Thread: Your View Om Communism

I agree, comunism is the best. :bravo: Though it really can't work. People are and always will be greedy. Why care about the person on the street when you are rich, or doing ok with a good-ish job. When people see the bigger picture, they will see that comunism is the answer (never gona happen though).

i am an american, but my attitude toward communism has nothing to do with the Cold War or Russia.

I will say i like the IDEA of communism, because it is ideally a utopian society. The only problem is IT WILL NEVER WORK. Some greedy asshole will take power and opress the people. Plain and simple. And the fact that people, for the most part, want to work harder than everybody else to put themselves ahead of others is a factor. It is just a basic human need that communism cannot fill, making it impossible.

I will say the Capitalism is THE BEST WAY to run a society.
......................what do you think made America kick so much ass?

Originally Posted by Hominus

I will say the Capitalism is THE BEST WAY to run a society.
......................what do you think made America kick so much ass?
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That is sadly true. As soon as people start thinking about others and not only about themselves, it will all change. Capitalism is the best for the Capitalist, ignorant people will allways follow them, be poor and work for the rich people, untill they find out that they have the power and are just being abused by rich people with the brainwashing power of misery. I myself wouldn't be very happy if I was rich, not because people say that money doesn't bring happyness, but because I would know that I have the money that could buy "houses" for a thousand people (for example).

Originally Posted by Bonsay

I agree, comunism is the best. :bravo: Though it really can't work. People are and always will be greedy. Why care about the person on the street when you are rich, or doing ok with a good-ish job. When people see the bigger picture, they will see that comunism is the answer (never gona happen though).
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Yes I agree. People will allways be greedy. It is in the human nature. But maybe one day when we have food replications, and changed our moral in a way that possesion doesn't make people happy. Maybe then we can have communism...

Originally Posted by Bonsay

i am an american, but my attitude toward communism has nothing to do with the Cold War or Russia.

I will say i like the IDEA of communism, because it is ideally a utopian society. The only problem is IT WILL NEVER WORK. Some greedy asshole will take power and opress the people. Plain and simple. And the fact that people, for the most part, want to work harder than everybody else to put themselves ahead of others is a factor. It is just a basic human need that communism cannot fill, making it impossible.

I will say the Capitalism is THE BEST WAY to run a society.
......................what do you think made America kick so much ass?
[/b]

Capitalism indeed is the best way to run a society... if you are leading it. In a totally capitalistic state a simple worker with no schooling can never get amoung the elite of america.

You think in the next 100 years there will be a black person, that used to live in the gutter, will be in office? That isn't going to happen. The amican dream is a lie. Capitalism works, but it sucks if you are low in the ecomical-chain. It sucks hard. And you can't do anything about it.

Allso capitalism doesn't really care about education. It wants the elite group that has the power to keep that power and it wants to have the workers schooled just enough so they can do their jobs.

Pure Capitalism doesn't care about nature, pure capitalsm doesn't care about people that contribute nothing to the economy (african countries), pure capitalism puts money above everything.

I can quite honestly say I would rather live in total anarchy then total capitalism. But I would gladly live in pure communism.

Yet, (luckly for 2 out of 3), those things arn't going to happen where I live in the next 100 years...

I like communism through small government, as in you share and help people. I hate communism through large government where they force you to do stuff against your will.

The biggest flaw I see in communism is that they always have large government that goes along with it to force you into doing stuff. So its really not communism thats the problem but the totaliaterain government that goes along with it.

Neuro, you said one day we can find a way to take away people's desire for possesions
What the hell are you thinking? To do that would make us inhuman.

Whats so bad about capitalism? The basic principal is the best prevail. That is all. It fulfills the basic need for humans to compete with eachother to come out ahead. Its kind of like a Bell-curve.

Maybe the black man wont be in an office (by the way, if hes living on the streets thats his own fault, not capitalism's). You have to understand that dreams have to be in perspective. Maybe he could run a fast food joint one day, which isnt a bad life at all. If "capitalism" sucks so bad then why did America come out ahead. It might not be the greatest system for EVERY SINGLE INDIVIDUAL, but which society is. Communism? Please. What we do obviously works and makes our country great.

The good thing about Capitalism is it endures. It has ups and downs (the depressions), but it always jumps back. Everything else, like communism and socialism, collapse after a while. Look at the Soviet Union.

If you fools really want every single aspect of your daily life governed by a communist government, then go ahead. I enjoy my freedom to have any job i want, say what i want, and protest what i want. If you want to be subject to restrain then be my guest.

