Thread: Barre Chords

You can't really do much about the pain. Just practise. Don't over-apply yourself though. If it's really hurting, take a break. The last thing you want to do is pull something and put good practise to waste.

As far as the string goes - new strings can often sound tinny and bright, is it new? It's hard to help over the internet though. Maybe there's something off with the saddle in the bridge or something. If you think there's something wrong your best bet would be to take it to a guitar shop and ask them.

Originally Posted by Ardent

You can't really do much about the pain. Just practise. Don't over-apply yourself though. If it's really hurting, take a break. The last thing you want to do is pull something and put good practise to waste.

As far as the string goes - new strings can often sound tinny and bright, is it new? It's hard to help over the internet though. Maybe there's something off with the saddle in the bridge or something. If you think there's something wrong your best bet would be to take it to a guitar shop and ask them.
[/b]

dude... play until your hands are a bloody pulp... it sucks, but after a while you will get used to it and get good calisus. i thought i had a good one... until i started playing the upright bass. just play man.

Yeah, it took some getting used to, for me, too. The sharp pain in your fingertips from rubbing against the strings will go away after you've built some callouses over them.
As far as the dull arthritic pain in your fingers and hand, you should take a break every few hours or so, or maybe even take some Aleve before you start playing.

nio not the pain in the finger tips. in the bones and muscles of my hand a litle higher than my wrist.

It might be from the way you're picking the strings. Use as little movement of your wrist as possible. I only use my entire arm to pick if I have to hit notes really quickly.

Push it until you feel burning, but not pain. Those muscles and tendons need to get used to it.

Are you playing an electric or an acoustic? It's going to be a LOT harder (and slower) on an acoustic.

A racquetball is good exercise for your hand when you aren't playing. Just rolling it around will keep your hand loose, and you can squeeze it with your thumb to exercise that muscle that gets so sore.

That sound in your third string will take care of itself. It is either a strength issue or the way you are placing your hand. Don't worry about it yet. Build up your strength first.

Make sure your finger is straight and as close to the fret as possible without overlapping it. Keep your thumb centered on the back of the neck and just slightly ahead of your first finger. Use the pad of the thumb - not the tip and don't let it go flat. Keep that curve there.

Don't overdo it. You'll get there with patience. Don't push it through pain.

what do you mean by the raquetball? what excersize?

thanks

A racquetball - just a softish rubber ball, about the size of a small orange.

In your left hand, you can just roll it around with your fingers and it will keep those muscles loose that are going to get sore as you are developing them. You can also hold it between your fingers and thumb pad and squeeze it for exercise when you don't have a guitar handy. Squeeze from thumb to fingers to work that big muscle in the base of your thumb and the tendons up your arm. Palm it and just squeeze with your fingers to just work the fingers - together and individually.

Make sure your thumb is in the right spot, not hanging over the neck, it should be like this...

my thumb is pressed aganst the neck.

thanks for the advice!

Originally Posted by Mr

Make sure your thumb is in the right spot, not hanging over the neck, it should be like this...


[/b]

Actually i don't think that's necessarily important. I mean there are players who actually use their thumbs within chord patterns, and even to play riffs. I think whatever technique you develop, it just takes time to adjust, especially if you have built up already established technique.

For example, i've decided, after almost 7 years of playing, that my right hand technique needs to be altered. It's not a major alteration at all (basically i'm just rotating the angle of the pick a little), but it's so frustrating because not only does it feel strange, but it's actually causing some pain if i keep at it for too long because a) my muscles aren't used to being used that way, and b) i'm not relaxed within the position yet, so i'm straining unnecessarily. But once i've adjusted that will all go away.

No pain, no gain...

Anyway the good news is that after you can do barre chords with acoustic guitar then electric guitar will be a piece of cake. And your left arm is going to look like popeye's ( the muscles on the arm below the elbow really big )

Originally Posted by Ardent

Actually i don't think that's necessarily important. I mean there are players who actually use their thumbs within chord patterns, and even to play riffs. I think whatever technique you develop, it just takes time to adjust, especially if you have built up already established technique.

For example, i've decided, after almost 7 years of playing, that my right hand technique needs to be altered. It's not a major alteration at all (basically i'm just rotating the angle of the pick a little), but it's so frustrating because not only does it feel strange, but it's actually causing some pain if i keep at it for too long because a) my muscles aren't used to being used that way, and b) i'm not relaxed within the position yet, so i'm straining unnecessarily. But once i've adjusted that will all go away.
[/b]

Really? I guess that's just style based. In classical it's taboo to have the thumb hanging over the neck. It's acceptable in jazz, since there isn't exactly a standard technique. But I think it's important to develop a good reach in the left hand, once that's accomplished, then you can let things slide and be comfortable, but you can't break the rules until you've learned them. But it's just an opinion anyway!

Originally Posted by Adagio

Really? I guess that's just style based. In classical it's taboo to have the thumb hanging over the neck. It's acceptable in jazz, since there isn't exactly a standard technique. But I think it's important to develop a good reach in the left hand, once that's accomplished, then you can let things slide and be comfortable, but you can't break the rules until you've learned them. But it's just an opinion anyway!
[/b]

Everything is taboo in classical guitar!
They're picky about how you hold the guitar, how you sit, what shape your fingernails on your picking hand are, and God forbid you use your pinky to pluck a string!

