Astral Projection and Spirit guides

[SaMaster14]

Well... I know astral projection is a little bit beyond lucid dreaming, where your soul or consciousness leaves your body and you are able to go wherever/do whatever you want and view both physical and astral planes. But what are good techniques for this? Will WILD work? Next question is how am I able to contact my spirit guides? I have been trying to for a while, by just attempting to talk to them before I sleep and seeing if they answer me or come in my dreams, but I don't have much luck. Any help with that? Thanks!

[Jabrol2001]

Well, how spiritual are you? Have you a spirit animal? Or have had other things happen in real life that you can connect to? If not i would try meditating a bit, and well get to know them. You have to know what is there (if anything at all) before you start doing what you want. Good luck and let me know what happends. I can explain some things to you if you want. Ive been traveling in the spirtual world for some time.

[Phantasos]

Well... I know astral projection is a little bit beyond lucid dreaming, where your soul or consciousness leaves your body Actually, it is the same thing, so no problems. Some think their soul leaves body, some think their have entered dream without losing consciousness but it is just a matter of which interpretation you prefer. The phenomenon itself is the same in both cases. and you are able to go wherever/do whatever you want and view both physical and astral planes. But what are good techniques for this? Will WILD work? Yes, as astral projection and WILD is the same thing. Next question is how am I able to contact my spirit guides? I have been trying to for a while, by just attempting to talk to them before I sleep and seeing if they answer me or come in my dreams, but I don't have much luck. Any help with that? Try to search and/or call them when you are in LD/AP. Also you may want to think about reasons why do you want to see them. And practice LDing/APing (whatever you call it) - eventually some suspicious DCs will approach you.

[SaMaster14]

thanks for the replies guys! I'm gonna concentrate on my meditation and keep tyring to AP/LD.

[TJuulsgaard]

There is no definate proof that astral projecting and WILD is the same thing. The matter is more "grey" than "black or white". There have been lots of discussions on the subject in BD, so if interested you could find more info - and maybe take up the discussion.

[saxonharp]

Here's a technique I use to Journey (Astral Project): Envision yourself in a place in nature. Wherever your Heart leads you to first is usually best to go with, don't try to force the vision. Once you've got your scene firmly in your mind, collect 12 stones and begin placing them in a circle. First in the East then moving clockwise to SE, S, SW, W, NW, N, NE. Then, within that circle create a second circle placing the remaining four stones at the cardinal points, again starting in the East and moving clockwise finishing with North. In the center of your circle, build a fire. Start with the tinder, then build up to small twigs then small fuel. Once your fire is going, call out to your Guides and ask them to come to you. If you've focused on the fire building correctly, your mind will be quiet and you will be able to communicate quite clearly with your Guides in this sacred space you have created.

[SaMaster14]

Here's a technique I use to Journey (Astral Project): Envision yourself in a place in nature. Wherever your Heart leads you to first is usually best to go with, don't try to force the vision. Once you've got your scene firmly in your mind, collect 12 stones and begin placing them in a circle. First in the East then moving clockwise to SE, S, SW, W, NW, N, NE. Then, within that circle create a second circle placing the remaining four stones at the cardinal points, again starting in the East and moving clockwise finishing with North. In the center of your circle, build a fire. Start with the tinder, then build up to small twigs then small fuel. Once your fire is going, call out to your Guides and ask them to come to you. If you've focused on the fire building correctly, your mind will be quiet and you will be able to communicate quite clearly with your Guides in this sacred space you have created. hmm... very interesting. I will have to try this!! Oh... and one question: is this while meditating, or will I have to lucid dream and do this in a dream? Oh and TJuulsgaard: I will definitely check this section out for more topics and start conversation.

[moonshine]

There is no definate proof that astral projecting and WILD is the same thing. The matter is more "grey" than "black or white". There have been lots of discussions on the subject in BD, so if interested you could find more info - and maybe take up the discussion. Theres never going to be any definative proof. Even if there was a 99% probability of OBES and WILDS being the same, some would prefer to think otherwise. As it is theres growing scientific evidence that they are indeed the same - though its not often discussed in BD. Whats more, logic would suggest the same. Think about how the cult of astral travelling has changed to incorporate Lucid Dreaming in its "teachings". Its like the church accepting evolution. They have no choice but to do so.

[SpanishFlea]

Even if Lucid Dreaming and OBE's are different, they are definitely closely related to each other. From what I understand, most of those who experience a Lucid Dream upon awakening accept the unreality of the dream, and those who experience an OBE will not accept that fact and claim it to be real. I cant say that I've ever had an OBE, though sometimes I think I have. But it may have just been a lucid dream where I thought that I was having an OBE. It's too hard to tell for someone who hasn't directly experienced it, should there be anything to experience. Ive been reading a book lately called "Out of Body Experiences, how to have them and what to expect." The author clearly sees a difference in Lucid Dreaming and OBE, and there's numerous times in the book where he lapses from astral projection into a lucid dream, so obviously some people see the difference. Logic can suggest a lot of things that arent necessarily true, and I don't think that you should be calling astral travelers a "cult" moonshine, that might be a little offensive to some of the board members. I guess maybe from your viewpoint though, it's a spiritual practice that seems strange. Hence, cult. To each his own I guess

[saxonharp]

[QUOTE=SaMaster14;1177606]hmm... very interesting. I will have to try this!! Oh... and one question: is this while meditating, or will I have to lucid dream and do this in a dream? [QUOTE] I do this in a Prayerful state which is similar to a Metitative state with one significant difference: When I meditate, the Intent is simply to quiet my mind and examine one specific issue with crystal clarity. I am using my own Mind and Heart to make a decision or gain Understanding. While in this state, my Guides do not interrupt. I've heard others say that it's like the Guides are saying to one another, "Shhh.... he's meditating... don't bother him right now." A Prayerful state, like meditating, utilizes and requires a quiet mind, but rather than seeking Understanding from your own perspective, the Intent is to reach out to your Guides or Benefactor for the benefit of their Knowledge to aid you in a particular issue. Intent is everything. The more focused and clear your Intent, the more you will benefit from the messages you receive.