Perhaps your yearning for communism stems from you inability to run your own lives. For someone like you, communism is heaven. They take care of everything for you so you dont have to.

hmm.........Lazyness=communism=failure

Originally Posted by Hominus

If you fools really want every single aspect of your daily life governed by a communist government, then go ahead. I enjoy my freedom to have any job i want, say what i want, and protest what i want. If you want to be subject to restrain then be my guest.
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Capitalist propaganda... Dictators were never a part of the idea of communism. A dictatorship was only needed because people didn't want to accept communism yet. Marx actually predicted the true form of communism only 800 years in the future.
The true form of communism is when everybody would work to improve themselves and the whole of society, so no more money, jelaousy, poverty, ... wars? Now would that not be more efficient than capitalism?

Originally Posted by Hominus

hmm.........Lazyness=communism=failure[/b]

Lazyness... why?

Originally Posted by Hominus

Maybe the black man wont be in an office (by the way, if hes living on the streets thats his own fault, not capitalism's).[/b]

You have to pay for school in the USA, right? Well if someone is born in a poor familly and is unable to pay for his education, how is that his fault?

Originally Posted by Hominus

Neuro, you said one day we can find a way to take away people's desire for possesions
What the hell are you thinking? To do that would make us inhuman.[/b]

Ah that you have wrong. Wacky buddisht monks are still human. You don't get the concept of greed. Greed isn't the human think, it is wanting to become better that causes greed. We all allways want to be better (then someone else). That is the human trait. Greed and such are results of that.

Originally Posted by Hominus

Whats so bad about capitalism? The basic principal is the best prevail. That is all. It fulfills the basic need for humans to compete with eachother to come out ahead. Its kind of like a Bell-curve.[/b]

It furfills, yes. For a few. And it allso leaves humans robbed of the power to even furfill that basic need. As I said a badly schooled back person with bad friends can never get rich in america.

Originally Posted by Hominus

Maybe the black man wont be in an office (by the way, if hes living on the streets thats his own fault, not capitalism's). You have to understand that dreams have to be in perspective. Maybe he could run a fast food joint one day, which isnt a bad life at all. If "capitalism" sucks so bad then why did America come out ahead. It might not be the greatest system for EVERY SINGLE INDIVIDUAL, but which society is. Communism? Please. What we do obviously works and makes our country great. [/b]

Still, it makes your country great. Personally I doubt you are in the top 5% that is really rich. In 95% of the cases you are better off living in a less-capitalistic (still western) country.

And will a black guy that can hardly read becouse his government doesn't spend enough money on schooling ever become a manager? And if he grew up in a rich family he wouldn't even have to do an effort to get Anywhere. Anywhere high.

In perspective yes, but the lowest people in your capitalistic ladder have hardly anywhere to go. No one is happy to work at Mcdonalds, they all want to be something better. They all try sort or less, they all fail. Why? I don't think they are genetically weaker. The system made them weak.

Originally Posted by Hominus

The good thing about Capitalism is it endures. It has ups and downs (the depressions), but it always jumps back. Everything else, like communism and socialism, collapse after a while. Look at the Soviet Union.[/b]

Yes. So? A brick on the right side can't fall over. But a beautifull vase can. Is a brick better?

And alot of Way less capitalistic counties allso are doing great. America just had the advantage of a new stolen county and lots of space and recources. That advantage is running out.

Originally Posted by Hominus

If you fools really want every single aspect of your daily life governed by a communist government, then go ahead. I enjoy my freedom to have any job i want, say what i want, and protest what i want. If you want to be subject to restrain then be my guest. [/b]

Russia wasn't communist at all in the later stages. Communism has Nothing to do with giving up freedoms. I don't see why you think that. You can still do whatever job you like. You just get paid as much as someone else, perhaps he has a more easy job in your eyes, but if he is not as skilled he works just as hard in theory, and earns as much money. If people truely want to help their country they will not choose the easy job and do the job they are best at. Job choice-wise it is not that different from capitalism. Only the fair-pay aspect is different.

Originally Posted by Hominus

Perhaps your yearning for communism stems from you inability to run your own lives. For someone like you, communism is heaven. They take care of everything for you so you dont have to. [/b]

Haha. Once again, it isn't russia. Clearly you are getting personal youself, kind of weak. (I kind of went for the personal attack myself, but really, will you be president?)

Anyhow. I would work harder in a communist state then in a capitalist state. If I truely believe my job aids the nation and it's people that all equally work hard, I will be way more motivated to work then with the attitude: I will let my boss think I am doing my job, while I actually am looking at porno, I don't care aslong as I get paid.

Originally Posted by Hominus

hmm.........Lazyness=communism=failure
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Hmmmm american indoctrination = fail.

Hey really man, are you rich? You have any idea what a high-up CEO earns? maybe even 50 times more then you do. Does he work That much harder? No. You are just being screwed by your own system... but hey, if you like that. I guess that america really done well: They make the public love their own lie that is so deep in their anus they can't move.

I voted: I am not an American. I do not like communism.

It's never worked before, so whats to say it ever will. Its the human condition, I don't think we can cope with communism.