You can use your thumb in jazz occasionally if you're playing some reeeaaally exotic chord or something like that, but your thumb should generally not be visible, otherwise you are probably holding the neck the wrong way, which will be very difficult to correct in the future.

Originally Posted by Like

Everything is taboo in classical guitar!
They're picky about how you hold the guitar, how you sit, what shape your fingernails on your picking hand are, and God forbid you use your pinky to pluck a string!

You can use your thumb in jazz occasionally if you're playing some reeeaaally exotic chord or something like that, but your thumb should generally not be visible, otherwise you are probably holding the neck the wrong way, which will be very difficult to correct in the future.
[/b]

But generally it takes less energy to hold the thumb over the neck (therefore saving stamina) and it also facilitates the fingering of a lot of basic versatile chords, but for the most part it is good technique to use classical technique.

To get the best leverage, power and control over the fretboard hand, try to make it a habit early on to keep the thumb as close to the middle of the back of the neck as possible[/b]

Try this test:

Place your thumb in the center of the back of the neck, as per the illustration for classical position. Now, spread your remaining fingers out as wide as you can (With a little practice and relaxation, you will eventually be able to cover 6 frets easily, without moving your hand&#33. While keeping your fingers spread, slowly move your thumb up and over the top of the neck until you have it hanging over the fingerboard, as in the baseball bat position. Notice what happens to the rest of your fingers. There's just no way to keep them spread out with the thumb hanging over the fingerboard. This fact limits your access to three or four frets at a time with little or no mobility if you flop your thumb over the top of the neck.[/b]

If we have to move quickly either up, down the neck or across, it is imperative that the pressure from the thumb be extremely limited or nonexistent.

To have undue pressure in the thumb (the C-clamp) would be like having the parking brake on while you press the gas pedal of your car in gear; you are not going anywhere fast.[/b]

Pay attention to the thumb: Keep your thumb near the middle of the neck approximately between the first (index) and second (middle) fingers. Do not press hard with your thumb, in fact the less the better. Avoid choking the neck with excessive fret pressure. The thumb should provide stability, the fingers should be used to press the string. Keep your thumb fairly straight but not rigid.[/b]

I'm sorry, but literally everything I have ever read about the thumb on the fretting hand suggests that it is best to keep it on the middle of the back of the fretboard.

Granted, it's useful for exotic chords/scales, but that's the exception, not the rule.

I think it depends both upon how big your hands are and how much practise you do. Everybody has problems spreading their fingers when they first start learning guitar, regardless of where their thumb is. Perhaps with the same amount of practise one could spread their fingers without the aid of the thumb. Look at pianists; they don't have any aid from their thumbs yet some of them can also stretch and fly around on the keys.

My old guitar teacher was telling me about one of his friends who has insane reach. He can span a number of frets with his fingers AND fret a bass note with his thumb. He has huge hands though i believe, and lots of practise under his belt of course.

yaay!! i just did Bflat from my first try... i have been doin the ball excersize for like 10-20 mins a day and it helped! thx1

is it normal that i was practisin for a long time just now and there is tons of with (dead skin, im guessin) on my fingers. is this notmal?

Originally Posted by skuruza

is it normal that i was practisin for a long time just now and there is tons of with (dead skin, im guessin) on my fingers. is this notmal?
[/b]

Yup. Those are callouses. They'll always come and go, for as long as you play the guitar, I think. The more you play, though, the tougher your fingers get, and the harder it is to make them callous.

do finger stretches!! just kidding
my hands are naturally long.. perfect for conducting an instrument.. piano, guitar, its fun. i have a 6 bar stretch from my pointerfinger to pinky.. hurts a bit, but thats really good eh?
Ive been playing for 2 years now.. i LOVE guitar.. ive got two now, its soo cool to walk into my room and see two guitars just sitting there, waiting to be played.
Though now, i think i need a band. lol you got the singer and guitarist already (thats me).. just need bass and drums.. mabey piano... hmmm........

~R~

As far as the Thumb thing goes, I don't think it really matters. It's just style, whatever works for you.

Personally, when I play chords, mostly on the lower strings like D chord, I let my thumb hang over. I use it in some bar chords everyno and then. But when you are playing something that requres a "stretch" it's best to let the thumb be on the back of the neck as it lets your fingers spread farther more comfortably.

Ooh, thumb over the top, sloppy, sloppy!!

My father teaches guitar for a living; he suggests the thumb be opposite your middle finger on the back of the neck. It really does make it more comfortable that way.

I have neglected to learn guitar from my dad (I have a LOT of issues from attempting to learn from him at age 10), and have decided to attempt to learn on my own. I've been playing mostly acoustic for about two years. The best advice about barre chords I can give is to not make a huge deal out of them. I found that I would panic whenever I saw one was coming up. It wasn't until maybe a month ago that I started to get comfortable playing them! All it took was seeing a video instructor just go ahead and do it. He didn't say "uh oh, here comes that barre chord", he just treated it as any other chord in the song. The relaxation he played with made me realize that I had created that whole giant mental block of fear. You wouldn't believe how good I suddenly am at them!

If you want the video instructor site, let me know and I'll post it up!

Much luck!