[moonshine]

Even if Lucid Dreaming and OBE's are different, they are definitely closely related to each other. From what I understand, most of those who experience a Lucid Dream upon awakening accept the unreality of the dream, and those who experience an OBE will not accept that fact and claim it to be real. I cant say that I've ever had an OBE, though sometimes I think I have. But it may have just been a lucid dream where I thought that I was having an OBE. It's too hard to tell for someone who hasn't directly experienced it, should there be anything to experience. Ive been reading a book lately called "Out of Body Experiences, how to have them and what to expect." The author clearly sees a difference in Lucid Dreaming and OBE, and there's numerous times in the book where he lapses from astral projection into a lucid dream, so obviously some people see the difference. Logic can suggest a lot of things that arent necessarily true, and I don't think that you should be calling astral travelers a "cult" moonshine, that might be a little offensive to some of the board members. I guess maybe from your viewpoint though, it's a spiritual practice that seems strange. Hence, cult. To each his own I guess I'm not one who thinks that calling something "spiritual" or a "belief system" automatically validates the same or demands automatic respect. So Cult does me just fine. But you do give a good example of how "astral projection" and "lucid dreaming" now bleed across one another. To me its a mealy mouthed way of trying to envelope those issues which would otherwise be inconvenient in their own right. I've had what some might well consider awesome OBEs, leading into LDs. However, I have no need to feel that I am special or are connecting with the universe. It was just a cool way of entering a lucid.

[saxonharp]

I'm not one who thinks that calling something "spiritual" or a "belief system" automatically validates the same or demands automatic respect. So Cult does me just fine. Just because something does not automatically demand respect, does not mean it automatically deserves derision. The words we choose to describe something or someone are indicative of the emotions we feel towards that subject. The word "Cult" has many derisive overtones and implies a mindlessness that many who practice this would find uninformed at best, or derrogatory at worst. If that is how you feel, then certainly - as SpanishFlea has indicated - you are entitled to your emotions but don't be surprised at negative reactions. I've had what some might well consider awesome OBEs, leading into LDs. However, I have no need to feel that I am special or are connecting with the universe. It was just a cool way of entering a lucid. Again, your choice of words would implie that those who DO practice this are somehow doing so simply to fuel their own egos by appearing "special" or that the desire to connect with the "universe" is somehow a weak or insignificant thing worthy of derision. While I'm very sure that there are those who practice Astral Projection and other OBE methods for precisely this purpose or reasons (whether they know or admit it or not), there are equally those who do so for the well-being of the People. ALL People. You included. Painting with such a broad brush is not only innaccurate, it IS disrespectful to those who actively work to help bring balance, health and harmony to the world you are a part of. I would hope that as you mature, you will begin to recognize this. Mitaquye Oyasin, Mato Kinze

[Baron Samedi]

Your spirit guides are always with you. You do not need to dream about them or do AP to contact them, but it helps, because then the rest of your mind is quiet and undsitracted. I have done a lot of AP, but not with much success as I'd like. I am actually going to try some of the techniques listed here. You can hear them when you get to know their voices in your head, once you discern their thought from yours. In the Bible it's called a still small voice. I send you positive energy on your quest.

[moonshine]

Just because something does not automatically demand respect, does not mean it automatically deserves derision. Obviously. The words we choose to describe something or someone are indicative of the emotions we feel towards that subject. Obviously. The word "Cult" has many derisive overtones and implies a mindlessness that many who practice this would find uninformed at best, or derrogatory at worst. I am aware of this yes. If that is how you feel, then certainly - as SpanishFlea has indicated - you are entitled to your emotions but don't be surprised at negative reactions. Honestly, I'd be more surprise if I didn't feel the Astral Wrath. Again, your choice of words would implie that those who DO practice this are somehow doing so simply to fuel their own egos by appearing "special" or that the desire to connect with the "universe" is somehow a weak or insignificant thing worthy of derision. It wasn't an implication. It was a statement. And I firmly believe that yes, if you're kidding yourself about the significance of misunderstood dreams, and refuse to consider alternative viable and scientifically supportable interpretations, this is worthy of derision. there are equally those who do so for the well-being of the People. ALL People. You included. Can't really buy into that assertion. Though I do suspect some may do it to sell books and seminar tickets. Painting with such a broad brush is not only innaccurate, it IS disrespectful to those who actively work to help bring balance, health and harmony to the world you are a part of. From experience and observation, you may be overstating the typical BDers conflict resolution abilities somewhat. I would hope that as you mature, you will begin to recognize this. Until I see you berating those who similarly dismiss scientific evidence and the opinions of so called skeptics, I'll think I'll reserve judgement on how balanced and mature you are.

[saxonharp]

Until I see you berating those who similarly dismiss scientific evidence and the opinions of so called skeptics, I'll think I'll reserve judgement on how balanced and mature you are. Fair enough. My criticism of your remarks was taken with aplomb and answered with more "maturity" than I gave you credit for. I've heard this quote attributed to numerous individuals, but regardless of whence it comes, I find it appropriate now: "I may not agree with what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it."