You don't pay for school in the US. Well except collage which will bleed you dry. Basic schooling is free though.

I'm not American (Canadian hehe) and I think communism is a good idea, but in the end it sucks because people are stupid.

Originally Posted by Alric

You don't pay for school in the US. Well except collage which will bleed you dry. Basic schooling is free though.
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What I have seen and heard, basic schooling kind of sucks balls. In a bad neighborhood with overcrowded schools, you don't learn much.

Actually thats the problem. We don't pay for the schools, it comes from taxes. So a poor community is going to have a poor school. Its not really that noticeable untill you get into really bad areas. Then yea, it can get pretty bad.

Originally Posted by Alric

Actually thats the problem. We don't pay for the schools, it comes from taxes. So a poor community is going to have a poor school. Its not really that noticeable untill you get into really bad areas. Then yea, it can get pretty bad.
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Until said school gets so bad it Becomes title 1.

Communism is robbery. Communism is oppression. Communist governments make their people their bitches. Communism is an absurd idea. Communism is a historical failure. Screw communism.

Neruo, I am out of money right now because I have seen no reason to work hard. If you have any money, I want half of it because I am entitled to my fair share. No, I don't feel like working hard instead. Why should I? What's in it for me?

Seriously, when will you send me my check?

By the way, I am flattered by your obsession with my country.

Practically nobody is going to work hard if there is no strong incentive to do so. Greed is a deeply rooted part of human nature, and it is never going to go away. It is too much of an evolutionary advantage to ever die out. It is what gets things done. In communism, there is nothing, except fear if anything, that will make things happen. The United States is the most successful country in the world because of our capitalism. Nobody's communism or any other type of government has outdones us in business. Even our homeless people are fat. I'm totally serious. I don't say that with arrogance. I very much want the whole world to have our type of government. It would be awesome. If half of Europe starts kicking our asses in business, it will make me cry with happiness. I want the whole world to be capitalist. And the United States would be much better off if we were even more capitalistic. We need to extend it much more to the tax code and much more to the school system. Our public school system sucks while our private school system is incredible. That is no coincidence. The public schools lack the element of competition, so they suck. The same is true about communism. There is a reason the restaurants in the Soviet Union usually didn't have most of the items on the menues. Go figure.

word

I like how people keep talking about how communism would never work, when it has worked, several times in earlier societies we saw communism working, they were communists, they lived up to the early marxist ideals quite well. Sure, transition is a bitch and it's impossible to achieve in the sense that communists could not start revolutions right now and reach some sort of utopia, part of the irony is communism cannot be forced or corruption ensues, in this current swociety the only way to start successful communist societies would be for people to break away and form their own societies.

Yeah, everyone I've talked to has an opinion on communism, and 90% of them regurgiated the old, "it looks nice but it can't work" thing. Bullshit.

And another thing... since when the fuck did capitalism work? Last I checked the causes behind most of the massacres and wars in our society today are a cause of corporate corruption, which we can thank to capitalism. So what if communism doesn't work, I'd rather live in a society where it wasn't working than one where capitalism wasn't working.

Our problem is we don't have real capitalism. Theres to much market manipulation and government interference.

Originally Posted by Universal

Communism is robbery. Communism is oppression. Communist governments make their people their bitches. Communism is an absurd idea. Communism is a historical failure. Screw communism.

Neruo, I am out of money right now because I have seen no reason to work hard. If you have any money, I want half of it because I am entitled to my fair share. No, I don't feel like working hard instead. Why should I? What's in it for me?

Seriously, when will you send me my check?

By the way, I am flattered by your obsession with my country.

Practically nobody is going to work hard if there is no strong incentive to do so. Greed is a deeply rooted part of human nature, and it is never going to go away. It is too much of an evolutionary advantage to ever die out. It is what gets things done. In communism, there is nothing, except fear if anything, that will make things happen. The United States is the most successful country in the world because of our capitalism. Nobody's communism or any other type of government has outdones us in business. Even our homeless people are fat. I'm totally serious. I don't say that with arrogance. I very much want the whole world to have our type of government. It would be awesome. If half of Europe starts kicking our asses in business, it will make me cry with happiness. I want the whole world to be capitalist. And the United States would be much better off if we were even more capitalistic. We need to extend it much more to the tax code and much more to the school system. Our public school system sucks while our private school system is incredible. That is no coincidence. The public schools lack the element of competition, so they suck. The same is true about communism. There is a reason the restaurants in the Soviet Union usually didn't have most of the items on the menues. Go figure.
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You still don't get communism. Just becouse it has sucked so much when actually tried, and maybe it will go on sucking a lot more, that doens't make the basic idea a bunch of crap. The idea is great. I don't see how you can totally dismiss it. I mean untill people will shift their greedyness from self-enrichment to personal-bettering, then it has a shot.

untill then, somewhat of a communist/socialist factor is really quite good for a country. There is no way of telling or it will ever work, communism. But you can see that somewhat more socialistic (with about the same idea's as communism) countries do thrive. And I can quite honestly say am would rather be poor and lazy there then in america.

