saw 3. I have made copies of all my dvds as well. There are a few I am unable to do, but it's nice to have an extra copy. I use those when loaning out movies. That way if they never come back or are damaged, I haven't lost the movie completely. I used to loan my originals before I even had a dvd burner and most I never saw again or were too scratched up to play by the time I got them back. I'd never try to go out and sell copies. It's not worth the fines or jail time.

DVD Decrypter doesn't work on most of the newer movies. Older ones have no problem, but I get errors on most of the new ones. That program was free, but I have paid for other programs. I went and bought Roxio Easy Media Creator...it's not worth the disk it's on IMO.

Being able to non-physically copy music virtually for free is a very new technology in the grand scheme of things, and business simply never caught up to the technology. People were allowed to get just a taste of music freedom, and now that companies are trying to restore control again, people won't let it happen now that they've 'seen the light'. The record companies are having a sissy fit, however, because what we're seeing is a movement to bring control over the content to the people.

As for DRM, I'd say we're in an even better situation than we were years ago. I talked to a DJ once at a wedding and he said that most of his music was bought off of iTunes. Astonished, I asked him how he was able to use it with PCDJ, what with the protection and whatnot - He simply smiled and said "There are ways around that...", glancing over at his computer. As shady as it was, it seems like he was in hog heaven compared to the DJs of yesteryear who had to invest in and carry around huge CD/Cassette/Record collections along with expensive audio equipment. This guy just had an amp and a computer. Needless to say, DRM hardly serves its purpose at all, and simply does not work with the setups people have today. But you already know that.

EDIT: Fuck way to be on-topic, this is a DVD thread