Really, what have you accomplished? A powerfull nation, yes. But most of it's inhabbitants are living a lie. How many people in america work 14 hours a day? More then in any other country. The truth is that american's work the hardest off all, but still lead a crappy life.

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Anyhow, who is the most hated nation in the world?

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One more thing: Would you even accept communism if it was possible? If everyone really did make it work the utopical way, no dictators, no war, same effort = same pay. I don't see a reason not to want a system without greed, if it is possible (sadly not at the moment). If you don't want that, you are just a little brainwashed american, with probably some crappy education. Even the best public high schools have a lower level as freaking polish high schools if you ask me. Imagen... the polish.

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Maybe you don't fit into any system. A true capitalist would say you don't fit in, becouse you don't even try to compete, to work. Every political system can work, the problem is people like you.

neuro, you said equal work and equal pay.

In communism, there is NO reason to work just as hard as the next guy, and you still get the same amount of money.

Communism takes away the human spirit to work hard. The only way to keep the people in order is by fear.

Originally Posted by Hominus

neuro, you said equal work and equal pay.

In communism, there is NO reason to work just as hard as the next guy, and you still get the same amount of money.

Communism takes away the human spirit to work hard. The only way to keep the people in order is by fear.
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You want to know why you think that? Because that is a totaly capitalistic view on everything. I said it before and I'll say it again, in real communism everyone wouldn't have to be afraid to work, they wouldn't need reasons to work, because they would know that they are a part of their "country", they are doing their share of the work. To keep things going. And again, If you do something you like doing you would never think of not doing it in the first place.
Only a capitalist could think that way, lazy style. You know why, because you don't like your work. As Neruo said :"But most of it's inhabbitants are living a lie. How many people in america work 14 hours a day? More then in any other country. The truth is that american's work the hardest off all, but still lead a crappy life."

Originally Posted by Hominus

neuro, you said equal work and equal pay.

In communism, there is NO reason to work just as hard as the next guy, and you still get the same amount of money.

Communism takes away the human spirit to work hard. The only way to keep the people in order is by fear.
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Thanks Bonsay, you allready did my work of replying

But yes: In a true (and yes, unlikely) communist nation a person is Willing to work hard, so support his country and his fellow countrymen and woman. Your capitalistic view on work isn't about doing you job right, it is about making it seem you are doing you job right so you get paid, and maybe even promoted.

Allso your 'The only way to keep the people in order is by fear.' refers to russia I think. Russia wasn't a communist state when stalin was a dictator. They did name themselves communist, but I don't think marx would agree.

Originally Posted by Neruo

You still don't get communism. Just becouse it has sucked so much when actually tried, and maybe it will go on sucking a lot more, that doens't make the basic idea a bunch of crap. The idea is great. I don't see how you can totally dismiss it. I mean untill people will shift their greedyness from self-enrichment to personal-bettering, then it has a shot.

[/b]

So when can you send me my check?

Originally Posted by Neruo

Anyhow, who is the most hated nation in the world?

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The one that people are the most jealous of. This is illustrated by the fact that NOBODY on this site who supposedly hates our war policy can passionately bitch about anybody else's war policy. You have noticed that, haven't you? After several requests, you and others showed nothing in that thread except obsession with the United States and very brief mentionings of those who seek to make Americans and Israelis literally extinct. People are going to be the most jealous of the most successful country, which is going to be the country with the best capitalism. Guess who that is. If you have a problem with us now, you just wait until we lower our tax code and use a financial incentive voucher system with our public schools. When that happens, your obsession with us is going to be ten fold.

Despite the provocative comments I just made toward Neruo so that he will take me up on my challenge to go off about a country other than the United States, I want the whole world to be capitalist. I don't think the United States kicks so much ass in business because we are genetically superior. The vast majority of us are the close descendants of the same people Neruo and others here are descendants of. The vast majority of us have great great grandparents who were born in Europe, so such an attitude would be really ridiculous. I just think we have the best economic system, and I invite the whole world to be capitalistic on the same, or better yet, even greater level than we are. I am pro-world, not just pro-America. I want Europe and other places to start kicking major ass economically, even if they kick ours. That CAN happen.

I will never be jealous of America. i don't know why you keep saying that. Why be jealous of one of the most capitalist countries ever. We only talk about the US because you keep bringing it up.

So when can you send me my check?[/b]

In case you haven't noticed, communism doesn't work with people like you. And this isn't communism sadly, that's why sending you a check would be a kind, selfless, nice and helpfull act, also known as stupid in capitalist way of thinking.